Because if they aren't random they don't make as many minis.Uh, yes, that is my point. Nor would the end user have to buy more than they need to get what they need.
And I never get a complete set of Daemons, no thanks.
How much shipping will it cost to get a case to Europe?Shipping to Denmark is $49.75 minus a $10 discount which I honestly don't remember why I got.Because a case is more than $100, so Paizo pays the first $10 of shipping.
Tip: If you want to find out how much shipping will be, just put it in your cart, and start checkout. Paizo tells you what the shipping will be before you have to enter any payment details so you can just go back to your shopping cart after looking.
The "first ten" discount sometimes strikes me as a little odd. It seems like I could split my order of two cases and get the discount twice which feels kinda counterproductive, from paizo's perspective..
I like the looks, don't like the pricing. $4 for a single random medium miniature? $6 for a single random large? Pass.
Never mind shipping costs. Aren't these prices why WotC tried to use special 4e power cards to try to get people to buy their $4 non-random plastic miniatures? Didn't that kill the miniatures anyway?
Is there any clue as to how much the promotional black dragon will cost?
First, PF.. thanks for a great RP game :)
Second, lets crunch some numbers (Life is always better when you can see the numnbers). 40 minis in a set, correct? Lgs will cost $6, meds $4 and smalls $2 (you get 2 smalls in a pack).
PF is saying that you should get all (or nearly all) of the minis in a case - and a case costs $279-. Lets say that you're lucky (or their randomizing is really good) and you do. Yaay! What's a case? A case is 4 bricks and a brick is 19 boosters (16 s/m and 3 large). So a case is 64 s/m and 12 large. Therefore, PF is saying that the max number of larges they are doing is 12.
40-12 = 28. Lets split the 28 halfway into meds and smalls.
Lets also say that if you were to buy them singly, PF would "mark it up" a dollar. This makes smalls $3, meds $5 and larges $7. PF does this, well, because they love you and don't want to gouge you.
So lets add that up -
smalls: 14 x $3 = $42
meds: 14 x $5 = $70
larges: 12 x $7 = $84total: $84 + $70 + $42 = $196
I think my math is ok... lol
So you pay about $80 extra to preorder them on the (fingers crossed) hope that you'll get everything. (If not you'll have to buy up the singles). On the plus side you'll get the dragon.. and I do like dragons. I'll have to think hard on that.
I haven't looked through all 37 pages of the thread yet.. has someone from PF explained why they aren't just offering us whole complete sets. As i understand it, the problem is that Wizkids and PF don't want to have a whole bunch of minis left unsold. Understandable. But has PF seen how many pre-orders they'd get if they offered a complete set at their above prices? (the cost, btw would be $156. I leave arriving at that answer as an exercise for the reader). I would put down $156- in a heartbeat for the whole set. I'd also put down $200- for the whole set + dragon.
For me, its partly the money. But its mostly principle. Paizo has been amazingly responsive to its customer base with PF and has shown that treating its customers like adults is a...
One issue with your analysis is that a complete set would only be 40 minis and a case would be around 108 minis (estimating half the s/m boosters having small figs). So for less than twice the $156 you would get more than 2.5 times as many figs.
Complete collections (1 of each) are only good for collectors. Those playing the game want a lot of goblins, orc, etc. (basically the common and uncommon minis).
Actually if you released a complete set I would buy it over a case. Unless you announce something like that though I will continue to save to preorder a case.
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some drink from the font of knowledge while others mearly gargle.
Some pee into it.
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I like the looks, don't like the pricing. $4 for a single random medium miniature? $6 for a single random large? Pass.
Never mind shipping costs. Aren't these prices why WotC tried to use special 4e power cards to try to get people to buy their $4 non-random plastic miniatures? Didn't that kill the miniatures anyway?
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line. What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.
Paizo has said they will sell singles. They could if they choose decide to sell special "sets" as well, such as a complete set, group of mooks #1, group of mooks #2, ..., underground threats, ... Obviously the types of groups would depend on the actual miniatures in the set.
