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is there any way to make a build that can deal huge amounts of bleed dmg?


Advice


Also, do multiple bleed attacks stack?


You cannot have the same type of bleed stack, but different types can exist at once. Have bleeds that do different types of ability damage and drain. One that does con bleed, one that does str, etc.

So the question is how to get as many different types of bleed at once, and still have an effective build. One hit or full attack (maybe dual wielding weapons with different bleeds?) would be the most effective, but might be hard to accomplish.


That might even make it more effective since they would have to try to make more heal checks right?


You could go the Power Attack route to get to the Feat Bloody Assault.

Bloody Assault (Combat)
Sacrificing accuracy, you can inflict bloody wounds that are slow to heal.

Prerequisites: Str 13, Power Attack, base attack bonus +6.

Benefit: You can choose to take a –5 penalty on all melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks to inflict 1d4 points of bleed damage with your weapon melee attacks, in addition to the normal damage dealt by the weapon. A creature continues to take bleed damage every round at the start of its turn. Bleed damage can be stopped by a DC 15 Heal check or through any magical healing. Bleed damage from this feat does not stack with itself. You must choose to use this feat before making the attack roll, and its effects last until your next turn (although the bleeding lasts until healed, as normal).

Great for an animal companion with three attacks. Throw a Haste spell up and BAM!

Cheliax RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32

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The only stacking bleed in the game is Bleeding Critical. A high-crit build with this feat, maximizing the number of possible attacks (and thus possible crits) is the best way I'm aware of to rapidly stack bleed damage. The prerequisites are, as with most critical feats, fairly high-level (11+) but a fighter or ranger dual-wielding high crit weapons (such as keen kukris) is very likely to stack a lot of bleed on a foe during a full attack.

PRD wrote:

Bleeding Critical (Combat, Critical)

Your critical hits cause opponents to bleed profusely.
Prerequisites: Critical Focus, base attack bonus +11.
Benefit: Whenever you score a critical hit with a slashing or piercing weapon, your opponent takes 2d6 points of bleed damage (see Conditions) each round on his turn, in addition to the damage dealt by the critical hit. Bleed damage can be stopped by a DC 15 Heal skill check or through any magical healing. The effects of this feat stack.
Special: You can only apply the effects of one critical feat to a given critical hit unless you possess Critical Mastery.

Lantern Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Maps, Pawns Subscriber

Rogue/Ninja double wielding wounding weapons with the bleed sneak attack trick. Wounding weapons stack with itself and other bleed effects.

Probably with those you could take a class with a lot of attakcs too, either full BAB double wielding or a monk with weapon flurry.


This tengu feat stacks with Bleeding Critical.


Cool thanks for the info guys! So can you not stack different types either?


Pathfindersrd wrote:
Some bleed effects cause ability damage or even ability drain. Bleed effects do not stack with each other unless they deal different kinds of damage. When two or more bleed effects deal the same kind of damage, take the worse effect. In this case, ability drain is worse than ability damage.

So you could have hp damage, con damage, etc. Not familiar enough with the bestiary, feats, and spells to say what kinds, but the term "bleed" looks more to be describing how it slowly reduces over time instead of an immediate effect rather than actual red and clotting blood. So maybe certain mind effecting spells would have intelligence, wisdom, or charisma bleed. Again, not too experienced.

Of course, the actual abilities themselves could say they do not stack.

Qadira

One of the style feats gives you 2d6 Bleed damage. I think it's boar style, but I can't remember.


Yes boar gives bleed, but you must hit with two attacks in that round.


Are you restricted to Paizo or can you use 3PP stuff? The Feats of Critical Combat from Super Genius Games has a bleed feat as well as a critical hit that affects each of the different attributes.

Don't forget to get wounding on your weapon.


so combining everything in the thread so far we've got:

a tengu fighter (unarmed fighter) 1 / monk (MoMS) 2 / rogue (bandit/swordmaster) 17 with:
-the claw attack racial feature, and a keen/wounding AoMF,
-weapon focus (claws), boar style (1st)
-boar shred (2nd)
-feral combat (claws), dragon style (3rd)
-blood beak, bleeding attack rogue talent (5th)
-tiger trance (swordmaster)(6th)
-power attack, ambush (bandit) (7th)
-critical focus (9th)
-bleeding critical (11th can be traded with bloody assault if you want it earlier)
-bloody assault (13th, can be traded with bleeding critical)

ends up with 14/9/4 BAB (14/14/14 since you're using primary naturals), 10/13/8 saves, and 7 open rogue talents (4 of which can be advanced talents).
you deal 1d6(bite)/1d4/1d4 (claws x2) with a crit of 19-20x2, sneak attack +9d6, plus whatever modifiers you can tack on.

