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If the Slayer is a Halfling woman I will squee.
SQUEE I say!!!
a loligoth iconic could easily be a human, elf, or half-elf pretty easily if working with core races.Or Halfling, a not insignificant number of which canonically pass as human children.
i'd rather the loligoth iconic not be a halfling or gnome. now a human, elf or half elf, sounds workable, but the childlike halfling sounds too much like a cliche.
now a seemingly frail and petite human female of 14-19 could work pretty well. there are plenty of pieces representing well endowed women with very idealized figures, but what about petite human women that are potentially plucky and vulnerable?
we can't push all these archetypes on to the races. how about a human of 5 feet and 100 pounds whom disguises herself as a 10-14 year old apprentice as a means to draw enemy sympathy and catch them defenseless through a faked lack of experience? despite being 16-19 or so?
halflings are a little too young when it comes to appearance.
i just want a loligoth iconic or 3 for the Weeaboo in me. something animesque and cute, that isn't a gnome or halfling and is not half-naked. my problem with most of the current female iconics, is their costumes are either very skimpy and revealing, or very skintight and formfitting,Yes, you want a loligoth. That is very, very apparent.
However... The representation of female iconics seems to be pretty well done. You have women in armor (that is very specifically not boobplate) in the Paladin and Cleric. The Barbarian and Inquisitor are both wearing appropriate attire that is not sexualized. You have petite women without any boobs or butt in the Rogue (she wears "skin tight" leather.... But you can't see anything of her figure because she is covered in knives. That doesn't count as cheesecake and you know it) and the Druid. You have women who don't wear much clothing, true, in the Witch, Oracle, and Sorcerer, but there's nothing wrong with that. Their poses are also specifically done in a manner to where they are strong and confident in their abilities, not the seductive boobs-and-ass poses that so many other companies go out of their way for.
I mean, keep asking for your kawaii anime iconic, but please don't misrepresent the facts.
the iconic artwork for PF is pretty animesque already, it's just they don't have an iconic whose appearance suits my tastes. loligoth is a fashion style, and the character wearing it doesn't neccessarily have to be a child. but i would be upset if they made said iconic either a halfling or gnome. everytime we have a seemingly youthful iconic, they are always either a halfling or gnome. how about a youthful iconic whom isn't hiding behind their race as an excuse?
i mean loligoth is one step closer in the fantasy anime direction with the way the artwork looks.
halflings and gnomes seem to have the monopoly on otherwise cute iconics. can we have a similarly cute iconic that isn't a halfling or gnome? can we have a gothic fauxlita that isn't using their race to justify their fashion choice?
how hard is it to include 1 human loligoth for once without making her another halfling or gnome?
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i just want a loligoth iconic or 3 for the Weeaboo in me. something animesque and cute, that isn't a gnome or halfling and is not half-naked. my problem with most of the current female iconics, is their costumes are either very skimpy and revealing, or very skintight and formfitting,Yes, you want a loligoth. That is very, very apparent.
However... The representation of female iconics seems to be pretty well done. You have women in armor (that is very specifically not boobplate) in the Paladin and Cleric. The Barbarian and Inquisitor are both wearing appropriate attire that is not sexualized. You have petite women without any boobs or butt in the Rogue (she wears "skin tight" leather.... But you can't see anything of her figure because she is covered in knives. That doesn't count as cheesecake and you know it) and the Druid. You have women who don't wear much clothing, true, in the Witch, Oracle, and Sorcerer, but there's nothing wrong with that. Their poses are also specifically done in a manner to where they are strong and confident in their abilities, not the seductive boobs-and-ass poses that so many other companies go out of their way for.
I mean, keep asking for your kawaii anime iconic, but please don't misrepresent the facts.
the iconic artwork for PF is pretty animesque already, it's just they don't have an iconic whose appearance suits my tastes. loligoth is a fashion style, and the character wearing it doesn't neccessarily have to be a child. but i would be upset if they made said iconic either a halfling or gnome. everytime we have a seemingly youthful iconic, they are always either a halfling or gnome. how about a youthful iconic whom isn't hiding behind their race as an excuse?
i mean loligoth is one step closer in the fantasy anime direction with the way the artwork looks.
halflings and gnomes seem to have the monopoly on otherwise cute iconics. can we have a similarly cute iconic that isn't a...
This is sort of the way I feel about Small warriors, All warriors are always Dwarves or Humans or Orcs. I want to see some Halfings and Gnomes as Warriors
Creative Director
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Dont suppose a break down of the rest of the races would be possible?Yup. We sent the art order for the iconics out several months ago. I've not yet seen any of the sketches for them, but hopefully soon. Just as with our other iconics, we have an equal split of male/female, and if I remember correctly, 5 or 6 are humans of various ethnicities.
