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Just Making my Character, What concepts / builds, if any, should I avoid?


Rise of the Runelords


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

Not looking for spoilers, but remembering how frustrated the rogue builds could be in Age of Worms, are there any builds I should avoid?


What type of character are you interested in? What concepts tickle your fancy?


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

I'll make what I think the group needs, but I'm just curious if there are any landmines.

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

It's all about group synergy. Any one class isn't bad, it's the combination of classes that really makes a difference.

What are the other players playing?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber
kmdietri wrote:
Not looking for spoilers, but remembering how frustrated the rogue builds could be in Age of Worms, are there any builds I should avoid?

I don't really see anything that should be avoided, per se... but some serious reccomendations would be the Human Oath of Vengeance Paladin, Dawrven anti-Giant Skirmisher Ranger, Halfling Archeaologist Bard and just about any kind of Wizard (though we don't have one and we're looking just fine). In fact those four would make an excellent four-man party.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If you intend to play a character from 1st to 17th-ish level, make something you think will be cool. Don't worry so much about party roles and the like. Just try to have fun.

-Skeld


aye.. find a concept that atleast can be cool to roleplay.. may not be super powerfull, but can be damn fun.
avoid nothing and see what happens! :D

i'm about to put up a small thread showing my fun little band of misfits that i plan to destroy at some point (mohaha!)

Sczarni

I doubt there are landmines, but you can expect wide area of enemies. Having at least one arcane caster is helpful, but I wouldn't call it 100% needed.

I usually encourage players to play what they wish to play, within the limits of reason of course.

Cheliax

Wiggz wrote:
I don't really see anything that should be avoided, per se... but some serious reccomendations would be the Human Oath of Vengeance Paladin, Dawrven anti-Giant Skirmisher Ranger, Halfling Archeaologist Bard and just about any kind of Wizard (though we don't have one and we're looking just fine). In fact those four would make an excellent four-man party.

That's pretty much the carbon copied list of Iconics from CotCT with a bit of archetype skins.


Avoid having a low Will save.


Paladins are handy in this AP as is anyone with charm and knowledge checks

Andoran

Icyshadow wrote:
Avoid having a low Will save.

Always a good idea. RoTRL is a pretty well balanced AP, you can play pretty much anything.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber
baron arem heshvaun wrote:
Wiggz wrote:
I don't really see anything that should be avoided, per se... but some serious reccomendations would be the Human Oath of Vengeance Paladin, Dawrven anti-Giant Skirmisher Ranger, Halfling Archeaologist Bard and just about any kind of Wizard (though we don't have one and we're looking just fine). In fact those four would make an excellent four-man party.
That's pretty much the carbon copied list of Iconics from CotCT with a bit of archetype skins.

We are actually seriously considering doing it with two Master Summoners and a Wild Caller Summoner. The Master Summoners would be twins, a male and female half-elf - one with a stealthy infiltrator eidolon and the other with a tinker knowledge-baded eidolon. The Summoner would be their half-brother, a half-elf, half-orc sibling that they had just journeyed to find in exile and reunite with - the summoning magic being in their blood. His eidolon would be a mount and the two would fight in tandem with lance and claw.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Read the Players Guide, and make a character that the GM approves of.

Runelords is one of those "everything goes" kind of adventures that has a little mix of everything-- dungeon, wilderness, urban settings, and a decent mix of role-playing and combat encounters.

Osirion

For RoTL go with a classic D&D archetype, nothing too fussy. It's got a really cool old-skool feel to it, and the basic core classes with no archetypes-- we're finding-- are doing really well.


though anything else could be utilized, a wizard is highly recommended, in fact, most of the wizards you encounter in the AP as written are transmuters whom have forsaken illusion and enchantment. so mimicing this combo allows you maximium benefit for looted spellbooks past book 3. and the majority of the notable loot in the 2nd half is spellbooks looted from wizards and other wizard items, in fact, a lot of the notable wizard villains will utilize items or racial abilities to overcome percieved weaknesses. as an example,

Spoiler:
Mokmuran is a stone giant with 15 wizard levels in book 4 whom due to his huge racial bonuses and vast array of transmutation spells fights like a gish.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Keshori Sadhil Saatatya wrote:
For RoTL go with a classic D&D archetype, nothing too fussy. It's got a really cool old-skool feel to it, and the basic core classes with no archetypes-- we're finding-- are doing really well.

I completely agree. My party just concluded Hook Mountain Massacre, and are now at 10th level. They're all pretty standard, old-school D&D types...

