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Permanent ability gains with items


Rules Questions


I'm having difficulty in figuring out when exactly headbands/belts would actually turn into permanent bonuses. Usually forum searches work but discussion just goes in the way of talking about gaining skill points instead.

The rules state that after 24 hours pass bonuses become permanent but between sleep, bathing or during removing other equipment in the case of belts that bonus would be removed, even for a short duration, and reset the 24 hour attunement.

How is this resolved? Sleeping/bathing with a fragile silver headband would be pretty unrealistic. Rolls for potential item damage for the benefit of extra spell slots the next day?

On a similar note, if the effect is resolved (say with an ioun stone that circumvents physical contact), what happens with magic supression? Does the bonus return as a temporary bonus once the supression ends? Spell slots would be lost when the item becomes suppressed, but if it becomes temporary again for 24 hours, that means spell slots are lost for the day after too.


The general ruling on this has been that removing the belt/headband for normal activities such as sleep and bathing do not cause the 24 hours to reset. I don't know if there is any RAW that specifically says this, but I've yet run into a GM that has a problem with it.


RAW, you are technically right. In the cases of bathing or what have you, you would have to remove the equipment in order to clean those areas, meaning you are going to have to deal with that "permanent" loss. However, in the case of sleep, you wouldn't have to take the item off to sleep with it. If it were Medium or Heavy armor, you would have to (unless you have Mithral Heavy armor and/or Endurance feat) unless you are immune to being fatigued/exhausted.

RAI, I highly doubt the intent of removing equipment for the character to clean his/herself up, or to sleep should have much grounds or interference with the PC's statistics. Such a rule was most likely implemented so that PCs can't just apply the Headband, get the Permanent bonus, then apply another item of that slot to get that item's bonus, and/or to have a buff or two to further enhance that statistic. Therefore, I would propose a 'houserule' caveat to include that permanent bonuses do not fade unless:

  • The PC has not worn the item for 24 hours to initially receive the permanent bonus, and for at least 8 hours for every 24 hours thereafter.
  • The PC does not apply an enhancement bonus spell or wear other magical/wondrous items that cover the respective slot while such a bonus is active.

However, if we're sticking with straight RAW, you're SoL. If you got some leg room with houseruling and the like, then this is something you can bring up to your GM.


Stop bathing, and prestidigitate your clothes and body clean instead. Sleep in your headband


This is the real reason why wizards love prestidigitation. No need to bathe anymore.


mcv wrote:
This is the real reason why wizards love prestidigitation. No need to bathe anymore.

Wizards are prudes!

Also, that Wu Jen Taboo option makes a lot more sense now, too...

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