On this .pdf business, I know whenever I download a new product here I have to wait a moment for it to be personalized/watermarked. That suggests to me that the .pdfs of these boons could be individualized in some way that made them more difficult to black market.
It's probably too much work though, and frankly makes me a little sad to think it's even necessary, but there you go.
Is this a bad time to bring up how ridiculously insecure even supposedly "secure" PDFs are?
-j
Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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It's only PFS legal when used at an official Pathfinder Society game table. Since the boon won't be released until January, I expect to see the new line of Paizo gaming furniture introduced in early 2013.I must admit that one took me a minute. Need more coffee.
I hope that it's surfaced with a blank battlemat and has little green felt-lined wells at each seating space for rolling dice!
Blank battlemat? How passé! I'd expect at least something like this.
Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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Blank battlemat? How passé! I'd expect at least something like this.
It's only PFS legal when used at an official Pathfinder Society game table. Since the boon won't be released until January, I expect to see the new line of Paizo gaming furniture introduced in early 2013.I must admit that one took me a minute. Need more coffee.
I hope that it's surfaced with a blank battlemat and has little green felt-lined wells at each seating space for rolling dice!
I have one of these as a gaming table in my store. It's pretty nice to have, sometimes.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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I have one of these as a gaming table in my store. It's pretty nice to have, sometimes.Blank battlemat? How passé! I'd expect at least something like this.
It's only PFS legal when used at an official Pathfinder Society game table. Since the boon won't be released until January, I expect to see the new line of Paizo gaming furniture introduced in early 2013.I must admit that one took me a minute. Need more coffee.
I hope that it's surfaced with a blank battlemat and has little green felt-lined wells at each seating space for rolling dice!
We're doing some pretty extensive re-modelling of our house (mostly bedrooms and bathrooms), and the current plan includes fitting out a game room. We're definitely considering something like that (and a couple of their eight-hour chairs).
Pathfinder Society Campaign Coordinator
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I don't get it...my question still isn't answered by anyone official, so I'll say it isn't at my tables until they chime in...What I want to know is will this boon be PFS legal? This is the first Paizo Blog post where someone hasn't asked that yet and I NEED to know otherwise I will tear out my beard and yell at children and puppies!Well, the title of this thread is "PFS boon added to Pathfinder Online MMO kickstarter." And the info on the pledge page describes what it does "[w]hen used at an official Pathfinder Society game table..."
Yes, the boon is PFS legal and should be allowed at sanctioned events.
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We're doing some pretty extensive re-modelling of our house (mostly bedrooms and bathrooms), and the current plan includes fitting out a game room. We're definitely considering something like that (and a couple of their eight-hour chairs).
Some friends of mine, who host a lot of our gaming sessions, just got a Geek Chic table and chairs (they literally arrived yesterday). Tonight will be our inaugural session using them.
If my wife and I didn't already have a very good dining room table, I might well be in the market for such a thing, myself.
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*bows*
Thank you, thank you!
I'd like to thank my trolling advisers, who shall remain nameless to protect their identities (Hint, their names rhyme with Bile Kaird and Mug Diles) and of course Mike Brock, without whom I wouldn't have pulled this off so eloquently.
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Regional Venture-Coordinator, Baltic
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So I actually joined this kickstarter even though I’m really not interested in MMOs... (Currently at the $100 level)
Why?
I want a Pathfinder digital game to succeed, because of crossovers. I myself was only introduced to roleplaying games due to the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series.
I want people who are currently addicted to online games to enjoy the offline experience.
Will I ever use the PFS boon? Probably not. Unless I’m playing a Kyle Baird scenario run by Kyle Baird! ;-)
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So I actually joined this kickstarter even though I’m really not interested in MMOs... (Currently at the $100 level)
I must do my due dilligence and point out the Chartered Company: The Empyrean Order. Dedicated to Good, keeping the world safe from griefers, and having a blast. Stop by, join in. We want all those Early Enrollment folks we can get ;)
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The con boon rewards your involvement in PFS, though. Often times, they go to GMs who donate their time, and sometimes to players who are recognized by the others at their table for being particularly good.
