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Natural Weapon Attacks...


Advice

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Ok so i have spent a significant amount of time looking and have had zero luck..

This would be a 1st level character. Pathfinder only.

I was looking at the Catfolk race and the ability to have claws as a rouge. I just thought it may be neat to have a sneaky cat that actually used their claws as a primary attack...

Beyond gaining the 2 primary attacks from the Catfolk is there a way to increase the number of natural attacks you get? Or would i be making 2 attacks from level 1 all the way to 20. I do realize a rouge wouldn't even receive a third attack until level 15 but i want that attack when it becomes available. I would enjoy gaining a bite attack or something.

(Page 182 Core) You do not receive additional attacks for a high BAB. Any way around this??

Osirion

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Companion, Modules Subscriber

You can wield a manufactured melee weapon in your main hand and make your full iterative attacks, then 1 claw attack (with full BAB-5, 1/2 STR mod to damage because it is considered a secondary attack when fighting with manufactured weapons).


^ What Raisse said.

Sticking to only natural weapons, the only way to increase your number of attacks in a full attack is to increase the number of natural weapons you've got. There's a few ways to do this, but they're all kind of a case-by-case basis.

However, you can mix manufactured and natural weapons together. Natural weapons never benefit from iterative attacks (the second and third ones that you get from your BAB). If you're mixing manufactured and natural attacks though, you can use the manufactured weapon for your iteratives, and add natural attacks as well, though they will always be treated as secondary, giving you BAB-5 on their hit and 1/2 Strength on damage, as mentioned. You also generally lose the natural attack from the limb using the weapon, if they conflict.

I don't know if that all made sense, so here's examples.

From levels 1-20 you could use 2 claws, and that's all you'd ever get. They would each use your full BAB.

You could instead take a weapon in one hand, like a dagger. This means you could full attack with the dagger and with one of your claws. The dagger would be full BAB, and your claw would be BAB-5.

At level 8, you can full attack with the dagger for two attacks, with +6 and +1, along with the claws of your other hand at +1 (BAB-5).

At level 20, you can use the dagger for +15/+10/+5 when full attacking, and your free hand with the claws for +10.

For flavor, you might consider the Catfolk's Claw Blades which, I think, count as manufactured weapons.


Raisse wrote:
You can wield a manufactured melee weapon in your main hand and make your full iterative attacks, then 1 claw attack (with full BAB-5, 1/2 STR mod to damage because it is considered a secondary attack when fighting with manufactured weapons).

See i thought about doing that but i really want to stick to Natural attacks. Im trying to avoid manufactured weapons all together.

Would the two weapon fighting/ Improved TWF work? or no because neither are a secondary weapon?


Darkwolf117 wrote:

^ What Raisse said.

Sticking to only natural weapons, the only way to increase your number of attacks in a full attack is to increase the number of natural weapons you've got. There's a few ways to do this, but they're all kind of a case-by-case basis.

However, you can mix manufactured and natural weapons together. Natural weapons never benefit from iterative attacks (the second and third ones that you get from your BAB). If you're mixing manufactured and natural attacks though, you can use the manufactured weapon for your iteratives, and add natural attacks as well, though they will always be treated as secondary, giving you BAB-5 on their hit and 1/2 Strength on damage, as mentioned. You also generally lose the natural attack from the limb using the weapon, if they conflict.

I don't know if that all made sense, so here's examples.

From levels 1-20 you could use 2 claws, and that's all you'd ever get. They would each use your full BAB.

You could instead take a weapon in one hand, like a dagger. This means you could full attack with the dagger and with one of your claws. The dagger would be full BAB, and your claw would be BAB-5.

At level 8, you can full attack with the dagger for two attacks, with +6 and +1, along with the claws of your other hand at +1 (BAB-5).

At level 20, you can use the dagger for +15/+10/+5 when full attacking, and your free hand with the claws for +10.

For flavor, you might consider the Catfolk's Claw Blades which, I think, count as manufactured weapons.

Just checked it out and yes they would be manufactured weapons. But still, pretty neat. at least this way i could go down the TWF tree and keep the aesthetic look of just using claws. Thanks!

Would still be interested in a way to go straight Natural weapons. It just sounds appealing.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Cards, Companion, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Synthesist Summoner


Manufactured weapons are pretty much the only way to make use of iterative attacks as far as I know, and I don't think TWF lets you get around that.