I'll keep an eye on this for the secondary market (probably not here though, sadly Paizo's single miniature prices don't tend to be very competitive in my experience). I won't drop $4 on a medium or $6 on a large. So I'll look for the commons when they get cheap.
As to the specific marketing, I don't mind random sets, I have purchased some random boosters in the past when the entire set by and large was interesting to me. I dislike single randoms though. Let's say they were put into 4 packs as a comparison, from my experience in a single multi-mini booster, I haven't seen the same miniature ever show up more than once in a booster.
So if I purchased 8 miniatures, the most I'm going to get is doubles in a 4 mini pack, but I have the potential of getting 8 of the same miniature in a single mini pack. I don't like those odds. So I doubt if I'll ever purchase these boosters directly. When they start doing multi-mini boosters I have to look at the list of minis and see if they catch my interest.
So good luck to both Paizo and WizKids, I'll keep my eye on these developments and when they strike my interest I'll pick them up.
Plenty of companies do non randoms and have it work.
Name them. Remember, we're talking about pre-painted plastic.
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line.
I am not going to read the long ass thread to perchance come across a discussion of Wizard miniatures
What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.
Upon making them non-random, their prices increased 50-100% and their quality did not change. I'm sure making them non-random hurt the "gambling" draw of buying a random pack, but I certainly wasn't going to pay twice as much for a single plastic mini - even if I got to pick, regardless of quality.
Having a pack contain only a single creature, MAYBE 2 small ones, is not going to have remotely the same "gambling" draw as a large, varied pack. Maybe if they sell them for a dollar in those little plastic ball dispensing machines in front of grocery stores.
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line. What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.
Well that and they recycled some (un)commons from older sets that were most people already had and were cheaper. I don't think the non-random would have been as such a big failure if they had recycled some of the rarer miniatures that people couldn't get easily/cheaply. I've seen WizKids do this with their Fast Forces 6 packs.
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line.I am not going to read the long ass thread to perchance come across a discussion of Wizard miniatures
What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.Upon making them non-random, their prices increased 50-100% and their quality did not change. I'm sure making them non-random hurt the "gambling" draw of buying a random pack, but I certainly wasn't going to pay twice as much for a single plastic mini - even if I got to pick, regardless of quality.
Having a pack contain only a single creature, MAYBE 2 small ones, is not going to have remotely the same "gambling" draw as a large, varied pack. Maybe if they sell them for a dollar in those little plastic ball dispensing machines in front of grocery stores.
You see, there is a dirrect cause-effect relationship between increased costs and prices rising. All those minis that now sell for $1 offset the price of the ones that now sell for 3-5, or even the ones that go for 15, allowing a lower average price. The increased price allows for fewer of the low quality 1-2 color miniatures and more complicated miniatures, increasing the complexity of the line while still keeping it in a range people can afford.
I wanted a blackguard figure. Too bad it's nearly $20 just for it because it has some good ability in the minis game.
If you're talking about "Human Blackguard", I don't think it was that good. It was expensive because it was rare, and from the very first set.
This is a great move, well done Paizo.
Also, props for your transparency around the whole random/non-random thing. I understand the business reasons behind it. While the situation might not be to everyone's taste or preference, I'm pleased that you're bringing distinctive miniatures back into the market, and I'm doubly pleased that they're for Pathfinder.
My main concern is that I'd like to see a variety of PC-style miniatures drawn from art other than the iconics - it's always nice to look at a mini and go "hmm, I could use that for my PC".
You see, there is a dirrect cause-effect relationship between increased costs and prices rising. All those minis that now sell for $1 offset the price of the ones that now sell for 3-5, or even the ones that go for 15, allowing a lower average price. The increased price allows for fewer of the low quality 1-2 color miniatures and more complicated miniatures, increasing the complexity of the line while still keeping it in a range people can afford.
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line.I am not going to read the long ass thread to perchance come across a discussion of Wizard miniatures
What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.Upon making them non-random, their prices increased 50-100% and their quality did not change. I'm sure making them non-random hurt the "gambling" draw of buying a random pack, but I certainly wasn't going to pay twice as much for a single plastic mini - even if I got to pick, regardless of quality.
