Dreamscarred Press introduces the Path of War


Product Discussion

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Insain Dragoon wrote:

An Equilibrium Gun kata discipline would've been cool as heck though.

Our closest approximation according to Errant X is using Solar Wind and Broken Blade, though the only class who could pull that off right now is the Stalker.

Or a Grammaton Cryptic.

-X

Paizo Employee Design Manager

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In addition to the Stalker option (which is actually really cool), and the Cryptic option in Ultimate Psionics, there's some stuff by other 3pp who did releases that really took the time to deal with firearms in the thorough way they require that could scratch that itch until DSP has the time to really dig in and give it the attention it needs to really be done right.

Little Red Goblin Games has a .pdf called the Tome of Munitions that features a Gunslinger archetype called the Ascetic Trigger who uses katas and other techniques to give you a character much like Christian Bale in Equilibrium.

And if the Grammaton, Stalker, and LRGG's class aren't enough to scratch that itch, let me tell you three things:

1) Patience is a virtue.

2) The Akashic Mysteries Incarnum conversion was not the original pitch that Dreamscarred brought me on as a Lead Designer for. It was something else, and that something else, which is already mostly written and just awaiting the proper time to be added to the production schedule and released for playtest, involved a metric assload of firearms.

3) Chris and I are already in cahoots on an Akashic/Initiator cross-over class. If things go well there, and the time for the project mentioned in item number 2 comes around, there is a really good chance that you will get what you want at that time (or at least something really close to it) since we'll be taking the time to address the entire firearm subsystem anyways.


Well when I hear awesome news like that I can't help but learn to be patient can I? I'm super excited for any Akashic: Path of War Edition stuff already and the idea of Firearms being thrown in is even cooler!

At least I know that the reason I wont see it for a while is because DSP has some of the best playtesting practices I've seen in a Tabletop RPG developer.


The 12th level ability of the Stalker's Combat Insight class feature says

Combat Insight wrote:
This ability does not function against constructs, undead, or creatures with under 1/2 HD.

I suspect it's supposed to mean half the Stalker's hit dice.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

Insain Dragoon wrote:

Well when I hear awesome news like that I can't help but learn to be patient can I? I'm super excited for any Akashic: Path of War Edition stuff already and the idea of Firearms being thrown in is even cooler!

At least I know that the reason I wont see it for a while is because DSP has some of the best playtesting practices I've seen in a Tabletop RPG developer.

It may not even be that long a wait, because if I can get all of the Akashic stuff through final review and into layout by mid-August, I will be begging Jeremy and Andreas to allow me to open up the playtest on my other project in time for the initial playtest and subsequent releases to run alongside the release of the Iron Gods AP.

Keeping in mind that I haven't talked to Chris about this at all beyond him knowing what that other project is, I'd probably look at doing a Warder archetype or organization that introduced one new discipline specifically designed to compliment some of the new weapons and ideas, and it's probably something that wouldn't be released in playtest until October at the earliest.

All of which requires me getting a lot of work done and as much playtest and review information as possible on Akashic Mysteries before I can even consider trying to make that a reality and wheedling Chris into joining me on another project, assuming he's available.

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

And currently most of my time is going toward wrapping up projects, especially fulfilling our kickstarter rewards, plus gearing up for gencon.

I'm unfortunately a bottle neck at this point, although we are trying to fix that particular problem.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

So if any of you have them layout skillz and are willing to accept "exposure and a really b#@@*in' referral letter" as a substantial portion of your compensation, you should probably message the boss-man with a link to your portfolio ;)


Alas my portfolio is just "Two bestiary articles in Wayfinder."

I better change that :)


Playtesting is important. The hardcore playtesting that is done for these projects is the reason I've generally been so satisfied. If you say it's gonna take a long time for "Playtest Reasons" then you know what? Ok, that's great because I want a good base product, not a broken product that needs patches out the gate.


Aratrok wrote:

The 12th level ability of the Stalker's Combat Insight class feature says

Combat Insight wrote:
This ability does not function against constructs, undead, or creatures with under 1/2 HD.
I suspect it's supposed to mean half the Stalker's hit dice.