.

could also go rogue (swordmaster/bandit) 4 / monk (sohei) 6 / rogue 10 with:
-a keen/wounding fauchard
-EWP (Fauchard) (1st)
-bleeding attack (talent) (2nd)
-power attack, tiger trance (swordmaster) (3rd)
-ambush (bandit) (4th)
-blood beak feat (5th)
-bloody assault (7th)
-critical focus (9th)
-flurry with polearms (10th)
-bleeding critical feat (11th)

ends up with 14/9/4 BAB (14/14/14/9/4 while flurrying and ki attack), 9/14/9 saves, and 6 open rogue talents (3 of which can be advanced talents).
you deal 2d4/2d4/2d4/2d4/2d4 with a crit of 15-20x2, sneak attack +7d6, plus whatever modifiers you can tack on (1.5x strength and PA for two-handed weapon).

.

the anatomist trait (+1 to crit confirmations) seems like it'd be loads of help to either build.

EDIT: cleaned the post up (a lot)


Would belier's bite + an amulett of mighty fists with wounding on it work?


Tirq wrote:
One of the style feats gives you 2d6 Bleed damage. I think it's boar style, but I can't remember.

Eeeyup.

Hit with two Unarmed Strikes in a round and you can tear flesh and deal Bleed damage. Second feat in the tree lets you make a free action to demoralize when you tear flesh (at a +2 bonus). Can't for the life of me remember what the third one does.

Edit: Lets you make demoralize attempts as a move action and when you tear flesh you deal 1d6 Bleed to them every round.


AndIMustMask wrote:

Lots of Great build stuff!

I'd suggest vivisectionist alchemist in place of rogue as you can still get the bleeding attack rogue talent and sneak attack as well as a load of buffs.


forgot to mention that both builds have maneuver training, so their CMB for the tiger trance check is 16+str+whatever else you can add

the first build has 18+wis bonus rounds of trance, while the second has 15+wis rounds.

on the second build idea you could do sohei/qinggong and trade away the mount (i think you can do that) if you don't wanna use it.
the second idea also has three free monk bonus feats of your choice, which can include mounted combat feats.

Bertious wrote:
AndIMustMask wrote:

Lots of Great build stuff!

I'd suggest vivisectionist alchemist in place of rogue as you can still get the bleeding attack rogue talent and sneak attack as well as a load of buffs.

that is also a fine choice (i just like the swordmaster/bandit combo and more rogue talents/advanced talents).

also, you can also use vivisectionist/beastmorph to grab pounce that way, and you could get more natural attacks via wings(?), tentacle and claws with the somewhat dubious "vestigial armx2 wearing talons of leng" (though these would be a secondary natural attack since you're making other natural attacks) combo.

quick question: how would the tengu wings feat interact with the wings discovery? would you now have two sets of wings


Ishpumalibu wrote:
Also, do multiple bleed attacks stack?

The only way to get stacking bleed damage is a wounding weapon. If you get a wounding monk weapon, you can flurry of blows with it and get up a very strong bleed.


You can also worship the demon lord Andirifkhu and get a 5 point bleed on hits with slashing weapons.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/demon/demon-lor ds


johnlocke90 wrote:
Ishpumalibu wrote:
Also, do multiple bleed attacks stack?
The only way to get stacking bleed damage is a wounding weapon. If you get a wounding monk weapon, you can flurry of blows with it and get up a very strong bleed.

blood beak specifically notes that it stacks with other bleed effects, bleeding critical can stack with itself as well.

johnlocke90 wrote:

You can also worship the demon lord Andirifkhu and get a 5 point bleed on hits with slashing weapons.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/demon/demon-lor ds

this is quite useful, actually. the two build ideas i posted earlier can be LE (shift to NE/CE after finishing monk levels?) and follow her (andirif khu).

.

looking through magic items, the murderer's blackcloth seems like a must-have.


Wow, this really fleshed out. I kind of liked that first build more but I guess I should just playtest them both though!


