I am doing something wrong. When I look up old threads I see refence to a flat 1000 gp crafting a day? Where is this in the rules, as my craft speeds are WAY slower than that. I think I am missing something.
Take Larz Rovanky with his Leather Armor Crafting skill of +9.
He has an order for MW Studded Leather (a +3 armor bonus).
The Studded Leather Costs 25 gp
The Masterwork Component costs 150 gp.
Converted to SP that is 1750 sp.
If I let him take a 10 on his crafting skill check, he gets a 19. The DC to make the armor is 13. The amount of progress he makes in a WEEK is (19 x 13 = 247 sp worth of progress) if I divide the total cost of the item by 1 weeks progress it will take approximately 7.1 weeks to make the armor.
What am I missing? that seems WAY too long.
I think the 1000gp/day caveat is for magic item enchantment, but I may be wrong.
Masterwork component items have a DC of 20 first and foremost, the leather has the DC of 13.
"Create Masterwork Items: You can make a masterwork item: a weapon, suit of armor, shield, or tool that conveys a bonus on its use through its exceptional craftsmanship. To create a masterwork item, you create the masterwork component as if it were a separate item in addition to the standard item. The masterwork component has its own price (300 gp for a weapon or 150 gp for a suit of armor or a shield, see Equipment for the price of other masterwork tools) and a Craft DC of 20. Once both the standard component and the masterwork component are completed, the masterwork item is finished. The cost you pay for the masterwork component is one-third of the given amount, just as it is for the cost in raw materials."
Instead of adding the costs together it needs to be done separately, due to the different DC's of the items being made.
250 sp for the studded leather would equal out to about a week worth of work if you are using your masterwork tools, meanwhile you are also rolling for the different DC of the masterwork component:
Lets say for instance you have the masterwork tool for the trade giving you the +2 circumstance bonus:
Take 10 + skill + 2 would put you at 21: 21 X 20 = 420
1500 / 420 = 3.6
Even rounded up to a full 4 weeks, the total time spent on creating the armor and the masterwork component would be 5 weeks of work.
This is how it reads to me, but I could be wrong :)
Crafting time is messed up, but it isn't because of armor crafting time. Armor takes a looooong time to make by hand. Masterwork armor takes more time due to the extra care involved in sizing, shaping, implementing various tricks at the joints to increase mobility without sacrificing effectiveness, and so on.
Frankly, the masterwork component for armor should take more time than that of a weapon, not less time, and the masterwork cost should be higher than a weapon's, but that decision was probably made for reasons of game balance.
I am doing something wrong. When I look up old threads I see refence to a flat 1000 gp crafting a day? Where is this in the rules, as my craft speeds are WAY slower than that. I think I am missing something.
Take Larz Rovanky with his Leather Armor Crafting skill of +9.
He has an order for MW Studded Leather (a +3 armor bonus).The Studded Leather Costs 25 gp
The Masterwork Component costs 150 gp.
Converted to SP that is 1750 sp.If I let him take a 10 on his crafting skill check, he gets a 19. The DC to make the armor is 13. The amount of progress he makes in a WEEK is (19 x 13 = 247 sp worth of progress) if I divide the total cost of the item by 1 weeks progress it will take approximately 7.1 weeks to make the armor.
What am I missing? that seems WAY too long.
There are three parts to making Studded LA +3:
1) Studded LA (DC = 10+AC bonus = 13)2) Masterwork (DC = 20)
3) +3 Enhancement (DC = 14, or 19 if cannot make CL 9)
Part 1 & 2 are done with the Craft(Armor) skill. Part 3 can be done that way or with the Spellcraft skill.
Using Take-10 on Craft(Armor), parts 1 and 3 can be done. Part 2 cannot without something. The spell Crafter's Fortune can grant a +5 Luck bonus for 1 day/level. Lets assume you use the spell to raise the Take-10 to 24. Here is the breakdown:
1) Price 25gp -> 250sp. Weekly sp = 24(skill)*13(craft DC)=312sp. This is ~5.6 days. Without the spell, it takes ~7.08 days. Cost = 1/3 price = ~8.33gp. Accelerated crafting adds +10 to the DC, giving 552sp/week, taking ~3.2 days.
2) Price 150gp -> 1500sp. Weekly sp = 24(skill)*20(craft DC)=480sp. This is 3 weeks and ~0.9 days. Cost = 1/3 price = 50gp. Accelerated crafting adds +10 to the DC, making it too high for Take-10.
3) Price is 9000gp. Crafting is 1000gp/day, giving 9 days. Accelerated crafting adds 5 to the DC, and can do 2000gp/day, giving 4.5 days. Cost = 1/2 price = 4500gp.
Summing this up, it will take about 4 weeks, 4.5 days at least, and more likely 5 weeks, 0.6 days. Cost is ~4558.33gp.
/cevah
I your still limited to 1000gp a day with magic items you can't do 2000 gp a day. accelerated crafting just frees up more time in the day. It allows you to do 8 hours of work in 4 hours, but your still not allow to go over 1000gp a day per what the creation feats say. It meant to be used while adventuring giving you the ability to do 500gp a day instead of 250. Since you only net 2 hours of work while adventuring for 4 hours of work.
This process can be accelerated to 4 hours of work per 1,000 gp in the item’s base price (or fraction thereof ) by increasing the DC to create the item by +5.
The caster can work for up to 8 hours each day. He cannot rush the process by working longer each day, but the days need not be consecutive, and the caster can use the rest of his time as he sees fit.
Accelerated crafting allows you to make 1000gp in four hours. It does not limit you to four hours crafting per day. It does not limit you to 1000gp per day.