Though you might be able to get something through taking Improved Unarmed Strike? Not sure if that would let you throw in some kicks and punches, based on your BAB, while still making use of the claws. No guarantees on whether that works or not.

Otherwise, gaining natural attacks is possible through a few things, but they're all kind of random, and usually related to race or class. I can't really think of much that's available for a catfolk rogue, aside from the claws you've got. Sorry.


If only aspect of the beast allowed like a bite attack or something...


Well i was able to find this at least! so at least this will pop me up to 3 attacks for a single turn sometimes assuming i have claw pounce already. well this will get 3 attacks before 15 at least sometimes. Hope this helps anyone else that runs across this. I will most likely keep looking... possibly tomorrow... And update this if i find anything else. Thanks for the help so far guys!

PATHFINDER ACCESSORY

Hellcat Stealth
Prerequisites: Skill Focus (Stealth), Stealth 6 ranks.

Benefit: You may make Stealth checks in normal or bright light even when observed, but at a -10 penalty.

Hellcat Pounce (Combat)
Prerequisites: Hellcat Stealth, Skill Focus (Stealth), sneak attack +2d6.

Benefit: Whenever you attack and damage an opponent in the surprise round, you may immediately make a second attack against the same opponent using the same attack bonus. The target is not considered flat-footed against this second attack.

Special: This ability only functions when carrying a light load or less.


Scouts charge is better.

I have a catfolk ranger that uses natural attacks.. I got the catfolk claws, and a bite attack (adopted, so I could get the half-orc 'toothy' trait for 1d4 damage.)

So far, natural attacks are nice, but theres no easy way to get additional attacks. My build will take 4 levels to get good, and then will be passed by all other melee classes by level 10-12.

The only way I can think of to boost damage at all is:
Use rogue to ge sneak damage
dip monk for styles (boar shred is nice, requires feral combat training)
dip ranger for two levels (for rending claws, or stick with it for multiattack and eldritch claws)
buy a amulet of mighty fists
if you dip monk, monk hand wraps MAY apply to nat attacks with feral combat training.

Scouts charge(for sneak die on a charge) + claw pounce (can hit with both claws on a charge) plus boar shred and rending claws equals a lot of dice... (yes, sneak damage would be added to both claws)

I'm wondering though, for example, lets say you were being stealthy and jumped out of a tree on a goblin- suprise round and you're charging!

Swing with left claw- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)
Hellcat pounce activates: Left claw again- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)
Claw pounce lets you use both claws, so right claw- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)

If you had rending claws and boar shred, if two claws hit you'd do an additional 1d6 precision and 2d6 bleed. 6d6 + 3d4 + 3 x str mod (and perhaps rending and boar shred for 3d6 more) isn't too bad...

Unfortunately, still wouldnt compare with a barbarian with iterative attacks damage-wise.

Shadow Lodge

Redchigh wrote:
adopted, so I could get the half-orc 'toothy' trait for 1d4 damage.

Adopted doesn't work like that.

Toothy is an alternate racial trait.

Adopted lets you choose a race trait of a different race.


It might not be toothy, maybe Im thinking of Tusked, theres like 4 diff ways for a halforc to get a bite attack... I was talking about the racial trait in "orcs of golarion", not the alt. racial trait.


Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.


I play a ratfolk visectionist (sneak attacks like rogue). He took a feat at 1st level available to ratfolk that gave him claw attacks. I also use a tailblade that gives secondary tail attack. Eventually he can buy a ring of rat fangs (think that's the name). This will give him 4 natural attacks. At 1st he has 3. I believe that any race can buy the ring of rat fangs for 5k and get bite attack.


Kahn Zordlon wrote:
I play a ratfolk visectionist (sneak attacks like rogue). He took a feat at 1st level available to ratfolk that gave him claw attacks. I also use a tailblade that gives secondary tail attack. Eventually he can buy a ring of rat fangs (think that's the name). This will give him 4 natural attacks. At 1st he has 3. I believe that any race can buy the ring of rat fangs for 5k and get bite attack.

Love this, but hate that, of all the races, catfolk do not get a racial trait for a bite attack. Tengu do (ravens not being known for their ferocious chomping), and Rat-people do (more understandable), and lizardmen (who ever heard of someone being afraid of an iguana's bite?), plus half-orcs, but not GIANT CAT PEOPLE? That's kah-razy. I would suggest talking to one's GM, or for PFS min-maxing the hell out of this with nonsensical Lamashtu traits.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Iguana? No.

