Hmm Venture-Captain, Minnesota |
So... the last two sessions that Zahra played of PFS, she got completely blocked from bringing her tiger into the scenario despite multiple creative attempts of disguising it as entertainment, attempting to bribe the folks at the back door actors entrance, etc. The GM didn't even let me roll my bluff or diplomacy attempts, and just told me flat out it was impossible. Likely there was some language in the scenario stating that animal companions have to left behind.
But in the last scenario, Zahra's cleric husband Omar was the only person capable of melee combat, and he died (and then was raised as undead by the baddies) because he had no melee support at all. We also had bad luck, and several players who did not know how to play their characters and made some poor choices that cost us in the battle with the big bad guy. We nearly TPKed. I know that this happens, but I found this frustrating because it would have been completely different with one more melee capable character present.
Had Pumpkin been there, the tiger might have died, but Omar would have survived. Our just-turned-third level characters had to pay for a resurrection in order to keep going a partnership that we both enjoyed. What a good thing that we had a) had managed to earn good money before this and b) we were both saving up for expensive magical items and so had cash on hand to do this. Unfortunately, this means we are going to have to play down for 1-2 scenarios in order to recover the wealth to outfit Omar with decent weaponry again.
This experience was an unhappy one for me. I do not *ever* want to leave my tiger behind in a scenario again. I did not realize that there was a simple second-level spell that could have allowed me to carry Pumpkin in my purse until after this debacle, and I don't know if other PFS pet advocates know about it as well. To this end, I am proposing a new section to the guide, called "bringing your buddy with you."
I am hoping that this will benefit others.
BRINGING YOUR BUDDY WITH YOU
Not all societies are equally enlightened about non-humanoid pathfinders. Sometimes guards might not want to allow your animal friends to come along, or you are on a stealth mission where your mammoth buddy might give you away... Other times, you may face problems getting into tight physical spaces, or climbing up a knotted rope with a 500 pound dinosaur.
Fortunately, there are a number of spells that can help get you and your buddy out of a tight spot. Carrying scrolls (or even wands) of these items for emergencies are a great investment. If they're not on your spell list, buy the scrolls anyway and consider asking other party members for help casting them.
Carry Companion
Source:This second level spell is from Knights of the Inner Sea. It is likely worth buying the PDF just to get access to this one spell. If you own the book already, consider buying a scroll 5-pack of it for 2PP, because it is that useful.
What it does: Allows you to turn a willing friendly animal into a small figurine until needed. To get your buddy back, put the figurine on the ground, say a command word and your friend returns to his or her normal feisty self.
Who can cast it: Arcanists, druids, hunters, rangers, paladins, witches, sorcerers and wizards.
Who cannot: Oracles, clerics, inquisitors. Also bards, but they're not pet owners (yet).
Reduce Person
Source:CRB
As far as I can tell, this is only usable by Sylvan Sorcerers on their own companions. Still, it's a level one spell for those characters that might be useful as a wand for getting your large pet into dungeons and such.
Reduce Animal
Source:CRB
It's a second level spell, but this one is usable by druids, hunters and rangers, and works like Reduce Person, above.
Spider Climb
Source:CRB
It's a second level spell with all sorts of uses for PCs as well as your animal buddy. Just about everyone arcane (except bards and witches) can cast it, as well as druids and hunters, so you can get a fellow caster to do it for you if you buy the scrolls.
________
I'm sure there are other spells that I am not considering here that might be useful for low-level characters. Please, add them so we can improve the guide!
Hmm
Hmm Venture-Captain, Minnesota |
BretI Venture-Lieutenant, Minnesota—Minneapolis |
Hosteling could work for those worrying about Arcane Spell Failure if they put it on haramaki armor (from Ultimate Equipment) which gives 0% ASF. It would cost a total of 150 + 3 + 1000 (+1 enhancement) + 7,500 for a total of 8653 gold and requiring 27 fame.
Mnemonic Vest and a scroll would likely be a better use of the money.
claudekennilol |
Hosteling could work for those worrying about Arcane Spell Failure if they put it on haramaki armor (from Ultimate Equipment) which gives 0% ASF. It would cost a total of 150 + 3 + 1000 (+1 enhancement) + 7,500 for a total of 8653 gold and requiring 27 fame.