In any event, their appearances have been locked in since before Gen Con.
(And the reason half or just above half are human is because Golarion is humanocentric. That's not going to change.)
Nope. That's a huge reveal and one of the more important steps in building anticipation for 2014. We've got plans for where and when and how to reveal the iconics, and right now is too soon.
This is sort of the way I feel about Small warriors, All warriors are always Dwarves or Humans or Orcs. I want to see some Halfings and Gnomes as Warriors
i agree with you there.
i want a human loligoth iconic, and you want a halfling or gnomish martially inclined iconic that isn't mounted
we are like siblings in this respect.
if you will be my Onii-Chan, can i be your Imouto?
Nope. That's a huge reveal and one of the more important steps in building anticipation for 2014. We've got plans for where and when and how to reveal the iconics, and right now is too soon.Dont suppose a break down of the rest of the races would be possible?Yup. We sent the art order for the iconics out several months ago. I've not yet seen any of the sketches for them, but hopefully soon. Just as with our other iconics, we have an equal split of male/female, and if I remember correctly, 5 or 6 are humans of various ethnicities.
In any event, their appearances have been locked in since before Gen Con.
(And the reason half or just above half are human is because Golarion is humanocentric. That's not going to change.)
no it is not ;)
Could we hope for a Hispanic looking Iconic and one more dark skinned human (sorry don’t know the correct word. No offence intended).
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We need an Ulfen! Ulfen Bloodrager! And a Shoanti Shaman.
Seelah is pretty clearly wearing boobplate. The iconic cleric does however avoid boobplate.
You must have a very different understanding of sexualized than I do. I would say stuff like this is pretty sexualized. Imrijka is less sexualized than Amiri, but her art still has the whole boob-window thing going on.
I don't know where you get Merisiel is free from boobs or butt. Her outfit in her art has a boob-window. Or consider the miniature for her. The druid Lini does avoid these issues, though. I'll admit she's actually one of my favorite iconics.
Whomever made the Merisiel figure, obviously wasn't paying attention to the dimensions of the drawing, or Merisiel had a boob job between the two.
I want Iconics like this Phil and Dixie The third and last panels.
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i·con·ic/aɪˈkɒnɪk/ Show Spelled [ahy-kon-ik] Show IPA
adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of an icon.
2. Art. (of statues, portraits, etc.) executed according to a convention or tradition.Iconics shouldn't be gimmicks. A halfing Fighter can be cool, but when you say "Fighter," I think Dwarf or Human.
So the iconic ranger shouldn't use an axe and a crossbow (not traditional), be a dwarf (very not traditional), or be a dwarf that drinks tea instead of ale (practically heresy!)?
And the iconic fighter shouldn't use two-weapon fighting?
And the iconic cleric shouldn't carry a scimitar?
The 'iconics' have been quirky (and tarred and feathered for making un-optimal choices, in some circles) from the get-go.
Indeed, it could be said that, in Golarion, 'iconic' is *not* the same as 'traditional,' 'cause this isn't your grandpa's setting, where dwarves can only be fighters or clerics (and therefore the only dwarven iconics will be Tordek and Eberk), and, of course, the half-orc is a barbarian, because they aren't smart enough to be anything else, and obviously the iconic thief is a Halfling, because they aren't good at anything else.
i·con·ic/aɪˈkɒnɪk/ Show Spelled [ahy-kon-ik] Show IPA
adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of an icon.
2. Art. (of statues, portraits, etc.) executed according to a convention or tradition.Iconics shouldn't be gimmicks. A halfing Fighter can be cool, but when you say "Fighter," I think Dwarf or Human.
So the iconic ranger shouldn't use an axe and a crossbow (not traditional), be a dwarf (very not traditional), or be a dwarf that drinks tea instead of ale (practically heresy!)?
And the iconic fighter shouldn't use two-weapon fighting?
And the iconic cleric shouldn't carry a scimitar?
The 'iconics' have been quirky (and tarred and feathered for making un-optimal choices, in some circles) from the get-go.
Indeed, it could be said that, in Golarion, 'iconic' is *not* the same as 'traditional,' 'cause this isn't your grandpa's setting, where dwarves can only be fighters or clerics (and therefore the only dwarven iconics will be Tordek and Eberk), and, of course, the half-orc is a barbarian, because they aren't smart enough to be anything else, and obviously the iconic thief is a Halfling, because they aren't good at anything else.
You're taking my comment out of context. We were speaking specifically in terms of the Race of the Iconics.
