So here is the basics. I am going to be joining a group soon and they do not appear to have any healing ability. I have no problems playing a character that makes sure his fellow merc's are able to continue fighting. I do believe that most healing should be done after combat though. I was looking at a crusader cleric possible build. The extra feats would really help, I think. I was thinking a Keshilite merc that worships Sarenrae and uses a scimitar.
So on with the build requirement:
Non evil(leaning toward true neutral)
25 point build
4th level
6000 gp to spend
Zeher will always try stabilize a fallen party member in combat. He just don't want to be the healbot. I was thinking more along the line of a combat medic. I want to contribute to the fighting in combat(buffing and attacking), secondary is saving the "grunts" butt before they die, tertiary patching everyone up after combat. I hope this helps to clarify what I am going for.
Zeher will always try stabilize a fallen party member in combat. He just don't want to be the healbot. I was thinking more along the line of a combat medic. I want to contribute to the fighting in combat(buffing and attacking), secondary is saving the "grunts" butt before they die, tertiary patching everyone up after combat. I hope this helps to clarify what I am going for.
Well... if all you want is a combat medic... a single level of cleric or bard and a wand of cure light wounds does that. You can stabilize people, and provide out of combat healing, without being a dedicated healbot.
I am not sure if it matters but there is a wizard, a summoner, a ranger, and another that I am not sure of.
It certainly matters.
If the entire party was heavy damage dealers then making a so-so damage dealer as the 'healer' is a bit of a waste.
So you will have a party of 5, and you don't want to heal during combat.
My advice: don't play a healer (i.e. cleric, etc). Heck let the party ranger handle the downtime healing. Now play whatever you really want to play.
Easy.
From the sound of it, try a Paladin. You can even take the trait to stabilize on a touch.
You can be melee in the thick of it, stabilize those that drop, heal via wands out of combat, and when you need to actually heal a bit directly in combat.
I'm with James. Play something you'll find fun that is able to use wands of Cure Light Wounds. Just make sure to keep a couple on you at all times, as bad luck can lead to you burning through a wand fast.
I see clerics as more then just healers. They have many roles they can fill in a party. I was looking more advice on feats, attibute distribution, and possible interesting multiclass options.
The group is going to be mercenaries, there are no paladins that could be in such a group. I had thought of a hospitaler paladin but from what I can guess some mission would need an atonement frequently. I just cannot see it working rp wise either.
Take a look at the Bard Archetype Dawnflower Dervish. You'll have access to the bard spells and while battle dancing you can fill in as a front line fighter and at 8th level you can cast a heal spell as a move action while battle dancing. Bad: No group Bard song, have a battle dance that efects self only.
Cleric, toyed with a idea of a Half-orc cleric of Gorum with the domains of Ferocity & Tactics (sub-domains of Strength and War). Play him more as a fighter with buff spells.
I see clerics as more then just healers. They have many roles they can fill in a party. I was looking more advice on feats, attibute distribution, and possible interesting multiclass options.
The group is going to be mercenaries, there are no paladins that could be in such a group. I had thought of a hospitaler paladin but from what I can guess some mission would need an atonement frequently. I just cannot see it working rp wise either.
I am just looking for a healing and... build.
I'd go for oath of vengeance paladin. It pretty much changes your oath to "smiting evil, everything else is secondary and therefore tolerable."
You still gotta smite the BBEG, but not necessarily before he kills the damsel. Vengeance, not Prevention.
I've looked at the Crusader Cleric. Just think you're giving up too much for what you get. Rather play a straight cleric with the more martial domains.
If you want something like the Crusader Cleric I'd take a look at the Inquisitor. Problem here is I have very little idea on how they play.
I would NOT go with a Cleric with the Dervish Dance feat route. As that requires 2 feats and 2 skill points (Preform skill). Both of these requirements are just too big of a resource cost for clerics, in my opinion.