And sometimes you get a random chance to win a boon at every table you play, just for showing up. Yes, that still rewards people who show up, but so what? People who buy this Kickstarter boon and don't show up have zero impact on PFS, except for having given $5 to its parent company.
Venture-Lieutenant, West Virginia—Charleston
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Patrick: What I am getting at is that, in the past, all of the boons have been rewards for doing SOMETHING with Pathfinder Society. Even the novels encouraged you to learn more about the world of Golarian, which could help you roleplay more effectively. This...well, it will help you learn more about Pathfinder in a few years, based on their current dev schedule. Also, the benefit from the boons goes up with the level of Pathfinder Society involvement - the novels are fairly weak boons, the convention ones are stronger.
Andrew: It helps a sister company develop a product that I am uninterested in.
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Contributor
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I don't get it...my question still isn't answered by anyone official, so I'll say it isn't at my tables until they chime in...What I want to know is will this boon be PFS legal? This is the first Paizo Blog post where someone hasn't asked that yet and I NEED to know otherwise I will tear out my beard and yell at children and puppies!Well, the title of this thread is "PFS boon added to Pathfinder Online MMO kickstarter." And the info on the pledge page describes what it does "[w]hen used at an official Pathfinder Society game table..."S
It's a PFS boon. All of the details on the kickstarter page say this. So yes, it's PFS legal...
(not that I'm anyone official! but it looks like Mike already answered!)
I'm getting the impression that Todd's initial comment and then the various responses were all some kind of set up or inside baseball or something.
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a business plan, with that initial capital as a down payment, makes for an excellent position to go to a bank or the SBA and get a loan.
And they could have easily topped $1,000,000 on that loan, just so you're aware. I've recieved $750,000 loans with no backing other than my own personal background. A company with Paizo's history, and that kind of backing? Sky's the limit. Meaning that I am fully aware that making this game will cost more than $1,000,000. This kickstarter is still an end-around on traditional finance
So...let me see if I understand here...you've gotten $750,000 in loans for business (which must be paid back)...while Paizo is working on a cool million with no strings attached...and you think your way is better? LOL
But seriously, seems some folks are taking this whole think awfully seriously. It's just a game...not a religion for heaven's sake. Who cares if the guy sitting next to you paid 5 bucks to get an extra +1 on his will saves or some such...big deal.
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Andrew: It helps a sister company develop a product that I am uninterested in.
No, it helps to expand the Pathfinder franchise from the niche market of TTRPG into the much less niche market of MMO's. If you can't see how that has equal or greater value to paizo than people visibly playing PFS at cons then you are really not seeing the whole picture, because if the two are not equivalent then it is a distinction without a difference.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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a business plan, with that initial capital as a down payment, makes for an excellent position to go to a bank or the SBA and get a loan.
And they could have easily topped $1,000,000 on that loan, just so you're aware. I've recieved $750,000 loans with no backing other than my own personal background. A company with Paizo's history, and that kind of backing? Sky's the limit. Meaning that I am fully aware that making this game will cost more than $1,000,000. This kickstarter is still an end-around on traditional finance
So...let me see if I understand here...you've gotten $750,000 in loans for business (which must be paid back)...while Paizo is working on a cool million with no strings attached...and you think your way is better? LOL
They are fully paid back. Felt pretty good, too (-:
If you read through the things I've said I'm pretty sure you'll find that I fully acknowledge that getting hold of that much with no interest is absolutely the better option. Of course free money is going to be better.
The issue Paizo is having with this is an image issue. When you go look around on the Kickstarter page and other discussion forums (not the Paizo forums) to find what people are saying about this kickstarter, words like "money grab" and "greedy" and "unappreciative" are used over and over. The bad PR they are getting from this is at a level that is highly detrimental to their image. By layering enticements into the basic levels they are adding costs to this project that easily outweigh what a standard interest loan would have added, assuming they pay it back in a shortened time frame after having a successful launch.
And that successful launch is what they're after. The bad PR from this kickstarter is going to hinder that. I just think it was a poorly thought out move, and I'm not alone in that sentiment. Every tool has a reason for being around, and knowing how to properly use each tool you have at your disposal is a key part of doing business.