Deulist 10 gives crippling critical, which is another 2d6 bleed, but the feat requirements mean your not getting style feats without a moms dip, and crane style is so broken with the duelist that I couldn't imagine giving it up


hmm, actually, looking at tiger trance and pounce discovery i dont think the second build idea could pounce/flurry, whether or not it was rogue or alchemist (the two ablities let you charge and make a full-attack action, while flurry'ing is a full-round action)

Jaxtile wrote:
Deulist 10 gives crippling critical, which is another 2d6 bleed, but the feat requirements mean your not getting style feats without a moms dip, and crane style is so broken with the duelist that I couldn't imagine giving it up

would that apply alongside bleeding critical?

crazy idea: (alchemist/rogue, archetype combos therein) 4/sohei monk 6/duelist 10, wield a small-sized fauchard (keeps the crit range, still a polearm, now one-handed). the issue arises in trying to get it to deal piercing damage to apply for duelist stuff (isn't there a weapon enchant that lets you change the damage type?).

you can grab dodge and mobility as two of the three monk bonus feats, weapon finesse (useless, but required) at 7th--move bloody assault to 13th, and still meet the prereqs. unfortunately you cant use parry with this setup while flurrying.

Qadira

Why would you bother with going Sohei monk and Duelist?

1st of all, Boar style makes it so that your Unarmed Strikes deal Piercing damage instead of Blunt and they do bleeding damage. Wearing armor would limit you from getting your Wisdom to your AC, and you're also getting your Intellegence there, so it's not a problem. Taking the small-sized Fauchard doesn't make sense, since that gives you a -2 to hit but still has reach.


Tirq wrote:

Why would you bother with going Sohei monk and Duelist?

1st of all, Boar style makes it so that your Unarmed Strikes deal Piercing damage instead of Blunt and they do bleeding damage. Wearing armor would limit you from getting your Wisdom to your AC, and you're also getting your Intellegence there, so it's not a problem. Taking the small-sized Fauchard doesn't make sense, since that gives you a -2 to hit but still has reach.

hence "crazy" idea.

so MoMS monk (boar style, boar shred)2 / (rogue or alchemist) 8 / duelist 10?
what size type are natural attacks? if light, you could put finesse on your claws (and maybe agile on your AoMF?) and ignore str altogether. pounce, parry, etc.


AndIMustMask wrote:

so combining everything in the thread so far we've got:

a tengu fighter (unarmed fighter) 1 / monk (MoMS) 2 / rogue (bandit/swordmaster) 17 with:
-the claw attack racial feature, and a keen/wounding AoMF,
-weapon focus (claws), boar style (1st)
-boar shred (2nd)
-feral combat (claws), dragon style (3rd)
-blood beak, bleeding attack rogue talent (5th)
-tiger trance (swordmaster)(6th)
-power attack, ambush (bandit) (7th)
-critical focus (9th)
-bleeding critical (11th can be traded with bloody assault if you want it earlier)
-bloody assault (13th, can be traded with bleeding critical)

ends up with 14/9/4 BAB (14/14/14 since you're using primary naturals), 10/13/8 saves, and 7 open rogue talents (4 of which can be advanced talents).
you deal 1d6(bite)/1d4/1d4 (claws x2) with a crit of 19-20x2, sneak attack +9d6, plus whatever modifiers you can tack on.

This build going Alchemist (vivesectionist/beastmorph) 13 rogue (scout) 4 would be able to pounce on a charge with sneak attack as well as use an infusion of monsterous physique to take Calikang form for his full set of weapon attacks plus 4 slams all doing sneak attack damage.


I just realized my dm still uses the original 3.5 polymorph, before the polymorph subschool. I wonder if I could change into a form that would give a good bleed dmg source to a stat....


Bertious wrote:


This build going Alchemist (vivesectionist/beastmorph) 13 rogue (scout) 4 would be able to pounce on a charge with sneak attack as well as use an infusion of monsterous physique to take Calikang form for his full set of weapon attacks plus 4 slams all doing sneak attack damage.

good catch.


Tirq wrote:

Why would you bother with going Sohei monk and Duelist?

1st of all, Boar style makes it so that your Unarmed Strikes deal Piercing damage instead of Blunt and they do bleeding damage. Wearing armor would limit you from getting your Wisdom to your AC, and you're also getting your Intellegence there, so it's not a problem. Taking the small-sized Fauchard doesn't make sense, since that gives you a -2 to hit but still has reach.

It's Slashing, not Piercing. Snake gives Piercing.

Taldor

Boar + Martial Artist archtype is how the monk in my game tends to be the best disabler Monk I've ever seen. He's taken Big Bads down to quivering jelly in 1-2 rounds if he can land his attacks. Otherwise, the demorilizing/intimidation strikes are awesome.

Downside is the Monk classic issue. Lower AC/Hitpoints. He's crunchy as hell. But man when he hits, what a punch.

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