Having a pack contain only a single creature, MAYBE 2 small ones, is not going to have remotely the same "gambling" draw as a large, varied pack. Maybe if they sell them for a dollar in those little plastic ball dispensing machines in front of grocery stores.
That depends whether you define people as Paizo faithful or the average gamer who also uses miniatures. I can EASILY afford all this. I will not, however, buy it because of the price point though. There is a notable difference between being affordable and either being or giving the impression of being worth your cost. $6 for a random, plastic, non-posable figure that fits roughly in a 2" cube? You're kidding, right? Never mind the $4 random, plastic, non-posable figure that fits roughly in a 1" cube.
Complete collections (1 of each) are only good for collectors. Those playing the game want a lot of goblins, orc, etc. (basically the common and uncommon minis).
I'm a collector who plays the game. I want 1+ of each, more of things like kobolds.
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Actually if you released a complete set I would buy it over a case. Unless you announce something like that though I will continue to save to preorder a case.
Actually, that's not a bad idea:
Paizo, if you read this: You'll be selling singles. Why not sell complete sets, too?
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Actually if you released a complete set I would buy it over a case. Unless you announce something like that though I will continue to save to preorder a case.Actually, that's not a bad idea:
Paizo, if you read this: You'll be selling singles. Why not sell complete sets, too?
Well, they will be selling some sets:
Additionally, WizKids plans to release additional Pathfinder Battles Encounter Packs, which will feature visible non-random assortments of selected repainted or resculpted figures from the full sets. Product details for these later sets will be released shortly.
Maybe not as good as a full set of 40 or 60 minis, but depending on the sets, this may be my preferred mode of purchasing them.
First of all, I'm glad to see this line. More choice is a good thing.
I'm already going to pick-up a few of the non-random starter sets, BUT my major concern remains durability. The other stuff I've seen from WizKids in the past simply hasn't been nearly as durable as D&D minis were. If that has been sorted, I will pick up some of these.
But again, either way more choice is a good thing. :)
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Now sinking nearly $300.00 at one time will be a struggle for many. The release is five months away. That's $60.00 per month, or about $15.00 a week. I for one will look forward to opening a case.
that's basically what I'm doing. I opened a separate savings account under my regular bank account and I'm going to put ~$14/week in there until the set comes out. I will probably do the same thing for the RotRL set too.
-Skeld
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The "nerd rage" in this thread is making my head explode. I would rather have random sets than no sets at all. I am very tempted to buy some of these minis and I am very excited that Pathfinder is making them! Congrats and kudos to Paizo for giving this a try and I wish it every success.
I hope that there will be a focus on including setting-specific heroes and monsters, rather than more generic fantasy creatures such as giant rats and spiders. I can understand that new players may need some of these things as well but it would be cool to get stuff like Pathfinder goblins and Sinspawn as well as characters from the different regions as well.
No doubt I will buy some packs anyway but if it is more geared to the setting I will probably spend a foolish amount of money on these.
I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line. What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.Well that and they recycled some (un)commons from older sets that were most people already had and were cheaper. I don't think the non-random would have been as such a big failure if they had recycled some of the rarer miniatures that people couldn't get easily/cheaply. I've seen WizKids do this with their Fast Forces 6 packs.
The biggest problem with the visible mini was that it was never something you would want 6-10 of. Who wanted 6-10 unicorns, or Aboleths?
The biggest problem with the visible mini was that it was never something you would want 6-10 of. Who wanted 6-10 unicorns, or Aboleths?I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line. What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.Well that and they recycled some (un)commons from older sets that were most people already had and were cheaper. I don't think the non-random would have been as such a big failure if they had recycled some of the rarer miniatures that people couldn't get easily/cheaply. I've seen WizKids do this with their Fast Forces 6 packs.
Sorry, I should have been clearer. I was talking about the Hero sets.
