Fallout Conversion: Deathclaw


Conversions


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So, this is my first time in the conversion forum, but I was wondering; How would one go about converting the iconic Deathclaw from the Fallout series as a monster.

Here is the page on the Fallout wiki for more details. But most relevant, I think, is the biology section: "Deathclaws have a hunchbacked, bipedal reptilian build with long humanoid arms. They stand roughly nine to ten feet tall, with a thick and resilient hide, powerful muscles, and twelve-inch-long, razor-sharp claws that can kill almost any other creature in only a few swipes; hence their name. They have an excellent sense of smell and hearing, though their eyesight is poor. Their build gives them incredible speed, agility and strength in close combat, making them an extreme threat. Though they were originally mutated chameleons, they have lost the ability to camouflage themselves.

Although they do not have vocal cords, they can growl and shout, and some seem to be able to mimic human speech much the same as a parrot does. However, normal deathclaws aren't intelligent enough to be capable of real speech."

Using Pathfinder rules, I'd say a fair starting point would be classifying them as Aberrations, and a Full BAB, good Fort, and Reflex saves, but I don't know where to go from there, or what CR to shoot for, since enemies scale in strength based on player level in Fallout. Preferably, I'd like to give them something interesting to do in combat, maybe a pounce, but I'm not much of a "numbers" guy.

What does everyone have to share?


Pounce, 2 claws and a bite.

Size Large.

Armor Piercing Claws (Ex): Deathclaw claws are razor sharp and ignore armor bonuses to AC. They also deal damage as a creature one size category larger.

Racial -4 to sight based Perception or doubled range penalties for sight based Perception.

Scent.

Probably around 12 HD, CR 10-11, maybe 12 at a stretch (boost to 13-14 HD then).

I'm interested in this so I might try to come up with a full statblock later.


Please do, I'm trying to get the hang of number-crunching in pathfinder, as I'm a big fan of Homebrewing content. I was thinking about CR 10, but that felt a little brutal for something designed to come in groups, then again, any PCs who hear about something named Deathclaw should be very careful treading those grounds. How does this look for ability scores:

  • Str 24-26
  • Dex 9
  • Con 16
  • Int 3 (3d6 for the "Intelligent" variety)
  • Wis 15
  • Cha 5

    I like Armor-piercing Claws, too. A good way to integrate their ability to do that from Fallout.

    EDIT: Couple of edits, here and there for spelling.


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    Let's see here. I'll try to make it look as much like an official statblock as I can for ease of use, and actually attempt to follow the rules for the most part.

    --------------------------------

    Deathclaw:

    ---------------------
    Deathclaw CR 10
    ---------------------
    XP 9600

    CE Large Magical Beast

    Init: +6 Senses: Darkvision; Low-Light Vision; Scent; Perception +23 (+19 sight)

    ---------------------
    Defense
    ---------------------

    AC: 26, Touch 12, Flatfooted 24 (-1 size, +15 Natural, +2 Dex)

    HP: 137 (12d10+72)

    Fort +13 Reflex +10 Will +6

    ---------------------
    Offense
    ---------------------

    Speed: 40 ft.

    Melee: 2 Claws +19 (2d6+10, x3), Power Attack 2 Claws +15 (2d6+22, x3)

    Space: 10 ft. Reach: 10 ft.

    Special Attacks: Pounce, Rend (2 claws, 2d6+10), Push (claws, 10 feet)

    ---------------------
    Statistics
    ---------------------

    Str: 24 Dex: 14 Con: 20 Int: 2Wis: 14 Cha: 2

    Base Atk: +12; CMB: +20; CMD: 32

    Feats: Improved Initiative, Improved Natural Attack, Power Attack, Skill Focus: Perception, Toughness, Weapon Focus (Claws)

    Skills: Perception +23 (+19 sight)

    SQ: Armor Piercing Claws, Weak Vision, Acute Hearing, Bullet Resistant Hide

    ---------------------
    Special Abilities:
    ---------------------

    Armor Piercing Claws (Ex): As the name suggests, a Deathclaw's claws are a truly terrifying weapon. Their claw attacks deal damage as if one size category larger, add 1 and 1/2 times Str to damage, and their critical hit multiplier increases to x3. In addition, a Deathclaw's claw attacks ignore armor class bonuses from armor or shields.