Mnemonic Vest and a scroll would likely be a better use of the money.
Though you might have to pay for a large one when your tiger gets larger (assuming you're medium)... Can you "wear" armor too large for you (you have to wear it to be able to activate it)? It'd be easier to buy a tower shield as that can handle a large creature (all this is assuming you're medium-sized).
pauljathome |
Could you share which scenario this was? It sounds to me like the GM may have been in error in shutting down all your attempts to bring Pumpkin along. While this isn't usually a huge deal, when it results in character death it becomes a big deal. You may be able to get the death reversed.
Pup shape is short duration but may work in some situations. Vanish may work also
Damanta |
Ah yes, Carry Companion, the ultimate spell for: I can always take my animal companion along thank you very much.
There are a few scenarios I've played where getting an animal companion to come along would be problematic (and one where having a non-flier/climb capable animal companion was annoying), however creativity should be used (and was used in one scenario) and rewarded with the inclusion of the animal companion.
Library of the Lion: Taldan magical school, iffy enough to get insided, now you also want to bring along a filthy animal? Better have a good bluff or diplomacy
Echoes of the Overwatched: Yeah, way too many rope and ladder climbing and rickety ceilings to be safe for a non-flier
The Dissapeared: Getting an animal companion into the chelish embassy? Same as the others, better have a good bluff/diplomacy.
Hmm Venture-Captain, Minnesota |
Pauljathorne --
Among the Living
We didn't get a bluff check, or a diplomacy check, and couldn't get in the actors door to bribe anyone. No skill checks were allowed to be rolled on this. I don't know if it was part of the scenario or not.
Alas, I did not know about the Carry Companion Spell.
The PCs were a Reach Cleric, my Sylvan Sorcerer, Two Wizards, the Bard Pre-Gen, and an Inquisitor. It turned out that the inquisitor was not built for combat at all, and two of the players did not fully know what their characters could do.
Had I realized going in that the inquisitor had no combat ability, I would have suggested that Bret and I go in with melee-capable pregens to balance the party. Between not realizing the build of the inquisitor and not knowing that I could not get my tiger in, I had no idea how short of melee we would be...
So... Were skill checks supposed to be allowed by the scenario? If so, maybe we have a case. Otherwise, it is likely better for us to just move forward with far fewer cash resources than we would otherwise have.
Hmm
Hmm Venture-Captain, Minnesota |
Just a Mort |
If core only, id suggest oil of reduce animal. Scroll if you're confident of making umd. Use it on pumpkin, get omar to cast ant haul on himself and carry a big bag(with pumpkin inside) to the party. Don't let the cat out of the bag! Problem is you need enough reduce animal oil/scrollfor duration of opera.
Just a Mort |
Reduce person/vanish/any not meant for animals spells from wand does not work. The sylvan sorcerer must cast it out of her spell slots in order to affect her animal conpanion. Else truestriking animal companions using a wand would become commonplace. A power attacking improved natural attack large anklyosaurus that always hit except on a nat 1 would be broken.
I find the idea of buying a splatbook just to carry my companion not my cup of tea, so I generally use hostelling/reduce animal, or just do without that scenario.
redward |
Pauljathorne --
** spoiler omitted **
So... Were skill checks supposed to be allowed by the scenario? If so, maybe we have a case. Otherwise, it is likely better for us to just move forward with far fewer cash resources than we would otherwise have.
Hmm
The PCs are allowed to attend the opera for free (regardless of how they’re dressed), but anyone wearing less than a courtier’s outfit and 50 gp or more of jewelry suffers a –2 penalty on all Charisma-based checks when dealing with any Taldan nobles throughout the scenario.
pauljathome |
When I played it one of the PCs brought in his animal companion (a wolf, IIRC).
Personally, I think that the GM was way out of line to flat out disallow any and all attempts to bring Pumpkin in. Bribes, bluff, etc all should have had at least a chance of working. Pumpkin is still only young, Taldor has the kind of nobility that WOULD have young tigers as pets, and in a combat intensive scenario denying a character a significant part of their combat capability is something that should be done only when clearly called out by the scenario.
Its admittedly not absolutely clear cut but I think that you have a strong enough case that you could reasonably bring it up with your local VO.
