Pauper Princess |
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I need clarification on the Master Craftsman feat. Does having Master Craftsman allow a PC to use his ranks in a Profession to allow him to get the Craft Wondrous Item feat? Can he then craft wondrous items?
Here are the descriptions of Master Craftsman and Craft Wondrous Item:
Master Craftsman
Your superior crafting skills allow you to create simple magic items.Prerequisites: 5 ranks in any Craft or Profession skill.
Benefit: Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level. You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item. The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.
Normal: Only spellcasters can qualify for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats.
Craft Wondrous Item (Item Creation)
You can create wondrous items, a type of magic item.Prerequisite: Caster level 3rd.
Benefit: You can create a wide variety of magic wondrous items. Crafting a wondrous item takes 1 day for each 1,000 gp in its price. To create a wondrous item, you must use up raw materials costing half of its base price.
You can also mend a broken wondrous item if it is one that you could make. Doing so costs half the raw materials and half the time it would take to craft that item.
See magic item creation rules for more information.
Per the description, if you have 5 ranks in a profession, you can get the Master Craftsman feat. You can then choose a profession that you have at least 3 Ranks in to qualify for getting the Craft Wondrous Item feat because the prerequisite to get the Craft Wondrous Item feat is that the PC is a caster of at least 3rd level.
1)The PC has Profession: Merchant with 20 ranks.
2)The PC picked Master Craftsman feat on a level up.
3)The PC picks Craft Wondrous Item feat on a level up because he has Master Craftsman feat and it allows him to treat his skill ranks in Profession Merchant as his caster level for the purpose of qualifying for CWI.
4)The PC can now craft wondrous items given that he has the spells at his disposal for the duration of the crafting and he can roll high enough to craft them.
Is this all correct or is there something that is being missed?
Orfamay Quest |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Only if you use Profession: Merchant to create the item.
I'm not sure how your abilities as a merchant are supposed to allow you to create anything, though. I invite you to explain how the ability to buy low and sell high will allow you to invest a necklace with the ability to enrobe your fists in flame.
A more typical use for Master Craftsman would be Profession:Scribe and the Scribe Scroll feat, which allows you to write not merely elegant but magical documents, or in conjunction with Craft Wondrous Item to write stat-enhancing books. Profession: Herbalist might allow you to brew potions and similar magical (herb-based) elixirs, and of course Craft: Weapons is how dwarven smiths made those mighty swords of yore.
ETA: I should also add that access to the spells is not necessary. This can make Master Craftsman extremely powerful but the fact that it needs to be a specific (and useful) skill limits. A spellcaster will typically be able to use Spellcraft to manufacture any itemhe likes. A Master Craftsman will only be able to make a few things -- a master leatherworker could perhaps make a suit of (leather) armor, a belt, a vest, or a pair of boots, but not a bell, a sword, or a candle.
VRMH |
how is he limited to what he can craft?
He's limited to crafting magical items not covered by the other magical item creation feats. So if he want to try his hand at, say, shipbuilding, he could build a whole boat - provided it can be used to cast a cantrip or gives a small magical bonus.
At least that's what the rules say. A wise GM will step in at that point, and enforce some sanity.Orfamay Quest |
But since he has Craft Wondrous Item, how is he limited to what he can craft?
Because he has to use the relevant skill to make the item in question.
Which means, first of all, that the skill must have an item-making component. Profession(baker) probably wouldn't cut it, as I don't think I've seen any magical fruit pies anywhere in the system. Profession(merchant) also falls into this trap. As I said, I don't know of anything I would let you use that skill to make, as merchants don't make things. Profession(jeweler) would be fine -- providing what you want is in the form of jewelry, like a necklace or a ring or a tiara. Necklace of Fireballs, great. Key of Lock Jamming, probably not.
Second of all, the GM is under no obligation to allow you to re-skin items. So if you want to make a Candle of Invocation, unless you can come up with a way that you can make a candle using only Profession(baker), you don't get to say "well, I'll just make a Bagel of Invocation instead."
Third of all, Craft Wondrous Items is specifically singled out as NOT allowing you to duplicate other magic items by re-skinning them (this is a rule change from 3.0 and 3.5), so no Hat of Regeneration to avoid needing Forge Ring.
Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 |
I read this completely differently from you guys.