/cevah
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KainPen is incorrect.
Well here is what he is right on, you can only craft 1 magic item per day (except low level scrolls and potions). He is also correct in the adventure crafting rules.
Here is the thing he is incorrect in the accelerated crafting rules. Lets look at an item creation feat:
Craft Magic Arms and Armor
"Enhancing a weapon, suit of armor, or shield takes 1 day for each 1,000 gp in the price of its magical features."
This does indeed say 1000gp per day. This is also reflected in the magic chapter:
"Creating an item requires 8 hours of work per 1,000 gp in the item's base price (or fraction thereof), with a minimum of at least 8 hours...The caster can work for up to 8 hours each day. He cannot rush the process by working longer each day, but the days need not be consecutive, and the caster can use the rest of his time as he sees fit."
But then we have this rule:
"this process can be accelerated to 4 hours of work per 1,000 gp in the item's base price (or fraction thereof) by increasing the DC to create the item by 5."
This says that he can do 1,000 gp in four hours but does not change the fact that he can work up to 8 hours per day.
So....since the 1000gp per day (8 hours) rule is for Magic Items with accelerated crafting making it still 1 per day (4 hours - allowing you to do it while traveling). How much time does accelerated crafting take for NON-MAGIC items. Is it assumed to be 1/2? because the SRD does not say.
it simply says:
Special
Accelerated Crafting You may voluntarily add +10 to the indicated DC to craft an item. This allows you to create the item more quickly (since you'll be multiplying this higher DC by your Craft check result to determine progress). You must decide whether to increase the DC before you make each weekly or daily check.
so half time for +10 to the DC? sound right?
Also..the magic 1000/gp a day really messes up everything.
Craft Wonderous Item: a magical Folding Boat 7,200gp = about 7 days for a 15 person SHIP!
Craft a non magical rowboat: 50gp (500sp) = about a week and a half (and that is if I set the skill DC at about 15 and give our ship builder a skill of 12 and let him take 10)....I am sure a 15 person ship will take WAY longer but there is not one I can find in the rules.
I think I will throw the crafting rules out and just make up numbers that sound good when I need them.
Magic items are magic. A folding boat is just a box with layers of spells built into it to transmute it into a ship. It doesn't take long to craft a box; the majority of the time is imbuing it with magical ability.
Regular crafting is time consuming. A week and a half is pretty good for a rowboat.
The regular crafting rules are pretty bad in some places, though. Poisons, for example.
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It is the actual crafting feats limit you to 1000 gp per day not the craft magic item rules.
Think about what you just wrote.
The feats reproduce the general rule.
The craft magic item rules add a specific rule to override the general rule.
Also in the crafting magic Item rules you are limited to only 1 item a days so you can’t fast accelerate one item get 1,000 gp out of it and then fast craft another getting 1,000gp. Thus preventing you from getting 2,000 gp of work at all.
Who said anything about working on a second item? You CAN work on the same item the full eight hours per day max.
Thus the only reason to fast craft is to save yourself more hours in the day to do something else, during down time, such a retraining, maybe a profession check, rp bar room scene or single day encounters. Or to get a full 4 hours’ worth of work while adventuring. Sucks but that is RAW. The wording in the feats would have to change to allow 2,000 gp per day. As they are they are all “Crafting X takes 1 day for each 1,000gp in its base price.”
Again, specific trumps general.
Another good reason for fast crafting is less days of hiring another caster to provide a spell you need for the item. Yes, you can add 5 to the DC, but only for some items, and if you cannot afford the higher DC, hiring another becomes reasonable.
So....since the 1000gp per day (8 hours) rule is for Magic Items with accelerated crafting making it still 1 per day (4 hours - allowing you to do it while traveling). How much time does accelerated crafting take for NON-MAGIC items. Is it assumed to be 1/2? because the SRD does not say.
While adventuring, you max at 4 hours per day. It is either worth 2 hours of magic crafting if spread throughout the day, or worth 4 hours if you can make it a 4 hour block. This has nothing to do with accelerated crafting. Accelerated crafting speeds up the effectiveness of the time you do spend.
it simply says:
Special
Accelerated Crafting You may voluntarily add +10 to the indicated DC to craft an item. This allows you to create the item more quickly (since you'll be multiplying this higher DC by your Craft check result to determine progress). You must decide whether to increase the DC before you make each weekly or daily check.
so half time for +10 to the DC? sound right?
This is the rule for mundane accelerated crafting, and not the rule for magical accelerated crafting.
Also..the magic 1000/gp a day really messes up everything.
Craft Wonderous Item: a magical Folding Boat 7,200gp = about 7 days for a 15 person SHIP!
Craft a non magical rowboat: 50gp (500sp) = about a week and a half (and that is if I set the skill DC at about 15 and give our ship builder a skill of 12 and let him take 10)....I am sure a 15 person ship will take WAY longer but there is not one I can find in the rules.
I think I will throw the crafting rules out and just make up numbers that sound good when I need them.
Actually, it is great. Mechanical traps with automatic reset and a proximity trigger can go up to DC 45. Accelerate at +10 for DC 55. With a skill of 45 and Take-10, you generate just over 300gp/week worth of the trap. All other DCs listed fall below this, thus producing less gp/week. [Well, if you craft an armor with AC +35 or better, or a strength bow with a mod of 15 or more can top this, but when does that ever happen? :-)]
In that same time, you can craft magic items worth 14,000gp. That is over 45 times as fast for the most profitable mundane crafting. [There are ways to bump up Craft(Alchemy), but I will skip for now.]
/cevah