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Which of these is the least-terrible idea? [PFS]


Advice

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Below are some ideas for my next PFS character. I want to do something at least a little out of the ordinary, but still contribute with some damage dealing (as well as some noncombat competencies). These are all a bit "out there" but could still be fun. Which is the least terrible?

Swordy McCritface:

Human (Dual Talented)
STR 18 (16+2)
DEX 16 (14+2)
CON 14
INT XX
WIS XX
CHA XX

01:Fighter1:EWP(falcata), TWF
02:Barbarian1(urban):Controlled Rage
03:Fighter2:Weapon Focus (falcata), Extra Rage
04:Fighter3
05:Fighter4:Weapon Spec (falcata), Double Slice

Could potentially take a fighter archetype; haven't looked into that yet. But anyway, the idea is to TWF with falcatas and just eat the -4 TWF penalty. By 5th level (assuming both swords are masterwork or +1, and a +2 STR belt), I'm TWFing during rage at +11/+11 for 1d8+10 each, with 19-20/x3 crits. The plan would be to get both swords keen'd ASAP for lots of 3d8+30 crits. I could potentially dip Ranger for Favored Enemy, too.

Dark Stalker Wannabe:

Tiefling (heritage undecided) with two claw attacks
STR XX
DEX 18
CON XX
INT XX
WIS XX
CHA XX

01:Ninja1:Sneak Attack 1d6, Fiend Sight
02:Ninja2:Ninja Trick (Rogue Talent [Finesse Rogue]), ki pool
03:Ninja3:Sneak Attack 2d6, Fiend Sight

And continuing with Ninja from there. Most of the time, I'm just some random ninja who uses claws instead of TWF. But since I have the See In Darkness ability from having taken Fiend Sight twice, I carry oils of darkness/deeper darkness. If things get hairy, I put the lights out and start shredding faces - all enemies with less effective vision than myself are effectively blinded, granting me Sneak Attack damage on all attacks and also keeping me safe with 50% miss chance if they even attack the right space.

Just Plain Weird:

Same kind of tiefling as the Dark Stalker Wannabe, with probably very similar stats.

01:Ninja1:Sneak Attack 1d6, Weapon Finesse
02:Ninja2:Ninja Trick (whatever), ki pool
03:Monk1(maneuver master):Improved Dirty Trick, Agile Maneuvers
04:Ninja from here on out.

Thanks to Maneuver Master, I can tack a "free" dirty trick onto my full-attacks. So if I can't get a flank, I use dirty trick (blind) and then claw them twice. If the DT was successful, my full-attack gets Sneak damage. If it wasn't successful, well, it's not like it really cost me anything.

So those are my ideas. Thoughts?

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion Subscriber

I like the fighter, but rather then a human, what about a half orc to use the Destroyer's Blessing, Sympathetic Rage, and Gore Fiend feats?

Grand Lodge

I really like your Dark Stalker Wannabe Jiggy. I can see him doing more than just fighting in darkness. A flank with two claws is pretty terrorizing. But the basis of seeing through darkness and ripping people apart is awesome. With a party you have to be careful not to screw them over by not allowing them to see. The best solution I see is to cast darkness on an enemy not quite in battle and 1 vs. 1 him dead.


I'd go with the tiefling with no heritage. Honestly, where is the oni heritage?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

It might be worth pointing out my hesitancies with each build:

With the TWF guy, my main concern is the lack of skills. We're talking 2/level, unless I spend FCBs on them. I'd get an extra 2 on that barbarian level, and if I wanted I could start taking ranger from 6th onward to get more skills, but still.

With the Darkness guy, he's a bit "anti-social". To use his schtick, I have to essentially cut the rest of the party out of the fight. If the poo hits the fan then I can have a sweet "hero moment" like that, but the rest of the time I'm either being a jerk or playing Generic Ninja #448.

With the other tiefling, well... Let's just say there are still a lot of people whose blood pressure rises at the suggestion that the maneuver master works the way it says it works (uninhibited by armor, doesn't replace/alter any of your normal attacks). I'm hesitant to put myself and my tablemates through such discussions every time I have a different GM.


The TWF guy is definitely lacking in the "outside of combat competencies."

I like the darkstalker wannabe, and though his go-to schtick is anti-social, there is definitely a place at the table for a character like that. Especially if you reserve the schtick for necessary instances, or maybe as the opening volley, and then let the light shine in, so to speak.


Luna_Silvertear wrote:
I'd go with the tiefling with no heritage. Honestly, where is the oni heritage?

blood of fiends, advanced race guide, and the sorcerer bloodline (from UM, iirc) :p

@jiggy: you can dump cha to 7 to beef int to 13, and the lore warden archetype will further cover some of the lack of skills.

Silver Crusade

Jiggy wrote:


With the Darkness guy, he's a bit "anti-social". To use his schtick, I have to essentially cut the rest of the party out of the fight. If the poo hits the fan then I can have a sweet "hero moment" like that,

This character is definitely going to take restraint on your part to not dominate play.