Human male cleric of Sarenrae. No archetype. Mostly optimized as a healer. Fire and Sun domains.

Human male barbarian. Invulnerable rager archetype. Carries around a small arsenal of weapons, but his signature weapon is a polearm (found as treasure during Burnt Offerings, and the player completely adopted it). He's the most optimized character (the player is a bit of a power-gamer), and totally dominates melee combat.

Human male universalist wizard. No archetype. Built as a generalist arcane type-- he can do a little bit of everything.

Half-elf male ranger/rogue. No archetypes. Optimized for being the party skill-monkey and infiltrator: has scary high Perception, Disable Device, and Stealth skills. Two-weapon combat style (twin kukris).

We had two other PCs, but the players moved out of town, so I have moved the characters into recurring NPC roles...

Human female paladin of Iomedae. No archetype. Sword-and-board melee specialiast.

Dwarf male ranger. No archetype. Crossbow combat style-- the ranged combat PC.


I think the one thing i would say to avoid would be a medium character based around mounted combat. I don't think this is the AP for that type of character.


Dexion I kinda agree but,

spoiler:
Two games ago the Paladin in the group I'm running just found Shadowmist. I just don't have the heart to tell him that mounted combat won't come up that much...I guess I'll have to make sure some does

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

Another concept that may be problematic is the "accidental" adventurer.

While the concept works well in CotCT, the events of Burnt Offerings work better with someone who wants to be an adventurer/hero.


Matthew Bellizzi wrote:

Dexion I kinda agree but,

** spoiler omitted **

Fortunately for your paladin:

Spoiler:
Most of the dungeons are pretty big once you get past the first dungeon of Hook Mountain Massacre (the Graul homestead isn't very mount-friendly, but most of what happens beyond that particular dungeon is fine) and some of the final dungeons are downright massive. The biggest problems for mounts are dungeons that are compact and largely vertical like Habe's Sanatorium, the Foxglove Manor, and the Shadow Clock. The only places I could see as being potentially problematic late in the AP are the Festering Maze of Sloth (windy, narrow hallways, many halls are flooded), The Vekker's Cabin (compact and vertical), and the Lair of the Hidden Beast (narrow entrance tunnels).


Lol I think that covers enough to make it annoying for someone. As long as the character isn't 100% focused on mounted combat it wouldnt be too bad, but if they are I think they would get fustraited.

Other then that, I have found Rotrl to be a great AP for a balanced party. My group has a Witch, Alchemist, Cleric, Paladin, Monk and Sorcerer. Little caster heavy (they did not like playing with the Kreegs), but they just started book 4.

Edit: Oh yea, and +1 on the Will Save advise, our Alchemist has something like a +4 will save at level 10. It has become something of a joke (a dangerous one).


Dexion1619 wrote:

Lol I think that covers enough to make it annoying for someone. As long as the character isn't 100% focused on mounted combat it wouldnt be too bad, but if they are I think they would get fustraited.

Other then that, I have found Rotrl to be a great AP for a balanced party. My group has a Witch, Alchemist, Cleric, Paladin, Monk and Sorcerer. Little caster heavy (they did not like playing with the Kreegs), but they just started book 4.

Edit: Oh yea, and +1 on the Will Save advise, our Alchemist has something like a +4 will save at level 10. It has become something of a joke (a dangerous one).

True, but every class eventually faces situations where they're faced with seemingly-impossible situations (casters face the occasional magic-immune enemy or area of antimagic, fighters face the occasional long-range enemy or incorporeal thing that their weapons can't hit, everybody who can't channel positive energy faces massive headaches with otherwise essentially-unbreakable haunts, etc.), but there's always a way around things I think part of being a player is learning to accept the fact that regardless of what you play, an adventure isn't always going to cater to you, and learning how to make the best of that is part of the fun of the game. (At least for me anyways. Opinions may vary, and that's fine.)

(A tip: Avoid ever being 100% focused on anything. It inevitably leads to an encounter or two in which you find yourself countered, and then you face the frustration of being 100% useless rather than the frustration of being merely less useful than normal, which is what you get when your focus fails you, but you have backup plans.)


