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Disney Buys Star Wars


Movies

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4 people marked this as a favorite.
QXL99 wrote:
I never understood the hate for the man who created the film everyone is convinced could never be improved upon...

It's not so much hate. It's more a realization that George Lucas is the kind of man who get a lot of good ideas. Along with a lot of stupid ideas. And he no longer has anyone to go "No! Bad George!"

He really needs someone like that.

Andoran

3 people marked this as a favorite.
PsychoticWarrior wrote:
3 movies of steaming crap weaned me off Star Wars...

There are aspects of those three prequals that are actually pretty good. I'm still convinced you could take the three prequals and edit them down into one, possibly two, very good Star Wars movies.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Marc Radle wrote:
PsychoticWarrior wrote:
3 movies of steaming crap weaned me off Star Wars...
There are aspects of those three prequals that are actually pretty good. I'm still convinced you could take the three prequals and edit them down into one, possibly two, very good Star Wars movies.

Agreed. While I'm not fan of Episodes 1 -3 by a long shot, I did see all three of them on the big screen and there are set pieces in these movies that really REALLY are big screen set pieces and definitely lose some of the effect on home video.

The pod race in Phantom Menace. The Zam Westell vs. Obi Wan/Anakin chase on Coruscant, the Jango Fett / Obi wan ship chase, the Grand Melee in Attack of the Clones. The opening Starship fight / chase in Revenge of the Sith as well as the final fight between Obi Wan and Anakin.

There are amazing looking things in those movies but other than Ewan McGregor's performance as Obi-Wan there isnt much else to care about in regards to the characters. I'm not invested in them like I was Luke, Leia, Han and Chewie. I think that there are a lot of cringe worthy scenes in those movies and I'm not even talking about the Jar Jar Binks stuff.

I think that the Lord of Rings movies and things like The Avengers are the Star Wars of our generation. Star Wars at this point while still raking in crap loads of money is just another franchise unless these new movies are AMAZING.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ajaxis wrote:
ShinHakkaider wrote:

However, Disney now owns the Muppets, Marvel and LucasFilm. This now solidifies Disney, not APPLE as the EVIL EMPIRE.

I now bow before my GIANT MOUSE EARED OVERLORDS.

IIRC from what I read today, Jobs ('s family/estate now) got approximately 8% of Disney when it merged with Pixar.

GAH!!! AXIS. OF. CORPORATE. EVIL!!!

(is that like Temple of Elemental Evil? Instead of Zuggtomoy and Iuz it's Iger and Jobs (as a lich?))


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

One thing to remember in the comparisons to Marvel, is that for the years prior to Disney buying them they were already making good movies. What Disney did was bring their money and distribution channels, and let Marvel keep making their own movies. From the press release that's their plan here as well, with Kathleen Kennedy continuing to head Lucasarts. Supposedly George is retiring and will be a creative consultant. So the real question is, what does creative consultant mean in this context, and who's going to write the new movies? Because the quality of the 2015 movie will be determined by what Ms. Kennedy does.


On Creative Consulting, Lucas will basically do like what Stan Lee does for the Marvel movies; hangs out and makes sure certain things have "that" certain look and feel to them. Correct canonical inaccuracies, etc. Basically there to give it his blessing and keep his name involved.

Andoran RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Vador pls

Qadira

Asphere wrote:
It would be interesting to bring in the original cast. Of course they are 30 years older...

35 years older, actually, but who's counting. (Me, apparently.)

I say reboot Episodes I-III using ideas from this guy.

Shadow Lodge

Shadowborn wrote:
Asphere wrote:
It would be interesting to bring in the original cast. Of course they are 30 years older...

35 years older, actually, but who's counting. (Me, apparently.)

I say reboot Episodes I-III using ideas from this guy.

I was counting from when we last saw them in a Star Wars movie (1983).


1 person marked this as a favorite.

They will continue the Star Wars saga with Episodes 7,8, & 9. Plus they are looking at offshoot movies not involved with the main storyline. Also we have TV shows coming, several other things being designed for Disney theme park.

They have learned through trial and error on what makes good and bad Star Wars movies. As for the prequels they were fun but far from great. They learned alot from them nonetheless. I personally enjoyed Episodes I & III the best of the prequels. They will still be utilizing George Lucas' ideas and he'll have a say on some ideas. He will be like the Obi Wan Kenobi of Kathleen Kennedy who is in charge of Lucasfilm at Disney now. They have the budget, the have the power, they have the capabilities to make more great Star Wars movies. The Force is strong within the Star Wars universe once again.