That depends whether you define people as Paizo faithful or the average gamer who also uses miniatures. I can EASILY afford all this. I will not, however, buy it because of the price point though. There is a notable difference between being affordable and either being or giving the impression of being worth your cost. $6 for a random, plastic, non-posable figure that fits roughly in a 2" cube? You're kidding, right? Never mind the $4 random, plastic, non-posable figure that fits roughly in a 1" cube.
Find comprable producs.
You can get hordes that you need to assemble and paint for arround $2-$3 per mini from companies like GW. A new player getting into the hobby will then spend ~2 hours assembling the posable, variable plastic minis and ~1 hour painting each one. IME, a 10 pack of space marines takes ~10 hours of work to paint nicely. This is a good deal if you enjoy it, but not everyone does, and many get frustrated at their skill. These also now require special care. The plastic is more brittle than the PPM lines and you have a custom paint job on them, so they are much less convienient.For more than the basic hordes, you are looking at higher price points. Standard Reaper heroes are in the 4-7 range for medium and 6-12 for large. These are not posable but will take painting. These tend to have more detail, and an hour or 2 per mini is not unreasonable. And they have even more special care that needs to go with them, as they are more fragile than the metal and harder to repair. They are also heavier, which has bennefits (enjoy the weight) and problems (transportation can get cumbersome)
Previous PPM lines had price points arround the $3 per medium mini mark, and grossly vary in quality. Comprables have been out of production for a while though, so its not unrasonable to assume costs have gone up some due to inflation and oil price increases. In this line, costs vary greatly by complexity and quanity. Randomness allows for offsetting complicated loss leaders with mooks. (You can offset a mini that costs more than a pack to make by assuming people will buy multiple packs to get it. This would not be possible with non-random, as you would see some minis that are priced outside of where people are willing to pay, further reducing demand and increasing cost per unit more, causing a cycle.) Assuming rarity is set in line with demand, those mooks will still be useful in quantity (goblins, orcs, town guard), though maybe not what you want. PPM have the advantage of no time required to paint and using a more flexible plastic that is resistant to abuse. This allows for much simpler storage and transportation.
Personally, I feel charging $4 per mini for what I am guessing is a smaller print run than previous PPM lines (higher costs) with what appears to be higher production quality (higher costs) is a reasonable jump from the previous price point of $3. I stopped thinking plastic was lower quality when I saw some of the recent stuff and started collecting a 40K army.
Sorry, I should have been clearer. I was talking about the Hero sets.The biggest problem with the visible mini was that it was never something you would want 6-10 of. Who wanted 6-10 unicorns, or Aboleths?I know the thread is, like, long and stuff, and reading it is tedious, but to boil it down, no that's not what killed their line. What killed their line was making them non-random. And of poor quality.Well that and they recycled some (un)commons from older sets that were most people already had and were cheaper. I don't think the non-random would have been as such a big failure if they had recycled some of the rarer miniatures that people couldn't get easily/cheaply. I've seen WizKids do this with their Fast Forces 6 packs.
oh yea those. You mean the "Hey, look we bundle 4-6 commons together, so you can buy them again?" ;)
Find comprable producs.
Done. Go to one of the online retailers that have tons of old D&D minis and have aggregated them into packs of certain things and buy a pack of 10 for ~$17. You now spend no time painting, have 10 miniatures that you wanted, and paid a per mini price of ~$2. The average gamer just using minis isn't going to care about superior quality. The hobbyist paints. The miniature gamer is serious about minis. The D&D player who just wants a guy who looks remotely like his character or a DM who just wants a recognizable hoard will get what he wants for $2 each.
Randomness allows for offsetting complicated loss leaders with mooks. (You can offset a mini that costs more than a pack to make by assuming people will buy multiple packs to get it. This would not be possible with non-random, as you would see some minis that are priced outside of where people are willing to pay, further reducing demand and increasing cost per unit more, causing a cycle.)
Yes, you can. But since these are ONE a pack, the buyer now has to overcome the disinterest in getting 3 useless duplicates out of buying 8 boxes and maybe getting a single of what he really wants.
