A beginner GM in trouble

[Maxander]

Hi everybody!

I fairly recently started playing Pathfinder with some friends and it's a great game though I have one problem due to my inexperience with the combat maneuvers.

One of the players plays a summoner subtype which wraps himself up with his eidalon and becomes one with it and he's incredibly strong against most melee opponents. His eidalon has a 10 ft reach and uses this to trip every opponent that gets into his area so they fall down without reaching him and then he just keeps them down with attacks of opportunity every time they try to stand up so they never get close enough to fight him.

Could anyone give me any advice on how to make the game a bit more of a challenge for my group instead of just pushing in huge monsters or other beings which are "impossible" to trip?

[andreww]

It sounds like he is using the Synthesist Summoner archetype. If you are playing a PFS game be aware that it is not legal for play.

[Matthew Downie]

Summoners are often problematic...

Some ways to avoid being tripped on approach:

Have flying creatures swoop down.
Win on initiative; if he hasn't acted yet he can't make Attacks of Opportunity.
Have several creatures attack him in a round - more than the number of AoOs he can take.
Attack him with humanoids using reach weapons.
Archers.
Spellcasters.
A large creature with reach.
Creature with very high CMD - quadrupeds get bonues against trip.

(I suspect this is in the wrong forum - this doesn't sound like a Pathfinder Society game.)

[Kydeem de'Morcaine]

This is just a guess. But I think you are talking about a Pathfinder home game, not a Pathfinder Society organized play game (often at a game show with a Venture Lieutenant organizing several play tables).

Is that correct?

If so, this thread should probably be moved to the general advice forum. Then you can get a lot of advice on things you can do to challenge anyone.

If not and this really is a PFS game, you are very limited in what you can do. The scenarios detail the opponents to be encountered and what gear they have. Often it specifically tells you what strategy they will follow.

[Matthew Morris]

As pointed out above, if it is PFS, then your solution is simple "That is illegal in Pathfinder, please rebuild your character."

If it isn't in PFS (and in the wrong forum) then you as a GM can use the above options. I'd also add, on occasion, makng sites or encounters that remove/hamper his summoning ability. Not all the time, but once in a while to make him sweat. just like Tony Stark has proved now and again he's still a threat w/o armor, force the Summoner to function in a fight (or scenario) without his Eidilon

In a cave! With a BOX OF SCRAPS! :-)

[Iczer]

The problem here is that you cannot 'trip lock' a person. Getting up from prone triggers the attack of Opportunity (and you should double check how many the eidolon actually can perform) but the attack of opportunity occurs before the action. So he's effectively trying to trip a prone opponent, who then gets up from prone (which is what he was doing in the first place)

Mobs will work well (they always will). low level creatures with low CR's attacking en mass can simply swarm him. He will get an AoO on the first little guy, and then the rest can gank him with flanking.

Ranged attackers also are good here, as he will have to actually close with them to get his trip trick to work.

Use attackers with reach. they won't trigger AoO by moving into attack range, and most reach weapons are higher damage.

At some point some basic dispell or banishment are going to work, and remember he counts as an outsider now, making him vulnerable to a lot more attacks.

Of course the actual build would be nice to know (all I have to work on is Trip + 10 foot range.

The sythestist build is pretty good at what he's doing here, so there's no shame in him being good at what he does, and for a while he will outclass the straight melee types, but it will all even out as your bad guys will have broader options.

[Maxander]

Ah yes, it should be moved. My bad. Thanks a lot for the advice :)

[Kydeem de'Morcaine]

I would also suggest putting the details of his build up here. Almost every time I've heard someone say they were having problems with a summoner or eidolon, it has turned out that it was built wrong.

[The Fox]

Also, it is perfectly okay, especially as a new GM, to ask a player to play a different character.

[Dan Simons]

Iczer wrote:

The problem here is that you cannot 'trip lock' a person.

This statement is completely accurate. If you need to prove it to the player, look at the FAQ post from 2010.

[Maxander]

I see, thanks :) Can't post his char here atm since I don't have access to it right now but will try to solve that tomorrow.

What about this:

He trips them as they come within his reach on their turn thanks to his 10 ft reach. Then when it's once again their round they stand up again with their move action so they only have a standard action left which leaves them with the choice of either get into a defensive position (Total Defense) or use the action to make another movement. If they make a move and tries to get in melee contact with him again he gets another AoO thanks to his Combat Reflex in which he can trip them once again so that they still never make it past his 10 ft reach.

I know that one solution would be to attack with many weak opponents but it doesn't make much sense since his AC goes between 25 - 30 (and the weak opponents would be around level 4-5 since he's only a level 8).

[The Fox]

Move Action: stand up
Non-Action: 5-foot step
Standard Action: maul summoner

[Blackbot]

He can stand up and take his 5-foot step.

PRD wrote:

Move

The simplest move action is moving your speed. If you take this kind of move action during your turn, you can't also take a 5-foot step.

Many nonstandard modes of movement are covered under this category, including climbing (up to one-quarter of your speed) and swimming (up to one-quarter of your speed).

You are not forbidden to take the 5-foot step when you use a move action for anything but moving, crawling, climbing, flying or another interpretation of "move" - standing up is another action.

[Avatar-1]

The solution is to ban the synthesist from your home game, just like PFS does.

[Akerlof]

Have some of your NPCs play smart: Stay back and force him to come to them. Then they can 5' step in without triggering an AoO and smack him. Or, if he trips them, well, he just made one prone without doing any damage and ended his turn. Then show him the value of full attacks. ;)

Enemies with reach, enemies who can't be tripped, enemies who don't care if they tripped all help as well. But be careful, don't overtune your encounters towards the Synthesist and then murder the rest of the group accidentally. If the disparity gets too bad, where the Synthesist overshadows the rest of the group and makes the game about him and nobody else, _and they are unhappy about that_ then maybe ask him to reroll.