    Weak Vision (Ex): A Deathclaw's sight is not nearly as sharp as its other senses. It takes a -4 penalty on all sight based Perception checks and doubles the penalties to Perception for range after 60 feet.

    Acute Hearing (Ex): A Deathclaw reduces the distance penalties for hearing based Perception checks to 1/4 the normal (essentially adding -1 Perception every 40 feet instead of every 10 feet).

    Bullet Resistant Hide (Ex): A Deathclaw's hide is tough and can resist most small arms fire. A Deathclaw's Natural Armor bonus applies to attacks against firearms.

    I figured it was supposed to be a tough CR 10, so I compared it to a CR 10 Dragon's statblock and worked from there.

    In essence he is fast and deadly like he should be. In comparison to the dragon he has less attacks, but hits more often and both claws hit like a truck when Power Attacking, especially with Rend in play.

    He is less maneuverable (no flight), and has no ranged attacks.

    Comparable HP. Toughness essentially makes up the difference between DR/Magic when the DR comes into play.

    Here's the dangerous part.

    The Deathclaw can Pounce, guaranteeing two claw attacks from the get-go, pretty much no matter what. He also has the Push ability, shoving enemies hit by his claws back 10 feet at his option (this of course mimics the massive knockback Deathclaws have on their attacks in the games). Essentially waht this means is he can deny your melee PC Full Attacks while not doing the same himself.

    May warrant a +1 CR boost because that's an effective combo, but really no more effective than "Fly-By Attack Strafing Run Dragon".

    He's a Magical Beast because it was the closest fit in creature type. Magical Beasts in Pathfinder are basically genetic experiments performed by Wizards or strange magical mutations, which fits very well with "Radioactive mutated chameleon".

    Enjoy!


    Dotted... for no evil reason whatsoever.


    Rynjin wrote:

    Let's see here. I'll try to make it look as much like an official statblock as I can for ease of use, and actually attempt to follow the rules for the most part.

    --------------------------------

    ** spoiler omitted **...

    Oh, I like! The Pounce-Rend-Push Combo is really nasty, unique too, as far as I know, and the Bullet proof Hide saves it from the Dragon Problem, as my group calls it.

    Next up, some of the variants from the series. I think Alpha Deathclaws/Mothers would be good with a size category boost, and the advanced template. Would the intelligent variety (since awaken won't cut it on a Magical Beast) be in need of more than just 3d6 to Int?

    And I Personally peg the Legendary Deathclaw somewhere around CR 18, or higher. It was one of the deadliest creatures in the series if I'm not mistaken. Next to, of course, the Legendary Bloatfly. Maybe we could slap the Half-Dragon template on an Alpha Deathclaw with some adjustments. Because a flying Deathclaw is the stuff of nightmares. And a flying Deathclaw that breaths fire, would keep me up at night.

    Liberty's Edge

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    Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

    I think the Armor Piercing Claws thing is a bit much. I get where it's coming from, but (essentially) brilliant energy claws on a +19 to hit seems like overkill. It also seems strange to me that something like a common dog with only AC 13 from +1 natural armor, Dex and size is effectively harder for a deathclaw to injure than a DEX 10 dwarf wearing stone plate and a tower shield (AC 23.) I'd lose the "ignores armor and shield bonuses" part or, if you're really in love with it, maybe keep it to only when the deathclaw uses pounce.

    Push could be also be replaced by the Awesome Blow feat. It's different and maybe less powerful, but it's an ability that already exists in the game with rules to explain how it works. All you'd have to do is give the deathclaw STR 25, designate Improved Natural Attack as a Bonus feat and replace a feat with Improved Bull Rush. I'd probably drop Skill Focus (Perception.)

    Not that it probably matters but I'd probably give the deathclaws a slightly higher CHA as well, maybe even a 6. They're only a tiny bit smarter than most animals, but they seem like social creatures like ravens and lions that gather in groups with an apparent pecking order based on size, strength and ferocity.

    As far as intelligent deathclaws go, Goris was the smartest introduced in the games and he maxes out at INT 8 using Fallout's SPECIAL attributes when the Chosen One reaches the endgame of Fallout 2. Mother, the deathclaw matriarch, from Fallout Tactics only has INT 4 and she's supposed to be the smartest of her pack. SPECIAL uses INT 9 as genius intellect and Goris was the only deathclaw in his pack to even break INT 4. For Pathfinder, I'd say the average intelligent deathclaw is still only around INT 7. Older deathclaws like Mother would get age bonuses for INT 8-10 and exceptional specimens like Goris might reach as high INT 18 with time and no magical aid.


