Table Variation


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The Exchange 5/5 RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

That's because your doughty faunic companion is trying to do all that with a Received Pronunciation accent, Paul. It just sounds smarter, that's all.

Scarab Sages 5/5

pauljathome wrote:
Bob Jonquet wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
This was clarified for pfs
[Pet peeve] GMs who claim that my IQ 7 familiar is acting too intelligently while other vermin and constructs seem to completely understand flanking rules, AoO's, etc [/pet peeve]

Even my Int 5 foulspawn understands flanking and AoO

I agree that 'mindless' creatures will even move into position, and ready and action for a flank - and then take the attack when the flank is in place.

I find this occurs way more often when all the critters of a same initiative (either all mobs are the same, or each type - the zombies move on initiative X, the wight on initiative Y - for example) - it is far less common when the mobs are not on the same init point so their prey might step out of the flank.

1/5 Venture-Captain, Germany–Hannover

Lingering performance sees some great table variation i guess.
It´s either you only need 1/3 of bardic performance (wrong i believe) or you need to start a new bardic performance every 3 rounds.

Also lighting rules in combination with sneak attack.
I have the feeling a lot of tables disregard that completely (to the joy of rogue/ninja players).

Dark Archive 4/5

Benjamin Falk wrote:

Lingering performance sees some great table variation i guess.

It´s either you only need 1/3 of bardic performance (wrong i believe) or you need to start a new bardic performance every 3 rounds.

Also lighting rules in combination with sneak attack.
I have the feeling a lot of tables disregard that completely (to the joy of rogue/ninja players).

This is why my characters with SA all have dark vision

2/5

Another rule with variation is what you can use while holding a light shield, or other instances where a 'free hand' is less than free, but still can do some things. I've seen metamagic rods, laying on hands, & even some saying you can cast with your shield hand.
And what is 'fine manipulation' with a weapon cord?
What if the weapon cord is on your waist?

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Sammy T wrote:
As a GM or player, what things have you personally experienced table variation on?

How illusions work (specifically "interaction" and disbelief).

Darkness/light effects.

Whether or not an NPC/monster needs to be aware of what my PC's best defenses are before working around them.

Pretty much any situation where a rule is defined as working like a certain parent rule except as otherwise specified but doesn't reiterate every single detail of that parent rule. Anything not reiterated in the more specific rule (i.e., anything which would cause "works like parent rule X" to actually mean something) has a chance of not being applied "because it doesn't say it applies".

4/5

Bob Jonquet wrote:
Chris Mortika wrote:
Another common issue I've noticed: NPCs and initiative. Do all the opponents act at once, or does each foe have its on initiative? That makes a huge difference.
As a GM more than a player, I have pondered this issue myself. To be "fair" NPC/monsters should act on individually determined initiative. However, I have decided that as long as companions (animal or familiars) continue to play on their handler's initiative and function like there is a hive-mind, I will treat the bad guys the same way. That may not be the ideal circumstance and not the way I would run a home-game, but for the sake of efficiency and time management, some compromises are in order. YMMV

I've gone back and forth on this. I always ran the bad guys at the same time because it was easier for me as a GM and it saved time.

Then I saw a few TPKs that were only possible because the bad guys all went at once. Taking 10-15 hits from an entire party of bad guys in a single round can be very deadly. It's a lot easier to survive a combat if you take 2 hits from one bad guy, then someone in your party can react before the rest of the bad guys drop the hammer on you. It forces the bad guys to respond to players strategy and movements, and that makes the players actions in combat carry more weight.

Lately, I've been trying a mixed approach. I divide the bad guys into different groups, usually two or three mooks in a group with the BBEG going on his own initiative. If any of the mooks have different initiative modifiers, I pair them up. It's easier than running every bad guy on his own initiative, but it's more fair to the players than having all the bad guys go at once.

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/55/5

Chris Mortika wrote:

That's because your doughty faunic companion is trying to do all that with a Received Pronunciation accent, Paul. It just sounds smarter, that's all.