Damanta |
Damanta --
Unsurprisingly, the two scenarios where I could not play Pumpkin were on your list.
Hmm
Between bribes, diplomacy and bluff it should be possible to get the animal companion in with most of those scenarios. Sounds like the GM has an unreasonable hatred for animal companions.
As Pauljathome already mentioned Taldan nobility would show up with any young animals as pets, as long as you are dressed for the occasion and offer a suitable bribe it should've been possible to have her enter.
Ascalaphus Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden |
Damanta |
For me it's on par with saying to a cleric that she cannot take her holy symbol with her.
You are shutting down a large part of a characters mechanical abilities by being so rigid.
When I played the scenario in which Hmm and her partner had the character death, it was hard for my fighter to bring her weapon in, but thanks to knowledge (nobility), diplomacy, bluff and a (hefty) bribe I was allowed to take it inside. Hmm should have been given the same chance.
pauljathome |
I dunno if I'd go so far as to say "unreasonable hatred". It could just be a bit inflexible mindset; "tigers going into the opera is ridiculous; therefore it's just not going to happen". Rigid, but not malicious.
Agreed.
As a GM I do like to introduce SOME element of reasonableness to the world, even when not explicitly called for. I think the GM was definitely within their rights making the tiger an issue and not just quietly allowing it in. Where I think they crossed the line was in automatically disallowing all attempts to get it in.
But we all make mistakes. Making a mistake doesn't make a GM bad. I'm NOT suggesting that the GM did anything more than make a bad call at the time. Which we ALL do.
Ascalaphus Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden |
I think this is something worth keeping in mind when designing and kitting out a PC; some PCs are more "all-terrain" than others.
* The fullplate paladin without Swim (it's not a class skill!)
* The T-Rex companion at a fancy dinner party
* The low-Cha tiefling when you've been asked to negotiate the release of pathfinders from some crazed inquisitors.
* The low-Cha barbarian at a fancy dinner party.
* The barbarian with only very big weapons during an undercover mission.
Big weapons are good for killing things with brutal gory violence. But they're not as all-terrain as smaller more subtle weapons. ACs are a lot like big weapons. In some of these cases, I think it's better to have some small backup weapons, and if all else fails, excuse your PC and bring a different one.
LazarX |
Reduce person/vanish/any not meant for animals spells from wand does not work. The sylvan sorcerer must cast it out of her spell slots in order to affect her animal conpanion. Else truestriking animal companions using a wand would become commonplace. A power attacking improved natural attack large anklyosaurus that always hit except on a nat 1 would be broken.
I find the idea of buying a splatbook just to carry my companion not my cup of tea, so I generally use hostelling/reduce animal, or just do without that scenario.
The spell is also found in the Advanced Class Guide, I think.
claudekennilol |
Just a Mort wrote:The spell is also found in the Advanced Class Guide, I think.Reduce person/vanish/any not meant for animals spells from wand does not work. The sylvan sorcerer must cast it out of her spell slots in order to affect her animal conpanion. Else truestriking animal companions using a wand would become commonplace. A power attacking improved natural attack large anklyosaurus that always hit except on a nat 1 would be broken.
I find the idea of buying a splatbook just to carry my companion not my cup of tea, so I generally use hostelling/reduce animal, or just do without that scenario.
If it is it's either not in the PRD or not called Carry Companion.
BretI Venture-Lieutenant, Minnesota—Minneapolis |
LazarX wrote:If it is it's either not in the PRD or not called Carry Companion.Just a Mort wrote:The spell is also found in the Advanced Class Guide, I think.Reduce person/vanish/any not meant for animals spells from wand does not work. The sylvan sorcerer must cast it out of her spell slots in order to affect her animal conpanion. Else truestriking animal companions using a wand would become commonplace. A power attacking improved natural attack large anklyosaurus that always hit except on a nat 1 would be broken.
I find the idea of buying a splatbook just to carry my companion not my cup of tea, so I generally use hostelling/reduce animal, or just do without that scenario.
To my knowledge, the only place that the Carry Companion spell is located is Knights of the Inner Seas page 28. It is under the list of "The Spells of Serran" which comes from Serran's field manual. Basically a bunch of spells that an NPC caster made up to help knights.
