Questions from a new GM / DM!!!


Beginner Box


I recently bought a Pathfinder BB due to a convincing sales pitch against the D&D items I was looking to purchase. I have been out of the RPG world 20+ years so was completely unaware of all the changes and legal stuff. I had some found memories and wanted to provide some for my children. Anyway, enough of the back-story, I do have some noob questions that my memory fails to provide me with a solution.
1) When treasure is found does the PC that finds it keep everything and I have to make sure as GM that all PC's get a chance to find equal treasure? Or do I distribute the treasure that is found equally?

This problem arised as one PC that moved faster was finding most of the treasure first in the adventure thus leaving other PC's low. I have made a few adjustments but was wondering what action is the norm staying within the Pathfinder rules.

2) If PC's in the party are becomeing low on hit points because an encounter is proving to be to hard for them, what mechanic can I use for them to make a flee attempt from the encounter?

We are enjoying the game and are going to advance beyond the BB but I want to become more comfortable with the game before I am introduced to the more complex features of the game. I was told that this community is great at offering help/answers to questions and I hope this holds true. I am sorry if these questions seem redundant or obvious but I truly was not able to find a good explanation with the limited resources contained in the BB.


Welcome!

To answer your questions, I'll keep it as simple as possible for Beginner Box and try to leave anything too rulesy or complex out:

1. You're the boss, as the GM. It's your rules, so you can distribute treasure as you see fit and you feel is fair. If other players are having a hard time or seem to feel a bit put out by the other player roving ahead and grabbing loot, you may want to pause the game and have a calm but frank conversation on making sure that everyone is playing in a way that allows everyone to have fun.

In Pathfinder Society Organized Play and on these forums, there's a simple rule: "Don't be a jerk." Seems obvious, but it's something for every player and GM to keep at the forefront of their mind.

2. For now, again, you're the boss as GM. You can decide when your player group may have bitten off more than they can chew, and when to let off the throttle in terms of the monsters you're throwing at them.

Later on, you'll read about Withdraw Actions in the Core Rulebook, but for now, just simply letting your players know that the occasional tactical retreat is certainly available as a choice for them if they feel they need to run away.

Liberty's Edge

I can only try to address #2. if there are full move actions, withdraw, and run actions in the basic set, then you could suggest such to the players. withdraw allows the charactor to move thier movement rate as a full round action without attacks of opportunity. running is four times movement rate and may carry them out of the combat quickly, depending on the terrain.


ighost wrote:
1) When treasure is found does the PC that finds it keep everything and I have to make sure as GM that all PC's get a chance to find equal treasure? Or do I distribute the treasure that is found equally?

We regard it as a group effort. It doesn't matter who picks it up first, it's all "party treasure" and at a convenient time we share it out equally and decide who gets what magical stuff based on how much everyone currently has and who can make best use of it.

In our view, the cleric or Mage at the back don't charge for their spell casting, so the thief scouting ahead shouldn't get to profit more than the others just due to fulfilling his role.


ighost wrote:
2) If PC's in the party are becomeing low on hit points because an encounter is proving to be to hard for them, what mechanic can I use for them to make a flee attempt from the encounter?

Basically, on their turn, they can move twice their speed (ie use a move action and then another move action in place of their standard action).

Unfortunately the beginner box rules arent great on this. In the core rules it gets slightly more complicated when it comes to leaving a square next to the opponent (and there are more nuanced options available to the PCs when it comes to running away). It's not a particularly elegant part of the game though, in my opinion.

As a general rule, I rely heavily on what will entertain the players best. Plotting out a protracted chase scene across the battlemat (your move - my move - your move - my move - etcetera) is not particularly exciting, in our experience - if the monsters move faster than them, they'll never really be able to get away, if the monsters are slower then they'll always get away.

I generally fall into descriptive mode if the party decides to flee (and maybe allow them to make one or two skill checks as they slam doors, push over statues, rush through obstructing terrain, leap over pits etcetera). Alternatively, I'll allow the monsters one final missile attack against the fleeing characters and then let the PCs regroup unmolested to lick their wounds.


Some good advice so far.

Though i want to comment on Lamontius' "You're the boss!" Ummmhh... not so much. It's a group game. The PCs are controlled by the players alone. Check out The social contract and RPGs blog post on gonome stew. Food for thought.

