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My 2 cp is that I believe that the elemental races should be made a bit more available. Especially considering that Aasimars and Tieflings are as well. I don't think however that I can make a better argument for them then has previously been stated.
As an aside, in my years of playing and GMing, multiple cons included, I have never seen a character or even the boonsheet for those races. I know they must exist but they just don't seem to come to Idaho :(
The elemental races are the races that are in the boon rotation this year (convention support). If you were hoping for an Ifrit, it was the fall boon so you'd probably have to trade to get your hands on it.
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Secondly, I would say, look at the GM stars. I wouldn't say it's everyone, but the players who have put in a lot of time and energy GMing, setting up games, and basically giving their blood sweat and tears tend to be on the 'lets not open up too much' side of things.
I'm not for opening up everything, but I would just like a route to getting it opened up that wasn't based on the ability to attend cons, which is largely based on geographic area. Virtual cons might be filling that niche, but I really did like the star options, or the scenario option (run/succeed at rats of round mountain, collect a boon) Luddite and living in a sparsely populated area do tend to go together a bit
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Is it wrong I was actually expecting for once that Blood of the Moon would be the return of Chronicle Sheets inside it for preordering it to allow playability of a race?
The return? I'm not sure this was ever a thing, was it? As a subscriber, pretty much everything I buy is a preorder, and I don't remember it.
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First off, my last few posts have come off as a little shrill, for that I appologise (it's what sometimes happens when you post without enough sleep). As for why people who want more races, particularly those who want to open up everything I feel have less moral weight behind it is twofold.
First off, in PFS Golorian is a world set up with certain facts built it, for example, humans are the most dominant race, Cheliax worships devils, Andoran doesn't allow slavery etc. Everyone who plays in PFS accepts these 'givens'. When you alter the racial demographics too much you are changing one of these basic facts, rather like getting rid of Andoran.
Secondly, I would say, look at the GM stars. I wouldn't say it's everyone, but the players who have put in a lot of time and energy GMing, setting up games, and basically giving their blood sweat and tears tend to be on the 'lets not open up too much' side of things. I think that should carry some weight. Also many of them have been in past organized play systems like Living Greyhawk and Living City. I wasn't there, but I have heard a lot of people talking about having tables where a Lizard man, 2 Drow, and an Assimar walk into a bar in a major city and it's a 'lets blend into the crowd' mission. Basically, the 'lets let everything in' attitude detracted from the game, and resulted in a loss of players over time.Of course my perception could be biased, but I see a lot more vitriol, personal attacks, and entitlement coming from the "I want less race options at...
Thank you for the explanation. I do think that people deserve props, rewards, whatever for donating their time and efforts to making PFS run. I know it takes a lot of work and volunteer hours to make happen. I also know that many times it can be thankless work.
But I am also a little reluctant to say stars should be the metric for dictating what is best for PFS, because I think high stars can often ironically lead to a mentality that isn't always concerned with what is best for PFS. If you look at people who have started to view PFS as a job instead of fun, those that get the most pleasure at events from the death of players, those that seem disappointed when no one dies, those that actively try to attack the wealth of characters, those that are the most hostile towards builds that players put a lot of time and effort into making work efficiently, are all 3+ star GMs. This is not to say that all high star GMs burn out, but it does happen. Because of this, I personally don't think that heavily weighting the opinions based on stars is going to lead to the most collective fun. The whole purpose of this game is to have fun, and less fun equals less profit.
The problem with the attitude that buying a book deserves some reward, is that I bought the book AND when to a Con.
I don't have insight into market analytics at Paizo, but I am inclined to wonder why your con attendance matters for this point. Perhaps con attendance generates much more revenue than I realize. At the Comicon I went to here, I don't think Paizo saw any direct profits.
I would think that books that open up races would be ones that people would be more inclined to buy. I can easily see people dodging a book purchase on a feat or item here or there in a build. If it came up, only a small aspect of the character is invalidated. However, if it ever were to arise that someone was using an illegal race, that would invalidate an entire character. This leads me to think race books should sell better than your average other book that is being sold to make a PFS legal build. I would be very interested in seeing if my speculation on these sales are accurate. If so, the Blood of Angels and Demons saw a spike after opening up those races to the public, and they should have higher sale rates than similar products.
Cons obviously do lead to revenue, but is the amount gained by con limited race, item, etc boons more than what would be made by treating those same things as free market items? Right now I have zero chance of buying the Dhampir book, but I would do so almost immediately if I could build a PFS character with it. Judging by several of these threads, I think a lot of people would do the same for other races they are interested in.
In addition to your "Well I have done more" mentality possibly not making the most business sense, it can be used to justify all sorts of silly things. When I was in the military, this mentality was pretty rampant, and I always thought that it was a flaw in reasoning based on some variation of band-wagoning or ad populum to trick people into doing all kinds of irrational things that they wouldn't normally do. I have seen a lot of people deny themselves health, time, family, nourishment, self improvement, and dignity in the name of "some people do more for less."