If you like heavy armor and have a friendly mage, you want them to have this book. First level spells to allow you to sleep in armor, armor several people, keep watch all knight without being fatigued, and a few other things. It also has a magic item that allows you to quick-equip armor.
If you have an animal companion, you have a much harder decision. How much money is it worth to be able to bring that class ability with you?
Undone |
If I don't let the animal companion participate, how am I going to kill it? :)
We had a fighter get dominated and decapitate mufasa which let me say "NOOOO MUFASA!"
If you have an animal companion, you have a much harder decision. How much money is it worth to be able to bring that class ability with you?
2 Prestige.
Hmm Venture-Captain, Minnesota |
In some of these cases, I think it's better to have some small backup weapons, and if all else fails, excuse your PC and bring a different one.
By the time we realized that we could not get the tiger in and had no melee backup for Omar, it was too late to excuse my PC and bring in a pregen.
Hmm
BretI Venture-Lieutenant, Minnesota—Minneapolis |
Z...D... Venture-Lieutenant, Maryland—Hagerstown |
Faelyn |
BretI wrote:You can get 5 copies of a second level spell (like Carry Companion) on a scroll for 2 PP.This is quite a useful trick...what is your source for this. This would make my druid and hunter very happy.
I would also love to the a quotable source for this just in case I need to show a GM.
Drake Brimstone |
Ah yes, Carry Companion, the ultimate spell for: I can always take my animal companion along thank you very much.
There are a few scenarios I've played where getting an animal companion to come along would be problematic (and one where having a non-flier/climb capable animal companion was annoying), however creativity should be used (and was used in one scenario) and rewarded with the inclusion of the animal companion.
** spoiler omitted **
I got my AC into one of those.
Thinking on this, I now have a new bluff to use next time I have to get my AC into an otherwise socially "unacceptable" situation. I will tell them my legs are crippled and I can't walk well so I have to ride my (Medium Sized) Giant Wasp everywhere. I can't think of any scenario where I can't get that AC anywhere any PC can go (Pending bluff checks for when the limitation is social instead of physical.) Even if I fail the bluff, my Wasp has a high enough stealth that they could probably just sneak in.
Wedjat |
Oh, wouldn't a tattooed companion be great!
Fluffer, meet Wedjat, a third party eagle in a non PFS campaign. Could I have your advice on some feats for him? He carries a non-melee caster cleric around.
He's starting at level 5, and has three feats, 11 tricks, and 5 skill points to spend. I'd love your suggestions and advice.
Hmm
Sebastian Hirsch Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria |
After losing an animal companion to a ghosts touch attack I humbly suggest the following tactic:
Raise animal companion INT to 3+ (either via level advancement, or other methods)
Take
hough not a swashbuckler, you have and can use panache.
Prerequisite(s): No levels in a class that has the panache class feature.
Benefit: You gain a small amount of panache and the ability to perform a single 1st-level swashbuckler deed. Choose a 1st-level deed from the swashbuckler's deeds class feature; once chosen, this deed cannot be changed.
At the start of each day, you gain 1 panache point. Throughout the day, you can gain a number of panache points up to a maximum of your Charisma modifier (minimum 1). You can regain panache points as the swashbuckler's panache class feature. You can spend these panache points to perform the 1st-level deed you chose upon taking this feat as well as any other deeds you have gained through feats or magic items.
Special: If you gain levels in a class that has the panache class feature, you can immediately trade this feat for the Extra Panache feat.
Take
: At 1st level, when an opponent makes a melee attack against the swashbuckler, she can spend 1 panache point and expend a use of an attack of opportunity to attempt to parry that attack. The swashbuckler makes an attack roll as if she were making an attack of opportunity; for each size category the attacking creature is larger than the swashbuckler, the swashbuckler takes a –2 penalty on this roll. If her result is greater than the attacking creature's result, the creature's attack automatically misses. The swashbuckler must declare the use of this ability after the creature's attack is announced, but before its attack roll is made. Upon performing a successful parry and if she has at least 1 panache point, the swashbuckler can as an immediate action make an attack against the creature whose attack she parried, provided that creature is within her reach.
Combat reflexes and extra panache make this build far better and an offensive animal companion (large cat, raptor) with plenty of piercing attacks is suggested.
