[Rogue Genius Games] Talented Classes product line


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A vote for magus


Owen KC Stephens wrote:
Kolokotroni wrote:
You mean a summoner that summons things instead of being the eidolon's sidekick? Thats just rediculous. Also awesome and gimme gimme.
christos gurd wrote:
...damn you owen, now i want the alchemist. Bombless, mutagenless, alchemist as a viable option sounds great.

Hehehe...

That's what I hoped you folks would say.

I am really curious how something like an eidolon (or a druids animal companion) will fit into a talent/edge system. When a single ability scales that mutch it certainly seems like it should be more then one edge or what have you. Either way, I am very curious to find out.


Could be one edge for an eidolon, then another edge(s) for evolution points.


Owen KC Stephens wrote:
Spiral_Ninja wrote:
OWEN STEPHENS wrote:
Antipaladin will be included in the Paladin class. As will my ideas for Partisans and Tyrants.

Will you be doing variants for all 9 alignments?

'cause that I'll buy!

Yes.... and no. Characters of any alignment will be able to take the talented paladin class. But many abilities will be restricted to certain alignments. In some cases it'll be a single element (you must be of good alignment to receive smite evil), and in other cases it'll be an exact alignment (you have to be chaotic evil to take cruelties).

However, a Lawful Evil paladin can take Motivations instead of Cruelties, and a True Neutral paladin can take Balances.

But not every ability has exact equivalences for every alignment. If you are neither good nor evil, you get no smite. But you do have access to more kinds of bonds.

Of course, every paladin has the same number of edges and talents, so even if not every one will look like as total a swap-out of class features as the antipaladin, but they'll all have the same total number of class features.

Sounds interesting.


Magus come on!


While you're waiting on the next offering in the Talented series, we here in Abaddon would like to know what you'd like to see in a Talented Bestiary. Our system is done and we're designing monsters. What's a take on a classic Pathfinder monster you think has been missed?

As an alternative, what do you need to throw at your players that you just haven't found somewhere else?


Monsters that are other than ordinary society monsters (such as orcs, goblins, etc.). For example, the Aboleth. They are solitary, or, in really bad nightmares, they have a society. Not all members of the society should be cookie cutter examples and I think some realistic options that are play balanced (without me having to do that with my poor group) would be of great use. Giants of various types would be another good example. There is the classic example in the bestiary, the better than average bodyguards, nobility, priesthood, hedgewizard (maybe), and the leader(s). What about some specialists scattered about the tribe? Perhaps a tribe of specialists instead of an ordinary cookie cutter society. These are the types of monsters that I believe could benefit the most from some talented treatment, for which, I would drop unseemly amounts of money to save me torturing my group through my guestimates of what would work as a proper challenge...


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You're gonna love this book, my friend. It will exactly present alternate takes on a lot of monsters, most a little more powerful, some a little less to create skirmish or footsoldier versions. In every case, the goal is to challenge the assumptions about the original creature, or to focus on an iconic aspect of it.

I'll tel a brief story: We decided to have a little contest, a pair of the designers and myself. Pestilence dropped the rules on Facebook and we raced to completely finish our CR 6 monster's stat block from the ground up.

Little confession, I got excited and didn't pay attention to the rules, so I finished first, and even wrote some fluff and descriptive text, before realizing I'd made the wrong kind of monster. So I started over with a brand new monster and built him again from the ground up.

Now, I finished third out of three because of that, and the guys gave me a hard time. But what's important is three of us scratch built four complete CR 6 monsters from the ground up in about half an hour.

So destrachan hunter killers? phase spider king? great wyrm chimera? marilith godslayer? The book will present a system for making anything you want intuitively and quickly.

And writing this book is the most fun I have had in design. I love Pathfinder and I'm proud to make planning easier and fun for the GM.


So, when is this getting released?


It'll be a bit. I am shooting for the post-Gen-Con, pre-Halloween window. Manuscript is in development, art needs to be finished, editing pass hasn't begun.

But it's coming along.


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Excellent [steeples fingers as he reclines in the chair].


