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Two Crossblooded Sorcerer questions.


Rules Questions


I'm playing as a Crossblooded sorcerer and chose Arcane as one of my bloodlines. Since being Crossblooded allows you to take lower-level bloodline abilities at higher levels and/or take abilities that would normally branch into another one, it seems like some odd things can come about.

My first question has to do with the Metamagic Adept ability.

Quote:
Metamagic Adept (Ex): At 3rd level, you can apply any one metamagic feat you know to a spell you are about to cast without increasing the casting time. You must still expend a higher-level spell slot to cast this spell. You can use this ability once per day at 3rd level and one additional time per day for every four sorcerer levels you possess beyond 3rd, up to five times per day at 19th level. At 20th level, this ability is replaced by arcane apotheosis.

Does this mean that if I select Metamagic Adept as my 9th level power, at 20th level if I select a bloodline power that isn't Arcane Apotheosis, Arcane Apotheosis replaces Metamagic Adept anyways?

For my second question, if I select New Arcana as my 20th level bloodline power, what of these would be true?

New Arcana:
Quote:
New Arcana (Ex): At 9th level, you can add any one spell from the sorcerer/wizard spell list to your list of spells known. This spell must be of a level that you are capable of casting. You can also add one additional spell at 13th level and 17th level.

A.) I get to pick one spell, up to 9th level, to add to my list of spells known.
B.) I get to pick up to one 4th level spell (9th level sorcerer), up to one 6th level spell (13th level sorcerer), and up to one 8th level spell (17th level sorcerer) to add to my list of spells known.
C.) I get to pick 3 spells, up to 9th level, to add to my list of spells known.
D.) I don't get to add any spells to my list of spells known since I am not 9th, 13th, or 17th level.

I apologize if these questions have already been addressed, but I used the search function and didn't see any relevant posts. Thanks!


My understanding/rules interpretation:

First question: if you don't select Arcane Apotheosis at Sorcerer 20, then you don't get it as a "replacement" for Metamagic Adept.

Second question: if you select New Arcana at Sorcerer 20, then you get three new spells known (one of up to spell L 4, one of up to L 6, and one of up to L 8) - in other words, answer B from your list.


If you were to follow the letter of the rule, I would say that arcane apotheosis replaces metamagic adept regardless. That's obviously not the intended outcome, but it is certainly how its written.


It's reasonable to read it as meaning when you take Arcane Apotheosis, it subverts Metamagic Adept. You still have to take it for the replacement to happen. Keep in mind the general archetype rule (and sorc bloodlines, essentially, function as archetypes) that if you replace an earlier ability in a "chain" of abilities, all subsequent abilities in the chain are "shifted back" to account.

Regarding New Arcana, I'd say the same "shift back" principal applies. If you take it at lvl 20, you can pick one spell that you could cast at lvl 20. You'd have to gain 4 more levels for the next spell (presuming your game allows this).


Spoke to my playgroup and GM today. We came to the consensus that since it isn't specifically addressed in any way going by the RAW is the way to go. Metamagic Adept is automatically replaced by Arcane Apotheosis at Lv. 20 no matter what and New Arcana only benefits you if you're 9th, 13th, or 17th level while you have it. Thanks for the input.


DeathAndAlchemy wrote:
Spoke to my playgroup and GM today. We came to the consensus that since it isn't specifically addressed in any way going by the RAW is the way to go. Metamagic Adept is automatically replaced by Arcane Apotheosis at Lv. 20 no matter what and New Arcana only benefits you if you're 9th, 13th, or 17th level while you have it. Thanks for the input.

It's replaced, but you don't have the ability so, essentially, that reading means at lvl 20, you lose Metamagic Adept and have nothing to replace it.


No. Metamagic Adept becomes that ability. It doesn't say "at 20th level, when you get Arcane Apotheosis, you lose this ability [Metamagic Adept]."

Honestly, I'm not sure why that line is even in there.

They could have just as easily put, "At 20th level you can use this ability any number of times a day." and Arcane Apotheosis could have been reduced to "Whenever you use magic items that require charges, you can instead expend spell slots to power the item. For every three levels of spell slots that you expend, you consume one less charge when using a magic item that expends charges."

However, as it is written, at 20th level I get Arcane Apotheosis as long as I have Metamagic Adept. Alternatively if I'm wearing a Robe of Arcane Heritage at Lv. 16 and MMA turns into AA, then if I take off or lose the robe I lose AA and don't regain MMA. Talk about rough!

Crossblooded Sorcerer already gets poo'd on enough with the -2 Will save and knowing one less spell at each level. It doesn't seem gamebreaking for them to get something nicer than minor versatility and a second arcana.

Unless someone would like to direct a dev towards this topic to tell us otherwise, my group will be playing it as written. Thanks, again.

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