    Push is an ability that already exists, I made sure of that. I went searching for "Bull Rush" under the Universal Monster Rules and that came up, exactly what I was hoping for. It's not REALLY a Bull Rush, it pushes the opponent a fixed distance from the attacker (their choice if it activates).

    Here.

    There's an ability like that for every Combat Maneuver I believe (including Steal, I know the Nalfeshnee Demon has that), but I don't know any creatures that actually have Push or Pull.

    Higher Cha might be good, I forgot the pack aspect. Cha 6 is where lions are at so it seems a good number.

    I don't think Armor Piercing Claws is too much necessarily, though too much without a CR boost maybe. It fits the creature.

    Also, I actually don't find it strange, if only because I'm basing these off of FO3/New Vegas Deathclaws. It's almost always better to take off your armor when fighting one since it makes you more maneuverable and dodge easier.

    They also DO kinda have a problem with dogs. They miss one in every 3-5 hits on one when I've seen them fight dogs.

    Of course, they kill them in one shot unless that dog is Dogmeat.

    Liberty's Edge

    Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

    Oh neat. I thought I remembered seeing Push somewhere but I couldn't find it when I searched for it so I thought I imagined it.

    I'd agree with a higher CR for the AP Claws. Most PCs' AC comes from armor and shield bonuses. Sure there are exceptions and, when compared to something like a CR7 spectre who can touch all day long for 2 levels of energy drain, it doesn't sound so bad, but I'm concerned with the TPK potential of dropping a nest of these monsters on a party or even just advancing a couple to make a mother and an alpha. Almost guaranteeing the things 8d6+88 damage (4 claws from natural attacks + rend) a round just sounds too brutal to me. In my current game of Lv. 12 PCs, that approximate average of 128 damage/rd. pretty much kills one character every round. I've no doubt the party could kill one if they all ganged up on it, but I have a feeling one or two PCs might die in the process depending on the initiative order. Thinking about it more, maybe CR 12 is closer to appropriate?

    I think the reason dogs give deathclaws any trouble at all in the games is their model size and seemingly random hit detection. Maybe Fallout dogs have displacement? My point about the dog is really that it comes down to +1 AC of furry hide is apparently more protection than +9 AC of solid rock and +4 AC of thick, iron-banded wood.


    Fair enough. CR 12 sounds good too, though I think its HD are a couple too low for CR 12 (since monster HD tend to race ahead of their CR it seems).

    And yeah, it's the model size and spotty hit detection.

    I figured if I was modeling one quirk of the game engine (knockback from the attacks is only a "feature" in that damage = knockback and high damage = high knockback) I'd try to justify another quirk. =p

    Liberty's Edge

    Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

    An alternate method of mirroring the FO deathclaws might be to give their claws a Greater Sunder effect as an Ex ability. Since armor and weapons in Fallout have a condition meter and are quickly shredded by deathclaw attacks , this would match up to the video game pretty well. It also leaves the character with their normal AC at the beginning of the fight, but still proves a huge threat as their armor is rapidly reduced to scrap metal. It gets around the weird dog vs. dwarf thing too.

    Armor Piercing Claws could be like: A Deathclaw's claw attacks deal damage as if the creature was one size category larger and score a critical hit on a roll of 19-20. Additionally, a deathclaw may choose to initiate a greater sunder attempt against an opponent instead of dealing full damage when it attacks. The deathclaw receives a +4 bonus on checks made to sunder an item. Whenever a deathclaw sunders to destroy a weapon, shield, or suit of armor, any excess damage is applied to the item's wielder. No damage is transferred if the deathclaw decides to leave the item with 1 hit point.

    I increased the threat range and lowered the multiplier just because their claws remind me more of a fistful of longswords than a fistful of battle axes.


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    Hm. I personally dislike Sunder as an enemy tactic because it's so annoying to fix. You survive the fight but are crippled for the foreseeable future, especially at this level where everything is magical (and thus requires ever higher level casters to repair).


    Why not let the ability stand, but only ignoring a certain amount of armor? Say 5 AC from armor and shields ignored by a regular Deathclaw, and allow that to scale based on the variant types (Alpha would ignore more, Young would ignore less, etc...)?


    Okay... lol. Why is this creature being given armor piercing abilities? Just give it a decent bonus to its attack roll.