TRYING!?!?! My accent is flawless! Good day-to-you-SIR!

4/5 *

Castilliano wrote:
Another rule with variation is what you can use while holding a light shield, or other instances where a 'free hand' is less than free, but still can do some things. I've seen metamagic rods, laying on hands, & even some saying you can cast with your shield hand.

You can "carry other items" but can't "use weapons"; I would think that precludes using most items, although laying on hands might be reasonable. I can definitely see table variation there.

Castilliano wrote:
And what is 'fine manipulation' with a weapon cord?

A very good question. I'd love to see an FAQ on this, and similar situations (gauntlets, cestus, etc.).

Castilliano wrote:
What if the weapon cord is on your waist?

Thankfully, that one is easy:

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
Weapon cords are 2-foot-long leather straps that attach your weapon to your wrist.

Also, don't forget the new errata that weapon cords require a move action to recover your weapon now, rather than the printed swift.

The Exchange 5/5

Hay Tony - what was the errata for? I checked and didn't notice it in the Adventurers Armory - which is the source I would use for weapon cords...

(edit: I think I found what you are talking about! it's an FAQ entry.)

4/5

Dorothy Lindman wrote:

I've gone back and forth on this. I always ran the bad guys at the same time because it was easier for me as a GM and it saved time.

Then I saw a few TPKs that were only possible because the bad guys all went at once. Taking 10-15 hits from an entire party of bad guys in a single round can be very deadly. It's a lot easier to survive a combat if you take 2 hits from one bad guy, then someone in your party can react before the rest of the bad guys drop the hammer on you. It forces the bad guys to respond to players strategy and movements, and that makes the players actions in combat carry more weight.

Lately, I've been trying a mixed approach. I divide the bad guys into different groups, usually two or three mooks in a group with the BBEG going on his own initiative. If any of the mooks have different initiative modifiers, I pair them up. It's easier than running every bad guy on his own initiative, but it's more fair to the players than having all the bad guys go at once.

My current solution for this is to roll the initiative for all the bad guys during prep. I line them up off to the side on my combat pad and bring groups over for each encounter, inserting the PCs in once they've rolled.

I always ask the players first if they're okay with it, but so far no one has minded.

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

I've recently started rolling separate initiative for mooks, and I find it doesn't add a significant amount of time. Unless you're running "Murder on the Silken Caravan" at the high subtier. So... many... goblins...

Silver Crusade 2/5

I broke those goblins into "red team"/"blue team", etc. Otherwise, I roll separately.

Sovereign Court 4/5 5/5 ***

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
RainyDayNinja wrote:
I've recently started rolling separate initiative for mooks, and I find it doesn't add a significant amount of time. Unless you're running "Murder on the Silken Caravan" at the high subtier. So... many... goblins...

Roll20 does this by default and I liked the effect it was having on my games, so I transferred it to my real life GMing. I just run into a problem when there's a lot of enemies. When I run a certain Season 4 7-11 on high tier, I have to tear the index cards in half to make them thinner so they will fit on the table.

Grand Lodge 4/5

James McTeague wrote:
RainyDayNinja wrote:
I've recently started rolling separate initiative for mooks, and I find it doesn't add a significant amount of time. Unless you're running "Murder on the Silken Caravan" at the high subtier. So... many... goblins...
Roll20 does this by default and I liked the effect it was having on my games, so I transferred it to my real life GMing. I just run into a problem when there's a lot of enemies. When I run a certain Season 4 7-11 on high tier, I have to tear the index cards in half to make them thinner so they will fit on the table.

Does that mean that you can select multiple tokens, hit the Init macro, and it rolls for each token selected individually?

Shadow Lodge 4/5

New one to the list:

Rogue's Skill Mastery and UMD

Some GMs allow it and other GMs (like me) do not.

My Reasoning:

-Normal skill use: You can Take 10 if not distracted/threatened.
-Skill Mastery skill use: You can Take 10 even if distracted/threatened.
-Use Magic Device: Not allowed to Take 10. Period. You must roll.

Skill Mastery only applies to skill usage in adverse conditions.