Boots and a stylish hat are optional^^
BretI Venture-Lieutenant, Minnesota—Minneapolis |
So I'm a human with a medium wolf companion and the Undersized Mount feat.
Without any extra feats, what magical stuff can I equip him with? What non-magical stuff can I equip him with? Do I have to have a saddle to ride him?
If this is for PFS, your wolf only has a neck slot. Amulet of mighty fists is the usual choice.
Yes, you can and should put light armor barding on your wolf to protect it. Provided it has no Armor Check Penalty, there is no need for armor proficiency. If you want to go to medium amor, then you will want to get both light and medium armor proficiency.
Without a saddle, Ride is at -5. Read the Ride skill and decide how much of an investment you want to make.
Flutter |
So I'm a human with a medium wolf companion and the Undersized Mount feat.
Without any extra feats, what magical stuff can I equip him with? What non-magical stuff can I equip him with? Do I have to have a saddle to ride him?
Magical- Neck slot (there's a chapter on that up above)
ArmorStone of Alliance
Potions, Oils, scrolls, and wands of spells that they'd find useful. Carry companion can't be stressed enough. One of my most useful items for friends I meet along the way is a wand of mage armor.
Non magical
Armor- Leather for a starting adventurer, masterwork studded leather until they hit their growth spurt, then mithral chain or mithral kikko armor.
Training harness: +2 to handle animal checks
Whet bone until you get an amulet of mighty fists
Exotic military saddle, since wolfies don't normally wear saddles, and you probably don't want to fall off if you get clonked in the head.
Flutter |
What about if I get off my mount, does he still act on my initiative?
Yes. While there are actions that can change your initiative (delay, ready) there's no "the person i rolled initiave with isn't there any more so I have to reoll initiative" rule. Once your initiative is set its more or less set.
As long as you're not doing anything shady like pumping your initiative to the stratosphere and dismounting wolfie as a free action every turn you'll be fine.
What about encumbrance, can he still function well as a mount if he's got a medium load?
Medium load Max dex +3 Armor check penalty –3 Speed 50 feet becomes 35 feet movement.
Thats not horrible for a mount but its not great either. A potion of ant haul, a wand of ant haul you hand to pretty much any other party member may not be a bad idea.
claudekennilol |
I'm just not very familiar with mounted combat, specifically. I'm probably never actually going to ride him, but I want to know what the rules are for handling it.
I'm probably never going to actually ride him. The only reason I have the undersized mount feat (and a level in cavalier) is so my hunter can qualify for a worg companion via the monstrous mount feat. I wanted to be melee, so it was either be a small race with small weapon die (and probably a str penalty) or a human using up my bonus feat on Undersized Mount (so either no feat spent on it or spend a bonus feat on it which nets out to the same number of other feats to spend) and get a str bonus from human floating bonus.
Flutter |
I'm probably never going to actually ride him. The only reason I have the undersized mount feat (and a level in cavalier) is so my hunter can qualify for a worg companion via the monstrous mount feat.
I think you can do that just off of the hunter companion
Prerequisite(s): Handle Animal 4 ranks; Ride 4 ranks; divine bond (mount), hunter's bond (animal companion), or mount class feature with an effective druid level of 4.
A druid would have to dip hunter or cavalier but a strait hunter seems to meet it.
I wanted to be melee, so it was either be a small race with small weapon die (and probably a str penalty) or a human using up my bonus feat on Undersized Mount (so either no feat spent on it or spend a bonus feat on it which nets out to the same number of other feats to spend) and get a str bonus from human floating bonus.
Wayangs are small and don't have as strength penalty. If you get a lance though small cavaliers are amazingly effective, even with the smaller die and minor penalties, X3 damage starts to add up.
Artoo |
claudekennilol wrote:
I'm probably never going to actually ride him. The only reason I have the undersized mount feat (and a level in cavalier) is so my hunter can qualify for a worg companion via the monstrous mount feat.
I think you can do that just off of the hunter companion
Prerequisite(s): Handle Animal 4 ranks; Ride 4 ranks; divine bond (mount), hunter's bond (animal companion), or mount class feature with an effective druid level of 4.
A druid would have to dip hunter or cavalier but a strait hunter seems to meet it.
Hunter's Bond is the name of the Ranger class feature. For Hunters it's just called Animal Companion.