Have you heard of a Komodo Dragon's bite? Even if live through the attack, you will die.


If you want, I made a catfolk sub-race called "Feral Catfolk".

They are xenophobic, distrustful of humanoids, and prefer natural weapons over the pitiful metal weapons made by weakling humanoids. If you would like me to post it, I can. They start level 1 with bite/claw/claw.


Redchigh wrote:

Scouts charge is better.

I have a catfolk ranger that uses natural attacks.. I got the catfolk claws, and a bite attack (adopted, so I could get the half-orc 'toothy' trait for 1d4 damage.)

So far, natural attacks are nice, but theres no easy way to get additional attacks. My build will take 4 levels to get good, and then will be passed by all other melee classes by level 10-12.

The only way I can think of to boost damage at all is:
Use rogue to ge sneak damage
dip monk for styles (boar shred is nice, requires feral combat training)
dip ranger for two levels (for rending claws, or stick with it for multiattack and eldritch claws)
buy a amulet of mighty fists
if you dip monk, monk hand wraps MAY apply to nat attacks with feral combat training.

Scouts charge(for sneak die on a charge) + claw pounce (can hit with both claws on a charge) plus boar shred and rending claws equals a lot of dice... (yes, sneak damage would be added to both claws)

I'm wondering though, for example, lets say you were being stealthy and jumped out of a tree on a goblin- suprise round and you're charging!

Swing with left claw- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)
Hellcat pounce activates: Left claw again- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)
Claw pounce lets you use both claws, so right claw- 1d4 (claw) + str mod + 2d6 (sneak)

If you had rending claws and boar shred, if two claws hit you'd do an additional 1d6 precision and 2d6 bleed. 6d6 + 3d4 + 3 x str mod (and perhaps rending and boar shred for 3d6 more) isn't too bad...

Unfortunately, still wouldnt compare with a barbarian with iterative attacks damage-wise.

This is neat but i would prefer not to dip as much into other character classes. Honestly not overly concerned with out doing the traditional fighter or barbarian. I like it more for the fluff (pun intended) aspect.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.

But lamashtu... eck.


Alex Cunningham wrote:
Kahn Zordlon wrote:
I play a ratfolk visectionist (sneak attacks like rogue). He took a feat at 1st level available to ratfolk that gave him claw attacks. I also use a tailblade that gives secondary tail attack. Eventually he can buy a ring of rat fangs (think that's the name). This will give him 4 natural attacks. At 1st he has 3. I believe that any race can buy the ring of rat fangs for 5k and get bite attack.
Love this, but hate that, of all the races, catfolk do not get a racial trait for a bite attack. Tengu do (ravens not being known for their ferocious chomping), and Rat-people do (more understandable), and lizardmen (who ever heard of someone being afraid of an iguana's bite?), plus half-orcs, but not GIANT CAT PEOPLE? That's kah-razy. I would suggest talking to one's GM, or for PFS min-maxing the hell out of this with nonsensical Lamashtu traits.

I agree completely why would a cat not have a option for a bite attack?? if i could convince the GM to allow me to take the orc feat that allows the bite attack (maybe just rename?) that would be sweet.


Redchigh wrote:

If you want, I made a catfolk sub-race called "Feral Catfolk".

They are xenophobic, distrustful of humanoids, and prefer natural weapons over the pitiful metal weapons made by weakling humanoids. If you would like me to post it, I can. They start level 1 with bite/claw/claw.

I would love to see this. The name alone makes sense to have as a sub-race choice anyhow.


> +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom: Feral Catfolk are quick on
> their feet and cunning hunters, but succumb to animalistic urges.

> Medium: Feral Catfolk are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or
> penalites due to their size.

> Normal Speed: Feral Catfolk have a base speed of 30 feet.

> Cat's Luck: Once per day when a Feral Catfolk makes a Reflex saving
> throw, he can roll the saving throw twice and take the better result.
> He must decide to use this ability before the saving throw is
> attempted.
> *Climber: Feral Catfolk excel at hunting prey from trees and other high
> vantage points. Catfolk with this racial trait possess a climb speed
> of 20 feet (along with the +8 racial bonus on Climb checks a climb
> speed affords).
> *Scent: Feral Catfolk have the scent ability.
> Feral Weaponry: Feral Catfolk have a primary natural bite attack and 2
> primary natural claw attacks that deal 1d4 damage.
>
Languages: Feral Catfolk begin play speaking only Catfolk. Feral
> Catfolk with high Intelligence scores can learn Common, Sylvan, and
> Gnoll (understand only).

