The header is basically the question. Imagine a Two Weapon Warrior who gets many abilities only after full attacking. Could you use that action on a dust mote lets say, to activate some of their armour buff or riposting abilities??(Defensive Flurry,Deadly Defense) Visually I imagine a martial arts movie (Conan doing a Kata!) in which the character flails his weapons around before actually engaging a foe.
yes you can do what ever you want. you can scream pudding and full attack the ghost next to you that only you can see and hear.
I am not certain what direction RAW would go on this, but personally I would allow it; you're spending a full-round action to buff yourself, and I don't see that really as any different than a caster using a standard action to put up a buff spell.
No, you cannot. That was asked before with Fighting Defensively. You can not gain the AC by attacking the air each round.
No, you cannot. That was asked before with Fighting Defensively. You can not gain the AC by attacking the air each round.
can you post a link?
An attack roll represents your attempt to strike your opponent on your turn in a round. When you make an attack roll, you roll a d20 and add your attack bonus. (Other modifiers may also apply to this roll.) If your result equals or beats the target's Armor Class, you hit and deal damage.
With a normal melee weapon, you can strike any opponent within 5 feet. (Opponents within 5 feet are considered adjacent to you.) Some melee weapons have reach, as indicated in their descriptions. With a typical reach weapon, you can strike opponents 10 feet away, but you can't strike adjacent foes (those within 5 feet).
"Represents your attempt to strike your opponent"
"You can strike any opponent within 5 feet"
RAW would suggest that you must have a viable target in order to make an attack or take a full attack action. Feats like Combat Expertise, Crane Style, or the attack modifier Fighting Defensively are contingent upon making an attack during your turn.
Using your action to increase your defenses without attacking anybody is a different action, Total Defense.
What buffs are in question here that require a full attack to activate. Knowing more specifics will help decide the correct answer.
What buffs are in question here that require a full attack to activate. Knowing more specifics will help decide the correct answer.
Nordlander mentioned them in the original post - Defensive Flurry and Deadly Defense (from the TWF Fighter archetype).
No, you cannot. That was asked before with Fighting Defensively. You can not gain the AC by attacking the air each round.
You can certainly Fight Defensively every round - lower AC bonus than Full Defense. Two main problems with doing it out of combat:
1) You'll quickly become fatigued and exhausted by constant combat.
2) You're flat-footed at the beginning of combat until your turn, thus losing the Dodge bonus to AC that fight defensively gives you.
I would say YES
There is no stipulation that you must successfully hit an opponent.
Attacking an invisible opponent in a square is about the same as attacking an empty square you are simply imagining where the opponent will be and striking as if they were in that spot. This would activate the buffs.
So then, there is nothing to say that your opponent must be hittable or even real. Full attacking an empty square where the fighter imagines an invisible opponent, should work. I believe this is called shadow boxing.
If that is not good enough... Like fireball can be targeted at a square the adjacent square can be declared the opponent and targeted. Full attack the adjacent space as the viable target, done.
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If that is not good enough... Like fireball can be targeted at a square the adjacent square can be declared the opponent and targeted. Full attack the adjacent space as the viable target, done.
If I can't attack the darkness, I'm going back to the tavern to get drunk with the ogre-slaying knife guy...
No, that's just silly. Why even put in the requirement if it's meaningless?
Here's the real question, does anyone think the intent of either of these abilities is that you should be able to get the bonuses without performing a full attack against an opponent? Not just a square, or a spec of dust but an actual creature.
Besides, as DrDeth said above, if you could simply full attack the dust or a square or a door to recieve this bonus what would really be the point of the requirement in the first place?
You all can argue this is allowed by RAW but its ridiculous to me to believe that was the intent.
Here's the real question, does anyone think the intent of either of these abilities is that you should be able to get the bonuses without performing a full attack against an opponent?
What bonuses? Even if you're ignoring other creatures in combat and they actually move to attack you, it's doubtful the bonus from Defensive Flurry will be any better then just going Full Defense.
As for Deadly Defense... at 19th level... sure - waste your turns swishing your blades around, and you can have free attacks on people if they bother to rush up to you (kinda like if you readied or delayed).
None of this does anything outside/at-start of combat, when you're flat-footed.
You all can argue this is allowed by RAW but its ridiculous to me to believe that was the intent.
I agree,
But if attacking an empty space to get buffs makes the player and GM happy even if it is not the intent of the ability it is the intent of the game as a whole. And possibly the point of doing it, you know, just for fun.
If getting reassurance that this is an accurate interpretation of RAW so that they can wholly feel satisfied in their practices. Even if they are in my opinion wasting a round for the sake of buffing. As it really seems to be doable. If it brings a smile to them then I am not to be a naysayer on the issue.
Sometimes its worth a chuckle right?
Besides, as DrDeth said above, if you could simply full attack the dust or a square or a door to recieve this bonus what would really be the point of the requirement in the first place?
While I can't say whether it's allowed by RAW\RAI or not, I don't know that that's a very good argument against it.
It's a requirement because otherwise the ability grants a flat AC bonus, which is far more powerful than an ability that has some method of activation.
Even if you assume that you can activate it without attacking an actual foe, it still limits its benefits; a Fighter isn't going to wander around town randomly swinging his swords on the off-chance that an assassin might shoot a crossbow bolt at him, because the city guard will probably frown upon it.
However, he might go through a quick routine of attacks prior to charging into combat to limber himself up or to try and intimidate his foes.
I wouldn't spend all day full attacking the air even if it did have a positive effect. Who wants their movement reduced to 5 feet per round?
I can't understand a world where you can attack a square that you think an invisible enemy might be in, but can't attack a square that you don't think one is in. Either you can attack a square or you can't, and if you can't, then invisibility just became way better.
As for me the original question is based upon possibly rolling a fighter and noting some issues with the Two Weapon Warrior archetype (his weapon training replacement and two major abilities are based on FULL Attacks at the loss of ALL Armour Training and Weapon Training{Gloves of Dueling...} so on some reflection not the greatest archetype
But on wider view if not allowed it would likely adversely affect other Martial feats , for example Stalwart line seems to be better working off of Crane Style than Combat Expertise. So the fighting defensively activation of the Stalwart line could be important for some builds. The idea of attacking a mythical invisible foe to activate certain abilities, as stated, at HUGE opportunity cost doesn't seem overpowering. In the tradition of Schrodinger we could call this potential nemesis, the "Full Attack Cat"
Absolutely, you can. It's entirely up to you to designate an opponent for your full-attack action. There's no rules anywhere that says combat opponents must be living creatures and "buffs" only take effect in an actual combat scenario. If you want to turn that dust mote into...dust...then go for it!
I also put my vote in that this is just like a caster pre-buffing before a fight. I imagine Bruce Lee (or Bruce Leroy) warming up on that Kung-Fu Mannequin with all the pegs, etc...
Unless you are flying you can always attack the ground below you non-lethaly.
Eat that RAW