It's up to the writers, sound guys, composers, director, etc...To make the next great Star Wars movie because they have the tools now more than ever. Disney will preserve and protect Star Wars like nobody else can. Lucas is old and retired now, it's his universe and he has now passed it on to the next generation of film-makers. It's the end of an era, and the beginning of a new hope for Star Wars and its dedicated fanbase.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I have so many conflicted feelings, it's hard to know exactly how I feel. But I think, ultimately, I'm hopeful and excited.

It would be really easy to mess everything up. But Disney has had a good track record recently (and I, personally, enjoyed the John Carter film), so I'm actually really excited.

Reference George Lucas...
First, while not true for everyone, he's received a lot of cruel hate and vitriol, which, really, is misdirected.

Second, as others have said, he needs people to tell him "no" sometimes, and filter and refine and expand his really great ideas (I'm actually this way... I have many great ideas, but I need assistance to refine them into something better).

Third, the guy made a large number of mistakes, mishandled the prequels pretty badly, and continued to make poor decisions reference the fans, but at the same time, he created Star Wars and Indiana Jones. To reiterate: George Lucas created Star Wars and Indiana Jones! He had a lot of help, and I'm not going to defend his poor decisions, but he's also responsible for the origin of some great things.

Personally, I'm both happy and sad that he's selling it, yet staying on as a consultant. I'm happy, because now, hopefully, people will tell him "no" like he needs. I'm sad, because it's really the end of an era thirty-plus years long, and is the literal handing-off of a dream created by a college kid long ago. I'm also happy because Lucas is going to be around, giving input and guidance. I'm also sad because it's necessary for the continued strong survival of the franchise that he created that he surrender it to another.

I'm overwhelmed, amazed, and cautiously optimistic (and looking forward to getting more excited as time goes on, as generally occurs with me).

Silver Crusade

SuperSlayer wrote:


It's up to the writers, sound guys, composers, director, etc...To make the next great Star Wars movie because they have the tools now more than ever. Disney will preserve and protect Star Wars like nobody else can. Lucas is old and retired now, it's his universe and he has now passed it on to the next generation of film-makers. It's the end of an era, and the beginning of a new hope for Star Wars and its dedicated fanbase.

I believe that if Star Wars copyrights were to expire tomorrow.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Marc Radle wrote:
PsychoticWarrior wrote:
3 movies of steaming crap weaned me off Star Wars...
There are aspects of those three prequals that are actually pretty good. I'm still convinced you could take the three prequals and edit them down into one, possibly two, very good Star Wars movies.

Sure there is! As they are now the prequels are trainwrecks but I fully believe there is the core of a great set of movies there. I once saw something called The Phantom Edit where someone had re-editted the Phantom Menace (not adding anything mind you just taking out certain scenes and de-emphazing certain characters) and it was pretty enjoyable.

Lucas doesn't really like editors though and there are even scenes in the making of where he talks about firing editors who wouldn't edit the movie exactly like he wanted. It all comes down to no one being able to say 'no' to Lucas without losing their jobs.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I've long been a big Star Wars fan and look forward to what results from this development.

I worry the Ep VII-Ep IX movies, because what I've read indicates it will be about the "heroes of Yavin", will vastly contradict the numerous EU novels and comics set in the years following Return of the Jedi. I hope they can find a way to work it into the existing timeline.

I do hope they continue to work on a live action TV series set in the Dark Times between Episode III and IV. I think this timeframe has a lot of possibility. I hope it's pretty gritty, something in the style of a 10pm ABC show like 666 Park Avenue but probably not as dark as Walking Dead or American Horror Story.

I also think that a number of the novels and comic series would make great animated features in the style/quality of the Clone Wars animated series. The Thrawn Trilogy, Dark Empire, Shadows of the Empire and Crimson Empire (lots of Empire there) all come to mind.

L

Qadira

6 people marked this as a favorite.

I have to say, I saw one of the funniest comments on Facebook concerning this.

To paraphrase: If fans had known that it would take $4 billion to get Star Wars out of Lucas' hands, someone would have put together a Kickstarter a while ago.


I'm torn on the EU.

Thrawn was fantastic and part of me would like to see him stay "canon".

