So I only play PFS online thus far as we don't have a local group yet. I know the GM's have so much on their plate already. What is the best way to handle when a player is not cheating, but lets just say doing something by mistake. Example: Someone useing a large sized greatsword 3d6. It was titan maouler but I don't think they were awared how handness worked. There are lots of other little things I notice sometime but I don't want to stop a game to call the player out or anything. I welcome correction if I have something wrong. I know I don't know everything but my system mastery is good enough to catch things on the fly. Was just wondering what is the best way to address this or if I should even care about if others are doing something wrong. Thanks
|
The onus of how a character's mechanics work is on the player. If you have questions of something, he should be able to answer. It is not expected that you, the GM, should have mastery of every character mechanic out there.
If there is something you don't understand, and it is not game breaking (like your Titan mauler example), I would recommend asking that player how the mechanic works during a break or even after the game. It just might be a simple mistake that the both of your can figure out and learn more about together.
These teaching moments are what brings a community together and garner respect for each other.
|
It sounds like the OP was another player at the table, rather than the GM.
If you're sure of the mistake, then not stopping the game or distracting the GM is a good tactic. Maybe write some text in the VTT chat while the GM is talking (to someone other than you or the other player)? Or mention it while the GM is busy switching maps?
Above all, be polite: the other player has made a minor mistake, and you just want to be helpful in correcting it in future. No doubt they'd be grateful if you told them of a mistake where the correction benefited them.
Yeah I was not GM'ing I was playing. When we play home game we help and correct each other all the time and do arena style play sometimes to work out mechanics or try new builds. I didn't have a question on how it works. I know how things work and catch people making mistakes all the time was just wondering if others notice this and how they may handle it or if I should care. I often get asked how my builds work when I do something surprising like massive damage or something and am happy to share. I just didn't want to be like hey man you know you can't do that right? and stop the game,
I am hoping to start to run games starting maybe next month. As GM's do you guys find you correct people a lot or do you just assume they are doing it right? As stated I don't think the things I have seen are them strait forward cheating, it just seems they don't quite know how sometihng works.
|
Paz has some good ideas there, and I would like to elaborate a little. My comments here should be valid for online or IRL play.
1) Never feel afraid to ask "How do you do that?", either as a GM or a player? Answering such a question can help the player figure out there was a problem, or if there wasn't, teach others how they did that (in case you, or someone else, wants to exploit the same rule).
2) Let the GM make a ruling on the spot. If it isn't game breaking, then a quick ruling (after the above explanation) will allow the game to continue. Then, after the game, for SURE look up all the pertinent rules, and correct what is necessary (note: this may require a retrain).
3) Unless there is more than circumstantial evidence (such as having talked with the same player about the same character's rule violation in previous games), assume that the error was accidental. This will help keep things civil!
I will say that there have been times while GMing, that I have wondered about someone's build... but have let it go with "Well, if they want to cheat, the only person they are really cheating is themselves!"
Its not I'm asking myself how they did that. I'm usually thinking well thats not legal or correct. I play a lot. My friends and I build and rebuild and tear apart builds. I can optimize and powergame with the best. I know I don't know everthing, but I do look up stuff if its new to me. Same guy was also swinging +14 with oversized sword when raging. Again imposible. He was level 3. Feats were two weapon fighting, Step up and he was human so bonus I think was double slice as his damage when two handing was the same, if not well that was just another thing wrong. So BAB +3, Raging Str was +6, so even if other feat was weapon focus that takes it to +10, MW makes it 11. weapon size takes it back to +9 but titan mauler reduces that by 1 to back to +10 so +12 on charge, maybe he had reckless abandon to to to +13 he didn't state he was using it so I don't know but thats still 1 shy and if it was this way his two handed damage was wrong b/c he didn't have double slice.
I just don't want to be the guys saying hey your cool thing your doing well you can't do that. Eo you guys run accross this or do you tend not to notice/care what others are doing?
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
During my mini introduction speech, I ask the players at my table if there is anything their character can do that is really out of the ordinary (+15 to Stealth at 1st level or something like that). It is at that time, I ask them how are they able to do it.