Bards can make pretty decent healers but they can also be resource hogs as they require the use of scrolls, wands, and successful UMD checks (not hard to do on a bard.)
gear:
+1 Greatsword (2,350)
+1 Breastplate (1,350)
Cloak of Resistance +1 (1,000)
Pearl of Power, lvl1 (1,000)
holy symbol and misc. potions/scrolls (300)
Spoiler:
at 17, his AC isn't great but its not terrible for his level- and could be buffed with shield of faith or whatever. these stats also assume taking the favored class bonus in hit points, which will help survivability. his greatsword attacks at +9 for 2d6+4, to which he can add two different +2s 8/day each (so basically +2 every time, or +4 8/day), and can channel smite for an extra 2d6 upto 8/day- unbuffed... if he has a chance to cast enlarge person and bull's strength before combat his base increases to +11 for 3d6+7, plus reach (if you only spend 8 rounds/day in combat-- 2 encounters, about 4 rounds each-- you could always be doing 3d6+11+2d6/swing, if you get to buff first). next level power attack would be a good choice, or quick channel if you want to be able to kick out AoE damage and still cast or attack (of course, you wouldn't have selective channel so you'd need to be careful)
alternatively:
if you went human instead you'd lose the resists and darkvision and whatnot, and your Cha would drop by 2 (meaning -1 channel/day and -2 domain-bonus-damages/day) but you could take these two feats both at 1st and pick up power attack at 3rd... that would put your base attack at +8 to hit for 2d6+7 (or +10 for 3d6+10 with enlarge and bull's str), and you'd still qualify for quick channel at 5th if you wanted
I was looking at making a Crusader Cleric with the feat Dervish Dance but do you all think the Dervish Dancer Bard is better for my purpose?
Dawnflower Dervish (a different archetype from Dervish Dancer) can deal really nice damage and a higher levels can cast healing spells as a swift action. It also gets you access to those healing spells you want, and you get Dervish Dance for free right at first level. It makes for a pretty good build.
Dawnflower Dervish has to be Sarenraeist. Dervish Dancer is weak. There are only three optimization excuses to build a bard that can't share inspire courage: (1) someone else is already playing a bard, evangelist, or sensei that can; (2) you are an archaeologist or possibly sandman on trap duty; or (3) you are a Dawnflower Dervish with less than two other weapon users in the party or a selfish archetype (dervish dancer or archaeologist) with no other weapon users in the party. Summoned monsters count as other weapon users if they make manufactured or natural weapon attacks.
Arcane Duelist is probably the best stabilizer/buffer you're likely to get since evangelist isn't going to fit well into a mercenary company.
If you expect to fight anything that does non-HP damage you may want a proper cleric though. When you need Restoration you need Restoration. Bards don't get it and Paladins get it late.
Witch is another possibility. The strength patron can get you some of the battle cleric self buffs for an eldritch knight or you can hang out in the back like an officer and debuff, using the healing hex through scar to stabilize people at range so you don't have to risk your unarmored d6 hit dice.
Oracle of metal, battle, or ancestors can be effective in combat, and can pick up all the good buff and restorative spells. Doesn't need more than a 13-14 charisma if you avoid save spells. Nothing wrong with breastplate shield and scimitar.
Cleric of Gorum with honor and tactics domains could work. You could even go the guided hand and monk dip to get wis to attack and ac and spells. Scores like 14 13 13 10 17+2 7. Eventually get mantis style and a ki greatsword.
Dawnflower Dervish has to be Sarenraeist. Dervish Dancer is weak. There are only three optimization excuses to build a bard that can't share inspire courage: (1) someone else is already playing a bard, evangelist, or sensei that can; (2) you are an archaeologist or possibly sandman on trap duty; or (3) you are a Dawnflower Dervish with less than two other weapon users in the party or a selfish archetype (dervish dancer or archaeologist) with no other weapon users in the party. Summoned monsters count as other weapon users if they make manufactured or natural weapon attacks.
Arcane Duelist is probably the best stabilizer/buffer you're likely to get since evangelist isn't going to fit well into a mercenary company.
If you expect to fight anything that does non-HP damage you may want a proper cleric though. When you need Restoration you need Restoration. Bards don't get it and Paladins get it late.
Witch is another possibility. The strength patron can get you some of the battle cleric self buffs for an eldritch knight or you can hang out in the back like an officer and debuff, using the healing hex through scar to stabilize people at range so you don't have to risk your unarmored d6 hit dice.