Have 5 ranks in Profession: Lawyer? Take this Feat, then take Craft Magic Arms and Armor, and craft away. You are not restricted to only making Lawyer related magic items. You simply use your Profession: Lawyer check in place of your Spellcraft check. If you want a Flaming Sword, then add +5 to the DC if you don't have the spell prerequisites.
Orfamay Quest |
I read this completely differently from you guys.
Have 5 ranks in Profession: Lawyer? Take this Feat, then take Craft Magic Arms and Armor, and craft away. You are not restricted to only making Lawyer related magic items.
RAW differs with you.
Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level. You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item. The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.
Tell me how your skill at writing briefs enables you to forge a sword, and I'll reconsider.
Starbuck_II |
Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan wrote:I read this completely differently from you guys.
Have 5 ranks in Profession: Lawyer? Take this Feat, then take Craft Magic Arms and Armor, and craft away. You are not restricted to only making Lawyer related magic items.
RAW differs with you.
d20pfsrd.com wrote:Tell me how your skill at writing briefs enables you to forge a sword, and I'll reconsider.
Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level. You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item. The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.
Ask Asmodeus how he used his lawyer skill you create the magic contract he made.
It was called the contract of creation.Ughbash |
Rules on Magic creation lists skills used in creation startign on page 550 of core rule book.
Creatign Magic Armor
Items Creation Feat Required: Craft magicv arms adn armor
Skill used: Spellcraft or Craft armor
Creating magic weapons,
Feat required Craft magic Arms adn Armor
Skill used in creation: Spellcraft, Craft (bows) (for magic bows adn arrows), or Craft (weapons) (for allother weapons).
It lists the skills that can be used for various skills, so Profession Merchant or Profession Lawyer will not work (though Progfession Scrieb or Craft CalligraphY) will work for scrolls.
Can'tFindthePath |
Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan wrote:I read this completely differently from you guys.
Have 5 ranks in Profession: Lawyer? Take this Feat, then take Craft Magic Arms and Armor, and craft away. You are not restricted to only making Lawyer related magic items.
RAW differs with you.
d20pfsrd.com wrote:Tell me how your skill at writing briefs enables you to forge a sword, and I'll reconsider.
Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level. You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item. The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.
Sorry, but semantics differs with you.
The terminology "You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item." is referring to the creation of the magical part of the item, not the mundane item itself. That would read 'to craft the item.'
You must of course have a masterwork item to imbue with the magic, but you then use your chosen profession OR craft skill.
Think about it, since by definition in the CRB, only craft skills can produce items, then why would the feat allow you to chose a profession skill?
Orfamay Quest |
Orfamay Quest wrote:Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan wrote:I read this completely differently from you guys.
Have 5 ranks in Profession: Lawyer? Take this Feat, then take Craft Magic Arms and Armor, and craft away. You are not restricted to only making Lawyer related magic items.
RAW differs with you.
d20pfsrd.com wrote:Tell me how your skill at writing briefs enables you to forge a sword, and I'll reconsider.
Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level. You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item. The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.Sorry, but semantics differs with you.
The terminology "You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item." is referring to the creation of the magical part of the item, not the mundane item itself. That would read 'to craft the item.'
You must of course have a masterwork item to imbue with the magic, but you then use your chosen profession OR craft skill.
Think about it, since by definition in the CRB, only craft skills can produce items, then why would the feat allow you to chose a profession skill?
Because there are a number of instances where profession skills are called out as being useful for making items Profession(scribe) for writing things, for example.
Diego Rossi |
Only if you use Profession: Merchant to create the item.
I'm not sure how your abilities as a merchant are supposed to allow you to create anything, though. I invite you to explain how the ability to buy low and sell high will allow you to invest a necklace with the ability to enrobe your fists in flame.
A more typical use for Master Craftsman would be Profession:Scribe and the Scribe Scroll feat, which allows you to write not merely elegant but magical documents, or in conjunction with Craft Wondrous Item to write stat-enhancing books. Profession: Herbalist might allow you to brew potions and similar magical (herb-based) elixirs, and of course Craft: Weapons is how dwarven smiths made those mighty swords of yore.
ETA: I should also add that access to the spells is not necessary. This can make Master Craftsman extremely powerful but the fact that it needs to be a specific (and useful) skill limits. A spellcaster will typically be able to use Spellcraft to manufacture any itemhe likes. A Master Craftsman will only be able to make a few things -- a master leatherworker could perhaps make a suit of (leather) armor, a belt, a vest, or a pair of boots, but not a bell, a sword, or a candle.