Hey Owen, I haven't seen this asked, so wanted to request a clarification on the intent on the Talented Monk at level 8. The chart shows a new Edge, which matches the text under Edges, but doesn't show gaining a talent. However, the text under talents indicates you get 2 talents/level at levels 1-3, then 1 every level past 3. Should there be a talent @ 8 per the text, or only an edge per the chart?
This is in relation to the PM I sent you re: PCGen. :)


As if often the case, the table is correct and the description of talents is in error. That used to be a talent, and when I switched it to an edge I didn't fix the talent entry.


I does think there was a delay again. Either way keep up the good work and thanks for the prompt reply last time. Sorry I havent replied with thanks sooner but life likes to happen to us all.


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Talented Ranger should be out before Gen Con
I'll try to revise some items after Gen Con.
Talented witch should hit before October.
:D


Ok thanks for the update once again.


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Talented Bestiary? I really need to keep up with this thread better. I'm very excited about this.

I really, really like the Talented series and hope that eventually all the classes get some love.


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DungeonmasterCal wrote:
Talented Bestiary? I really need to keep up with this thread better. I'm very excited about this.

Yep, RPG Superstar Steven T. Helt and his writer's guild, The Four Horsemen, are working on that one as we speak. They pitched it, convinced me, and have done some cool things with it so far.

DungeonmasterCal wrote:
I really, really like the Talented series and hope that eventually all the classes get some love.

That is the plan.

The Talented Ranger is going to be out really soon, and Talented Witch will follow in fairly short order. After that it looks like a toss up between the Alchemist and Magus, based on current voting.

Then after THAT, I may opt to finish all the core rulebook classes before moving on.

And starting in September, I'll begin working on how I want to handle the Advanced Class Guide material. :P I know what I'd LIKE to do, but until the book is available to the general public I can't spend any time figuring out if that's practical to do.


I already use the Talented Rogue like it's going out of style. I own all the others, as well. But the TR is by far my favorite.


DungeonmasterCal wrote:
I already use the Talented Rogue like it's going out of style. I own all the others, as well. But the TR is by far my favorite.

TRogue and TMonk seem to be the most popular to date. :)

Weirdly I almost didn't do the TRogue, since rogues already *have* a talent system. It was fan feedback that convinced me I should give it a go.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Talented Rogue is the disco godfather of the thief-acrobat, the urban thug, and other assorted cool characters.


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Oddly, that totally makes sense to me. :)

Liberty's Edge

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Talented Magus : one of my players in JR is recreating Elric and I am sure we could cook-up something far closer to his wishes with this instead of cumulating archetypes.


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So now for "what comes after ranger and witch" that's:

Alchemist: 11 vote
Gunslinger: 7 votes
Magus: 13 votes
Paladin: 3 votes
Summoner: 5 votes
Wizard: 1 vote

(And three votes for the Dark Mistress vote above, which will have to wait until the Talented Bestiary [by RPG Superstar winner Steven T. Helt and his Four Horsemen group] is published)

So the Magus is pulling ahead!


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Coming This Week!
The Talented Ranger
More than 22,000 words of edges, talents, tricks, traps, and tracking.
Find out what a ranger can REALLY do!


HUZZAH!!

Sovereign Court

+1 Talented Summoner vote


The pdf is coming in at more than 40 pages.
No *wonder* this took me so long!


Sorcerer, Magus and Magister


Magister as in The Genius Guide to the Magister?


Yes I love the Magister and would like to see more options for it, although I know the chances of that happening are rather small.

Liberty's Edge

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Any chance for the Talented Templar? Gotta give some more love to that class, Owen.


Mitspieler wrote:
Yes I love the Magister and would like to see more options for it, although I know the chances of that happening are rather small.

Yeah, I'd love to see more Mystic Bonds relating to classes that came after the Magister last came out (Arcanist anyone?), and more of the "5th level & 9 spells" feats. I've done some of my own, but I know I'm not that great at balance.

Plus an update with the Occult adventures come out, to include all the Psychic Magic and bits with it. :D


Somewhat Off-Topic:

Will you update the already excisting Genius Guides with Archetype-talents from the ACG??? Or may I in general act like that every Archetype feature from Archetypes in ACG until lvl 10 may be a talent and above an advanced talent?


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I am sure in time I'll manage to include ACG toy in RGG product designs, with either expansions products or updates. But I don't have an eta yet.

