Synthesist + Wild Shaper archetypes?


Rules Questions


I'm putting together a synthesist summoner with a treant-themed eidolon. The Half-Elf Wild Shaper archetype seems to complement the nature based theme of the character very well and I don't see any class abilities that conflict. Is taking both together allowed?


They both alter the Eidolon class feature, unfortunately.

Liberty's Edge

You don't see any abilities that conflict? How about the eidolon ability?


ShadowcatX wrote:
You don't see any abilities that conflict? How about the eidolon ability?

What I meant was that I don't see anything about the respective changes to the eidolon ability that conflict with each other. The Wild Shaper archetype only removes certain evolution options from the eidolon, but doesn't change anything about the way the eidolon functions. The opposite is true for the synthesist's eidolon. Figured I'd ask. A shame since it'd fit the concept.


It doesn't work from a balance point of view. It changes a feature synthesists don't really use (the summoning sla) then for practical purposes gives them more evo points.

If it were legal I can't see why 100% of half elf summoners (so basically almost all of them) woukdnt take it.


Unless I'm wrong, the Summon Nature's ally series is roughly equivalent to Summon Monster series of spells power-wise; trading one for the other wouldn't seem to factor into the balance issue much. The extra evolution points are traded solely for the sacrifice of various evolution options.

I hadn't initially noticed the bonus evolution points; I'd mistakenly thought they were the same bonus points to be gained from the half-elf's summoner favoured class feature. It was the summon nature's ally series of spells that I wanted. Maybe I'll just ask my GM to let me swap SM for SNA spells and spell-like abilities.

Liberty's Edge

Ambrus wrote:

Unless I'm wrong, the Summon Nature's ally series is roughly equivalent to Summon Monster series of spells power-wise; trading one for the other wouldn't seem to factor into the balance issue much. The extra evolution points are traded solely for the sacrifice of various evolution options.

I hadn't initially noticed the bonus evolution points; I'd mistakenly thought they were the same bonus points to be gained from the half-elf's summoner favoured class feature. It was the summon nature's ally series of spells that I wanted. Maybe I'll just ask my GM to let me swap SM for SNA spells and spell-like abilities.

You are wrong, summon nature's ally is significantly weaker than summon monster.

And there may not be any changes that conflict with each other, but the fact that both archetypes modify the same class feature means they cannot be used together.


By the rules:

Quote:
A character can take more than one archetype and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the base class as another alternate class feature.

.

But if you really like the theme, ask your group. If you can make the game more fun, when you don't follow the rules, you probably should.


Got it. Thanks.

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