The starred items could easily be swapped out, climber is an alternate racial trait.
Gnoll are their native enemy (being doglike). This can be swapped out for another.


Redchigh wrote:

Why would you waste a feat when there's a trait to do the same thing?

Would your dm allow a catfolk subtype?

Possibly.

We are getting a new GM that i have yet to meet. Not sure how strict he is. My friend knows him and says he's pretty chill so there is no harm in trying.

At least if i bring a coherent sub-type and a convincing argument to the table there is more of a chance that it will be allowed.


Redchigh wrote:

> +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom: Feral Catfolk are quick on

> their feet and cunning hunters, but succumb to animalistic urges.

> Medium: Feral Catfolk are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or
> penalites due to their size.

> Normal Speed: Feral Catfolk have a base speed of 30 feet.

> Cat's Luck: Once per day when a Feral Catfolk makes a Reflex saving
> throw, he can roll the saving throw twice and take the better result.
> He must decide to use this ability before the saving throw is
> attempted.
> *Climber: Feral Catfolk excel at hunting prey from trees and other high
> vantage points. Catfolk with this racial trait possess a climb speed
> of 20 feet (along with the +8 racial bonus on Climb checks a climb
> speed affords).
> *Scent: Feral Catfolk have the scent ability.
> Feral Weaponry: Feral Catfolk have a primary natural bite attack and 2
> primary natural claw attacks that deal 1d4 damage.
>
Languages: Feral Catfolk begin play speaking only Catfolk. Feral
> Catfolk with high Intelligence scores can learn Common, Sylvan, and
> Gnoll (understand only).

The starred items could easily be swapped out, climber is an alternate racial trait.
Gnoll are their native enemy (being doglike). This can be swapped out for another.

Sorry I edited my post, it's up there ^


Redchigh wrote:

> +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom: Feral Catfolk are quick on

> their feet and cunning hunters, but succumb to animalistic urges.

> Medium: Feral Catfolk are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or
> penalites due to their size.

> Normal Speed: Feral Catfolk have a base speed of 30 feet.

> Cat's Luck: Once per day when a Feral Catfolk makes a Reflex saving
> throw, he can roll the saving throw twice and take the better result.
> He must decide to use this ability before the saving throw is
> attempted.
> *Climber: Feral Catfolk excel at hunting prey from trees and other high
> vantage points. Catfolk with this racial trait possess a climb speed
> of 20 feet (along with the +8 racial bonus on Climb checks a climb
> speed affords).
> *Scent: Feral Catfolk have the scent ability.
> Feral Weaponry: Feral Catfolk have a primary natural bite attack and 2
> primary natural claw attacks that deal 1d4 damage.
>
Languages: Feral Catfolk begin play speaking only Catfolk. Feral
> Catfolk with high Intelligence scores can learn Common, Sylvan, and
> Gnoll (understand only).

The starred items could easily be swapped out, climber is an alternate racial trait.
Gnoll are their native enemy (being doglike). This can be swapped out for another.

Seems pretty legit. Would it not be better (as far as balancing goes) to make the bite attack secondary? What are they actually losing to gain an extra attack?


Pathfinder Companion Subscriber
KatoCha04 wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.
But lamashtu... eck.

I love Lamashtu! She reeeeally loves her furry friends. Scaled and tentacled ones too.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
KatoCha04 wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.
But lamashtu... eck.
I love Lamashtu! She reeeeally loves her furry friends. Scaled and tentacled ones too.

My problem would be Chaotic Neutral is the closest i could get to a good character which is fine i guess but explaining to the Angelkin Lawful Good Paladin that

Me: "no no no, I'm not evil, i just worship lamashtu."
Paladin: o_0 *poke poke* "smite... *poke* hmm... guess not..." *Whistle while walking away*
Me: IRL "...you could have just detected evil"
Paladin: IRL "i know.. lol"


If I recall, it lost two racial abilities for feral weaponry. (sprint, etc)

I really don't exactly remember, I made the race 3-4 months ago with my dm. Unfortunately Ill have to burn a feat to qualify for claw pounce. It's prereq is one of the things I gave up, along with lowlight vision. (I swapped it out for scent. Our whole group had lowlight vision, so I thought scent would fill a niche against stealth. I'm also a ranger though, so I get a bonus to tracking.)


Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Religious persecution is a Paladin thing, I suppose.

You could have a different view, and worship in your own way.

Southern Bapists, Catholics, Lutheran, and Mormons all seem to worship the same god.

Very differently though.

I would have fun creating my own kind of way of worshiping her.


Redchigh wrote:

If I recall, it lost two racial abilities for feral weaponry. (sprint, etc)

I really don't exactly remember, I made the race 3-4 months ago with my dm. Unfortunately Ill have to burn a feat to qualify for claw pounce. It's prereq is one of the things I gave up, along with lowlight vision. (I swapped it out for scent. Our whole group had lowlight vision, so I thought scent would fill a niche against stealth. I'm also a ranger though, so I get a bonus to tracking.)

You lose the sprint for climber racial trait.

Change +2 Cha for +2 Int

You lose low-light for scent racial trait.

The only thing your really loosing for the bite as a primary is the change in languages choices:
Elven, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Halfling, Orc, and Sylvan.
For Common, Sylvan, and Gnoll (understand only).

Unless I'm missing something else. I love the idea I just see being shot down for the balancing aspect.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

Religious persecution is a Paladin thing, I suppose.

You could have a different view, and worship in your own way.

Southern Bapists, Catholics, Lutheran, and Mormons all seem to worship the same god.

Very differently though.

I would have fun creating my own kind of way of worshiping her.

This is actually a great point. She has the madness domain i suppose you could be a good kind of crazy (thats real right? lol) Striving to eliminate other beasts/monsters to gain her approval and evil (intelligent) beasts/monsters need to be eliminated to better focus her "love" on just you.

I would be interested in what ways you have/could create to worship her that would not lean me towards a evil character.


Also lose natural hunter.

If a dm were to require a "no metal weapons" element like the druid's "no metal armor", then it would be more balanced.

Of course, if you really forbid all weapons other than natural attacks, then you will get three attacks at full bab at level 1, but never gain any iterative attacks. Even at level 20, you'll still only have the same bite/claw/claw at full BAB, while a fighter might have 8-12 attacks with better damage and an easily enchantable masterwork weapon at level 12-15.

The fact that you're voluntarily nerfing yourself for flavor should balance with the dm at least giving you a chance to shine at early levels. (According to my observations, a NA build does amazing damage at levels 1-4, good damage (on par with a barbarian) at levels 5-7, decent damage (might be out-damaged by melee builds) at levels 8-10, and at level 11+, you might as well learn to grapple or use ways to always get sneak die on every attack, because otherwise you'll be a burden on the party, especially if you can't bypass DR.


Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Lamashtu's followers seek out deformity in themselves and in others.

It is the beauty of the monstrous, and the perfection of the deformed.

The creation of new monstrous beings is a focus of her religion as well.

Being a creature so close to the beast, you may see yourself as a possible blood relative to one blessed by Lamashtu.

Finding the beautiful monster within is perhaps what you focus on.

The choice of a more feral battle style is testament to that.

For you, the only true "monsters" are those who deny the beast within.


Redchigh wrote:

Also lose natural hunter.

If a dm were to require a "no metal weapons" element like the druid's "no metal armor", then it would be more balanced.

Of course, if you really forbid all weapons other than natural attacks, then you will get three attacks at full bab at level 1, but never gain any iterative attacks. Even at level 20, you'll still only have the same bite/claw/claw at full BAB, while a fighter might have 8-12 attacks with better damage and an easily enchantable masterwork weapon at level 12-15.

The fact that you're voluntarily nerfing yourself for flavor should balance with the dm at least giving you a chance to shine at early levels. (According to my observations, a NA build does amazing damage at levels 1-4, good damage (on par with a barbarian) at levels 5-7, decent damage (might be out-damaged by melee builds) at levels 8-10, and at level 11+, you might as well learn to grapple or use ways to always get sneak die on every attack, because otherwise you'll be a burden on the party, especially if you can't bypass DR.

Dang Natural hunter is good too.

4 Attacks if i get hellcat pounce(at least sometimes) Also Eldritch Claws will get past magic/silver DR at least and an Amulet Of mighty fist will boost every attack i have. so i could get like Amulet of mighty fist +5 eventually gaining Speed which will add 1 additional attack. so really to be a continuous help to my party (as i level up) i mainly need the sneak damage pretty much every attack. full attack at level 13 in a surprise round would be 35D6 Sneak +10(AoMF)+ 5D4 + Strx5(for each attack) Average is like:146(assuming you hit every attack) not including str. assuming i don't increase the sneak damage or Natural attack damage.