And I know, the Ranger being a Dwarf is a little different, but he's also a giantslayer, which fits squarely in Dwarf territory.
For Harsk, dwarves can make fine rangers. He uses a crossbow because, frankly, a dwarf with a longbow looks silly. He uses an axe because dwarves love axes.
As far as the tea, I think that's because Wayne Reynolds put a teapot in his gear and the Paizo staff riffed on that. Kind of like Valeros's lucky tankard.
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We can make some sane guesses at their home countries if nothing else. We have:
Alahazra - Rahadoum, Manaket
Alain - Taldor
Amiri - Mammoth Lords
Balazar - Nex
Damiel - Kyonin, River Kingdoms
Ezren - Absalom
Feiya - Linnorm Kings, Irrisen
Harsk - Varisia, Druma
Hayato - Minkai
Imrijka - Ustalav
Kyra - Qadira
Lem - Cheliax (which surprises me)
Lini - Linnorm Kings
Lirianne - Alkenstar (and horribly underused I might add)
Merisiel - Varisia
Reiko - Minkai
Sajan - Vudra
Seelah - Katapesh
Seytiel - Cheliax (?)
Seoni - Varisian poster girl
Valeros - Andoran (obviously, he's the all-American hero)
Assuming some other important places will be represented, here are my guesses.
The Swashbuckler might be from Galt. Something about the flag-waving and revolutionary spirit says a dashing blade would fit right in, like the the scarlet pimpernel with a rapier, or anachronistically a Musketeer.
The Arcanist might be from Razmiran. The only problem might be the evil nature of the place, but a magic user who can eat clerical magic items for their power would be right at home there.
The Shaman is probably from Mwangi. It might be a bit obvious, but Mwangi will definitely be represented, surprised it isn't already. The only reason it won't is if the concept is a little too close to Alahazra's as an 'African' mystic. I wouldn't be unhappy though, Mwangi is excellent and it deserves an iconic of one of the game's most powerful classes.
The Hunter might be from Nirmithas. That place is CG woodland, Robin Hood land and a brave huntsman with his pet wolf will not be out of place.
The Bloodrager might be Shoanti and I think there is support for this idea as Shoanti needs a hero. The other option is that he is from the Worldwound. Bloodragers are crazy, violent and magical. You have to put them in a safe place where it doesn't matter if they break or fireball stuff. As it happens, my playtest BR is an urban Andoran Eagle Knight who gets mileage out of his high charisma, but I appreciate not everyone wants to go in that direction.
For Warpriest I think we need a less obvious deity. Calistria is one of the most interesting deities and does not have enough published support. Kyonin then? Frankly I'd like to see a Wasp Queen PRC but that's for another discussion.
Skald will be some harsh northerner - Mendev, Shoanti or possibly Brevoy.
For Slayer I am backing Mediogalti Island, maybe the Shackles. This is because connecting the class to the Red Mantis is a given and these places just loooove assassins. Slayers loooove assassinating people.
Brawler - Belkzen? Half-Orc? Maybe it's a bit obvious, but I wouldn't mind seeing it at all.
Investigator - Cheliax. I know there are two Chelish characters already but neither is typical. Lem is a halfling from the slave class and Seytiel is just a weirdo. Cheliax is a place of cities and political intrigue, power games and blackmail. An investigator can be tied to the Chelish establishment without being Asmodeus worshipping and evil, because Paizo don't want to go with evil. Also Paizo love Cheliax (as do I) and support the place like they do their beloved Varisia.
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The Bloodrager might be Shoanti and I think there is support for this idea as Shoanti needs a hero.
Will the Bloodrager be the hero they want or the hero they deserve? ;)
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...and Seytiel is just a weirdo.
I lol'd
An investigator can be tied to the Chelish establishment without being Asmodeus worshipping and evil, because Paizo don't want to go with evil
Ironically enough, Seytiel is our Evil iconic - our Asmodeus-worshiping, Lawful Evil bishi iconic, so a new evil iconic isn't something that's necessarily impossible.
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We need a male iconic in boobplate.
Be careful what you wish for. Oglaf, entire site NSFW
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I just want someone from Nurvatchta.
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I just want someone from Nurvatchta.
Obscure nation, uh huh...
Strange but beautiful people, right, blah blah...
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They do what now
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And someday, hopefully not too far in the future, I'd like a goblin iconic.
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I just want someone from Nurvatchta.Obscure nation, uh huh...
Strange but beautiful people, right, blah blah...
!
They do what now
Y'know, I was going to say "can we have Holomogi amazon dinorider?" but this makes me want to change my vote. :D
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What I really want is an iconic from the nation of Geb.