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Secondly, I would say, look at the GM stars. I wouldn't say it's everyone, but the players who have put in a lot of time and energy GMing, setting up games, and basically giving their blood sweat and tears tend to be on the 'lets not open up too much' side of things.I'm not for opening up everything, but I would just like a route to getting it opened up that wasn't based on the ability to attend cons, which is largely based on geographic area. Virtual cons might be filling that niche, but I really did like the star options, or the scenario option (run/succeed at rats of round mountain, collect a boon) Luddite and living in a sparsely populated area do tend to go together a bit
I don't think you're wrong, and judging by the online cons (not my thing btw) and citing examples of events, like charity events where a store has two games a night and two slots saturday/sunday for one week to qualify for con boons as 'blueprints' of how you can do it in a smaller/less active PFS area are examples of showing people 'what to do'. I know I've sent most of my boons in the mail to players in such areas (and I'm out, and taking a break from GMing because of work and that additional stressers in my life have made me less effective of late IMHO). It's not perfect but it's something.
I think a boon (racial or otherwise) a star would be a good idea.
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Thank you for the explanation. I do think that people deserve props, rewards, whatever for donating their time and efforts to making PFS run. I know it takes a lot of work and volunteer hours to make happen. I also know that many times it can be thankless work.
But I am also a little reluctant to say stars should be the metric for dictating what is best for PFS, because I think high stars can often ironically lead to a mentality that that isn't always concerned with what is best for PFS. If you look at people who have started to view PFS as a job instead of fun, those that get the most pleasure at events from the death of players, those that seem disappointed when no one dies, those that actively try to attack the wealth of characters, those that are the most hostile towards builds that players put a lot of time and effort into making work efficiently, are all 3+ star GMs. This is not to say that all high star GMs burn out, but it does happen.
I don't disagree, and have had a few encounters which back up what your saying. I even know of a VO who was removed in part because of such arrogance (and sadly didn't see it when it was pointed out to him). Age can lead to wisdom but it can lead 'I know better'. I think evidence of involvement is what stars do reflect.
I think, ironically, we are both right, but neither of us tells the whole story.
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Stars do not denote knowledge. While it will be more common to find more wealth of knowledge and experience, stars do not and should not denote that someone is more knowledgeable than someone.
I do believe the following:
1. OUTSIDER subtypes should be kept to a minimum. I say this because I have had a number of sessions so far break because a BBEG simply could not do anything to an outsider, or the environmental effects could not affect an outsider. The biggest thing that comes to mind is Golemworks Incident, and Tide of Twilight. Tide of Twilight completly lost its edge of weirdness and urgency because the party was a Druid, Tiefling, Tiefling, and Aasimar. Most games I have run in my lodge ahs at least 1 tiefling or aasimar. In Golemworks,
2. We need more small races. Kobolds already have several reasons they can be introduced, so do Ratflok (Sewer dragons of Absalom, and Rats of Round Mountain respectively). Neither of these races are uncommon or evil, both are actually very common, simply sticking to their own clans and tribes. Neither introduce any additional power and are very balanced. Will they introduce more freakness? Yes, but introducing any new race at this point in time will. I feel like opening a new race should introduce another small or two. We only have 2 currently.
3. Variety is the spice of life. With so many new materials and players lately, I feel introducing a couple more races really does not have a drawback both mechanically or roleplay wise.
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Kobolds already have several reasons they can be introduced
Kobolds are 'kill on sight' monsters in Absalom; I doubt you'll ever see them available to all.
And people who own Orcs of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide aren't allowed to play their favorite race. And the people who will own Kobolds of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide won't be allowed to play their favorite race. And whenever there is a gnoll, drow, duergar, or any other evil race, those people won't be able to play their favorite race. They won't ever be open for everyone to play.
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Kobolds already have several reasons they can be introducedKobolds are 'kill on sight' monsters in Absalom; I doubt you'll ever see them available to all.
And people who own Orcs of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide aren't allowed to play their favorite race. And the people who will own Kobolds of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide won't be allowed to play their favorite race. And whenever there is a gnoll, drow, duergar, or any other evil race, those people won't be able to play their favorite race. They won't ever be open for everyone to play.
Good tag, I did not realize Kobolds were kill on sight!
The Kobolds were merely an idea, since they were small, and have been touched in the Society. My main point was that it would be nice to have some more small races.
The return? I'm not sure this was ever a thing, was it? As a subscriber, pretty much everything I buy is a preorder, and I don't remember it.
The Aasimar race from the Blood of Angels book.
And people who own Orcs of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide aren't allowed to play their favorite race. And the people who will own Kobolds of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide won't be allowed to play their favorite race. And whenever there is a gnoll, drow, duergar, or any other evil race, those people won't be able to play their favorite race. They won't ever be open for everyone to play.
Darn.
Venture-Lieutenant, Florida—Melbourne
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Kobolds already have several reasons they can be introducedKobolds are 'kill on sight' monsters in Absalom; I doubt you'll ever see them available to all.
And people who own Orcs of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide aren't allowed to play their favorite race. And the people who will own Kobolds of Golarion and the Advanced Race Guide won't be allowed to play their favorite race. And whenever there is a gnoll, drow, duergar, or any other evil race, those people won't be able to play their favorite race. They won't ever be open for everyone to play.
Darn. I was hoping to bring back my Living Greyhawk Kobold Monk, Ki Yip Kai, master of Cowerfu.