This should be at least a decent build.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

Lamashtu's followers seek out deformity in themselves and in others.

It is the beauty of the monstrous, and the perfection of the deformed.

The creation of new monstrous beings is a focus of her religion as well.

Being a creature so close to the beast, you may see yourself as a possible blood relative to one blessed by Lamashtu.

Finding the beautiful monster within is perhaps what you focus on.

The choice of a more feral battle style is testament to that.

For you, the only true "monsters" are those who deny the beast within.

Sir you may have convinced me to convert lol. at least for this character... i may just worship her regardless now if the DM allows Redchigh's: Feral Catfolk or not. It would make for an intresting game.


How do you figure the 35d6? Doesn't look right... Remember claws and bite are d4's
(although improved natural attack claw and catfolk exemplar will bump them to d8's, its probably not worth burning two feats to bump your average base damage on your claws from 2.5 each to 4.5 each)


Changlings also get claws. Suprisingly a changeling barbarian with fiend totem will give you three natural attacks.


Redchigh wrote:

How do you figure the 35d6? Doesn't look right... Remember claws and bite are d4's

(although improved natural attack claw and catfolk exemplar will bump them to d8's, its probably not worth burning two feats to bump your average base damage on your claws from 2.5 each to 4.5 each)

Sneak Damage

claw 7d6
claw 7d6
speed claw(AoMF) 7d6
hellcat pounce 7d6 although not considered flat-footed for this attack I'm sure there is a way to apply it still.
Bite 7d6
5x7=35d6

as far as the increase in dice i was thinking vicious claws rouge talent increasing sneak to D8 and maybe just the one feat (Catfolk Exemplar) to increase claws to D6.
That's only 1 feat and 1 Rouge Talent for the Increase. Obviously more for the whole ponce and what not but the increase in Dmg can be achieved as early as 1st level.

So...
Claw D6 + 7D8 sneak x 4= 4D6+28D8
Bite D4 + 7D6 sneak= 1D4+7D6
= 28D8+11D6+1D4


doctor_wu wrote:
Changlings also get claws. Suprisingly a changeling barbarian with fiend totem will give you three natural attacks.

Thanks but that would miss the character concept that I'm going for.


I was already planning on a going rogue scout (after a couple monk or unarmed fighter levels) for the scout's charge/claw pounce. (since its hard to get full attacks regularly)

I might be wrong, but I thought you could only make one attack during the suprise round (no full attacks) so you would get claw + hellcat pounce instead of claw/claw/bite/speedclaw (since full attacks are neigh-impossible in suprise round)

What is speedclaw again?


After reading Claw pounce....

Claw Pounce (Combat, Catfolk)
You can charge and make an attack with your paws.
Prerequisites: Str 13, Dex 15, Nimble Striker, base attack bonus +10, catfolk, cat's claws racial trait or Aspect of the Beast (claws of the beast manifestation).
Benefit: When you make a charge, you can make a full attack with your claws.
Normal: Charging is a special full-round action that limits you to a single attack.

Im not sure if i would still get the bite attack being that it says with your claws. That an the BAB of 10 that you don't get till 14 you wouldn't get this till 15. My bad

so its more like...
Claw (1D6+8D8sneak)x4= 4d6+32D8 on charge assuming you get the 8D8 sneak from hellcat pounce.

or if not in surprise round...
Claw (1D6+8D8)x3=3D6+24D8
Bite 1D4+8D8
= 32D8+3D6+1D4

Without sneak
3D6+1D4


Redchigh wrote:

I was already planning on a going rogue scout (after a couple monk or unarmed fighter levels) for the scout's charge/claw pounce. (since its hard to get full attacks regularly)

I might be wrong, but I thought you could only make one attack during the suprise round (no full attacks) so you would get claw + hellcat pounce instead of claw/claw/bite/speedclaw (since full attacks are neigh-impossible in suprise round)

What is speedclaw again?

Damn... I thought i had written down a way to get a full attack but i can't find it. If i do find it ill let you know.

Speed Claw (AoMF) would need quite a bit of money but it would be pretty sweet.


hellcat pounce may not be worth it since it only works in the surprise round and with a reach of 5 I'm probably not starting next to people a whole lot.
That would save 2 feats.