No, that means a creature with 1/2 a hit die. I.e. that god-forsaken bag of rats / kittens / other small mammals that people love to reference and incite me to rage. A rat, by itself, does not have a full hit die. Neither does a kitten, or a parakeet, or a goldfish. They have 1/2 a hit die. This reads as 1hp. If the creature is a parakeet / goldfish / rat / kitten, then what are you doing fighting it, you heartless murderous hobo?

-X

Paizo Employee Design Manager

It should probably be "creatures with 1/2 hit die or less".

And rat killing has been a time honored profession since the first Baldur's Gate (at least!). I got my very first xp ever killing a rat in a basement... Sadly, my very first character death was also at the weird little paw-hands of a rat in a basement (that's when I learned why 1st level elven wizards should both invest in Con and never engage in melee with anything, ever).


That's not a mechanic in Pathfinder. Rats have a hit die.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

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That's adorable. Also, evidence that it's been a long time since I've looked at a Bestiary entry for rats, since I didn't catch that either. (If I'm going to throw rats at the party, they'll at least be dire rats, for the group's dignity if nothing else.)

On an unrelated note, it made me sad to see that the average kobold only has 1 more hit point than the average sewer rat.


Yeah they got rid of the fractioned hit die completely in Pathfinder. Might want to rewrite that to prohibit things below a certain CR instead?

Paizo Employee Design Manager

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Orthos wrote:
Yeah they got rid of the fractioned hit die completely in Pathfinder. Might want to rewrite that to prohibit things below a certain CR instead?

Agreed. Since it's a 12th level ability anyways, you could just say creatures of CR 1 or lower or something to that effect.


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Ssalarn wrote:
*Unending stream of good news.*

Well. Hard to respond to this. Guess I can only say that DSP continues to prove to me that they deserve my patronage. You rock Ssalarn.

Dark Archive

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Ssalarn wrote:

In addition to the Stalker option (which is actually really cool), and the Cryptic option in Ultimate Psionics, there's some stuff by other 3pp who did releases that really took the time to deal with firearms in the thorough way they require that could scratch that itch until DSP has the time to really dig in and give it the attention it needs to really be done right.

Little Red Goblin Games has a .pdf called the Tome of Munitions that features a Gunslinger archetype called the Ascetic Trigger who uses katas and other techniques to give you a character much like Christian Bale in Equilibrium.

Flying Pincushion (for whom I work) just did a gun kata prestige class, too, in Into the Breach: The Gunslinger.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Worth noting that I've been a bad internet friend and still owe YD a review on his last release, but he managed to really impress me by writing one of only two witch archetypes in existence that I've liked enough to consider playing and I have every reason to suspect the Gunslinger materials will be equally up to par.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'm genuinely flattered. I owe you a bouquet of kittens.

Edit: I don't know why I'm surprised that the internet can deliver this picture for me...


When is this book comiiiiiiiiiing!?

Paizo Employee Design Manager

Barachiel Shina wrote:
When is this book comiiiiiiiiiing!?

I'm fairly certain Jeremy is doing everything he can think of short of stealing a Gutenberg printing press and hand crafting the plates to get printed copies available in time for GenCon.


Ssalarn wrote:
Barachiel Shina wrote:
When is this book comiiiiiiiiiing!?
I'm fairly certain Jeremy is doing everything he can think of short of stealing a Gutenberg printing press and hand crafting the plates to get printed copies available in time for GenCon.

...and why isn't he doing that? Come on, its all about the customer (me). He should be willing to risk some jail time.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

Gator the Unread wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Barachiel Shina wrote:
When is this book comiiiiiiiiiing!?
I'm fairly certain Jeremy is doing everything he can think of short of stealing a Gutenberg printing press and hand crafting the plates to get printed copies available in time for GenCon.
...and why isn't he doing that? Come on, its all about the customer (me). He should be willing to risk some jail time.

Plus, just imagine the collectible value.

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

The proof arrived late yesterday and today was spent correcting the minor issues.

I'm waiting for Chris to get me the minor changes from the last review that came in, then it's export and release.

Paizo Employee Design Manager

Jeremy, have you sorted out how those of us with the subscription can obtain the discounted hard copy? (Or did I miss that announcement?)