The average gamer just using minis isn't going to care about superior quality.
You see I think a lot of people will disagree with you here. I don't like to play with many old PPM because the quality was low. Deformed faces, eyes on the side of the head, no distinction between the weapon and hands are just some of the issues I have had with cheap PPM. Newer ones can look awesome, but the price for them per model is also higher, and many people are willing to pay for that extra quality.
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Heroscape (a Hasbro/WotC product) sold 5-6 non-random, high-quality PPMs in a visible blister pack for $12.99 MSRP. Hereoscape has no relative commonality among figures (aside for some retailer exclusives or GenCon specials). When you could find them at Walmart, they usually sold for $10.68/pack (in my area). A set contained 4 blister packs, so about 20-ish figures and they would release 1-2 sets/year.
-Skeld
The average gamer just using minis isn't going to care about superior quality.You see I think a lot of people will disagree with you here.
I have to counter. There is a difference between superior quality and good enough. Some of the earlier D&D Minis are bad. I mean, bad. I've seen an Orc and have a Troglodyte that are awful. But the later stuff is good enough. It's not exactly the finest craftsmanship money can buy, but it isn't awful. With this, sure, the quality is better, but you are paying more. With something playing "PPM" you are putting quality vs price point. These things aren't articulated, are small, have no target use outside the game (by which I mean "generic character representation on the board"), and their collectibility is minimal. I don't seem them being worth $4-6. I imagine the average gamer, which you clearly aren't, will not be buying them and if Paizo just wants to keep selling to hobbyists and Paizo faithful, they can stick to the deal with Reaper.
Heroscape (a Hasbro/WotC product) sold 5-6 non-random, high-quality PPMs in a visible blister pack for $12.99 MSRP. Hereoscape has no relative commonality among figures (aside for some retailer exclusives or GenCon specials). When you could find them at Walmart, they usually sold for $10.68/pack (in my area). A set contained 4 blister packs, so about 20-ish figures and they would release 1-2 sets/year.
-Skeld
Three words: Economy of Scale.
Hasbro is a gigantic company that could leverage product placement in Wal-Mart in the first place, and could order thousands and thousands of each mini to be produced.
Oh, and Heroscape minis aren't around anymore either, so arguing that their prices were a good comparison might not be the best approach.
If you buy individual packs then you are paying $2-6 per mini.
If you buy a brick then you are paying $3.08 per mini.
If you buy a case then yopu are paying $2.55 per mini.
One day, maybe we'll have access to high quality local 3D printers, with some nice automated painting systems. And on that day, we'll all be able to print out the figs we want and need for our games and perhaps even the terrain.
In the mean time, this looks like a pretty good way to get something that suits whatever character I want to play, without and whatever monsters I want to run.
My main concern is that I'd like to see a variety of PC-style miniatures drawn from art other than the iconics - it's always nice to look at a mini and go "hmm, I could use that for my PC".
Have you looked at Reaper's metal line? For me, while the random plastic is great for building a monster collection, a PC who is going to be in many, many sessions deserves a great metal figure. Reaper has all sorts of great character figures that aren't iconics. Pathfinders, Eagle Knights, Grey Gardners, Wardens, etc.
Although I'm sure we'll see some heroic non-iconics in the plastic line too.
Heroscape (a Hasbro/WotC product) sold 5-6 non-random, high-quality PPMs in a visible blister pack for $12.99 MSRP. Hereoscape has no relative commonality among figures (aside for some retailer exclusives or GenCon specials). When you could find them at Walmart, they usually sold for $10.68/pack (in my area). A set contained 4 blister packs, so about 20-ish figures and they would release 1-2 sets/year.
-Skeld
Three words: Economy of Scale.
Hasbro is a gigantic company that could leverage product placement in Wal-Mart in the first place, and could order thousands and thousands of each mini to be produced.
Oh, and Heroscape minis aren't around anymore either, so arguing that their prices were a good comparison might not be the best approach.