Dark Empire was a lot of fun.

The Jedi Academy series was decent and provided a nice look at how new Jedi were trained.

The Yuuzhan Vong were a waste of time. Horrible. I read half a dozen of the books, but they no longer felt like Star Wars, so I eventually abandoned them altogether.

All told, I'd prefer they wipe the EU slate clean rather than try to incorporate the Vong into 6, 7 and 8. Plus, wiping the slate would give a whole new generation of writers the opportunity to put their own spin on the expanded universe...

Shadow Lodge

tocath wrote:
The Yuuzhan Vong were a waste of time. Horrible. I read half a dozen of the books, but they no longer felt like Star Wars, so I eventually abandoned them altogether.

Were those the things that were "immune to the Force"? I've never read about them but heard snippets of something like that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Interesting...

This claims Episode VII will be an "original story" and not the Thrawn books.


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Thrawn would be hard to do, since much of it revolved around the 3 main characters and kind of needs to take place soon after the series. You'd have to recast Luke, Han and Leia. I'm not sure how that would go over.

You also don't want to do too much that relies on any more continuity than can be summed up in a short intro.

They're not going to be bound by everything in the Extended Universe as canon. The closest they'd come would be to retell some of the main plots with all sorts of changes.

I think I'd rather they started fresh.

Does anyone actually know what Lucas's original idea for the 3rd trilogy was? I've heard rumors of it since the early 80s, but never any actual information.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
thejeff wrote:

Thrawn would be hard to do, since much of it revolved around the 3 main characters and kind of needs to take place soon after the series. You'd have to recast Luke, Han and Leia. I'm not sure how that would go over.

You also don't want to do too much that relies on any more continuity than can be summed up in a short intro.

They're not going to be bound by everything in the Extended Universe as canon. The closest they'd come would be to retell some of the main plots with all sorts of changes.

I think I'd rather they started fresh.

Does anyone actually know what Lucas's original idea for the 3rd trilogy was? I've heard rumors of it since the early 80s, but never any actual information.

Mosst evidence suggests Lucas didn't even know.

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
PsychoticWarrior wrote:
Marc Radle wrote:
PsychoticWarrior wrote:
3 movies of steaming crap weaned me off Star Wars...
There are aspects of those three prequals that are actually pretty good. I'm still convinced you could take the three prequals and edit them down into one, possibly two, very good Star Wars movies.

Sure there is! As they are now the prequels are trainwrecks but I fully believe there is the core of a great set of movies there. I once saw something called The Phantom Edit where someone had re-editted the Phantom Menace (not adding anything mind you just taking out certain scenes and de-emphazing certain characters) and it was pretty enjoyable.

Lucas doesn't really like editors though and there are even scenes in the making of where he talks about firing editors who wouldn't edit the movie exactly like he wanted. It all comes down to no one being able to say 'no' to Lucas without losing their jobs.

For your viewing pleasure: The Phantom Edit


QXL99 wrote:
I never understood the hate for the man who created the film everyone is convinced could never be improved upon...

Because he was given too much credit for making it. He wasn't really responsible for a lot of the awesome stuff originally, though he came up with the concept and was a genius with special effects on a budget.

He got a huge head that he was responsible for everything good about the movies and so everything it he recent ones was his idea of the perfect movie and frankly it sucked.

A lot of the really cool stuff, conceptually, he stole as well. That's fine, you steal a lot in good art. But he started to act like he was the source and that his well of ideas was limitless.


Of course the next trilogy will be original idea's spawned from Lucas himself. Lucas is retired tho and he will not actually be working on the new movies, that's why he passed the company on before he dies of old age. They did say they will do offshoot movies possible based off some of the novels already in existance. Lucas did get 4.5 Billion dollars for selling his company but he's already stated he is donating most of it to Education. Plus if you think the prequels are trainwrecks, than you have never seen a trainwreck movie. Those statements are premature and underdeveloped. The Lucas hate bandwagon continues and I hope this major move Lucas made will scare off the rest of the flies buzzing in fans ears.


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They weren't train wrecks. They were bland and boring, relying on overworked visuals to be stunning.

I used to have some lithographs of concept art from Episode 1. They were pretty.

Several actors in those movies have done good work in other movies, but they feel stiff and wooden under Lucas' direction.