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

Not yet, but we did it before with other projects, so I'm sure we'll figure out a solution. :)


Is there an answer on why some of the 1st-level stances scale and others don't?


GhanjRho wrote:
Is there an answer on why some of the 1st-level stances scale and others don't?

Because I felt some stances held use throughout the majority of an initiator's career at their current tier, and I felt others needed to scale up to continue to perform their job and maintain function.

-X


I have the subscription so I am waiting on the PDF :D


Stupid question with regards to the Warder's Defensive Focus ability.

Am I misreading this somehow? Since it's a full-round action to recover maneuvers with it, the extended threat region and everything that goes with it (movement), bonus against Acrobatics, difficult terrain etc... will almost never come into play. Right? I mean, the only time it would actually do anything is if an opponent had a readied action, I think. Because the full-round action is resolved entirely on the warder's turn, so nobody else actually gets to commit any actions that would provoke an AoO.

Maybe I'm sequencing this wrong in my head. I suspect I am but keep running an initiative sequence where X goes, Y goes, warder goes (recovers maneuvers), Z goes, and because "(recovers maneuvers)" happens entirely on the warder's turn, X, Y, and Z don't ever get to trigger any of its neat abilities.

I'm thinking that maybe this should be a one-round action, so all that pretty text happens every once in a while?


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Barachiel Shina wrote:
I have the subscription so I am waiting on the PDF :D

Um, Barachiel, if you've got the subscription to the WiP here on Paizo, just re-download it. It contains the unified book (DRP2710_FULL.PDF).


It's a full round action to set up, it persists until the beginning of your next turn.

Defensive Focus wrote:
Until the beginning of his next turn...


Anguish wrote:

Stupid question with regards to the Warder's Defensive Focus ability.

Am I misreading this somehow? Since it's a full-round action to recover maneuvers with it, the extended threat region and everything that goes with it (movement), bonus against Acrobatics, difficult terrain etc... will almost never come into play. Right? I mean, the only time it would actually do anything is if an opponent had a readied action, I think. Because the full-round action is resolved entirely on the warder's turn, so nobody else actually gets to commit any actions that would provoke an AoO.

Maybe I'm sequencing this wrong in my head. I suspect I am but keep running an initiative sequence where X goes, Y goes, warder goes (recovers maneuvers), Z goes, and because "(recovers maneuvers)" happens entirely on the warder's turn, X, Y, and Z don't ever get to trigger any of its neat abilities.

I'm thinking that maybe this should be a one-round action, so all that pretty text happens every once in a while?

Think of it as the same way "Summon Monster" full-round actions occur. The ability is on-going until the beginning of the Warder's next turn, allowing it to be interrupted (or in this case trigger) until the Warder finishes it.


Cavian wrote:
Anguish wrote:

Stupid question with regards to the Warder's Defensive Focus ability.

Am I misreading this somehow? Since it's a full-round action to recover maneuvers with it, the extended threat region and everything that goes with it (movement), bonus against Acrobatics, difficult terrain etc... will almost never come into play. Right? I mean, the only time it would actually do anything is if an opponent had a readied action, I think. Because the full-round action is resolved entirely on the warder's turn, so nobody else actually gets to commit any actions that would provoke an AoO.

Maybe I'm sequencing this wrong in my head. I suspect I am but keep running an initiative sequence where X goes, Y goes, warder goes (recovers maneuvers), Z goes, and because "(recovers maneuvers)" happens entirely on the warder's turn, X, Y, and Z don't ever get to trigger any of its neat abilities.

I'm thinking that maybe this should be a one-round action, so all that pretty text happens every once in a while?

Think of it as the same way "Summon Monster" full-round actions occur. The ability is on-going until the beginning of the Warder's next turn, allowing it to be interrupted (or in this case trigger) until the Warder finishes it.

If that's the case, then it is NOT a full-round action. It is a one-round action.

Edit: doing some digging in the Combat section of the Core, it's really great that this has been crappy since 3.0 According to Combat, there's no such action as a one-round action.

And yet, as with the summon spells...

Casting Time: 1 round

So yeah, I maintain that there needs to be specific verbiage declaring this an action that requires one round. Full-round actions are things like charge or withdraw.