I find players typically like this because they get a little bragging time to talk about their PC. It is also helpful to me to know before hand instead of stopping the game and asking how the PC did 60 points of damage from a dagger attack.
|
|
Ashe: I just wanted to say Bravo on you for having the courage to want to bring this up. It really is very important to hammer out errors like this as early as possible. Mostly because the earlier an error is caught, the less foolish/angry the player will feel. Also it helps reduce errors from spreading throughout the community.
Good luck with whichever method you use.
During my mini introduction speech, I ask the players at my table if there is anything their character can do that is really out of the ordinary (+15 to Stealth at 1st level or something like that). It is at that time, I ask them how are they able to do it.
I find players typically like this because they get a little bragging time to talk about their PC. It is also helpful to me to know before hand instead of stopping the game and asking how the PC did 60 points of damage from a dagger attack.
Yeah I will have much more control when I GM and will not feel bad about corecting players its just as another player I hate to be that guy, but most of the time I think they are doing it wrong b/c they are unaware and no one has been that guy to say hey this is wrong. I don't know.
Ashe: I just wanted to say Bravo on you for having the courage to want to bring this up. It really is very important to hammer out errors like this as early as possible. Mostly because the earlier an error is caught, the less foolish/angry the player will feel. Also it helps reduce errors from spreading throughout the community.
Good luck with whichever method you use.
Thanks. Yeah I don't want to be a jerk. I want to help people. I know not everyone has the time to poor over all the books and optimize and what not, or to investigate a build before trying it. I just didn't want to stop game play over it. thanks.
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I think that, even if you are 99.5% sure that you know the rules and the other player is doing it wrong, asking "how does your character do that?" is a good, non-threatening way to start the conversation. It sounds more cooperative to say "let's figure out how the works properly" instead of "I'm going to tell you how you're doing it wrong" even if you get to the same result in the end.
|
|
During my mini introduction speech, I ask the players at my table if there is anything their character can do that is really out of the ordinary (+15 to Stealth at 1st level or something like that). It is at that time, I ask them how are they able to do it.
I find players typically like this because they get a little bragging time to talk about their PC. It is also helpful to me to know before hand instead of stopping the game and asking how the PC did 60 points of damage from a dagger attack.
I like this A LOT!!
It has been recommended by a GM (and V-L) locally that a useful tool as a GM is to go around the table (in character), having someone as "What makes you special?" - or something like that. The idea is to get the feel for the character, see why she would have been selected as a Pathfinder, and to also get an introduction out there. I think I'll be reworking how I do this (which has gotten mixed results so far... but I keep trying!)
Fictitious Example:
The party is waiting to see Venture-Captain Ambrus Valsin at the Grand Lodge. While they are in the waiting room, Valsin's clerk comes out, asking...
"Pathfinders, Venture-Captain Valsin is a busy man. While he is meeting with important persons... no you needn't ask who they are... he has tasked me with creating a summary of the team that he will be sending on the next mission."
"Xander Broog, what is your area of specialization?"
Xander, "Um, I fight good?"
Clerk: "I am sure you've picked up some interesting tricks over the years... what is something that you do better than any other Pathfinder you've worked with?"
Xander: "Well, I use this Greataxe that I picked up off the corpse of a Hill Giant we killed a few months back. Seems to do really a lot of damage."
Clerk: "Very good, Mr. Broog. I see that you'll make a fine front line fighter for this team. Something that is always needed."
Clerk: "Jayne Munny... good to see you again. Still out there blasting away at the monsters with that musket of yours?"
Munny: "Yeah, pretty much, though Vera's gotten a bit more reliable as of late. Oh, and Abadar has graced me with his Divine Power... I am now a Lawman of Abadar."
...
And so on.
Try and draw out what the player thinks is special about his character, and then ask a couple of leading questions towards how that "special" thing works.
Going around the table shouldn't take more than 5 minutes.
This is also a good time to prompt for usage of Additional Materials, and the like. Better to find out now (which, of course, is required, but who actually announces the usages?), then later.
Also a good time to bring up things that may be considered "table variation" at your table (using a Spring-Loaded Wrist Sheath is a "Retrieve an Item" action, and thus provokes).