There was also a lot of high expectations. Episodes 4-6 have a place in people's hearts and have been shaped by nostalgia. Phantom Menace didn't live up to that hype so it got panned pretty hard. It's not the worst movie ever, it was on the bad side of mediocre.

Silver Crusade

I didn't think so.

The Phantom Menace was great. Just that too many people were expecting an Oscar winning movie.

I'd love to have a Star Wars movie get best picture someday, but too many in the Academy will never accept a movie designed by a philosophy that says "that movies are supposed to transport us to magical places," as best picture.

So, note to everyone, even if Star Wars 7 wins a golden globe for best picture, the Hollywood Elite will not pick it for an Oscar.

Qadira

2 people marked this as a favorite.
GM Elton wrote:

I didn't think so.

The Phantom Menace was great. Just that too many people were expecting an Oscar winning movie.

I'd love to have a Star Wars movie get best picture someday, but too many in the Academy will never accept a movie designed by a philosophy that says "that movies are supposed to transport us to magical places," as best picture.

So, note to everyone, even if Star Wars 7 wins a golden globe for best picture, the Hollywood Elite will not pick it for an Oscar.

Wrong. I wasn't expecting an Oscar-award winning movie. I was expecting a good Star Wars movie. I didn't get it. Numerous reasons why...

  • Jar-Jar Binks
  • Ridiculous racial stereotypes
  • Anakin built C-3P0...what?
  • midichlorians
  • Terrible dialogue
  • No main character
  • Best Sith ever dies in this movie
  • Amidala's monotone
  • Anakin accidentally blowing up the Trade Federation mothership

There's lots more. This was a bad movie.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
GM Elton wrote:


So, note to everyone, even if Star Wars 7 wins a golden globe for best picture, the Hollywood Elite will not pick it for an Oscar.

Return of the King won best picture. Gladiator won best picture. Braveheart won best picture.

If it's any good, and there's nothing else better that year, they'll pick it.


Hell; Avatar was up against Hurt Locker.

Hurt Locker was just a damn good film.

Silver Crusade

I am really positive about the sale and looking forward to the release of the new film(s). The Yuuzhon Vong could be a cool storyline to explore, though the later novels in the series were kind of hard to read. Any change is a good change... right? Right?! :)

Shadow Lodge

This pretty much sums up my feelings about the Phantom Menace.

Link


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Irontruth wrote:
It's not the worst movie ever, it was on the bad side of mediocre.

I agree but I still really dislike TPM. Not because of hype. Not because of any to the nitpicky fanboy stuff. Not because of Jar Jar Binks. I actually really like the central conceit of the plot. The movie was essentially over when Palpatine got the senate to call the No Confidence Vote on Chancellor Vellorum (?). Palpatine had already WON at that point.

No I really dislike the film because the pacing was really, really off and aside for a few decent action set pieces (The Pod Race and the final duel between Maul/Obi wan/ Qui-Gonn) it was as boring as hell. Exposition was given in the most straight forward and clumsy way possible, there was no reason to be emotionally invested in ANY of the characters outside of their perceived relevance to the future of the series. And that for me was it's real central fault, I wanted to be entertained and excited. Instead I was bored.

Liked the plot though.

Shadow Lodge

The plot was full of huge gaping holes though. They were so huge in fact that it didn't make any sense without massive revision.


George Lucas is donating most of his fortune from the $4.5 billion dollar sale to Education charity. Here is George's speech...

"Storytellers are teachers and communicators who speak a universal language. That was Homer’s primary role, and both Plato and Aristotle used narratives and dialogues as a means of educating. Good storytelling is based on truths and insights, and a good storyteller is ultimately a teacher – using the arts as a means of making education emotionally meaningful. These are all tools at our educational system’s disposal, but too often we aren’t making use of them.

When I was in high school, I felt like I was in a vacuum, biding time. I was curious, but bored. It was not an atmosphere conducive to learning. I was fortunate that I found my path and my language.

It’s scary to think of our education system as little better than an assembly line with producing diplomas as its only goal. Once I had the means to effect change in this arena, it became my passion to do so – to promote active, life-long learning. I believe in the artisan school of learning, through apprenticeships and Aristotelian questions and discussion. This level of engagement dates back to the beginning of human life, but it’s still the best way of doing things. There have to be universal standards – particularly in education – and while it seems unwieldy, there is a willingness among educators to share their best practices.

Ultimately, that is why I created Edutopia and the George Lucas Educational Foundation.