I agree with your reasoning, but you are forgetting a very important thing about master craftsman:
" Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats."Only those two feat are allowed by master craftsman, not scribe scroll.
Aeshuura |
As has been mentioned by several developers in the past (I don't remember which, specifically) the rules were written with the intent that some common sense would be applied, thus negating the need for them to cover every little instance.
The simple fact that the question was asked means that the original poster does not believe that this should work, so it shouldn't work.
If you have to ask, I would err on the side of caution and say no.
--
Of course, in my experience, common sense isn't so common, so... *shrug*
^_^
Aeshuura |
Orfamay Quest wrote:Only if you use Profession: Merchant to create the item.
I'm not sure how your abilities as a merchant are supposed to allow you to create anything, though. I invite you to explain how the ability to buy low and sell high will allow you to invest a necklace with the ability to enrobe your fists in flame.
A more typical use for Master Craftsman would be Profession:Scribe and the Scribe Scroll feat, which allows you to write not merely elegant but magical documents, or in conjunction with Craft Wondrous Item to write stat-enhancing books. Profession: Herbalist might allow you to brew potions and similar magical (herb-based) elixirs, and of course Craft: Weapons is how dwarven smiths made those mighty swords of yore.
ETA: I should also add that access to the spells is not necessary. This can make Master Craftsman extremely powerful but the fact that it needs to be a specific (and useful) skill limits. A spellcaster will typically be able to use Spellcraft to manufacture any itemhe likes. A Master Craftsman will only be able to make a few things -- a master leatherworker could perhaps make a suit of (leather) armor, a belt, a vest, or a pair of boots, but not a bell, a sword, or a candle.
I agree with your reasoning, but you are forgetting a very important thing about master craftsman:
" Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats."
Only those two feat are allowed by master craftsman, not scribe scroll.
True, but he could produce Manuals! :D
Slime |
(...)
Sorry, but semantics differs with you.
The terminology "You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item." is referring to the creation of the magical part of the item, not the mundane item itself. That would read 'to craft the item.'
You must of course have a masterwork item to imbue with the magic, but you then use your chosen profession OR craft skill.
Think about it, since by definition in the CRB, only craft skills can produce items, then why would the feat allow you to chose a profession skill?
That the way we go and we enjoy mytical inspiration for unexpected craft or profession to be used that way.
Ex.: Prof. Lawyer: Need to spend days to write the proper contracts with the proper forces in the universe in this proper time line and using just the right wording and payment/rewarding of the involved powers. This could work for both Wonderous Items and Weapons being marked by the signatures of the lawyer and the Powers Invoked scribed on the item probably with a qote like: As agreed with ...
Ex.: Craft.Jeweler: Just put (and pay for)the right decoration to the base item to invoke.
Ex.: Prof. Cook: Prepare and serve something so awsome for the powers required, they will remain with the item (And if you smell the item very closely, or use detect magic, you'll smell that awsome food).
Slime |
Would master craftsman work in conjunction with profession - smith or better yet, profession - inventor (think Leonardo da Vinci). I'm thinking just one skill to cover making weapons, armor and wondrous items.
Excatly. You don't need the craft or profession to make the actual weapon, armor or item. You need it to make them "Magical" or "Wonderous".
Edit: Actually just the same as what you would do with Spellcraft but with a different twist.
Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 |
Orfamay Quest |
Would master craftsman work in conjunction with profession - smith or better yet, profession - inventor (think Leonardo da Vinci). I'm thinking just one skill to cover making weapons, armor and wondrous items.
I'm not sure that profession(smith) or profession(inventor) exist in this system.
I certainly wouldn't allow profession(inventor) into any game I ran, as the skill itself is too broad. (I've seen stuff like that tried in other systems, and it invariably ended up being an attempt to develop a single I-can-do-anything skill.)
Imagine how badly profession(action hero) would break Pathfinder:
* There's a chasm you need to cross. "No problem, I'll use profession(action hero) to jump it!"
* There's a locked door you need to get through. "No problem. I'll use profession(action hero) to open it!"
* The queen doesn't seem enthusiastic about your ideas. "No problem. I'll use profession(action hero) to seduce her!"
* et cetera.
... and you see the problem with profession(inventor). I could, after all, just invent an automatic <whatever> contraption to solve those problems, too.
Rules as written suggest that crafting bows, armor, and weapons are all separate (Craft) skills. While you could certainly write Craft(anything) on your character sheet, most GMs would not allow it.