His party looked a bit light on melee types. That is why I suggested the Dervish. As it supplied another melee type while giving the bard buff spells.
Have never played with a summoner and know very little about them but I did not think the bard song effected the summoned creatures.
I don't think clerics can heal eidolons. I may be wrong.
Any one can heal it form SRD
Eidolon: A summoner begins play with the ability to summon to his side a powerful outsider called an eidolon. The eidolon forms a link with the summoner, who, forever after, summons an aspect of the same creature. An eidolon has the same alignment as the summoner that calls it and can speak all of his languages. Eidolons are treated as summoned creatures, except that they are not sent back to their home plane until reduced to a number of negative hit points equal to or greater than their Constitution score. In addition, due to its tie to its summoner, an eidolon can touch and attack creatures warded by protection from evil and similar effects that prevent contact with summoned creatures.
A summoner can summon his eidolon in a ritual that takes 1 minute to perform. When summoned in this way, the eidolon hit points are unchanged from the last time it was summoned. The only exception to this is if the eidolon was slain, in which case it returns with half its normal hit points. The eidolon does not heal naturally. The eidolon remains until dismissed by the summoner (a standard action). If the eidolon is sent back to its home plane due to death, it cannot be summoned again until the following day. The eidolon cannot be sent back to its home plane by means of dispel magic, but spells such as dismissal and banishment work normally. If the summoner is unconscious, asleep, or killed, his eidolon is immediately banished.
His party looked a bit light on melee types. That is why I suggested the Dervish. As it supplied another melee type while giving the bard buff spells.
Have never played with a summoner and know very little about them but I did not think the bard song effected the summoned creatures.
Bard song effects all allies. Summoned creatures are allies, but even if the summoner is just standing at the back while his eidolon fights that's two people making attacks that benefit from inspire courage apart from the bard. Dawnflower Dervish is already a bad tradeoff. In fact if the ranger takes an animal companion as most do he alone makes Dawnflower Dervish a bad tradeoff. The extra boost the DD gets is arguably worth losing out on the boost on one ally, but not on two or more. Dervish Dancer doesn't get doubled inspire courage as compensation for selfishness so it isn't good unless you're playing solo or with no allies that aren't back line casters with no plans to summon stuff.
The undecided character will probably not be another back line caster since the party already has one (maybe two depending on the summoner) so you're probably looking at five "people" benefiting from inspire courage. Of course if you know you have a bard in the party building a summoner for combat is entirely possible. Just take a typical archer bard feat and stat plan and start with martial proficiency: longbow instead of lingering performance, or play a half-elf with ancestral arms. Melee summoners are a little harder because they don't get miss chance defenses, but not impossible if you're careful. With summoner and eidolon both making attacks that benefit from inspire courage it's effecting five targets even if the undecided brings a second wizard.
There's nothing wrong with a standard bard in melee. He won't be a heavy hitter if you don't count the buffs on allies, but arcane strike makes up the power attack gap, the power attack gap makes up the accuracy gap compared to a bardless low tier martial, and mirror image does a lot for the armor gap.
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Provos wrote:
I don't think clerics can heal eidolons. I may be wrong.
Of course they can -- clerics who can heal most party members can heal any living creature.
The restriction is on summoners -- they cannot use their spells to heal anything but eidolons.
The best allocation of resources in a party that has both a cleric and a summoner is for the cleric generally not to bother healing the eidolon except by channeling or Mass Cure spells that do not consume any additional resources from the cleric. The summoner can usually take care of the eidolon's healing needs.
Step 1: Oracle of Battel or Metal and be able switch spell to cures.
Step 2: Take Eldrietch Heiratage chain (Arcane Blood line) get Familair
Step 3: Take Adept Chanel
Step 4: Take Improved Faimlair that can use a wand.
Step 5 Take Extra Channel
This give you all the healing spell for big single dump heal
Wand jocky to heal/buff while you fight
and Channel 5 time per day at your caster level -3
All for cost of 5 feats.
Adept Channel
Source Orcs of Golarion pg. 27
Some orc adepts enjoy a greater connection to their gods, and can channel their faith through their unholy symbols. You gain the ability to channel energy as a cleric.