The focus of GLEF has been to share educational innovations – cooperative and project learning, mentorship, parental involvement, and technological advances. This all comes straight from those on the front lines, from teachers who are putting these methods into practice. We are the facilitators. Our goal has been to showcase bold successes and inspire others to further increase the appetite for education. Our hope is that administrators, teachers, and parents will see the power of these collective efforts and join the fight for wider reforms.

But reform is just the beginning. We need to build new foundations, fostering independent thought and a desire to keep learning. Our students need to come away with more than just survival skills, and more than just what is required to complete the program. We need to promote critical thinking and emotional intelligence. We need to focus on building an education system that promotes different types of learning, different types of development, and different types of assessment. We have an opportunity and an obligation to prepare our children for the real world, for dealing with others in practical, project-based environments. It’s about working together and building character – being compassionate, empathetic, and civil as a means to a greater end.

As technology changes, so do students. So should classrooms, and so should our methods of teaching. In a few short years, connectivity has gone from a technological novelty to a daily necessity. It’s how our culture communicates, and our children are at the forefront of its use. Understanding those tools – and how to integrate them into learning – is an integral step in defining our future.

My pledge is to the process; as long as I have the resources at my disposal, I will seek to raise the bar for future generations of students of all ages.

I am dedicating the majority of my wealth to improving education. It is the key to the survival of the human race. We have to plan for our collective future – and the first step begins with the social, emotional, and intellectual tools we provide to our children. As humans, our greatest tool for survival is our ability to think and to adapt – as educators, storytellers, and communicators our responsibility is to continue to do so."

-George Lucas


anything related to disney ultimately becomes g and pg rated and for video games msut be family friendly and thuse

rated e for everybody


Asphere wrote:

This pretty much sums up my feelings about the Phantom Menace.

Link

That was awesome. I immediately watched the whole thing and am 1/2 way through attack of the clones now. It could have left out the gross misogyny, but otherwise was awesome.


If I remember correctly, they had a vague plotline where I-III would be the rise of the Evil Empire, IV-VI would be the struggle against Darth Vader, and VII-IX would be the struggle against the emperor. Then they sat down and looked at it, and found that IV would be the best starting point. Once VI came into focus, Lucas was still uncertain there would be any more movies, so he scrapped the three final movies and killed off the emperor in VI.

I am sure there is better information to be found.

Shadow Lodge

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Steelfiredragon wrote:

anything related to disney ultimately becomes g and pg rated and for video games msut be family friendly and thuse

rated e for everybody

The Avengers was PG-13.

I personally have no problem with more movies being rated G/PG though. Doesn't make them bad movies, and having a higher rating doesn't make them good movies.

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Spanky the Leprechaun wrote:
GM Elton wrote:


So, note to everyone, even if Star Wars 7 wins a golden globe for best picture, the Hollywood Elite will not pick it for an Oscar.

Return of the King won best picture. Gladiator won best picture. Braveheart won best picture.

If it's any good, and there's nothing else better that year, they'll pick it.

The Return of the King oscar should have went to the Fellowship of the Ring.

Silver Crusade

Orthos wrote:
Steelfiredragon wrote:

anything related to disney ultimately becomes g and pg rated and for video games msut be family friendly and thuse

rated e for everybody

The Avengers was PG-13.

I personally have no problem with more movies being rated G/PG though. Doesn't make them bad movies, and having a higher rating doesn't make them good movies.

Actually, PG-13 is the worst rating a movie can receive. with an R-rated movie, you can go into stories that teach that Sin has consequences. G is really, really close to PG-13 in the fact that you tend to white wash the story and suddenly you're telling a lie. PG-13 is a movie where you can go see sin whitewashed. Woman in Red -- the story of a man committing Adultery with a model -- is the second PG-13 movie. Pretty Woman, the converse, is the story of a man redeeming a hooker; is rated R.

I think it's time to ditch the rating process and just make good films. It's pretty much outlived it's usefulness, and the informed movie goer and use reviews to pick and choose their movies. The MPAA rating system should not exist because it can be used and abused. Hollywood has been manipulating us with the Rating System since Temple of Doom made its debut.

It used to be you can trust A PG-rated movie to be a safe movie about the struggle of Light vs. Darkness. Now most of these are PG-13. So, it's time to ditch these altogether. The rating system is about manipulation and it should be ditched and buried because really we can pick and choose our movies and vote with our dollars which movies should be made.