As for your questions:

1. If one player wants to grab all the loot and not share, he may. Though he could be breaking the (implicit) social contract with the other players. If it creates problems in the group talk about it out of character. If the players are okay with it, it can create some interesting roleplaying.

2. If the players decide to flee, let them try. Providing the rules for resolution of this i.e. a method to decide if they succeed or not, is up to you. And they get to roll some checks. The proper use of encounter distances, the perception skill or maybe chase rules (or use these) can circumvent many encounters. Those are advanced rules though, so how about you set the initial encoutner distance and let them roll Wisdom checks to notice.

Also not all encounters need to be combat encounters. Or what about some bluffing or intimidating, or *gasp* diplomacy?


Are your players young children? I have GM'd for a total of about 20 kids between 8 and 12 years old, and I find only a precious few of them capable of thinking in terms of the group's welfare when it comes to treasure lol. Because the adventures necessitate group effort, in reality every player (unless he or she played particularly poorly) has a significant contribution to every coin of treasure found. And so I basically have taken control of the distribution of treasure, dividing coins evenly and lowering a character's share of the good when that character receives a magic item -- sometimes even taking a magic item and owing gold to the other party members later.

If it were not for the relative lack of maturity of my players, I would have them devise their own system. But I would also argue against a "you snooze, you lose" system of treasure distribution because it rewards competition and encourages players to race into a room or open a treasure chest without taking the proper precautions. (If they went ahead anyway, I would let the in-game circumstances punish, or reward, such behavior.) It also becomes a real source of inter-player conflict that I don't see turning out well unless the players have full knowledge of what they're getting themselves into.

As far as I remember, the BB doesn't codify how to handle retreat. So use your common sense, perhaps whatever you did in your long-ago gaming days. The full rules introduce attacks of opportunity -- which interrupt a moving character's movement -- AND add exceptions to this rule. Review the PRD rules on attacks of opportunity to see if you want to add these rules for this particular situation in your Beginner Box play.


Wow you all have some great advice. So far for the treasure I have been letting them find and keep what they find but if someone was getting or finding too much then I just alter their access to the treasure. As for treasure that comes from monsters I decide it up among the party. Now for the difficult monster thing I either had a npc come rescue them while not destroying the monster for them and making the pc's pay gold to the npc for the hassle. My kids are young teens but have the attitude of "let me get what I need then I might give you something". This of course is the product of sibling rivalry. I really like Steve's idea of handling the retreat by making it more randomized while keeping it entertaining.
Pathfinder so far seems pretty flexible and we are really enjoying it. You guys are to notch and have been a great help. I can't wait till I learn all the core rules and expand my knowledge. Your help has been appreciated and I hope someday I can pay it forward or back.


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Thanael wrote:
perception skill

I linked to the d20pfsrd there, which has the PFRPG Core Rules. So don't worry if it looks a bit too detailed. Though if you click Fast Play rules it should be quite legible.

For easy reference of the PF Beginner rules check out the www.PFBeginner.com website which lists the perception rules from the Beginner Box here.

Also i recommend reading threads in the Beginner forum like this one or this one which contain some excellent advice. (...and a link to this excellent blog about the introducing kids to RPGS with the PF Beginner Box)


Thanael wrote:
Thanael wrote:
perception skill

I linked to the d20pfsrd there, which has the PFRPG Core Rules. So don't worry if it looks a bit too detailed. Though if you click Fast Play rules it should be quite legible.

For easy reference of the PF Beginner rules check out the www.PFBeginner.com website which lists the perception rules from the Beginner Box here.

Also i recommend reading threads in the Beginner forum like this one or this one which contain some excellent advice. (...and a link to this excellent blog about the introducing kids to RPGS with the PF Beginner Box)

Thanks for linking to my article! I actually haven't continued writing on the topic, not being sure how much interest there has been in it! It's encouraging me to write some more.

Good luck ighost! It sounds too me like there hasn't been too much conflict among your players so far -- I am guessing you don't have characters with overlapping abilities? Two archers will have a lot more loot to argue over, than a fighter and a wizard, for instance


Thanks again I am grateful for the additional resources.

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