I'm thinking a Warpriest of Urgathoa, or maybe a Bloodrager with the Undead bloodline?
Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.
Customer Service Dire Care Bear Manager
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Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.
Seltyiel ;)
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Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.Seltyiel ;)
Sometimes when I see that avatar portrait using his Mythic artwork I just get lost in his eyes.
Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.Seltyiel ;)
Gah!
Normally I love Pathfinder's artwork (hey, WotC - THIS IS HOW YOU ART) but that guy's just...icky. Not even villain-icky, just icky in general and the pose is...
Dude's literally begging to get run through.
Or he broke the oath of ages among the dwarvenkind: THOU SHALL NEVER SIP TEA, ALE IS THE ONLY BEVERAGE FIT FOR A DORF.
Fixed it for you. ;)
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The Swashbuckler might be from Galt. Something about the flag-waving and revolutionary spirit says a dashing blade would fit right in, like the the scarlet pimpernel with a rapier, or anachronistically a Musketeer.
Seconded, though I could also see Brevoy as an option.
Investigator - Cheliax. I know there are two Chelish characters already but neither is typical. Lem is a halfling from the slave class and Seytiel is just a weirdo. Cheliax is a place of cities and political intrigue, power games and blackmail.
Cheliax would be good, but I could also see Ustalav (the southern part of the country has some good intrigue plots going for it).
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I can't decide if I like this one or the first better.
Cute little fiery elemental / demon dude he's conjuring up makes all the difference. As often happens with fantasy art, it makes me want to write up a spell that could do that. (As I don't think there's anything on the Magus list that creates little winged fire demon dudes and chucks 'em at people.)
Dude should be wearing a mithril shirt, 'though. Isn't that standard Magus-wear?
I blame chainmail for being a pain to draw. :)
(Same with Alhazra. Why not use that armor proficiency, chica? Not that you aren't dressed fabulously for a blind woman, but still, no use wasting a revelation to have magic armor for a small fraction of your work day, when you could just shell out pocket change for some jangly metal protection, or even a nice white dragonhide breastplate, to keep your core cool in those warm climates.)
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Or he broke the oath of ages among the dwarvenkind: THOU SHALL NEVER SIP TEA, ALE IS THE ONLY BEVERAGE FIT FOR A DORF.Fixed it for you. ;)
Wars have been started for less!
No true dwarf (tm) drinks aught but mead.
And sipping? No. Chugging, pouring and shotgunning are the accepted means of imbibement, with the odd exception for bodyshots off of an elven lasses tummy.
a young and petite human noblewoman from Southern Ustalav could be an amazing investigator. i'm not saying loligoth, but i had stuff like a hybrid of Irene Adler from Sherlock Holmes and Victorique De Blois from Gosick. the spoiled and selfish noble lady whom deduces brilliant deductions as a third party to help the true investigative authorities (Victorique) and a former performer of great wealth and talent (Irene).
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Personally, I hope the investigator is an Ustalavian woman who dresses like Sherlock and smokes a pipe :)
Hell, if the investigator DOESN'T look like that, I'm going to deviantart and commissioning the mess outta her ;)
Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.You don't have to be evil to be born and raised in Geb.
Heck, the motivation for joining the Pathfinders writes itself. "I joined so I could go ANYWHERE BUT GEB."
Geb sounds like a great place to live! Late night parties, folks who take care of all your stuff for you, a strong political leader, and a GREAT military.
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Geb sounds like a great place to live! Late night parties, folks who take care of all your stuff for you, a strong political leader, and a GREAT military.Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.You don't have to be evil to be born and raised in Geb.
Heck, the motivation for joining the Pathfinders writes itself. "I joined so I could go ANYWHERE BUT GEB."
Also, their recycling program is quite effective...
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Or he broke the oath of ages among the dwarvenkind: THOU SHALL NEVER SIP TEA, ALE IS THE ONLY BEVERAGE FIT FOR A DORF.Fixed it for you. ;)Wars have been started for less!
No true dwarf (tm) drinks aught but mead.
And sipping? No. Chugging, pouring and shotgunning are the accepted means of imbibement, with the odd exception for bodyshots off of an elven lasses tummy.
I believe quaffing is also an acceptable method of imbibing.
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Generally speaking all iconics must be non-evil, I believe it's a Paizo rule.Seltyiel ;)Gah!
Normally I love Pathfinder's artwork (hey, WotC - THIS IS HOW YOU ART) but that guy's just...icky. Not even villain-icky, just icky in general and the pose is...
Dude's literally begging to get run through.
He has the "boob window" that people gripe about in art of female characters. Of course those same people are often silent on the barechested warriors....