Lunge / Mythic Lunge and AOO

[Clectabled]

Sorry if I missed a FAQ or thread that addressed this already...

I read an older thread where the consensus was Lunge could only be activated on your turn, and since it's effects end at the end of your turn, You could never use lunge and AOO together.

However in reading the Mythic Lunge description is specifically calls out using Lunge with AOO.

Lunge (Mythic):

Your reaching strikes aid your defenses against those
you hit.
Prerequisite: Lunge.
Benefit: Whenever you use Lunge and hit a creature
with the melee attack, you no longer take a –2 penalty
to AC against that creature. You can expend one use
of mythic power when you use Lunge to negate the –2
penalty to AC whether you hit or miss, and gain a +2
bonus on attacks of opportunity you make while Lunge
is in effect.

This seems to imply you can activate lunge whenever you want correct?

Based on this reading, one could end his turn, and then activate Lunge if someone got close enough to invoke an AOO.

Does anyone see any reason why you could not use Lunge and Retributive Reach together?

Retributive Reach:

Treat your reach as 5 feet greater than normal for the purpose of determining whether or not you can make an attack of opportunity. If a creature provokes an attack of opportunity within this area of increased reach, you can expend one use of mythic power to gain a bonus equal to your tier on the attack roll and damage roll of the attack of opportunity.

Finally is there, or should there be an action involved to activate Lunge?

[DesolateHarmony]

Non-mythic lunge still allows you to make attacks of opportunity, but only during your turn. So, when someone else is taking their turn, you don't have the increased reach. But, if you have greater trip, and trip someone during your turn, you sure do get to make the attack of opportunity.

Lunge does not last past your own turn. It does not have the wording 'until your next turn' as so many other feats and effects do.

From the description of Retributive Reach, it appears to be on all the time. But it has the wording 'Treat your reach as 5 feet greater than normal for ...' so it appears not to stack with lunge.

I don't think you can get the 10 feet of extra reach for attacks of opportunity during your own turn.

[Night_Shade]

The feat has the following statement:
You can increase the reach of your melee attacks by 5 feet until the end of your turn by taking a –2 penalty to your AC until your next turn.
So does that mean that if bad guy 1 goes on initiative rd 20 he makes a normal attack, then if you lunge on init round 17 you have reach and a -2 to AC, bad guy 2 on init round 10 gets to strike you at the -2 AC penalty. Band guy 3 moves from 15 ft away to 5 ft away to attempt to hit you (this causes an AoO I think), then when we go to the top of the round the first bad guy attacks you still with the -2 AC penalty, then on your turn you are back to normal (no penalties) ?
or does that mean that at the end of the turn your AC penalty is gone and bad guy 1 never gets a chance to hit you at the -2 AC?

Just in case I think it is the first one, but if I am wrong I would like to know.

[kyrt-ryder]

Worse, the AC penalty lasts long after your turn is over, until the start of your next turn, while your reach only lasts until the END of your turn.

Remember, your turn only lasts while you are acting.

[Night_Shade]

That bites :-(

[lemeres]

Night_Shade wrote:

That bites :-(

Depends on what you use lunge for.

If you use it with a reach weapon, then the enemy is left 15' away from you after you attack. That means most enemies have to move 10' to reach you, which draws an AoO and most likely removes their ability to do a full attack (when they only need a 5' step to reach you without lunge).

That improved distance makes a great defense that is worth the penalty to AC, quite often. That, and the fact that it sets up AoOs and still has the intended effect of widening you attack range into a 45' wide circle.

Not sure if it is worth it for a lot of other melee builds though. That is for you to decide.