    Out of all the powerful creatures that exist in this game, from ancient dragons, 500-ton machines, and all the way to Cthulhu, this guy gets armor piercing abilities?


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    Sauce987654321 wrote:
    Okay... lol. Why is this creature being given armor piercing abilities?

    Because that's how they work in-game. They ignore all AC/DT bonuses from armor.


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    And because Ancient dragons and Cthulhu have way nastier things to do to someone than just hitting them.


    The ability is fine as is but a High BAB and "claws count as adamant weapons" is more of a common way for armor peircing type stuff to be represented IMO.


    I think that they should have a gore and bite attack's as well.


    I remember i already saw a pretty well made Death Claw a while back. Cr is 10, but it's still pretty strong.


    That does a good job of integrating the Deathclaw into Golarion, but I think I'm liking the set-up here mechanically.


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    Velcro Zipper wrote:
    Almost guaranteeing the things 8d6+88 damage (4 claws from natural attacks + rend) a round just sounds too brutal to me. In my current game of Lv. 12 PCs, that approximate average of 128 damage/rd. pretty much kills one character every round. I've no doubt the party could kill one if they all ganged up on it, but I have a feeling one or two PCs might die in the process depending on the initiative order.

    Good, they're supposed to die. You don't attack the Deathclaw, you slowly make your escape before urinating blood and crying for the next three days.

    Rynjwhatever, I think you made the perfect Deathclaw. Don't change anything, it's great as is.


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    Vamptastic wrote:


    Good, they're supposed to die. You don't attack the Deathclaw, you slowly make your escape before urinating blood and crying for the next three days.

    I remember my first random encounter with a Deathclaw in Fallout 3.

    "What's that red blip on the-"

    *DEAD*

    "The hell killed me?"

    *Camera pans*

    "HOLY F*#@ WHAT IS THAT AAAAH!!!!"


    Rynjin wrote:
    Vamptastic wrote:


    Good, they're supposed to die. You don't attack the Deathclaw, you slowly make your escape before urinating blood and crying for the next three days.

    I remember my first random encounter with a Deathclaw in Fallout 3.

    "What's that red blip on the-"

    *DEAD*

    "The hell killed me?"

    *Camera pans*

    "HOLY F%%# WHAT IS THAT AAAAH!!!!"

    You were lucky. You never had time to run away from it, enter some random house, hide next to the bed because that's the only option, only to watch with horror as it ENTERED THE ROOM. IT CAN OPEN DOORS OH MY GO-Load Last Save.


    I got lucky. The first one I saw was at night, and it was half-dead, on the other side of a fence. This did nothing to stop me from wasting most of my ammo on it as the horrifying thing I had never seen before slowly lumbered around the corner and OHGODNOTHEFLASHBACKS


    Kudos to anyone who had the stones to actually delve into Quarry Junction.

    Big pile of nope.


    Well, by the time I got to that point I was aware of their one weakness...

    Killing them in one hit from an Anti-tank rifle from really far away and then running with a stealthboy.

    But more on topic; would just using the Advanced template and bumping them a size up to huge, be an accurate method of creating an Alpha or Mother? Maybe increase their base speed, too.

    Or if I want everyone in the party to die, give an intelligent one the Half-Fiend template, and swap out an SLA for haste.


    I remember it was distracted fighting an entire Raider gang and their pack of dogs. I was watching this from across a bridge, knowing I had to cross this bridge. Eventually, as it slaughtered the last hound and started stalking around, I pulled out the Fatboy, lobbed my one Mini Nuke at it in Vats, and watched it turn towards me with five health left, limping towards me. I was playing a pure Unarmed/Explosives character, no firearms, no grenades on me.

    Sometimes, thinking about it, my hands and feet still go numb and I find it hard to swallow.


    Quarry Junction actually wasn't an issue. Deathclaws in New Vegas are weaksauce compared to Fallout 3 (barring Alpha Males, Matriarchs, and the Legendary Deathclaw).

    Especially when you're specced for Explosives and go in THUMP-THUMP A BLAZIN'.

    No, it's the Deathclaw Sanctuary and to a lesser extent Old Olney in FO3 that really require the cojones.

    Dark cave, in close quarters with creatures stronger, faster, and likely with better senses than you are, guaranteed not to have maxed out HP (since the Endurance Bobblehead is IN THERE)?

    Helluva lot scarier than what is essentially an open area you can shell from the cliffs with Explosives and long range weaponry.

