I am running a druid for the first time and I just got Wild Shape. It is not clear to me what stats I am supposed to use when I choose a shape.
The books says you get a couple bonuses depending on whether you change into a small or medium creature. That seems to imply that these are the only advantages you get. I have also heard that shields carry over into your wild shape. What about other stats?
I guess I get to use the attacks that the creature has because people reference this all the time, but I cannot find in the book where it says this explicitly.
What about HP? Do I still have my same HP?
Armor Class?
Attack Bonus?
Damage?
Do the creatures I use also level up as I level up? Can I only pick animals from the Bestiary that are my level or lower?
Any guidance would be appreciated.
I am running a druid for the first time and I just got Wild Shape. It is not clear to me what stats I am supposed to use when I choose a shape.
Your own. Seriously, wildshaping is like a battle-suit that you put on that buffs your base human form up. It works exactly like the Beast Shape line of spells except that you get a longer (hours per level duration) and you can cast spells (with the natural spell feat)
The books says you get a couple bonuses depending on whether you change into a small or medium creature. That seems to imply that these are the only advantages you get.
Whatever the spell says you get, you get, anything else is not allowed. For example:
When you cast this spell, you can assume the form of any Small or Medium creature of the animal type. If the form you assume has any of the following abilities, you gain the listed ability: climb 30 feet, fly 30 feet (average maneuverability), swim 30 feet, darkvision 60 feet, low-light vision, and scent.
Small animal: If the form you take is that of a Small animal, you gain a +2 size bonus to your Dexterity and a +1 natural armor bonus.
Medium animal: If the form you take is that of a Medium animal, you gain a +2 size bonus to your Strength and a +2 natural armor bonus.
So if you turn into a wolf (medium animal), you get a +2 size bonus to strength, +2 natural armor bonus, scent and low light vision, and thats it.
I have also heard that shields carry over into your wild shape. What about other stats?
Errrm, nope? First I've heard of it. As per the polymorph rules (which wildshape follows) all carried gear melds with your form and becomes non-functional if you morph into a form that can't use it. That includes weapons and shields. Now if you were to become a humanoid elemental, sure you could keep your shield.
It might not be sized for you anymore, but thems the breaks.
I guess I get to use the attacks that the creature has because people reference this all the time, but I cannot find in the book where it says this explicitly.
In addition to these benefits, you gain any of the natural attacks of the base creature, including proficiency in those attacks. These attacks are based on your base attack bonus, modified by your Strength or Dexterity as appropriate, and use your Strength modifier for determining damage bonuses.
What about HP? Do I still have my same HP?
You have the same HP unless you Con was changed, if so, adjust your existing HP based on your new con bonus. Remember, when you shift back to human, your wounds transfer over to your human form and if you don't have enough Hit Points left, you might die.
Armor Class?
You lose the benefit of any shield (as previously stated) and worn armor (unless it has the wild enchantment), but gain a natural armor bonus based on the spell used to determine the effects of Wildshape (Beast Shape I, II, III, Plant Shape I, II, Elemental Body, I, II, III)
An interesting side note is you can wear barding up to the level of armor that you are proficient in, so that might be worth a look, that works just like wearing armor. Druids are proficient up to medium armors if I recall, so you could wear a hide/lamellar barding.
Attack Bonus?
Your Base attack Bonus stays the same, if you have increased strength, your overall attack bonus might go up. If you have increased size, your overall attack bonus might go down. Small forms work the other way around, obviously.
Damage?
You use your natural attacks to deal damage, so it would be your natural attack dice + static mods.
Do the creatures I use also level up as I level up? Can I only pick animals from the Bestiary that are my level or lower?
Ah, thats 3.5 talk. In Pathfinder Wildshape works off the Beast Shape line of spells and as you level up, you can use higher level Beast Shapes (Beast Shape I is small and medium beasts, II is large and tiny, III is huge and diminuitive). Under those guidelines (mostly size based) you can pick whatever animal you'd like to turn into.
Any guidance would be appreciated.
De nada.
prototype00
I have also heard that shields carry over into your wild shape.
When you wild shape, your armor melds into your body, and you lose your regular armor bonus. (You could get some specially made armor and have your allies put it on you when you're in animal form...) The rules don't say you lose your shield bonus, so some people have claimed you should be still able to benefit from your shield, but this isn't likely to be Rules As Intended.