The MPAA rating system has been crap since 1990.


Excuse me, but I once saw a documentary about an Australian Star Wars fan club and what happened to it when The Phantom Menace came out, but I can't remember it's name.

Does anybody know?

Silver Crusade

Shadowborn wrote:
GM Elton wrote:

I didn't think so.

The Phantom Menace was great. Just that too many people were expecting an Oscar winning movie.

I'd love to have a Star Wars movie get best picture someday, but too many in the Academy will never accept a movie designed by a philosophy that says "that movies are supposed to transport us to magical places," as best picture.

So, note to everyone, even if Star Wars 7 wins a golden globe for best picture, the Hollywood Elite will not pick it for an Oscar.

Wrong. I wasn't expecting an Oscar-award winning movie. I was expecting a good Star Wars movie. I didn't get it. Numerous reasons why...

  • Jar-Jar Binks
  • Ridiculous racial stereotypes
  • Anakin built C-3P0...what?
  • midichlorians
  • Terrible dialogue
  • No main character
  • Best Sith ever dies in this movie
  • Amidala's monotone
  • Anakin accidentally blowing up the Trade Federation mothership

There's lots more. This was a bad movie.

Actually:

  • Qui-Gon Jin was the Main Character of the movie. Watch the movie again, and see how everyone -- including Sidious, reacts to him. Everything Sidious did was in reaction to Qui-Gon Jin. As a politician, however, he reacted in a way that was to his advantage. Qui-Gon was the one that made all the choices and decisions in the movie.
  • On racial stereotyping: given where the movie was produced and the state of our awareness, you can't really escape it this charge. George did his best to make the Neimoidians seem alien and he succeeded. I'm so surprised that people would think that the movie was bad because of this. Given the movie's setting your supposed to suspend your disbelief.
  • Midichlorians -- this claim means your ignorant about Biology. if you read the Science of Star Wars, there is a scientific basis for this. The writer tied it to Mitochrondria in our cells. However, if you want a better explanation, you can look up Dr. Reich's work on Youtube.
  • Sidious is the best Sith ever, not Darth Maul. Look at what Sidious did.
  • Amidala's monotone was because of bad directing. GL should have not directed the movie, and he should have asked Josh Whedon to do it.
  • When are you going to accept there are no accidents?
  • Terrible Dialogue -- well, you can always rewrite the script.
  • C-3PO -- this was because George needed the movies to come full circle. It may have seemed contrived, but this is because he started with IV instead of I.

And the last, Jar-Jar Binks. Take away Jar Jar Binks, and the movie would have been worse. Take a good look at Jar-Jar. Look at how he reacts at every situation. Jar-Jar acts a little over the top, showing emotion at every turn. This is because he's an emotional character. He's supposed to counter balance Obi-Wan's logic. If you take away Jar-Jar Binks, the movie falls apart.

However, the central problem with Star Wars TPM was that there were too many characters. You just need 8 characters for the story to work. Goerge Lucas central failing was that he split the Protagonist's role up among three characters: Qui-Gon Jinn, Padme Amidala, and Anakin Skywalker for example. Sidious was the Antagonist, but his Antagonism was filtered through the Trade Federation and Darth Maul.

Each of the Throughlines were okay. The Main Character was Qui-Gon Jinn. The Impact character was Obi-Wan Kenobi. The M/I through line was wonderfully written. The central conflict between Master Jinn and Padawan Kenobi was over Anakin Skywalker, and Qui-Gon managed to change Kenobi to his point of view.

The Overall throughline was the focus, because if you watch the movie it excels at giving you the story about the Milieu. I tell my brother that TPM is one of my favorites because of this fact, I allowed the movie to draw me into that Galaxy, far far away. The Overall Throughline was excellent.

However, the story changed midway from a Time-Lock to an Option-Lock. At first, it's a rush to see Amidala. Then during the later half of the movie, everyone ran out of options. Our minds can't solve the problem if the movie wasn't consistent.

So your excuses on how the movie was bad, means that you couldn't really pin on what was wrong with the movie. What was wrong with the movie is that George just put too many characters in the movie, the timing was off, and the central argument wasn't fully resolved.

The main character had a bad end; yet we are supposed to feel good about two peoples coming together. Is it a tragedy? George should have focused on the tragedy of Qui-Gonn Jinn dying to resolve the argument -- he should have cut out the celebration at the end. He tried to downplay it.