Prerequisites: Ability to cast divine spells, summon familiar class ability, caster level 4th, Cha 13.
Benefit: You gain the channel energy class feature, as a cleric, usable 2 times per day. This ability otherwise functions like the cleric’s channel energy ability, except that your effective cleric level is equal to your divine spellcasting class level –3. Unlike a cleric, however, the number of times per day you may channel energy is not affected by your Charisma modifier.
5 feats is really expensive for someone with only 10 over his lifetime, and the familiar isn't really doing anything for you. It's a wand jockey, but it has to use UMD so there's no advantage to having it be your familiar. Let the wizard muck about with improved familiars. It costs him one feat and he has 14.
Adept Channel is also not available to oracles anyways. The familiar ability is not the same thing as the summon familiar ability, which only the Adept NPC class has. Hence the name.
Able to heal and decent front line combatant. There is no equipment on the character listed u insert as u please base on what u think is worth it. This i know is not a cleric like u asked but it does what u want and is slightly better front liner.
-Race-
Half-elf
-Class-
Bard (Arcane Duelist)
-Stats-
STR 13 (base 12)(1 leveling)
DEX 28 (base 16)(4 leveling)(2 racial)(6 orc bloodline)
CON 14 (base 14)
INT 10 (base 10)
WIS 08 (base 08)
CHA 16 (base 16)
How does a Merciful Healer Cleric with the Dervish Dance feat sound? I didn't know there was a combat medic archetype available. I kind of like it because I came keep the theme of my build. Does this sound viable? Does anyone know if piranha strike works with dervish dance?
Able to heal and decent front line combatant. There is no equipment on the character listed u insert as u please base on what u think is worth it. This i know is not a cleric like u asked but it does what u want and is slightly better front liner.
-Race-
Half-elf
-Class-
Bard (Arcane Duelist)
-Stats-
STR 13 (base 12)(1 leveling)
DEX 28 (base 16)(4 leveling)(2 racial)(6 orc bloodline)
CON 14 (base 14)
INT 10 (base 10)
WIS 08 (base 08)
CHA 16 (base 16)
You're putting a leveling stat point into a stat where it's only worth one point buy point. If you move a point from dex or cha to strength you free up two point buy points which are enough to either not dump wisdom (for +1 to will saves and perception) or push int to 12 (for +1 skill point/level) The stat dropped to 15 gets your level 4 stat boost, essentially getting you +2 to a stat for a slight power reduction for three levels. If you take it out of charisma and aren't planning on offensive spellcasting you won't even notice because you'll be back up to 16 before you get high enough for it to give a bonus spell.
Also, the orc bloodline adds to strength, not dex. It's pretty much useless to a dervish dance build.
i should have pointed out, too: for that melee cleric build i posted earlier, if you take Power Attack at 5th, at 6th level your attack bonus would still be +9 but you could do 2d6+16+3d6 8/day (or +11, 3d6+19+3d6 if you get the two buffs off) which would still probably be every attack in an average party (assuming you cast a spell here and there). that's an average of 33.5 damage per hit (or 40/hit buffed)!
How does a Merciful Healer Cleric with the Dervish Dance feat sound? I didn't know there was a combat medic archetype available. I kind of like it because I came keep the theme of my build. Does this sound viable?
Well if you wish to worship Saranae (NG) this can work:
Cleric (Merciful Healer)
Halfling (NG)
STR 05 (7-2racial)
INT 07
WIS 14
DEX 20 (17+2racial+1bump)
CON 14
CHA 16 (14+2racial)
Skills: Perform(dance) 2 ranks, diplomacy 1 rank, sense motive 1 rank
Future skills: all dips, later pick up +2 int to get a full skill in something
Favored Class: Cleric pick up domain powers Copycat, Seize the Initiative, etc
Domain: Healing (Restoration)
Mercy: I'd avoid Fatigued, pick one of the other two. Your touch can remove fatigue up to 3+WIS/day, so pick what you think will come up most often in combat. Likely shaken.
Future Mercies: Disease, Curse, Paralyze. Note the first two, unlike paladins, have no check required.
Check with your DM if you can take 'extra mercy' as you might consider those for 7th and 9th level feats over Leadership/metamagics.