I have also heard that shields carry over into your wild shape.When you wild shape, your armor melds into your body, and you lose your regular armor bonus. (You could get some specially made armor and have your allies put it on you when you're in animal form...) The rules don't say you lose your shield bonus, so some people have claimed you should be still able to benefit from your shield, but this isn't likely to be Rules As Intended.
Well, they actually do.
Items that provide constant bonuses and do not need to be activated continue to function while melded in this way (with the exception of armor and shield bonuses, which cease to function).
Also from the Polymorph subschool text.
prototype00
ok. It all makes sense except for the natural attacks. I'd like to walk through a scenario and see if I have it right.
In normal form, these are my key stats
Str mod +3
AC w/o armor 11
Before going into battle, I cast Barkskin and raise my natural AC to 13.
I then wild shape into a Deinonychus (dinosaur). This is a medium animal and so I get +2 Strength and +2 natural armor. This brings my stats up to this.
Str mod +4 (the +2 was to the score not the mod right?)
AC 15
HP is the same as my normal shape
Right so far?
So now I go on the attack.
The Bestiary says that the deinonychus has the following melee attacks to choose from.
2 talons +5 (1d8+2), bite +5 (1d6+2), foreclaws +0 (1d4+1)
Do I also get to choose from these natural attacks while I am in this form, but I use my attack & damage bonus instead of what is listed?
So on my turn I decide to make 2 talon attacks. I roll and add my attack bonus of +7 (BAB + Str mod).
If I hit, I roll 1d8 +4 (str mod)
Sound correct?
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Sounds good.
The "foreclaws" of a Deinonychus are considered "secondary" natural weapons (whereas the bite and talons are "primary"), so whatever attack bonus you calculate for your talons and bite, subtract 5 from that and you have your attack bonus for your foreclaws.
Secondary natural attacks also add only half your Strength bonus to damage (+2 in your case).
As part of a full attack, your deinonychus would be able to use all of those attacks. So talons, bite, and fore claws, or 4 attacks total. When you cannot full attack, you choose a single attack, 1 talon, bite, fore claw, or other talon.
Remember that 2 Talons, is two attacks. So in your example, it would be d20+BAB+STR twice, if both hit, the damage would be 1d8+4 twice. Also, as I said before, if you are making 2 talon attacks, you can also make a bite and fore claw attack.
The other somewhat complicated thing to remember with natural attacks is whether or not they are primary or secondary. When making a full attack, primary attacks use your full bonus (generally BAB+STR) while secondary use your full bonus minus five. They also only get half your STR on damage. Reading the bestiary, you can see which attacks are primary and which are secondary, in your example, the fore claws are secondary, because their bonus is 5 less than the other attacks, the damage is also reduced.
Hope that helps. Druids can be confusing the first time. Most of the rules in the game are written assuming a PC is using a weapon or two, and the rules for natural attack don't follow the same rules as weapons.
Good deal.
Thanks everyone for your help.
Presumably you're in a party that can help you put it on? If not, yes, lack of opposeable thumbs is a problem.
prototype00
Here's the question.. then. Is your party going to be spending time putting on your druid's armor while they are in pitched battle? Have you reviewed the time to don armor rules lately? BTW, such activity DOES provoke. Because if I'm helping my buddy put on his barding, I am doing a half-assed attempt at best at properly defending myself.Presumably you're in a party that can help you put it on? If not, yes, lack of opposeable thumbs is a problem.
prototype00
What the heck are you doing getting the barding on in battle? Is the paladin going to wait until gnoll A throws his first swing before he puts on full plate?
Wildshape lasts for hours per level. Put that stuff on before the dungeon. Good grief, if the druid doesn't do that, he is sorely lacking in common sense.
prototype00
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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So if I use Beast Shape II to change into a Giant Eagle I use my stats modified by the spells stats give for a Large creature as opposed to the beastiary's stats for a Giant Eagle, is that right?
Yes.
You ignore the bestiary for Giant Eagle entirely regarding STR/DEX/CON/WIS/INT/CHA.
You take what the spell gives you.
You modify before applying the spell if you are smaller than small or larger than medium.