This is my revised class design based on my own ideas, plus suggestions from Palehore6, RJGrady, Neo2151, Benn Roe, jfkg306, and DarkOne the Drow.
The biggest problems with the class are as follows:
- It can't hit anything reliably.
- It doesn't really feel like a hunter.
- It doesn't provide enough reason to choose it over the Druid.
Here's my new Hunter table:
Level...Special
1st.......Animal companion, animal focus, nature training, orisons, wild empathy
2nd.......Precise shot, track
3rd.......Hunter tactics, teamwork feat
4th.......Natural trap lore +1
5th.......Hunting style, woodland stride
6th.......Teamwork feat
7th.......Natural trap lore +2
8th.......Swift tracker, second animal focus
9th.......Teamwork feat
10th.....Natural trap lore +3
11th.....Hunting style
12th.....Teamwork feat
13th.....Natural trap lore +4
14th.....Experienced hunter
15th.....Teamwork feat
16th.....Natural trap lore +5
17th.....Hunting style
18th.....Teamwork feat
19th.....Natural trap lore +6
20th.....Master hunter
Spells: Spontaneous caster using the bard's spells per day and spells known, but drawing spells from both the druid and ranger list.
Precise Shot: As per the feat. Every hunter gains some basic training in how to properly aim a bow. Replaces the Precise Companion class feature.
Natural Trap Lore (Ex): Starting at 4th level, the hunter gains a +1 insight bonus on Reflex saves to avoid natural traps, Perception checks to find natural traps, and Survival checks to set/disguise natural traps. This bonus increases by +1 every three levels thereafter, to a maximum of +6 at 19th level.
Hunting Style: At 5th level, the hunter chooses a hunting style. This style grants her one bonus feat at 5th, 11th, and 17th level. She does not need to meet the prerequisities for these feats (except those listed in parentheses). She cannot choose the same feat twice.
Archery: Deadly Aim, Farshot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (longbow or shortbow), or Weapon Specialization (any bow, must have Weapon Focus).
Capture: Bludgeoner*, Distance Thrower*, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bolas), Exotic Weapon Proficiency (net), Improved Grapple, or Net Adept* (only if you have net proficiency).
Spear: Death From Above*, Lunge, Step Up, Weapon Focus (any spear), or Weapon Specialization (any spear, must have Weapon Focus).
* Ultimate Combat
Experienced Hunter (Ex): Once she reaches 14th level, the hunter has attained a better understanding of the dangers of the natural world and its occupants. She gains a +4 bonus on saving throws against disease and poison, as well as charm and sleep effects.
Add Point Blank Shot to Archery, and Combat Reflexes to Spear.
I've also had three people vote for a d10 hit die so far.
1) Why are you assuming spear style for melee hunters?
2) What does this provide to help it hit aside from weapon focus and precise shot?
This looks interesting.
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1) Why are you assuming spear style for melee hunters?
2) What does this provide to help it hit aside from weapon focus and precise shot?
This looks interesting.
Thanks!
1) I was going for thematic weapons. Like, what would a hunter (as in a game hunter) actually use on a daily basis? Bow, net, spear, bolas...I could also see an argument being made for a style involving the javelin, blowgun, or kukri. Swords would be something they use to fight other people maybe, but their primary training would be in the tools of hunting.
2) Obviously those two do help. Hm. Maybe I could add Improved Weapon Focus to the feat list? I've been going for flavor and balance, so I'm not sure what would be OP for the class.
I'm of a mind that the hunter is a false start. I've redone the whole thing with gunslinger instead of druid. It makes it good at hunting, capable of hitting, a better pet class, flavorful, and customizable. Oh, and trapping.
I too wanted to emphasize a spear or net, but I couldn't really figure out how to other than arbitrarily making other things worse instead of making them better.
I'm of a mind that the hunter is a false start. I've redone the whole thing with gunslinger instead of druid. It makes it good at hunting, capable of hitting, a better pet class, flavorful, and customizable. Oh, and trapping.
I too wanted to emphasize a spear or net, but I couldn't really figure out how to other than arbitrarily making other things worse instead of making them better.
Unfortunately, since I really wanted better spellcasting instead of no spellcasting, I can't support this. Also, I believe we already have a spell-less traps-based ranger.
Unfortunately, since I really wanted better spellcasting instead of no spellcasting, I can't support this. Also, I believe we already have a spell-less traps-based ranger.I'm of a mind that the hunter is a false start. I've redone the whole thing with gunslinger instead of druid. It makes it good at hunting, capable of hitting, a better pet class, flavorful, and customizable. Oh, and trapping.
I too wanted to emphasize a spear or net, but I couldn't really figure out how to other than arbitrarily making other things worse instead of making them better.
Heh. Part of what makes the Druid/Ranger list good is that it benefits heavily from being able to switch things up from a day to day basis. Take away that benefit from a hyper specialized list and you end up with a hyper specialized caster.