For the same reason, I don't think GMs should allow profession(smith) to make both weapons and armor, especially since "making things" is not the purview of professions at all.
Bill Dunn |
Because he has to use the relevant skill to make the item in question.Which means, first of all, that the skill must have an item-making component. Profession(baker) probably wouldn't cut it, as I don't think I've seen any magical fruit pies anywhere in the system. Profession(merchant) also falls into this trap. As I said, I don't know of anything I would let you use that skill to make, as merchants don't make things. Profession(jeweler) would be fine -- providing what you want is in the form of jewelry, like a necklace or a ring or a tiara. Necklace of Fireballs, great. Key of Lock Jamming, probably not.
I would say probably. If it can be bejeweled, then profession (or craft) jewelry should be just fine.
Drachasor |
Personally, if I was running a game, I'd just change "Master Craftsman" to the following:
Master Craftsman
Your superior crafting skills allow you to create simple magic items.Prerequisites: 5 ranks in any Craft or Profession skill.
Benefit: Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. This skill must involve creating items (but this can include consumable such as in the case of a Brewer). When creating an item with this craft, you can also enhant it as though you possessed the Craft Wondrous Item and Craft Arms and Armor feats, with a caster level equal to your ranks in the chosen skill.
Instead of a spellcraft check, you use a check with the chosen skill instead. The DC remains the same.
I think that makes more sense, personally.
As we all know Profession: Burglar or Profession: Thief are the best professions for Master Craftsman. What can't you craft? Only things that can't be stolen.
Stealing isn't crafting an item. So this wouldn't work.
It lists the skills that can be used for various skills, so Profession Merchant or Profession Lawyer will not work (though Progfession Scrieb or Craft CalligraphY) will work for scrolls.
Master Craftsman lets you use any appropriate skill you want instead of Spellcraft. So you aren't limited to what is listed for an item.
GreenMandar |
2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Allowing any craft/profession skill to be used for any item, isn’t supported by anything I can see in this feat or in the rulebooks, neither from a strict rules reading moving to more thematic explanations,
First, as I stated before this feat does not allow you to substitute your craft/profession skill for spellcraft or for any other. People may want it to work that way, but it doesn’t.
The standing item creation rules require you to use spell craft or the listed craft/profession skills. Note that the listed craft/profession skills are relevant to the magic items being created, implying that unless using spellcraft your ability to actually create that type of item matters. When you read Craft Wondrous Items part in the Magic Item Creation Chapter it lists “applicable Craft or Profession skill check”. This doesn’t mean ANY craft or profession skill. It seems logical here to look to all the previous magic item types for an idea of what “applicable” means (however being that this isn’t strictly defined I can see this being used as hole through which to drive a munchkin semi-truck).
Next look at the descriptions for Creating Magic Weapon and Creating Magic Armor which are functionally identical.
“To create” a magic weapon/ magic armor, “a character needs a heat source and some iron, wood, or leatherworking tools.” He/She “also needs a supply of materials, the most obvious being the” weapon/armor “or the pieces of the” weapon/armor “to be assembled.”
All the other magic items have similar language.
So in some cases you are just enchanting pre-made stuff, in other your are putting it together. It seems logical that the characters using spellcraft are probably using more fully assembled items and the characters using craft/profession skills are using them to insert some of magical materials and techniques during assembly. Of course this is just thematic explanation, but regardless there is nothing here to support using one type of crafting type skill to make a different type item.
D'arandriel |
Allowing any craft/profession skill to be used for any item, isn’t supported by anything I can see in this feat or in the rulebooks, neither from a strict rules reading moving to more thematic explanations,
First, as I stated before this feat does not allow you to substitute your craft/profession skill for spellcraft or for any other. People may want it to work that way, but it doesn’t.
The standing item creation rules require you to use spell craft or the listed craft/profession skills. Note that the listed craft/profession skills are relevant to the magic items being created, implying that unless using spellcraft your ability to actually create that type of item matters. When you read Craft Wondrous Items part in the Magic Item Creation Chapter it lists “applicable Craft or Profession skill check”. This doesn’t mean ANY craft or profession skill. It seems logical here to look to all the previous magic item types for an idea of what “applicable” means (however being that this isn’t strictly defined I can see this being used as hole through which to drive a munchkin semi-truck).Next look at the descriptions for Creating Magic Weapon and Creating Magic Armor which are functionally identical.
