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Druids Shamens: Wild shape / elementals

Rules Questions

Simple question, can Animal Shamans use thier +2 to wildshaping to effect thier elemental shape by taking the shape of an animalistic elemental?


Druid wildshape penalty to everything but animal-2 for 8 levels (when you hit lvl 14 and finally no longer suffer the penalty as far as what you can shape into) so -16 points

Benifit of being a shamen and wildshaping. +2 for 2 levels (as far as what you can change into) so +4 points. (bc it only gives you a bonus up to level 8, at which point your maxed in your animal choices, and you cant wild shape period till 6 anyways))

Delay to wild shaping period for 2 levels -2 points
net loss by choosing to be an animal shamen (in regards to wild shaping) is -14 points.

Now i know you cant break everything down into a point system like above, but it still seems like a rather large loss in the wildshaping department.... a 2 level delay to wildshaping period for a whole 2 levels of bonus use (understandable i would think) its that -2 to everything else that lasts long after your benifiting (as far as what you can shape into) that kinda hurts in the long run.

Now if you could use the wild shape to change into an elemental animal shape, (so at level 8 i could change into say, a large elemental earth bear) it would balance out a bit more, as it would still restrict me up till level 14 in every other shape, but also give me my bonus in my specification till lvl 10. using the point system it works out like this.


Druid wildshape penalty to everything but animal, -2 for 8 levels =16 points

Delay to wild shaping period -2 points

Benefit of being a shamen +2 for 4 levels=8 points
total -10 points.

there is another way of looking at it below as well

alternate reasoning:

without shaping into animal elementals
-2 delay to wildshaping (lvl 4-vs lvl6)
-2 delay to maxing wild shaping options (lvl 12vs vl14)
+2 lvl gain to maxing one animal (lvl 8 vs lvl 10)
Net loss, 2

With shaping into animal elementals
-2 delay to wildshaping (lvl 4 vs lvl 6)
-2 Delay to maxing wild shaping options (lvl 12 vs lvl 14)
+2 lvl on maxing one animal (lvl 8 vs lvl 10)
+2 on maxing elemental of one shape (lvl 10 vs lvl 12)

Now i know your gonna say ask my gm what he reasons, but im just looking for some input before then, id love to get jasons take on it of course though i doubt he'll see this (i think he wanted to eliminate plant and elemental shaping for shamens completely anyways, which would have completely nerfed the shamen)

and yes i know totemic summons is a big boost, but i think that balances out with the fact that you have a penalty that last 8 levels for a bonus that effect you for 2 (4 if you do the elemental animal thing) plus the loss of the thousand faces (albeit it its a crappy feat, but its still a loss coupled with all the other net losses)

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