Laugh all you want. I can only hope you won't be laughing if this fails to fund, and a bank subsequently tells them, "Not now."
Edit: If you doubt me, have a look at this page. They're having problems with this one, unlike the last one. You can go from there to several discussion forums that revolve around this project. There isn't a lot of positive energy there. That means something.
And understand something important: I like Paizo. A lot. They are a huge part of my own business. I want them to be successful. I want this project to be successful. The better off they are, the better off the game world is (and, by extension, stores like mine). Don't misunderstand my comments as wishing for them to fall apart. Please realize my comments are merely criticism directed solely at them in an effort to make them realize they shouldn't be making missteps like this.
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I don't like the idea of paying for extra things, but I don't see how paying for this boon is any different than paying for a book to use an item/ability/race/whatever that you can see for free of the PFSRD. At the end of the day I choose my own level of cost and if I break it down to dollars spent vs numbers of hours entertained, I really can't think of a much cheaper hobby that would interest me.
The argument earlier for PFS GMs and their lack of control I can see as legitimate though. I personally don't like GMing PFS games as it is because I can't tweak them to my party. Widening the character power gap for whatever reason would only increase this concern.
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I'm getting the impression that Todd's initial comment and then the various responses were all some kind of set up or inside baseball or something.
Many of us Old cranky PFS Forum goers have a ton of inside jokes or just like playing off each others jokes.
Been going on for a long time, as you get used to that you will be able to follow along..
Back on Subject...
Drogon you get your s~&$ together yet? Don't make me come to Denver!
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So, derailing completely, how does this work, anyway? Pledging will only allow me to pick one reward. Do I have to pledge $5 for the boon and separately $15 for the PDF? I've never actually had money to throw at a Kickstarter before. :P
If you Pledge $5 or more and the Kickstarter is successful you will get the Boon. If you want Both the Emerald Spire PDF and Boon, you just need to put down $15 for the PDF.
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What lack of control?
Not being able to adjust encounters on the fly to make them meaningful to the party means when you have very optimized people there is no challenge and when you have lame people it can be a TPK. In home games you can adjust your encounters to suit your party and make them all challenging but not overwhelming.
Note, I am not arguing against this boon, just saying that I understood whoever it was earlier saying they didn't like disparity of power based on pay.
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Umm but encounters get adjusted on the fly all the time, in that there are ways for the GM to pull punches and tone things down. Similarly, if you have an optimised 'party' then sure it can be tough, but an optimised party seems to be unusual around this neck of the woods as PFS play tends towards a lot of PUG's so you probably (at best) have (some!) optimised individuals.
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I just want to point one thing out to Drogon.
The 1mil GW is raising with this kickstarter has NOTHING to do with getting the game funded. The game is funded after the release of the kickstarter Tech demo.
The current kickstarter is going to be used to speed up the process to get those backers who pledge for the Early Enrollment to be allowed in to the game sooner. The 1mil (and this is if I remember it correctly) would speed up that process for a year. So if this kickstarter fails those who are interested in the MMO will have to wait for a year to try it out, and it will be in a way a setback for GW with the development as they are going to be relying on us, the players or the crowdforgers with the development of the game.
Also, if this kickstarter fails, nobody will get any of the Super dungeon PDF, the Mini's etc (maybe the goblin squad store wont' even happen then :( )
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I just want to point one thing out to Drogon.
The 1mil GW is raising with this kickstarter has NOTHING to do with getting the game funded.
Sure it does.
Everything that they do that has the Goblin Works or Pathfinder Online names attached will ultimately have some effect on the operations of the company and funding of this game. Just because this money is going to be used for early development doesn't mean it won't impact what they can accomplish. And if they have so much cash they can fully fund the development of the game without bank or investor backing, then why did they do this kickstarter?
I can guarantee you that negative publicity and a poor public perception of the company's leadership and direction will impact their ability to gain that funding and will affect the launch of the game.
Edit: On a phone. Had to clarify language. Sigh. Multiple times. Sorry.
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I just want to point one thing out to Drogon.
The 1mil GW is raising with this kickstarter has NOTHING to do with getting the game funded.
Sure it does.