The other problem that you may run into is GMs who aren't totally up on the way that darkness and light spells interact, the way darkness and abilities like scent interact, etc. There are a lot of fiddly little rules that you'll be running into. All fairly easily handled by your having printouts (or at least page references) to the relevant bits.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I'd prefer to avoid stat-dumping if possible this time around... What if...

STR 17 (15+2, bump at 4th)
DEX 16 (14+2)
CON 14
INT 12
WIS 11 (bump at 8th)
CHA 10

That might be doable. Heck, I could even swap INT and CON, and take Toughness at some point. My Fort save is going to be solid anyway, thanks to martial multiclassing.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I might have noticed a problem with the wording of Maneuver Master that could screw up your Dirty Trick build:

PRD said wrote:
Flurry of Maneuvers (Ex): At 1st level, as part of a full-attack action, a maneuver master can make one additional combat maneuver, regardless of whether the maneuver normally replaces a melee attack or requires a standard action. The maneuver master uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus to determine his CMB for the bonus maneuvers, though all combat maneuver checks suffer a –2 penalty when using a flurry. At 8th level, a maneuver master may attempt a second additional combat maneuver, with an additional –3 penalty on combat maneuver checks. At 15th level, a maneuver master may attempt a third additional combat maneuver, with an additional –7 penalty on combat maneuver checks. This ability replaces flurry of blows.

This is different from the wording of Flurry of Blows, and it would seem to indicate that if you dip 1 level of Monk, you'll only ever be adding 1 to your CMB on your extra maneuver.

Apologies in advance if this has been gone over ad nauseam in Monk threads already; I don't read those things, and I just noticed it for myself.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

It would be incredibly dumb for a GM to actually interpret it that way.

But in any case, I like the TWF falcata guy better at this point, as he'd be easier to play at the table (fewer dice, more static bonuses, less explanation, more laughs generated by the -4/-4 penalty, etc). Now I just need to make him skilled enough to be useful for more than just stabbing.

Sczarni

Are you taking the Tusked or Toothy or whatever trait to get a bite too? May as well get as many sneak attacks in as possible. I'm also a fan of burning a feat on the 2 Natural Armor in Armor of the Pit, because you will have to choose between Amulet of Mighty Fists and Amulet of Natural Armor. This way you get +2 Natural Armor and keep the neck slot open for the 8-12 level when you get the AoMF.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

The idea I'm leaning toward at the moment is the human one, actually.


Jiggy, what's the story behind these piles of numbers?

What drives Stabbins McCritsalot to do this?

(Mathematically, you may want to look at TWF Ranger for that - you trade the ability to wear heavy armor, but you can also get by with a much less expensive DEX and not tank other feats as well. Plus, more skill points.)

Here's a similar "two weapon fighting with unusual weapon" build

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

How does this look for the falcata guy?
.
.
.
.
Human (Dual Talented)
STR 18 (16+2)
DEX 16 (14+2)
CON 13 (bump at 4th)
INT 12
WIS 10
CHA 10

Traits: Berserker of the Society, Indomitable Faith

01:Barbarian1(urban):Crowd Control +1, Controlled Rage, EWP(falcata)
02:Fighter1(two-weapon warrior):Two-Weapon Fighting
03:Fighter2:Double Slice, Extra Rage
04:Fighter3:Defensive Flurry +1, CON to 14
05:Fighter4:Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization
06:Fighter5:Twin Blades +1

And so forth. All FCB's into skills (so 5 ranks at 1st, 4 ranks/level thereafter).

Any good?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

AdAstraGames wrote:

Jiggy, what's the story behind these piles of numbers?

What drives Stabbins McCritsalot to do this?

I typically come up with backstory after I have a more solid idea of the stats. Feels more organic that way, like I'm "meeting" someone who exists independently of me. When I start with a concept, they always end up feeling really contrived and lifeless.

It's probably different for other folks, but for me, I can't seem to really get into a character with any kind of depth unless I get the stats sorted first.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Jiggy wrote:
AdAstraGames wrote:

Jiggy, what's the story behind these piles of numbers?

What drives Stabbins McCritsalot to do this?

I typically come up with backstory after I have a more solid idea of the stats. Feels more organic that way, like I'm "meeting" someone who exists independently of me. When I start with a concept, they always end up feeling really contrived and lifeless.

It's probably different for other folks, but for me, I can't seem to really get into a character with any kind of depth unless I get the stats sorted first.

To each his own!

Cheliax

hasn't a "TWF falcata guy" been done to death already?

For the tiefling, I like 2 levels in monk, or one level in flame mystery oracle for the revelation that lets you see through fire and smoke, and use smoke bombs when you're darkness tricks get turned off. Also gets you some (infernal) heals, and maybe a bless every once and a while.