Take 10 can't be applied to Use Magic Device in any situation, adverse or not.

Skill Mastery in no way overrides UMD's "cannot Take 10" restriction. (It's not 'stress and distractions' that preventing Taking 10 on UMD, you just simply cannot Take 10 for UMD.)

So, Skill Mastery does not apply to UMD.

Grand Lodge 4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

Interesting. All that does is move the total bonus required to auto-succeed up by 9, but is something to keep in mind.

(e.g. if you could take 10 you would just need a +10 to always succeed at activating a wand, which means that since you cannot take 10 you need a +19 before you no longer need to roll.)

4/5

Sammy T wrote:

New one to the list:

Rogue's Skill Mastery and UMD

Some GMs allow it and other GMs (like me) do not.

** spoiler omitted **

The fact that UMD is the only skill with a negative result on a natural 1 should also tell you something about taking 10 with it.

5/5 5/55/55/5

A rogue made it to level 10? Dear gods let them bask in the only use of that ability.

The Exchange 5/5

redward wrote:
Sammy T wrote:

New one to the list:

Rogue's Skill Mastery and UMD

Some GMs allow it and other GMs (like me) do not.

** spoiler omitted **

The fact that UMD is the only skill with a negative result on a natural 1 should also tell you something about taking 10 with it.

ah... that would be a negative result on a FAILed check on a natural 1. And even then it only applies to the "Try Again" section...

"Try Again: Yes, but if you ever roll a natural 1 while attempting to activate an item and you fail, then you can't try to activate that item again for 24 hours."

a lot of skills have negitive results on failed rolls. Fail a Disable Device check to disable a trap by 10 and you have "negative results", lol! Fail a UMD by 18 and you have no negitive results - unless you rolled a nat "1".

I do not see how the Take 10 rules and the UMD check failure on a "1" rule are related at all...

Grand Lodge 4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
nosig wrote:
I do not see how the Take 10 rules and the UMD check failure on a "1" rule are related at all...

If you could take 10 a player could avoid ever risking rolling a natural 1 on a check, simply by comparing his bonus to the DC.

The Exchange 5/5

TriOmegaZero wrote:
nosig wrote:
I do not see how the Take 10 rules and the UMD check failure on a "1" rule are related at all...
If you could take 10 a player could avoid ever risking rolling a natural 1 on a check.

ah! yes. so this would prevent "Jams" unless you are really good...

thanks!

5/5

Eh, you can take 10 on UMD with a single level dip into Pathfinder Savant Prc. I'd let the Skill Mastery work, but that's me.

5/5 *****

TriOmegaZero wrote:

Interesting. All that does is move the total bonus required to auto-succeed up by 9, but is something to keep in mind.

(e.g. if you could take 10 you would just need a +10 to always succeed at activating a wand, which means that since you cannot take 10 you need a +19 before you no longer need to roll.)

Even at +19 don't you still have to roll as a natural 1 on UMD will always fail regardless if you meet the DC?

Grand Lodge 4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
andreww wrote:
Even at +19 don't you still have to roll as a natural 1 on UMD will always fail regardless if you meet the DC?

Nope.

"Try Again: Yes, but if you ever roll a natural 1 while attempting to activate an item and you fail, then you can't try to activate that item again for 24 hours."

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

BigNorseWolf wrote:
A rogue made it to level 10? Dear gods let them bask in the only use of that ability.

*cocks his head to the side*

"What you say? No others? *caw* Good, good. More biz-niss for me!"

(currently level 13 Rogue (no multi-classing), will be 14 after GMing Siege of the Diamond City at Conquest, and then 15 if I survive the Academy of Secrets)

5/5 *****

TriOmegaZero wrote:
andreww wrote:
Even at +19 don't you still have to roll as a natural 1 on UMD will always fail regardless if you meet the DC?

Nope.

"Try Again: Yes, but if you ever roll a natural 1 while attempting to activate an item and you fail, then you can't try to activate that item again for 24 hours."

Doh, I swear I read that section several times before posting.

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