Saurian druid wild shape question


Rules Questions


I am confused as to how wild shape works as a saurian druid. The book says that at 6th level, a wild shape of anything but a dinosaur will function at druid level -2 but a dinosaur will function at druid level +2. I read this to mean that a saurian druid can use wild shape to turn into a large size dinosaur at an earlier level, but will be limited to a small/ med non dinosaur for longer than normal.

I just leveled my saurian druid to level 2. Hero Lab is now telling me I can now wild shape into a dinosaur once a day. Very confused here.

Shadow Lodge

Probably a Hero Lab glitch. I don't use it personally, but I know glitches aren't unheard of.

Liberty's Edge

pogie wrote:
I just leveled my saurian druid to level 2. Hero Lab is now telling me I can now wild shape into a dinosaur once a day. Very confused here.

Could you be looking at Totem Transformation? That is the second level ability, it is a limited shape change ability.

I've never seen Wild Shape at L2 on my Saurian Shaman.


No, it is showing totemic transformation at level 2 which I was suspecting and also saurian wild shape.


That's definitely a glitch. A saurian shaman doesn't wild shape until level 6. At level 6, she can wild shape into a reptile or dinosaur as a level 8 druid or another form as a level 4 druid.

Edit: I just fired up Hero Lab and made a saurian shaman and saw the same thing. Yeah, that's messed up.

Edit the second: Also, I'm actually wrong by RAW. Technically, you still get wild shape as normal at 4, but the modifiers kick in at 6. This is weird, but then so is RAW.


That is correct and not a glitch. The APG doesn't say the Druid gets wild shape at 6th level. Unlike other archetypes it says the how the ability functions. Shamans are special in that they still get their wild shape at 2nd level and at 6th level it gets modified.

Edit: Not sure why it is giving wild shape at 2nd level. I am seeing the same thing in Hero Lab


Except neither regular druids nor * shamans get wild shape at 2nd level. They get it at 4th. The * shaman modifier doesn't kick in until 6th, so you don't get early entry.

2: No wild shape
3: No wild shape
4: Wild shape as 4, same as regular druids
5: Wild shape as 5
6: Wild shape as 8 (reptile, dinosaur) or 4 (everything else)
7: +1
8: +1
...

Grand Lodge

Unless a ruling has come out to the contrary in the past few months, your character won't have access to Wild Shape until 6th-level. I'm under the impression that this is an error on Hero Lab's part, but would need additional information/research. I have a 12-level saurian shaman in PFS.


By RAW, you get it at 4th (but not 2nd). By RAI, you get it at 6th (per this post by the designer).


I agree with Blahpers. The other archetypes specifically state you "gain" wild shape at x level and the shamans just say your wild shape ability now "functions" like.

I think what hero lab might be doing is calculating the +2 for shaping in to a dinosaur which would make you level 4 in terms of using the ability.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

pogie wrote:
I just leveled my saurian druid to level 2. Hero Lab is now telling me I can now wild shape into a dinosaur once a day. Very confused here.

You are correct (level 6 at 4th for dino, level 2 at 4th for non-dino), but the HeroLab staff disagree on the reading of the rules. You just have to ignore it or get a post from Paizo confirming it. The only official confirmation has came from the Author. Until SKR/Dev team/etc respond, HeroLab won't change it.

Sczarni

Don't rely on Hero Lab... put everything together using the books or online "books".

Also, it depends on how your GM and You interpret it. When it comes to the Shaman archetypes or any that mess with your Wild Shape, it's about how you perceive it. What's odd is that, even though they supposedly are just supposed to receive it at level 6 period, they worded other archetypes differently, saying you receive it at 4, but it functions as x level depending on form. A lot of folks say those are supposed to be received at level 6 too, but the wording says otherwise. I go by the wording of each archetype as stated in the rules for it. Either way, it's not gamebreaking.

Sczarni

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42 people have clicked an FAQ request HERE to get this resolved. The consensus so far is that Shamans do not gain Wildshape until 6th level (and as such wouldn't be able to take Wildshape feats until that point).

Let's continue the discussion over there.

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