Does the 'Furious' Weapon Ability effect stack with the 'Bane' Ability effect?


Rules Questions

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The bonuses provided by those two abilities aren't enhancement bonuses in and of themselves, they are untyped bonuses (Which stack with everything) to an existing bonus (the +1 or whatever enhancement the weapon has) and therefore stack with one another.

Its similar to barkskin. Barkskin provides an enhancement bonus to an existing natural armor bonus. Normally Natural armor bonuses wouldn't stack but because barkskin is providing a bonus of a different type to the natural armor bonus it works on creatures who already have natural armor. Its just that in the case of furious/bane the bonus is untyped, which stacks with everything.


So why, in your estimation, do different Banes not stack with either mg die or enhancement bonus? They explicitly aren't the same special ability, cuz u can't take the same special ability twice, right?

"The enhancement bonus provided by barkskin stacks with the target's natural armor bonus, but not with other enhancement bonuses to natural armor. A creature without natural armor has an effective natural armor bonus of +0."

AC=Constructed armor(+EBetc)+Dodge+Natural Armor(+EB)+Insight+Deflection+etc

Each are often called 'bonus' but that is as a bonus to total AC, this an example of what I meant earlier with "a positive change is a bonus" that's not disputable just ordinary english, fwiw.

Each of these categories have rules about how an when they apply.

Each of the above also have their own 'enhancement bonus' to which rules about enhancement bonuses apply.

Magical weapons have a singular "enhancement bonus" which is their "+1" in "+1 Magic Broomstick" for a bonus to be "untyped" it would have to say something like "this special ability gives +3 to hit and +3 damage " not "this ability changes the enhancement bonus"

For example:

Bane "A bane weapon is exceptionally effective against certain types of foe, during attacks against such foes it adds +2 to hit and to damage rolls and does an additional 2d6 damage."

Specifically referencing the enhancement bonus as the number changed = a bonus to enhancement bonus = cannot stack with others.

Earlier post claimed that "by this logic magic weapons can never be enhanced beyond +1" but you see, this logic (or at least, only this logic) doesn't always apply.. because there are specific rules for additive enhancements to magic weapons' enhancement bonus that provide for improvement. (even so, stacking requires two changes, a magical weapon created at +3 enhancement bonus is not "changed" to +3, it *is* +3.)

As there are specific rules for the math of totalling hp etc.


Welcome to the Rules Questions forum where we argue about what a "bonus" is and what a bonus is every single day.


Untentril wrote:
So why, in your estimation, do different Banes not stack with either mg die or enhancement bonus? They explicitly aren't the same special ability, cuz u can't take the same special ability twice, right?

Wrong.

Bane: Can I apply multiple bane special abilities to the same weapon? If so, do their effects stack? wrote:

You can apply multiple bane special abilities to the same weapon. For example, you can have a +1 dragon- and fey-bane longsword, which has an increased enhancement bonus and damage against dragons and against fey.

If you have multiple bane effects on a weapon and attack a creature against which more than one bane applies (such as a chaotic- and evil-outsider bane weapon used against a demon), the effects do not stack: the weapon's enhancement bonus is only +2 higher than its actual enhancement bonus, and it only deals +2d6 points of damage against that opponent.

(Compare to fighter weapon training or ranger favored enemy bonuses, both of which say you use the highest bonus if more than one bonus applies.)

It even conveniently comes with examples of similar abilities that you can take multiple times with mutually exclusive effects. If your Fighter wields a dagger (both a Thrown and Light Blades weapon) they don't get 2x Weapon Training either.

They're still the same source: Weapon Training and the Bane special weapon property.


The same special ability cannot be put onto a weapon multiple times.

A character can take weapon training multiple times.

"Mutually exclusive effects" includes.. typed stacking bonuses and untyped same bonuses. So admittedly that isn't exactly supportive of my case.

Still, the portion you quoted is not wrong(?) The WOTC ruling was the same for that purpose, different Banes are different abilities.


Bane isn't an enhancement bonus, it increases an enhancement bonus. Bane is an untyped bonus to an already existing bonus. Same as furious. Untyped bonuses stack with everything.

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