You can do something similar with ifrit if you've got the race boon.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Victor Zajic wrote:
hasn't a "TWF falcata guy" been done to death already?

Not that I was aware of - certainly haven't seen any locally.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion Subscriber
Jiggy wrote:

How does this look for the falcata guy?

.
.
.
.
Human (Dual Talented)
STR 18 (16+2)
DEX 16 (14+2)
CON 13 (bump at 4th)
INT 12
WIS 10
CHA 10

Traits: Berserker of the Society, Indomitable Faith

01:Barbarian1(urban):Crowd Control +1, Controlled Rage, EWP(falcata)
02:Fighter1(two-weapon warrior):Two-Weapon Fighting
03:Fighter2:Double Slice, Extra Rage
04:Fighter3:Defensive Flurry +1, CON to 14
05:Fighter4:Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization
06:Fighter5:Twin Blades +1

And so forth. All FCB's into skills (so 5 ranks at 1st, 4 ranks/level thereafter).

Any good?

If you are having trouble having enough skills, you might consider Lore Warden or Tactician for fighter archetypes - however neither of those is compatible with the two-weapon warrior, also, you may consider swapping Intelligence and Constitution and taking Fast Learner from the ARG, which then opens up Improvisation and Improved Improvisation which will give you some nice bonuses for skills which you don't invest points in. Fast Learner is also just as good as toughness for a character who would normally invest all of their FCB into skills.

Cheliax

Jiggy wrote:
Victor Zajic wrote:
hasn't a "TWF falcata guy" been done to death already?
Not that I was aware of - certainly haven't seen any locally.

I actually don't have any idea what a falcata is, but I've heard a good deal of chatter on the pfs boards that amounts to "and then the TWF falcata guy killed everything"

I'm not critizing your build, you just mentioned in an earlier post that you wanted to avoid such things.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Thanks for the heads-up. I do like for my PCs to be "my own". I had been under the impression that most TWF builds uses wakizashis, and haven't seen these references you mention.

Oh, and a falcata has the same stats as a longsword, except it's a x3 crit instead of x2, and it's exotic.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Jiggy wrote:

Thanks for the heads-up. I do like for my PCs to be "my own". I had been under the impression that most TWF builds uses wakizashis, and haven't seen these references you mention.

Oh, and a falcata has the same stats as a longsword, except it's a x3 crit instead of x2, and it's exotic.

Not quite the same stats -- falcatas each cost 3 more gp. Sorry if that ruins your build!

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

CURSES!!!

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

New idea:
Dwarven Dawnflower Dervish

STR 07 (I'm a dwarf, so who cares about encumbrance?)
DEX 17 (bump at 4th)
CON 15 (13+2, bump at 8th)
INT 10
WIS 10 (8+2)
CHA 14 (16-2)

Focus on non-save-granting spells (such as buffs/utility) and melee combat. Probably take Extra Performance a time or two so I can be dwarf-dancing in every encounter for extra bonuses to attack/damage.

Who says dwarves can't be bards? ;)

...Too much?


Is it a naked dwarf?


AdAstraGames wrote:
Is it a naked dwarf?

probably wears the absolute bare minimum and keeps everythign else in extradimensional storage or in his horse's saddlebags.


Jiggy wrote:

New idea:

Dwarven Dawnflower Dervish

STR 07 (I'm a dwarf, so who cares about encumbrance?)
DEX 17 (bump at 4th)
CON 15 (13+2, bump at 8th)
INT 10
WIS 10 (8+2)
CHA 14 (16-2)

Focus on non-save-granting spells (such as buffs/utility) and melee combat. Probably take Extra Performance a time or two so I can be dwarf-dancing in every encounter for extra bonuses to attack/damage.

Who says dwarves can't be bards? ;)

...Too much?

The only problem i can see with this guy is while dwarves don't suffer movement penalties for encumberance i think the max dex penalty still hits them right in their ac.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Bertious wrote:
The only problem i can see with this guy is while dwarves don't suffer movement penalties for encumberance i think the max dex penalty still hits them right in their ac.

True, but by the time I bump my DEX to 18 and would actually feel that impact, I can easily afford muleback cords and drastically increase my carrying capacity. Shouldn't be an issue.

Andoran

Jiggy wrote:
Bertious wrote:
The only problem i can see with this guy is while dwarves don't suffer movement penalties for encumberance i think the max dex penalty still hits them right in their ac.
True, but by the time I bump my DEX to 18 and would actually feel that impact, I can easily afford muleback cords and drastically increase my carrying capacity. Shouldn't be an issue.

Muleback Cords take up the same slot as a Cloak of Resistance, so it hits you right in the saving throws.

Also, and this may be more important, IMO Strength is second only to Con as a bad dump stat. It negatively impacts both Climb and Swim, and having a 7 Str means that you can be one-shotted by a Shadow, which can also do nasty things when you come back in the same encounter as an enemy.

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