The problem with TPM is not because of what you listed above, but because George was too heavy handed with the story. He didn't allow it to flow as it should have had. He's still a good storyteller, he just artificially controlled it. TPM should have been split into two full movies, like RTS should have been.

Shadow Lodge

GM Elton wrote:

I think it's time to ditch the rating process and just make good films. It's pretty much outlived it's usefulness, and the informed movie goer and use reviews to pick and choose their movies. The MPAA rating system should not exist because it can be used and abused. Hollywood has been manipulating us with the Rating System since Temple of Doom made its debut.

It used to be you can trust A PG-rated movie to be a safe movie about the struggle of Light vs. Darkness. Now most of these are PG-13. So, it's time to ditch these altogether. The rating system is about manipulation and it should be ditched and buried because really we can pick and choose our movies and vote with our dollars which movies should be made.

The MPAA rating system has been crap since 1990.

I can get behind this.


tocath wrote:

Interesting...

This claims Episode VII will be an "original story" and not the Thrawn books.

I'm fine with that. Really, I'd be good with the entire EU being ignored/wiped clean.

The Thrawn books were... decent. But otherwise, not much good has come from the EU, AFAIC.

Silver Crusade

A new thought:

If the story got you to realize that Sidious sacrificed others to attain his goal, but Qui-Gon sacrificed his life to defend the people he loved from a threat; it would have been a better ending.

Silver Crusade

Arnwyn wrote:
tocath wrote:

Interesting...

This claims Episode VII will be an "original story" and not the Thrawn books.

I'm fine with that. Really, I'd be good with the entire EU being ignored/wiped clean.

The Thrawn books were... decent. But otherwise, not much good has come from the EU, AFAIC.

The Jedi Archives timeline for the new MMO was excellent!


I remember being very impressed by Amidala's speech before the senate. She sounded completely different from normal, in a way that conveyed authority but also anger and grief. Monotone? Perhaps. Even so.

He did not make the neimoidians alien, though. They come across as an unattractive stereotype of japanese.

The phantom menace is a tragedy in its entirety. Qui-gon dies because of Darth Maul, that's one thing, but when Palpatine becomes chancellor, it's because Amidala's actions, and when Obi-wan decides to train Anakin, it's because Qui-gon asked him to. And the entire Jedi council specifically told him not to. There are warnings upon warnings upon warnings, yet the setup is hard to see ending anywhere else. The heroes see only the small picture, and most determinedly miss what is happening large-scale. Also, we see the seeds of Anakin's obsession with Amidala. I like the Phantom Menace, excepting the stuff thrown in to entertain the kids, specifically Jar jar zapping droids with his foot tangled in a droid arm, and Anakin accidentally shooting the mothership.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

It's Disney, so expect...

Film 7 - The Jar Jar Binks True Story
Film 8 - Another Ewok Adventure
Film 9 - Muppets Invade Tatooine 2

On a serious note, I'm actually pleased that Star Wars has been picked up.

I just hope that Disney stay true to the family film nature of these films and don't go too dark, gothic or 18R rated - because I don't want to wait another 10 years for my kids to be old enough to see them with me.

Silver Crusade

Slaunyeh wrote:
QXL99 wrote:
I never understood the hate for the man who created the film everyone is convinced could never be improved upon...

It's not so much hate. It's more a realization that George Lucas is the kind of man who get a lot of good ideas. Along with a lot of stupid ideas. And he no longer has anyone to go "No! Bad George!"

He really needs someone like that.

That someone divorced him because he couldn't give her the life she wanted. Marcia couldn't stay content to be with him, she wanted a glamourous lifestyle and he got himself too busy to even provide her with it. She divorced him, and the divorce almost destroyed him. Now his ego is monumental in order to compensate for the success of Star Wars. George cannot handle fame at all.

Read the Secret History of Star Wars.

Shadow Lodge

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I think saying that Qui-Gon was the main character is a leap. If that was the intention it wasn't clearly defined in the movie at all.

Obi-Wan should have been the main character. He should have been the one to find Anakin. He should have been the one that went against the wishes of the council and Qui-Gon in order to train him. We should have been able to see and relate to the relationship between Obi-Wan and his his master so that when Qui-Gon dies it had a bigger impact on us.

Watch the review I linked above. It lays it out fairly well.

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