“To create” a magic weapon/ magic armor, “a character needs a heat source and some iron, wood, or leatherworking tools.” He/She “also needs a supply of materials, the most obvious being the” weapon/armor “or the pieces of the” weapon/armor “to be assembled.”
All the other magic items have similar language.
So in some cases you are just enchanting pre-made stuff, in other your are putting it together. It seems logical that the characters using spellcraft are probably using more fully assembled items and the characters using craft/profession skills are using them to insert some of magical materials and techniques during assembly. Of course this is just thematic explanation, but regardless there is nothing here to support using one type of crafting type skill to make a different type item.
I'm not advocating any craft/profession to be used to make any item. Using Profession - merchant to make a magical item is just silly. But I think having the right profession/craft skill could work. For example, Profession - inventor may work. Obviously this would be up the GM. But I think if the concept is a "mad scientist" type, that is not a spell caster, then why not? Mechanically, its really no different that a wizard using spellcraft, a single skill, to craft a magic item.
Diego Rossi |
I'm not advocating any craft/profession to be used to make any item. Using Profession - merchant to make a magical item is just silly. But I think having the right profession/craft skill could work. For example, Profession - inventor may work. Obviously this would be up the GM. But I think if the concept is a "mad scientist" type, that is not a spell caster, then why not? Mechanically, its really no different that a wizard using spellcraft, a single skill, to craft a magic item.
The most common Profession skills are architect, baker, barrister, brewer, butcher, clerk, cook, courtesan, driver, engineer, farmer, fisherman, gambler, gardener, herbalist, innkeeper, librarian, merchant, midwife, miller, miner, porter, sailor, scribe, shepherd, stable master, soldier, tanner, trapper, and woodcutter.
In that list you see something even vaguely as open ended as profession (inventor)?
Crafts and Professions are are specific skills to do a specific work, not "anything I can cram in it". Profession (burglar) don't exist as it encompass several existing skills. Same thing for profession (inventor). It encompass one or more knowledge skills plus profession (engineer) and/or Craft (alchemy).Trying to add a skill that encompass several already existing skills is decidedly the wrong way to go.
Drachasor |
I'm not advocating any craft/profession to be used to make any item. Using Profession - merchant to make a magical item is just silly. But I think having the right profession/craft skill could work. For example, Profession - inventor may work. Obviously this would be up the GM. But I think if the concept is a "mad scientist" type, that is not a spell caster, then why not? Mechanically, its really no different that a wizard using spellcraft, a single skill, to craft a magic item.
I don't think that's remotely appropriate as a profession. It's more of an int-based skill, imho, and it is also too open ended. What are the limits of what you can make with that? New armor? New weapons? New clothes? Something to hold umbrellas? Vehicles? Constructs? What doesn't work?
It's like Craft(Anything I can put a new spin on). No good.
I think it is more of a class, archetype, or feat idea. Or it's more like what you could flavor things you make with this feat, rather than a specific skill you could have.
Aranna |
Well interesting... since they didn't restrict the skill choice beyond Craft or Profession you could by RAW use craft(basket weaving) in the manufacture of a +5 sword... You would simply roll against basket weaving instead of spellcraft. Many GMs would alter the feat with Rule 0, requiring specific skills, but should they? No one would argue about a PC with Craft (weapons) using this to make a +5 sword. BUT by RAW he should also be able to use it to craft armor or wondrous items since it legitimately is ONLY standing in for your magical knowledge. So it isn't so much about crafting a specific item. It IS about using a craft or profession to replace your magical knowledge. And as absurd as that sounds it is exactly what the feat does.
Diego Rossi |
The rules don't allow to substitute any skill for Spellcraft and don't allow to use whatever skill you like to make the craft/profession check.
Step by step:
Master Craftsman
Your superior crafting skills allow you to create simple magic items.
Prerequisites: 5 ranks in any Craft or Profession skill.
Benefit: Choose one Craft or Profession skill in which you possess at least 5 ranks. You receive a +2 bonus on your chosen Craft or Profession skill. Ranks in your chosen skill count as your caster level for the purposes of qualifying for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats. You can create magic items using these feats, substituting your ranks in the chosen skill for your total caster level.(1) You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item.(2) The DC to create the item still increases for any necessary spell requirements (see the magic item creation rules in Magic Items). You cannot use this feat to create any spell-trigger or spell-activation item.
Normal: Only spellcasters can qualify for the Craft Magic Arms and Armor and Craft Wondrous Item feats.
