Rhino Hide, Powerful Charge, and Pounce


Rules Questions

Lantern Lodge

Hey guys!
Building a barbarian that focuses on his mount (He'll be riding the druid's animal companion, his own mount, or the druid himself depending on the circumstances).

After getting greater beast totem and the animal fury rage powers, my mount will have a gore, bite, and two claw attacks while raging with me. My question is how Powerful Charge and Rhino hide interact with pounce and addition attacks.

Powerful Charge wrote:
When a creature with this special attack makes a charge, its attack deals extra damage in addition to the normal benefits and hazards of a charge. The attack and amount of damage from the attack is given in the creature's description.
Rhino Hide wrote:
This +2 hide armor is made from rhinoceros hide. In addition to granting a +2 enhancement bonus to AC, it has a –1 armor check penalty and deals an additional 2d6 points of damage on any successful charge attack made by the wearer, including a mounted charge.
Pounce wrote:
When a creature with this special attack makes a charge, it can make a full attack (including rake attacks if the creature also has the rake ability).

1. Can a monster use Powerful Charge and Pounce at the same time?

2. Does the Powerful Charge bonus apply to all, or just one attack at the end of the charge?
3. Assuming that both I and my mount have the charge through and trample feats, does my mount gain a +2 to it's free attack (from Trample), because it is charging at the same time? Does it's free attack gain the benefits of Powerful Charge?
4.Does Rhino Hide only add 2d6 damage to the first attack in a pounce charge, or does it add 2d6 to all attacks?

Thanks in advanced guys (and gals)!

Lantern Lodge

Shameless bump


1. Yes, powerful charge increases damage on a charge, and pounce is only triggered on a successful charge.
2. It's been a tough topic to pin down for a definitive answer, but the general consensus (on some topics) is that the increased damage from powerful charge would only occur on the first attack from pounce, not all attacks. GM can always rule otherwise of courser.
3. Mount only gains benefit of powerful charge if the mount itself has powerful charge and is the creature delivering the powerful charge attack. Similarly, if the rider doesn't have powerful charge, he/she couldn't benefit from the mount's powerful charge increased damage. This can be a grey area for the base Cavalier class though, so be careful. I don't know about the Charge Through and Trample feats, so I can't answer this one.
4. See answer 2 for this one, for the same reasons as stated in answer 2. Again, this is a often fought over topic, so deal with your GM (or yourself, if you're GMing) as to whether this should work on anything more than the first attack after a successful Pounce.


1&2. Sort of... but mostly no. A powerful charge is a specific special attack that is listed in the monster's stat block. So you just get that one "powerful charge" attack because it is listed as an attack ability. Or you could make a full attack with pounce, not both.

3. Only the mount needs charge through, because only the mount is charging. If you are riding a mount, there is literally no reason for you to have charge through. The bonus to attacks made on a charge generally apply only to the target of the charge, but I could see an argument for getting the +2 on the overrun check (also, check out coordinated maneuvers... good feat for mounted combat).

3B. Again, powerful charge is a special attack, not just a bonus to attacks made during a charge, so no... it would just be a regular AoO.

4. Rhino Hide does indeed apply to all attack made as part of a charge so yes, it will apply to all pounce attacks.


Lord_Malkov wrote:
1&2. Sort of... but mostly no. A powerful charge is a specific special attack that is listed in the monster's stat block. So you just get that one "powerful charge" attack because it is listed as an attack ability. Or you could make a full attack with pounce, not both.
PRD wrote:
Powerful Charge (Ex) When a creature with this special attack makes a charge, its attack deals extra damage in addition to the normal benefits and hazards of a charge. The attack and amount of damage from the attack is given in the creature's description.

The action being used is not "Powerful Charge". The action is making a Charge attack, which benefits from the Powerful Charge special attack. At least based on the minimal description in the Bestiary, I can't see anything that would disallow you to combine Powerful Charge and Pounce, though I agree with Daniel that you should likely get the bonus on the first attack only.

Similarly, a creature with the Disease special attack doesn't make a separate "Disease" or "Spread Disease" action in combat to benefit from the special attack. That creature simply augments whatever action the special attack is relevant to. It should work the same for Powerful Charge.

Pounce and Powerful Charge aren't really separate actions on their own, they both simply modify what happens on a Charge.

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