Standard Fantasy 15 points
Str 15
Dex 15
Con 12
Int 13
Wis 10
Cha 10

Feats?? I guess Feint tree and then go from there? The Sneak Damage is what is important on this character as far as damage goes.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If you really want the bite attack, I would just ask your DM to allow you to take the Razortusk feat, but tailor it for Catfolk. You could rename it "Razortooth" and change the prerequisite to "Catfolk". I really don't see any other mechanical changes that would break anything. If they're an experienced DM, they may allow it unless they're very strict RAW:

Razortusk wrote:

Your powerful jaws and steely teeth are deadly enough to give you a bite attack.

Prerequisite: Half-orc.
Benefit: You can make a bite attack for 1d4 points of damage, plus your Strength modifier. You're considered proficient in this attack and can apply feats or effects appropriate to natural attacks to it. If used as part of a full attack action, the bite is considered a secondary attack and is made at your full base attack bonus –5, and adds half your Strength modifier to damage.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.

Which book is this in? I can't find the Trait anywhere amongst my books/pdf's?

Is this the 1d2 bite attack one?


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Helm of the Mammoth Lord - Grants you a gore attack (which is primary)
Ring of Rat Fangs - Grants you a bite attack (again primary)
Wyvern Cloak - Expensive, but grants you a sting attack (primary as well)
Tentacle Cloak - Gives you two secondary natural attacks

There are also some 'fleshcrafting potions' that can give you some secondary natural attacks for a permanent penalty, although I wouldn't recommend using them. Essentially the above magic items are your best (and probably the least cheesiest) bet to acquire more natural attacks. In truth, natural attacks only really shine on something like a ninja, rogue, alchemist, etc. If you already have a Full BAB, you probably don't need them (just go ahead and stick with two-handing a weapon, unless you REALLY wanna have the natural attack flavor).


First, may I suggest lizardfolk? You can find it inthe 'More Races' section of the SRD. It does not list a specific book since it appears that those races are the examples released in various bestiary entries, examples set forth by Paizo in their creating new races, and other such places, but they are still all official. It is still fairly vanilla compared to the other examples. It's main features are three natural attacks, +2 natural armor, and bonuses to strength and con. Good for a thug build.

I would not suggest using manufactured weapons (outside of situations with DR) until you get up to two or three iteratives. Just not worth it, since you lose an attack and lose some BAB on other natural attacks in return for a manufactured weapon attack that is BAB-5.

Ah, and Barry, Mother's teeth entry is here. Yeah, it is that 1d2 attack that is a secondary natural attack(so multiattack would be needed from the very beginning to make it worth anything)


Pathfinder Companion Subscriber
Barry Armstrong wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Mother's Teeth will give you a bite attack as well.

Which book is this in? I can't find the Trait anywhere amongst my books/pdf's?

Is this the 1d2 bite attack one?

Yes, from Goblins of Golarion.

There are lot Lamashtu specific stuff. The Lamashtu's Mark, and Destroy Identity feats.

My favorite? The Demon Mother's Mask:

Demon Mother's Mask:
Mask, Demon Mother's

Source Gods and Magic

Aura faint transmutation; CL 3rd
Slot head; Price 3,600 gp; Weight 1 lb.
DESCRIPTION

This primitive hyena-like mask is usually made of leather, but some are made of soft metal like copper or even carved out of the skull of an animal. You gain a +2 competence bonus on Handle Animal and Heal checks. You can smell when nearby creatures are in heat or otherwise especially fertile (creatures such as humans that can breed any time of year always smell fertile unless they are barren).

If Lamashtu is your patron, the mask counts as a holy symbol and a hole for a third eye appears in the mask’s forehead. You may use summon monster II once per day to summon a fiendish hyena, which obeys you as if you shared a common language. You may interbreed with animals that are within one size category of your size, usually creating (if you are a humanoid) animal-humanoid creatures such as gnolls or lizardfolk, or sometimes natural lycanthropes prone to live in hybrid form.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTS

Craft Wondrous Item, detect animals or plants, polymorph, summon monster II, creator must have at least 5 ranks in Handle Animal and Heal; Cost 1,800 gp


As far as full attacks go, claw pounce might be as good as you can get when you can't full attack.


Tusked/toothy are both primary attacks. One is a trait you can get with "adopted" but I forget which.

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