Similarly I'll look at talented versions of RGG base classes, but likely not until I have a lot more Paizo classes covered. :)


in the more ranger talents book will you consider combining advice for talented ranger like you did with other talented products?


christos gurd wrote:
in the more ranger talents book will you consider combining advice for talented ranger like you did with other talented products?

That wasn't currently the plan, since you could just take the "heroic warrior" class I already did in The Genius Guide to the Talented Barbarian and give it access to ranger edges and talents. That wouldn't be a perfect match, but since The Genius Guide to the Talented Ranger was *already* the longest Talented book ever I couldn't justify the time or space to add another whole section to add a custom-fit ranger class ruleset for it.

I haven't ever added material like that to a "More Talents" book, but I might be able to if there was a general outcry for it.

Opinions?


I am mixed on this, while I can always use more talents, I really want to see the other books sooner than later and would hate to give you more to work on and possibly get distracted with.


Since there wasn't a strong outcry for it, I went the more standard route for The Genius Guide to More Ranger Talents, available now!


You know what, I kinda want to get all the core talented classed done so we could push for some kind of print option for these. that would be all kinds of epic.


Don't Wizards, Clerics, Sorcerers, Druids, and Oracles already get a highly mutable system of ability selection?


Insain Dragoon wrote:
Don't Wizards, Clerics, Sorcerers, Druids, and Oracles already get a highly mutable system of ability selection?

yes to a point but so did barbarians, and that turned out pretty swell. sides the most mutable caster of all, the witch, has already been greenlighted for talent conversion.


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christos gurd wrote:
Insain Dragoon wrote:
Don't Wizards, Clerics, Sorcerers, Druids, and Oracles already get a highly mutable system of ability selection?
yes to a point but so did barbarians, and that turned out pretty swell. sides the most mutable caster of all, the witch, has already been greenlighted for talent conversion.

At this point I am pretty sure I'll be doing all of them eventually, weirdly I suspect witch and bard will be first.

to use cleric as an example, what if you want your cleric to be so dedicated to her god she has all four domains, but she has fewer spells? Why do all clerics, including those who don;t care about healing or undead, have to channel? What if someone wants to play a cloistered cleric concept that isn't sub-par? Is it possible to build on the crusader archetype to have a cleric that doesn't cast spells at all? Could a cleric of a god of arcane magic end up with some classic arcane spells without being unbalanced, and if so what would it have to give up?

Spell selection is awesome, as is domain choice. But clerics can be asked to fill a wide range of roles, and the existing rules framework doesn't always match them well. The same is true of all the spellcasters. I think it's possible to make an effective witch who has no spells at all, for example.

That's where those talented write-ups will focus.


So I was reading my Advanced Class Guide PDF and I now have a humble request:

Please combine the Alchemist and Investigator into a single talented class!

Reading over the Investigator and its archetypes plus the single Alchemist archetype in the book just makes me feel like the two classes belong together. Oh, and please turn Spagyric Devices and Metamorphosis into talents/edges as well. Thank you.

(I still want Magus next, but if this merger is possible, picking between the two is going to become an impossible choice.)


pluvia33 wrote:

So I was reading my Advanced Class Guide PDF and I now have a humble request:

Please combine the Alchemist and Investigator into a single talented class!

Reading over the Investigator and its archetypes plus the single Alchemist archetype in the book just makes me feel like the two classes belong together. Oh, and please turn Spagyric Devices and Metamorphosis into talents/edges as well. Thank you.

(I still want Magus next, but if this merger is possible, picking between the two is going to become an impossible choice.)

Investigator and Alchemist should kiss.


Ahhh, thank you so much. I have such wonderful images of Quinn and Damiel right now. It makes me want to draw.... things.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Bomb-throwing sleuths ftw.


pluvia33 wrote:
Ahhh, thank you so much. I have such wonderful images of Quinn and Damiel right now. It makes me want to draw.... things.

I couldn't help it after " two classes belong together.".

They can snuggle into each other's trench coats and share a philter of love.

What would I get if I drew/painted such a thing and posted it?


I can't speak for anyone else, but I'd give you my eternal internet praise. Just make sure that Damiel is the uke.


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Soooooo... not to get things TOO back on-topic...

Advanced Options: Slayer Talents & Lethalities talks briefly about how to use it with the Talented Ranger and The Talented Rogue. If I do a Talented Alchemist before an Advanced Investigator, I'm sure a similar section would exist.

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