Full-Round Action

A full-round action consumes all your effort during a round. The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action. You can also perform free actions and swift actions (see below). See Table: Actions in Combat for a list of full-round actions.

Some full-round actions do not allow you to take a 5-foot step.

Some full-round actions can be taken as standard actions, but only in situations when you are limited to performing only a standard action during your round. The descriptions of specific actions detail which actions allow this option.


Aratrok wrote:

It's a full round action to set up, it persists until the beginning of your next turn.

Defensive Focus wrote:
Until the beginning of his next turn...

Aratrok found it.


Prince of Knives wrote:
Aratrok wrote:

It's a full round action to set up, it persists until the beginning of your next turn.

Defensive Focus wrote:
Until the beginning of his next turn...
Aratrok found it.

Thanks to both of you. I'm mostly reading this word-by-word to make sure each sentence is correct, so the big-picture escaped me. Glad that's covered.


Anguish wrote:
Barachiel Shina wrote:
I have the subscription so I am waiting on the PDF :D
Um, Barachiel, if you've got the subscription to the WiP here on Paizo, just re-download it. It contains the unified book (DRP2710_FULL.PDF).

Is it the final draft or does this one have all the corrections in it? I was told it would be re-released with all the corrections.


I'll be picking this up tomorrow, so a couple of questions.

Are the martial traditions included in the PDF? If so, are you limited to only being a member of one of them at a time?

I would love for my first character out of this to be a Warder/Umbral Blade that uses Black Seraph and, as far as I can tell, the only way I can get access to Black Seraph before Umbral Blade would be through the Martial Tradition which I would also need to be in another Martial Tradition to get the maneuvers needed for Umbral Blade, I forget the name.

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

Barachiel Shina wrote:
Anguish wrote:
Barachiel Shina wrote:
I have the subscription so I am waiting on the PDF :D
Um, Barachiel, if you've got the subscription to the WiP here on Paizo, just re-download it. It contains the unified book (DRP2710_FULL.PDF).
Is it the final draft or does this one have all the corrections in it? I was told it would be re-released with all the corrections.

I haven't updated the final PDF yet - waiting for feedback from Chris and Anguish and incorporating those changes. The PDF that's been released thus far is the preliminary draft.


Barachiel Shina wrote:
Anguish wrote:
Barachiel Shina wrote:
I have the subscription so I am waiting on the PDF :D
Um, Barachiel, if you've got the subscription to the WiP here on Paizo, just re-download it. It contains the unified book (DRP2710_FULL.PDF).
Is it the final draft or does this one have all the corrections in it? I was told it would be re-released with all the corrections.

Keep in mind that what we're up to is basically proofreading. The current PDF is usable for actual play, and learning the system. The kind of corrections that are mostly being made are typos that spell-checkers won't catch. So both the fluff and crunch are usable as-is.


That said, once we DO reach the final draft, the WIP will be of course updated to reflect that.


The 5th stance is gained at a weird place; it's one level before you qualify for 8th-level stances. As it stands, you can't get an 8th-level stance until 20 without a feat.


GhanjRho wrote:
The 5th stance is gained at a weird place; it's one level before you qualify for 8th-level stances. As it stands, you can't get an 8th-level stance until 20 without a feat.

Since the original release, I've adjusted the stance progression.

-X


Where is this PDF people keep talking about? I keep hearing people talk about it, but it's not on the DSP store.


If you have the Path of War Work in Progress PDF, it's in that download.


Considering I'm a subscriber I'm surprised that I don't have that PDF anywhere in my account.

When was it released? I've been on subscription since February.


Insain Dragoon wrote:

Considering I'm a subscriber I'm surprised that I don't have that PDF anywhere in my account.

When was it released? I've been on subscription since February.

Do you own this?

If you do, that's it. Go to the download for that product and inside the zip is the component parts and the full book.

Remember there's the nice new Downloads tab within a product page that takes you straight to its download too.


Ahh dang, I only own the PoW subcription off the Dreamscarred Press web store.


Insain Dragoon wrote:
Ahh dang, I only own the PoW subcription off the Dreamscarred Press web store.

Okay, I'm sorry I can't help there, but I'm sure Jeremy would be able to.


Might as well wait till the full release, to get the errors in it fixed.

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