Advanced Anti-Swarm Tactics


Advice

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

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So I've played some PFS scenarios lately that had some brutal swarms. They were at high enough level that carrying a few alchemist's fire just didn't cut it anymore. Obviously this isn't an issue for arcane casters, but what about martials and divine casters? What other options exist for dealing with higher-level swarms? Here's what I can think of:

Gear:
-Swarmbane Clasp (Expensive, and not useful against anything else)
-Necklace of Fireballs (Expensive, and risky)

Divine Spells:
-Sound Burst (Still low damage, and depending on GM, the stun effect might be useless)
-Wrathful Mantle (Mediocre damage, especially for a 3rd-level spell)

Anything else I should know about?

Dark Archive

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Swarmsuit - If you know its coming, makes you immune to it, so you can just walk past it.

Spells:
Gust of Wind and any spell that creates wind works on them. Even though the swarm is a Large creature, you treat it as though it were the size of the individual creatures in the swarm.

Wind Fan (5.5k gp 1/day each additional time 20% cumulative chance to break)
Elixir of Forceful Exhalation, 3 gust of winds within an hour of taking it.
Scrolls of Gust of wind are your best bet for that spell though. Druid/Magus/Sorcerer/Wizard

Anything that does area of effect damage does 50% more damage. Generally swarms have less HP than a monster of similar CR.


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Vermin Repellent
Elixir of Fire Breath


Druid: air elemental (either summoned or transformed) Whiiiirl wind attack!

Fire elemental: go ahead.. hit me!

Flaming sphere

Aqueous orb.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Hmm, I might have to invest in some vermin repellent so I can run away while they feast on my teammates.

The Elixer of Forceful Exhalation would be great if the swarms are flying, but against crawling swarms, the damage isn't so great. I think Elixer of Fire Breath is the way to go so far for my Cleric and Oracle.


Druid has flame strike


And ice storm

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Yeah, I know Druids have a solid selection of blasting spells, but Clerics/Oracles, not so much.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Ingredients:

Ring of fire resistance.
Flask of oil.
Tindertwig.

Process:

Step one: Pour oil on self.

Step two: Set self on fire.

Conclusion:

Swarm will either try to avoid you, or if it does insist on attacking will take fire damage each turn they share space with you.


Depending on the environment, could you use the oil to create a fire to block the swarm? Such as pouring the oil in a ring around yourself, and lighting it on fire.

Obviously circumstantial (dangerous in buildings made using wood; generally frowned upon), and not accounted for in the rules as an action and its effect, but it would make sense for it to work, no? These are hardly large bears that could charge through the fire, but instead dozens/hundreds/thousands of small creatures that would each be burnt badly over a large portion of their bodies.

Would you accept a player using bottles of oil/drinks with high alcohol content as a ranged touch weapon similar to an alchemist's fire? (obviously it would take another action to light, creating an obvious opportunity/actual monetary cost scenario)

Shadow Lodge

Hang on, a Swarmbane Clasp is 3000gp, and you say you're playing at high level. That's hardly expensive. How high level are we talking?

A ring of feather falling isn't useful against anything except falling, either.


Characters without AoE spellcasting as a class feature can always use UMD on some scrolls/wands of your AoE of choice.

Clerics and Oracles have access to mind-affecting effects so they can handle hive-mind swarms of non-immune creature types.

Martial characters can wield bludgeoning weapons against swarms composed of Tiny creatures with standard effects. They can also utilize any of the following Combat Maneuvers against swarms normally:

Dirty Trick (blinded works wonders)
Drag (move the swarm into position to be Fireballed)
Overrun (charge over it to get to the BBEG)
Steal (...ok, I got nothin' on this one)

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Avatar-1 wrote:

Hang on, a Swarmbane Clasp is 3000gp, and you say you're playing at high level. That's hardly expensive. How high level are we talking?

A ring of feather falling isn't useful against anything except falling, either.