(1) It repeat it 2 times the skill rank substitute your Caster level, not other skills.
(2) "You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item." Nothing about replacing spellcraft or changing other rules, simply your skill check should be the one used to make the item.
Magic Item Creation
To create magic items, spellcasters use special feats which allow them to invest time and money in an item's creation. At the end of this process, the spellcaster must make a single skill check (usually Spellcraft, but sometimes another skill) to finish the item. If an item type has multiple possible skills, you choose which skill to make the check with.(3) The DC to create a magic item is 5 + the caster level for the item. Failing this check means that the item does not function and the materials and time are wasted. Failing this check by 5 or more results in a cursed item (see Cursed Items for more information).
(3) The skill used to complete the item is either spellcraft or a "possible skill", possible implies a skill that can make that item and what is a possible skill is clearly defined for weapons or armors, while wondrous items allow several skills, depending on the kidn of item, but not any skill. Master craftsman don't change this.
Creating Magic Armor
...
Skill Used in Creation: Spellcraft or Craft (armor).Creating Magic Weapons
...
Skill Used in Creation: Spellcraft, Craft (bows) (for magic bows and arrows), or Craft (weapons) (for all other weapons).Creating Wondrous Items
...
Skill Used In Creation: Spellcraft or an applicable Craft or Profession skill check.
So, now we have a list of applicable skills:
Craft (armor) when creating a magic armorCraft (bows) when creating a magic bow and arrow
Craft (weapon) when creating all other weapons
an applicable Craft or Profession skill when creating a Wondrous Item
Applicable definition:
ap·pli·ca·ble (pl-k-bl, -plk-)
adj.
That can be applied; relevant or appropriate: a rule not applicable in all cases; added the applicable sales tax.
appli·ca·bili·ty n.
appli·ca·bly adv.
applicable [ˈæplɪkəbəl əˈplɪkə-]
adj
being appropriate or relevant; able to be applied; fitting
applicability , applicableness n
applicably adv
ap•pli•ca•ble (ˈæp lɪ kə bəl, əˈplɪk ə-)
adj.
relevant; suitable; appropriate: a solution applicable to the problem.
[1650–60]
ap`pli•ca•bil′i•ty, ap′pli•ca•ble•ness, n.
ap′pli•ca•bly, adv.
Someone would have to work very hard to try to pretend that applicable mean "any skill I want".
You want to make most wondrous items? Take Craft (jewelery), a large percentage of the wondrous items can be reskinned to be crafte with Craft (jewelery). You want to make a belt? Make it of metal links.
Any item in these locations can be a piece of jewelery:
Belts: belts and girdles.
Eyes: eyes, glasses, and goggles.
Head: circlets, crowns, hats, helms, and masks.
Headband: headbands and phylacteries.
Neck: amulets, brooches, medallions, necklaces, periapts, and scarabs.
Wrist: bracelets and bracers.
Aranna |
You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item.
Hmmm... I may have been misreading this part to also be a substitution for the skill required. But it doesn't say that does it. This is more a restriction than a substitution. Making it nearly impossible to make multiple item types from one skill... or perhaps totally impossible. You may need to buy this feat three or four times to get the full range of items it allows. I guess being a caster is the only REAL option if you want to be an item crafter.
Diego Rossi |
Diego Rossi wrote:You must use the chosen skill for the check to create the item.Hmmm... I may have been misreading this part to also be a substitution for the skill required. But it doesn't say that does it. This is more a restriction than a substitution. Making it nearly impossible to make multiple item types from one skill... or perhaps totally impossible. You may need to buy this feat three or four times to get the full range of items it allows. I guess being a caster is the only REAL option if you want to be an item crafter.
Craft (jeweler) in conjunction with Craft wondrous items work well. It will cover plenty of your needs, especially if your GM allow you to make non standard items, like an amulet combining natural armor and a resistance bonus.
StabbittyDoom |
I still disagree, I read Master Craftsman as substituting your Craft or Profession skill check for the roll required, similar to the mechanic of Versatile Performance for Bards.
I choose to take this interpretation. Not because of any supporting rule, so much as the rules *could* be read to allow it and it's the only reading that I can see making the feat ever worthwhile, especially when there are feats to gain spell-like abilities (and thus the necessary caster level).
Like Versatile Performance you wouldn't really be using the Craft/Profession skill, just using its modifier for crafting the item. You're still crafting it the normal way.