Everything that they do that has the Goblin Works or Pathfinder Online names attached will ultimately have some effect on the operations of the company and funding of this game. Just because this money is going to be used for early development doesn't mean it won't impact what they can accomplish. And if they have so much cash they can fully fund the development of the game without bank or investor backing, then why did they do this kickstarter?
I can guarantee you that negative publicity and a poor public perception of the company's leadership and direction will impact their ability to gain that funding and will affect the launch of the game.
Edit: On a phone. Had to clarify language. Sigh. Multiple times. Sorry.
*shrugs* you were the one who first started to complain about the fact it was a loan, they needed money to get the game funded etc. I point out you were wrong and didn't read up properly and now you look for another point to stab at something because you don't like it.
If you want to keep being negative about something then there is nothing one can do to persuade you to look at it differently. But as I said, the money is being used to get Early Enrollment going.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I'm not switching topics. They are all connected.
And I will repeat: I'm not rooting for them to fail. I am only offering criticism that I hope they consider when they make their next move. If you think I'm being negative, I would like to counter by saying I am merely defending my points.
Edit: I think I know where the confusion is coming from. When I say "fund this project" I am usually referring to the current kickstarter, not the overall PFO project.
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I can guarantee you that negative publicity and a poor public perception of the company's leadership and direction will impact their ability to gain that funding and will affect the launch of the game.
And the Ryan Dancey name has a bad association for a number of long time D&D players due to his takeover and attempt to cash in on Livng City by turning it into a MMO model. It's easy to see this as another attempt to cash in on enthusiastic gamers.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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Paizo is very good at what they do, but the main reason in they are in the lead, is that they've done the best job at surviving in a contracting market. The RPG market is nowhere near what it used to be.To be fair, they are the leader in the RPG industry.
Hm. As I am at home, I don't have access to any of my sales numbers nor to the industry reports that I get. But I'm going to go out on a limb and say that is an inaccurate statement. Last year saw some pretty astounding growth in RPG sales, and the year before was no slouch. In terms of "growth" nothing will ever come close to the 80s and the early years of the OGL. But in terms of raw number of players, there are more people playing RPGs now than ever in the past. Again, I'm out on a limb, so feel free to cite numbers and knock me off.
I won't dispute your 4e and D&D Next feelings, though.
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There are no plans for this. It hasn't even been discussed, and it's not something we've considered.Also: This makes me concerned that play of PFO will lead to PFS boons.
Sounds like a great chance to generate even further crossover. Do specific thing in MMO and get PFS boon? Sweet. Do thing in PFS and get bonus in MMO? Also sweet. This would be something rarely heard of in gaming and be treading new ground. I would play the MMO for PFS boons and heck I might find out I like the MMO and play it just for fun.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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So the link you provided shows pathfinder trending 12k shy of the goal, and projected to either be short 400k or go over by 200k...
KK gotcha, it's not 100% guranteed but probably will.
Yep. It's gotten much better in the last couple days. When I first posted that, the trend showed them failing by either 5% or 25%. Hopefully it'll keep up.
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I use Kicktraq to follow it. Not sure it is the same that Drogon posted.
At the moment they trend towards 960K and the Exponential projection is 877K to 1677K.
These numbers have to be taken with a shovel load of salt. The exponential projection was just half a few days ago. This value seems very dependent on the trend of the last three days.
The trend is likely more accurate - but half way through (not fully yet) it isn't taking into account a late surge.
I like a lot a spreadsheet that someone posted. It gives two key figures - daily average needed for rest of campaign and daily average needed assuming a 25% surge in the last 4 days.
You don't want the first one getting too high. Right now it's flatlining with gains over the last two days compensating for the days before that. The second one reached an all time low yesterday. This one shouldn't go up - or you face too high a mountain to climb in the last few days.
To me it looks healthy. It isn't a given and GW needs to work on it (as they do) and some nasty surprise (?) could hurt it. At the same time - if they manage to stoke momentum then it could become a given.
We will know in less than a month.
Well this sucks.
Paizo has done irreparable harm to their image with this Kickstarter.
On the bright side, maybe Paizo will stop being a mouthpiece for Goblinworks and go back to doing what they do best.