But to help you out,
Still can't hit anything.
Natural Trap Lore is relatively meaningless. A good perception finds all mundane traps and they're virtually gone at high levels. You already get Perception as a class skill and use Wisdom as your casting stat. This makes your perception score really good. +6 at first level with a 14 Wisdom(Reasonable). Mundane Traps start at DC20. A camouflaged Pit Trap(CR3) is DC 25. By the time you get Natural Trap Lore, your skill points are pulling the weight at a +10.
What are Natural Traps anyways? Quicksand? Pit Traps? Mold isn't actually a trap, do you get a bonus to spotting those?
What are Natural Traps anyways? Quicksand? Pit Traps? Mold isn't actually a trap, do you get a bonus to spotting those?
A "natural trap", besides things like quicksand, is any trap created through natural, mundane means. As in, not mechanical or magical. Pits of bamboo spikes covered with sticks and leaves, logs that fall if someone trips a vine, a net disguised and fastened to a bowed tree branch, a hidden noose, etc.
If you've seen the original Predator film, most of that stuff they rigged up would be natural traps.
What are Natural Traps anyways? Quicksand? Pit Traps? Mold isn't actually a trap, do you get a bonus to spotting those?A "natural trap", besides things like quicksand, is any trap created through natural, mundane means. As in, not mechanical or magical. Pits of bamboo spikes covered with sticks and leaves, logs that fall if someone trips a vine, a net disguised and fastened to a bowed tree branch, a hidden noose, etc.
If you've seen the original Predator film, most of that stuff they rigged up would be natural traps.
So a rope involved would be a no go but a vine would?
So a rope involved would be a no go but a vine would?
A rope is fine. For game purposes, Natural Traps can be summed up in one line: "Any non-mechanical, non-magical trap or trap-like hazard."
So a rope involved would be a no go but a vine would?A rope is fine. For game purposes, Natural Traps can be summed up in one line: "Any non-mechanical, non-magical trap or trap-like hazard."
You do know there are only two classifications of traps. Mechanical and Magical.
You do know there are only two classifications of traps. Mechanical and Magical.So a rope involved would be a no go but a vine would?A rope is fine. For game purposes, Natural Traps can be summed up in one line: "Any non-mechanical, non-magical trap or trap-like hazard."
That's an inherent game flaw. In fact, I've just provided the perfect examples and definition of the third type of trap, and it represents kind of a huge oversight that it was never covered. 3.5 made the same mistake, I'm sure, though I don't know if they ever redacted it or not.
This is what it means to be a "victim of your predecessor". However, it's never too late to expand the game. :)
You do know there are only two classifications of traps. Mechanical and Magical.So a rope involved would be a no go but a vine would?A rope is fine. For game purposes, Natural Traps can be summed up in one line: "Any non-mechanical, non-magical trap or trap-like hazard."That's an inherent game flaw. In fact, I've just provided the perfect examples and definition of the third type of trap, and it represents kind of a huge oversight that it was never covered. 3.5 made the same mistake, I'm sure, though I don't know if they ever redacted it or not.
This is what it means to be a "victim of your predecessor". However, it's never too late to expand the game. :)
It wouldn't be expanding the game unless they made new traps specifically keyed to "Any non-mechanical, non-magical trap or trap-like hazard."
What you ask for is redefining.
Unfortunately, since I really wanted better spellcasting instead of no spellcasting, I can't support this. Also, I believe we already have a spell-less traps-based ranger.I'm of a mind that the hunter is a false start. I've redone the whole thing with gunslinger instead of druid. It makes it good at hunting, capable of hitting, a better pet class, flavorful, and customizable. Oh, and trapping.
I too wanted to emphasize a spear or net, but I couldn't really figure out how to other than arbitrarily making other things worse instead of making them better.
If you think my version is "traps-based", which if you notice I posted trapping as an afterthought, you're mistaken. And I'm not the one who gave trap sense as a class feature. But maybe you meant you want a spell-full traps-based ranger.
But if we look at your list here:
- It can't hit anything reliably.
- It doesn't really feel like a hunter.
- It doesn't provide enough reason to choose it over the Druid.
Those first two are not things identified with "more spellcasting." And they are both things my version fixes.
If I were going to add the ranger spells to the druid spells for choosing, I'd give them all +1 effective level to balance the fact that they get 2 lists. Since you get 6 level casting, it's a pretty elegant fix.
Also, this: "logs that fall if someone trips a vine" is a very mechanical trap. Mundane and natural is not mutually exclusive with mechanical.
Good point. :)
I like it! Makes more sense to have a woodsy guy with spear and net skills than dual swords like the ranger. You ever see someone chase down a deer with swords?
And syntax aside, I know exactly what you meant by Natural Traps. :)