    Well, unless you were unlucky enough to make a sprint for New Vegas from the start, managed to survive the Cazadores (*shudders convulsively*), and the Viper Gang Members holed up nearby, and went just a little too far east...

    Man was that a disappointing reload.

    Green Smashomancer wrote:


    But more on topic; would just using the Advanced template and bumping them a size up to huge, be an accurate method of creating an Alpha or Mother? Maybe increase their base speed, too.

    Regular Deathclaw with the Advanced and Giant Templates sounds about right, yeah.

    Maybe give the Alpha Males a Gore attack since IIRC they headbutt you sometimes.


    Dead Wind Cavern was by far the most aptly-named location in New Vegas.

    And of course there was that one train yard that was inhabited by Contradiction Deathclaws. Who, if we were to stat them as a template, I think a +4 bonus to Perception wouldn't be enough considering those mofos just DID NOT CARE how good my sneak was at any level.

    EDIT: Wait Headbutt? I don't recall seeing that in 300+ Hours of playing. Though really, I've seen those horns, they should all have a headbutt.

    Sczarni

    Combat Shotgun, maxed sneak, Shotgun Surgeon, and big brass ones.

    A LOT of chems helps too.

    If you can get into their face faster than they can slice you up, unload a bunch of shotgun shells in their teeth, you can survive.

    Of course, the dart gun + landmines in FO3 made it all too easy out on the open terrain.


    Hey, since we started talking about Cazadores, I want to try to build those while I'm at it. I think a high touch AC, and fast fly speed (good maneuverability?) should accurately portray the frustration they give to a Gunslinger.

    EDIT: Now that I think about it Deathclaws can't overcome DR can they? Might add something like "claws count as Adamantine for overcoming DR" or something.


    Well that depends are we talking new fallout deathclaws or the ones from the originals. Since other people have been focusing on the new ones I think to give on based on the older ones in case.

    This is based on their stats in the game and trying to change them to equilevants on PF.

    Low AC, deathclaws are very easy to hit, in relation to their status as high tier opponents. (NOTE: Tough deathclaw variants actually have a very respectable AC)

    High initiative, they have higher sequence(same thing) than is possible to a player character without using perks. So I think improved initiative as feat is a good thing to slap on.

    They all have high HP, easy enough to do slap on toughness and good constitution score.

    Threath range, Tough ones have pretty decent one so for that variant get improved critical.

    Damage, VERY high, I suggest taking powerful jaw ability and applying it to their claws combined with high STR.

    To hit bonus should be high. Full BAB and high STR mentioned above should take care of that.

    They can do a lot of attacks since they have lot of action points so I would go with the pounce that was used previously since that seems the easiest way to go about it in PF.

    In relation to the above they should have pretty good movement speed 40-60ft

    DR, this should be /- and it should be 10 or 15 depending on CR.

    All in all they are brutes that can handle what they dish out.

    RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32

    And like all Fallout enemies, they should have a vulnerability to Called Shot: Head. Because I never met a foe across three games that that didn't deal with rather quickly.


    Depends on what weapons you use when it comes to Deathclaws.

    Shotguns are good, but you need to be a bit closer than you like.

    Machine guns just kinda plink off of 'em unless you're firing very rapidly and accurately.

    Pistols, hunting rifles, and laser rifles you might as well go home.

    Plasma rifles and sniper rifles work good though.

    As for Cazadores, good luck getting a VATS shot on their head with how glitchy it is. =p

    Silver Crusade

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    A good level action like the Medicine Stick and steady aim always handled Deathclaws well for me.


    Well, again, New Vegas Deathclaws are MUCH less buff (but usually appear in greater numbers). Or, to be more accurate, they're just as buff, but start appearing at lower levels, can be random encounters, in a game with less overall DPS in its weapons. New Vegas' guns were beefed up to an extent to compensate for Damage Threshold being a thing.

    The Medicine Stick's closest equivalent in FO3 (Lincoln's Repeater, which fired .44 magnum rounds) was a reliable option if you got the drop on them, but for open combat FO3 Deathclaws (and the ones in New Vegas' Lonesome Road DLC) needed to be taken down in 2 or 3 hits or they'd straight up murder you, and it took 4-5 IIRC for the Repeater to handle it.

    All I know is Deathclaws are SCARY in 3, but only a kinda tough fight in New Vegas.

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