From what I understand, Heroscape vastly overproduced minis vs their demand, allowing them to hit a lower price point per model but leaving Walmart with suplus. I saw so many extra boxes being liquidated for like 40% off it wasn't funny. Most ppm stuff wont make it into walmart because they can't hit the quantities needed for walmart and they don't think there is the demand for that number, which is probably correct.
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Three words: Economy of Scale.
Hasbro is a gigantic company that could leverage product placement in Wal-Mart in the first place, and could order thousands and thousands of each mini to be produced.
Oh, and Heroscape minis aren't around anymore either, so arguing that their prices were a good comparison might not be the best approach.
Errr... I was only providing that information as a data point for the posters looking for examples of comparable products, not as a argument against against WizKids' pathfinder miniatures or pricing scheme. There's no need to be testy.
Heroscape is a good counter-example because it is very nearly the exact opposite of the Pathfinder minis (random vs. non-random, visible purchase vs. blind purchase, relative commonality vs. none, large production vs. small, 20-40 figures vs. ~100, etc.). The fact that they were discontinued a couple years ago is at least partial evidence that the non-random model might not work.
-Skeld
Three words: Economy of Scale.
Hasbro is a gigantic company that could leverage product placement in Wal-Mart in the first place, and could order thousands and thousands of each mini to be produced.
Oh, and Heroscape minis aren't around anymore either, so arguing that their prices were a good comparison might not be the best approach.
Errr... I was only providing that information as a data point for the posters looking for examples of comparable products, not as a argument against against WizKids' pathfinder miniatures or pricing scheme. There's no need to be testy.
Heroscape is a good counter-example because it is very nearly the exact opposite of the Pathfinder minis (random vs. non-random, visible purchase vs. blind purchase, relative commonality vs. none, large production vs. small, 20-40 figures vs. ~100, etc.). The fact that they were discontinued a couple years ago is at least partial evidence that the non-random model might not work.
-Skeld
They also have the problem of not fitting a 1in battlemat.
They also have the problem of not fitting a 1in battlemat.Three words: Economy of Scale.
Hasbro is a gigantic company that could leverage product placement in Wal-Mart in the first place, and could order thousands and thousands of each mini to be produced.
Oh, and Heroscape minis aren't around anymore either, so arguing that their prices were a good comparison might not be the best approach.
Errr... I was only providing that information as a data point for the posters looking for examples of comparable products, not as a argument against against WizKids' pathfinder miniatures or pricing scheme. There's no need to be testy.
Heroscape is a good counter-example because it is very nearly the exact opposite of the Pathfinder minis (random vs. non-random, visible purchase vs. blind purchase, relative commonality vs. none, large production vs. small, 20-40 figures vs. ~100, etc.). The fact that they were discontinued a couple years ago is at least partial evidence that the non-random model might not work.
-Skeld
But was their worst decision to do just like the Hero sets, to reuse D&D (un)common minis to fill in their production schedule? Of course, the line could have already been on its last legs, and that was done to try and keep it on life support by decreasing their costs, but wasn't enough.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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First of all, I'm glad to see this line. More choice is a good thing.
I'm already going to pick-up a few of the non-random starter sets, BUT my major concern remains durability. The other stuff I've seen from WizKids in the past simply hasn't been nearly as durable as D&D minis were. If that has been sorted, I will pick up some of these.
But again, either way more choice is a good thing. :)
but if they start putting minis in from the APG and Ultimate series, are you going to protest?
(good natured ribbing intended, Bugley)
Would reducing the size of the sets perhaps make people happier? I think the problem with a set of 40-60 miniatures is that there are inevitably some pieces that are just filler that nobody wants - Gonk Droids from Star Wars and Twig Blights from DDM spring to mind.
I sort of feel that way already about the gnome that was previewed in the announcement for the Pathfinder Minis - I'm frankly scared of investing money into these for fear of ending up with a bunch of duplicate gnomes, which just don't get used in my home game at all.
Why not limit the sets to 20 or 30 miniatures that people definitely want, with the filler pieces stripped out? As I understand it, the cost is driven up by making the molds for each sculpt. Less molds should equal less money, right?