Reminds me of my first time running this... one of my players insisted, despite my warnings, on playing a cavalier. He somewhat belligerently demanded I allow for his horse

horse:
...to crawl on its belly through the hedge maze in front of Thistletop. I was tired of arguing, so I allowed it... and felt only a tiny glimmer of pity when he charged his mount across the trapped bridge, sending his mount into the surf below. His character got the party killed soon after by falling asleep on guard duty.


did the horse roll an escape artist check to squeeze through? if it were human, i doubt the large mount could truly do that without extreme difficulty. DC 25 Escape Artist would be reasonable.

also remember that the mount has a -4 racial penalty to stealth due to it's size, a massive weight (12 times that of a medium creature), the rider and their gear adds further additional weight, and horses don't have a lot of skill points. the bridge would also have to be a lot wider.

i feel no sympathy for the horse, nor it's dumb cavalier master.


Keshori Sadhil Saatatya wrote:
For RoTL go with a classic D&D archetype

Pretty much this.

Rise of the Runelords seems to be written to hit all of the staples of old-school D&D adventuring, particularly the "Against the Giants" modules (well before my time). It has goblins, wizards, giants and everything in between, a good deal of ruins (that suit an archaeologist or scholar type quite well, especially a wizard).

I say stick to the core-classes and play a "classic adventurer" of some description. My advice with adventure path characters is to steer away from lengthy backstories, and to let the plot happen to you rather than the other way around. A simple motivation: greed, fame, protecting your loved ones, or a passion for history can be all you need.

I wouldn't shy away from reading summaries of the AP just to know what to expect, and also talk with your GM about a character that ties in well with the path. If you're looking for ideas, a Dwarven giant-hunter, a retired ranger, a Thassilonian wizard/historian, a greedy thief, a gypsy priestess of Desna (the goddess who gets the most facetime in the path, even if it is very little)... just keep it simple!

As for character builds, decent damage (power attack for a meleer, ferinstance), good defenses (Toughness and Iron Will are your friends, or the fantastic Steel Soul if you're a dwarf) and a spellbook (for scribing the numerous scrolls that are about) are your friends, as is (in my opinion, ymmv) Turn Undead. There'll be plenty of traps, undead, magic and melee encounters, so every class should have its day.

I'll stop myself before I give anything away, but this is my two-cents for Runelords characters. Enjoy your game!


you are going to want at least a wizard. any specialty works, but a transmuter whom chooses illusion and enchantment as his opposition schools will be able to use the majority of the looted spellbooks.


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An Acrobat archetype rogue would be really fun, throw in neat feats, concentrate on throwing knives and things like cartwheel dodge and close quarters thrower, if you afford them feats like nimble and agile moves. Running around on rocks/rubble or across tables hucking knives for sneak attack and still being able to do all the out of combat roguey stuff sounds like good fun...


Pendagast wrote:
Running around on rocks/rubble or across tables hucking knives for sneak attack.

That's another thing! There is a tonne of cramped quarters, difficult terrain and interesting battle maps throughout the adventure, so an acrobat wouldnt go amiss. I'm used to maps a lot more open and less cluttered, with none of the cramped quarters you see in Burnt Offerings.

Assistant Software Developer

I added a spoiler tag.


wait, how can you fall asleep on guard duty? do you make them roll fortitude saves? Or did he deliberately choose to goto asleep?


He deliberately chose to go to sleep. He figured no enemies would be checking a lower level storage room in the depths of their lair, when the party had gotten in without raising the alarm.

And no, I didn't make the horse roll to squeeze. If I was going to force the issue, I just wouldn't have let the horse in at all, because it was ridiculous.


So now I am confused, what benefit did his character gain, by making this choice... I mean I get it in real life, I want to go to sleep. But In game there is no draw back to "I take my turn at guard", so why fight that? Just to be a contrarian?

Edit: I just had a hilarious vision, of going down to your cellar or store room, and suddenly finding it full or squatters.... "Martha! get the bat!!!"


Pendagast wrote:
Just to be a contrarian?

I think you hit the nail on the head, here. He was playing a petulant noble and I think the player was very much playing up that aspect in response to losing his horse.

Ironically, he's one of the players in my current group and is doing much better. Apparently there were other life circumstances going on.


so it was a combo of "stuff at home" and he was playing a character that was a deliberate pie hole?

Hmpf, I guess that explains it.

you made my day with the image of suddenly finding a bunch of people sleeping in your basement and beating them silly tho....


Did you make them all re-roll and write it off as a TPK? I would have. I have yet to encounter an instance of one player being so dumb as to cause a TPK like that. Just wow.


Actually, that's when our group ADD kicked in and we played something else. I think it was Scion. I didn't restart RotRL until well over a year later, and only three of my players are the same.

Cheliax

I have played through the whole campaign, not the anniversary edition.
I was a druid. IT WAS AWESOME.

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