Well, high level for PFS, which is about 7+. I might actually go with the Swarmbane Clasp for my combat Oracle, but it won't help my caster Cleric much.


[q]and not accounted for in the rules as an action and its effect, but it would make sense for it to work, no?[/q]
Look under the entry for oil flask in equipment. Just add more oil if not happy with damage :)


Why didn't the gouge tags work?


7heprofessor wrote:

Steal (...ok, I got nothin' on this one)

Don't come up with anything for this. I just know my players will figure out how to pick-pocket a swarm and stuff the whole swarm into a pouch for later use.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
RainyDayNinja wrote:

Hmm, I might have to invest in some vermin repellent so I can run away while they feast on my teammates.

The Elixer of Forceful Exhalation would be great if the swarms are flying, but against crawling swarms, the damage isn't so great. I think Elixer of Fire Breath is the way to go so far for my Cleric and Oracle.

+1 on the swarmbane clasp. 3000 gp is not a lot of change at higher levels. Certainly less than a raise dead.

Otherwise if the swarm is land-bound, 300gp for potion of levitate or 750gp for a potion of fly. Or if you can cast it, even better.

The aforementioned Elixir of Fire Breath works well. 3 shots for 4d6 energy usually works okay.

If it's a cleric, even if sound burst is relatively low damage, it's still an area (+50% damage) effect. And it has the added benefit of being something an offensive style cleric may memorize anyway.

If you have time, Glyph of Warding (3rd, 10 min casting time) will give better damage.

Meld Into Stone and ignore the swarm.
Wind Wall also is quite effective. Good one to have as a scroll anyway if you're dealing with archers.

Once your divine gets access to 4th, there's the Smite series to go with, if you want simple blasting.


DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

Ingredients:

Ring of fire resistance.
Flask of oil.
Tindertwig.

Process:

Step one: Pour oil on self.

Step two: Set self on fire.

Conclusion:

Swarm will either try to avoid you, or if it does insist on attacking will take fire damage each turn they share space with you.

Yes. Alchemist fire could do it a little quicker if you want to get fancy.


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DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

Ingredients:

Ring of fire resistance.
Flask of oil.
Tindertwig.

Process:

Step one: Pour oil on self.

Step two: Set self on fire.

Conclusion:

Swarm will either try to avoid you, or if it does insist on attacking will take fire damage each turn they share space with you.

This will work even without the ring of fire resistance, so why use that, it's expensive isn't it???

The Exchange

Except you'll be taking Fire Damaage as well as Swarm Damage if you have no fire resistance.

The Exchange

Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I allowed my players to use the flat of a shield as a blunt weapon for 1/2 damage against swarms of tiny size. SMOOSH.


About the whole lighting yourself on fire thing resistance 5 does t give u immunity to suffocation...

The Exchange

No, but the average character can hold his breath for a pretty long time.

Quote:
You can hold your breath for a number of rounds equal to twice your Constitution score, but only if you do nothing other than take move actions or free actions. If you take a standard action or a full-round action (such as making an attack), the remainder of the duration for which you can hold your breath is reduced by 1 round. (Effectively, a character in combat can hold his breath only half as long as normal.)


I always thought that using a burning torch as a weapon against a swarm would be pretty effective???

The Exchange

Snowleopard wrote:
I always thought that using a burning torch as a weapon against a swarm would be pretty effective???

The only damage a torch will do against tiny and diminutive swarms is the 1 Fire damage, so this is only effective at first level, and with Spider Swarms having 9 hp, you'll be in major trouble.


RainyDayNinja wrote:
Anything else I should know about?

Rope Trick.

Get in and pull up the rope. It is an extra-dimensional space that can be sealed off from the environment.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Guys, we need to brainstorm these tactics fast.

Then send them to the Chinese.


Sound burst and shout are good choices, sonic resistance is rare.

+1 for just leaving the area.

It's a bit cold, but bait works well too. Cast mount, summon something, or sacrifice the horses to buy yourself time to flee.

WInd wall can buy time.

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