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This just in! You cannot have your cake and eat it too. More on this story tonight at 11.
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I love the Gonk Droid! In SW games I use them for astromechs if I need some. In D&D (not PF due to IP), well I've found a use for them as well.
As for Twig Blights, I'm sure that if one tries they could find a use for them as well.
This just in! You cannot have your cake and eat it too. More on this story tonight at 11.
Damn! I always thought it was you can't eat your cake and have it too.
Errr... I was only providing that information as a data point for the posters looking for examples of comparable products, not as a argument against against WizKids' pathfinder miniatures or pricing scheme. There's no need to be testy.Heroscape is a good counter-example because it is very nearly the exact opposite of the Pathfinder minis (random vs. non-random, visible purchase vs. blind purchase, relative commonality vs. none, large production vs. small, 20-40 figures vs. ~100, etc.). The fact that they were discontinued a couple years ago is at least partial evidence that the non-random model might not work.
-Skeld
Ah, I gotcha. I thought you were one of those people complaining about the price point of the new line. I agree that Heroscape is apples to this new line of PPM's oranges.
/threadjack:
Personally, I loved Heroscape, and was madder than a wet hen when they moved it to WotC so they could kill it. Rehashing old molds and re-releasing it as D&D Heroscape defeated the purpose of having "battles across time", with elves and robots and aliens and orcs and dinosaurs and dragons and G.I.s and samuari etc etc.
I think Heroscape started losing ground when they released a set where 3 of the 4 blisters were unique/hero sets (as opposed to 3/4 of them being common/horde figures), so that no one was making multiple purchases of the blisters. You could only field one blister's worth of 75% of the release (and it was a Christmas release), so tons of minis were left sitting on the shelf. Wal-Mart wouldn't restock the next wave until they sold off that wave... which won't sell. The line came to a screeching halt right then.
IMHO of course.
/end threadjack
Would reducing the size of the sets perhaps make people happier? I think the problem with a set of 40-60 miniatures is that there are inevitably some pieces that are just filler that nobody wants - Gonk Droids from Star Wars and Twig Blights from DDM spring to mind.
I sort of feel that way already about the gnome that was previewed in the announcement for the Pathfinder Minis - I'm frankly scared of investing money into these for fear of ending up with a bunch of duplicate gnomes, which just don't get used in my home game at all.
Why not limit the sets to 20 or 30 miniatures that people definitely want, with the filler pieces stripped out? As I understand it, the cost is driven up by making the molds for each sculpt. Less molds should equal less money, right?
We already have a couple people in this thread who are thrilled about the gnome. With these sets, invariably some people are left with minis that they don't want that someone else does. If they go down to just the sure things, you will be left with a handful of commons that people want many of, like goblins, and a couple generic heroes. You lose out on a lot of the variety, and most minis have a market.
btw, 40 minis is less than many of the D&D mini lines.
but if they start putting minis in from the APG and Ultimate series, are you going to protest?
(good natured ribbing intended, Bugley)
I will keel you! <Begins warm-up of laser death stare>
;-)
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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oh yea those. You mean the "Hey, look we bundle 4-6 commons together, so you can buy them again?" ;)
I don't think that's very fair. Not all of them were repaints, and I don't think any of them were commons. The repaints were a mix of uncommons and rares. 3 to a pack, not 4-6.
From the first set of 18: 4 repaints, all look like uncommons to me
From the second set of 18: 4 repaints, 2 rare, 2 uncommon
However, they were a dismal failure regardless. Mostly because of your 3 in a pack, you typical got 1 figure worth having (sometimes 2), for a not that attractive price.
I just hope they don't print a gunslinger mini, ever. Because having a single mini with a gun will ruin the fantasy nature of Pathfinder now and forever, and I will never purchase another mini. Ever!
Gunslinger mini? Yes please.
I just hope they don't print a gunslinger mini, ever. Because having a single mini with a gun will ruin the fantasy nature of Pathfinder now and forever, and I will never purchase another mini. Ever!
You mean like this guy or this one or the iconic. :)