Goblin Squad Member
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Ability Damage!
Wait, PF already has that.
Ability damage is something I can't even fathom working... well except possibly on assasination (after all slowing down training is a good worse than death penalty). I mean you can drain the ones that function as saves/resistances... but considering a high str character isn't going to hit harder than a low str character with the same badges etc... essentially ability damage if sanely curable within an hour of getting it or on death, will do nothing, if not... it is too harsh a penalty for normal death, and really just a logically grieving ability (again I see it as fine for assassinations, assuming that GW is serious about requiring serious cost, setup etc... for assassinations to work of course. For a regular battle, touch of idiocy, ray of enfeblement etc... aren't logical skills as they would have no impact on the current battle, but great impact on the characters longterm development if they can't simply be cured after the fight (and if they can... well then that's an unnoticable penalty as it will be removed 5 seconds after the battle when they head back to their own town, adding an extra 5-10 mins to their offline training time... isn't particularly notable.
Of course there could be sane debuffs in place, say ray of enfeeblement is a debuff that reduces attack damage/hit rate etc... curable by the same spells the P&P equivalent is, makes perfect sense. To that I agree with you 100%
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Yeah, I would make ability damage penalize the appropriate stats rather then training time (which I truthfully forgot about).
Though I still want to know what the point of that is. Why do high strength characters not hit harder? Why can't they carry more?
Doesn't make sense to me, and makes many currently desirable magic items and spells worthless unless permanant (in which case might not be allowed at all)
Spells like Bull's Strength, in order for them to work, now requires bonuses to many stats and that will require a lot more programming then if they just use strength like normal. I.E. +4 to strength and the other stats update using existing code vs. + 2 atk, +2 dmg, +2 carry cap, +2swim, +2 climb, +2 to break down doors, +2 to break crates, etc.
Using the stats as in PnP would save programming time and complexity, make sense, act according to our existing expectations, and doesn't preclude affecting training time (which might not include temporary/enchantment bonuses).
Time to go through and reread some blogs I guess. See if I can't figure it out.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I don't want to see it have any effect on movement however, to jarring even on semi-turned based games, instead adjust the speed of players so they can move only that distance in 6 seconds (difficult terrain can slow down anyone passing through and such).
Hitomi--I think the idea wouldn't be that the stamina pool affects movement, but rather that movement would affect stamina. So your move rate is whatever it is, but then maybe along 3.5 rules, you can take a 5 foot step (i.e. maneuver around an opponent) without affecting the actions you can take, but if you make a full move, you eat into your actions, and if you make a double move you can take no actions.
So something like:
5' (or whatever) step=0 cost
Normal move (function of race, archetype and encumbrance?)=1/2 Stam. pool
Double move = Stam. pool
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Goblin Squad Member
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The blogs have the answer, but most people either ignore it or missed it, because there was a bunch of discussion on the topic. Blogs around 3-6 are probably the best to read, and contain the most information that is constantly repeated on these boards.
Short version:
Stop thinking of PFO in terms of Pathfinder mechanics. Attributes effect how well you train skills attached to them. If you have high strength you are not stronger, you are able to get stronger faster. Someone with a lower strength can become as strong as you, but they must work at it longer.
The only way I can see PFO working well is if they divorce the mechanics of the RPG and make their own systems. One game is turn based strategy, the other is real time combat. The 'flavor' that is retained should be mostly the lore, setting, and the general idea behind most spells, like 'fireball' casts a fireball.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Though I still want to know what the point of that is. Why do high strength characters not hit harder? Why can't they carry more?Doesn't make sense to me, and makes many currently desirable magic items and spells worthless unless permanant (in which case might not be allowed at all)
My personal understanding of it is, the attributes in PFO represent aptitude, not the actual ability, Nature = attributes, nurture = training. This is the same reason why your attributes won't be directly raised as you use them. Think like the kid in school who sleeps in class, but gets an A on the test, that's your 18 int guy. Next to him you've got the kid with 8 int. He can get an A on the test, but he doesn't have the aptitude, he's gotta work his tail off studying 5 hours a day just to get the same results as the 18 int guy who skims the book once.
Same for str, you have guys who can lift huge weights barely spending 15 minutes at the gym. Then you have guys who spend 4 hours a day at the gym attempting to duplicate those results. In the end the guy with no natural aptitude, but tons of determination and hard work catches up to the first guy, the end outcome is more or less the same, but it took the other guy a heck of a lot longer to get there.
If you ever watched the anime naruto, Rock Lee is the example of a guy with horrible attributes (Nothing at all came natural to him, so he wound up training every waking moment of every day for years, just to become average among guys who spent 4 hours a day training).
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... If you have high strength you are not stronger, you are able to get stronger faster. Someone with a lower strength can become as strong as you, but they must work at it longer....
What you are forgeting is how strength inter relates with other stats and how strength boosting spells and effects relate to those. Now maybe they just don't have any way to boost attacks or anything and in that case strength boosting effects would be removed due to having no effect.
But if they have anything boost attack or AC or anything like that then how do strength effects (SE to avoid confusion with the two meanings of "effect" discussed here) effect them?
Three solutions, of course I talk about strength but it applies to all six,
One is to have two strength stats, one to effect your training time and one that effects strength based stats, such as attack, carry cap, strength checks, etc. (Having an unseen strength stat falls under this catagory, but then what's the point and how do you make it so the strong guy breaks down doors better then the weak guy?)
Second is to have the strength stat uninvolved with other stats which requires more programming in the fashion of having to have SEs call out every single thing that is effected.
Third is to have the stats do both, effect training time and effect other strength based stats.
Yes, it is a different game but trying to keep as much as they are means they either need to be similar enough that knowledge of the PnP generally equates, or they need to distance themselves as far as possible from the PnP rules, which staying away doesn't sound like what they are doing, particularly since they are including a form of the classes (classes is a purely ooc concept, thus is completely useless and distracting from a pure fluff standpoint, therefore they must be including more then just fluff, even if they are altering it a bit.)
Also, many staple spells effect the stats which in turn effect many other things, they need a way to include how those spells work and the easiest, most complete, and sensical way to achieve this is too have ability scores, in one form or another, otherwise a wizard is just as strong as a fighter who in turn is as smart as the scholarly know-it-all and that is just not appealing at all.
Sticking pretty close to the book is possible as DDO has done so quite well, could have been better, but was certainly well done (favorite dedicated theme-park MMO and second favorite all around MMO) and is more fun then WOW or other more standard MMOs.
If they plan on complately divorceing PnP mechanics, then they need to completely seperate from them including not having roles/archtypes/classes or making such roles completely different in name.
Going halfway is unwise and is likely to cause much confusion for anyone who tries to play both games.
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Ninjad again
Lee didn't train those things he couldn't do, he trained the things he could do, so that he didn't need to do those other things. Lee couldn't do ninjutsu and still can't do ninjutsu.
The point is how do you measure how strong one character is from another?
Saying they are the same is the easy and incomplete way out, and certainly doesn't give hope for a quality game.
Lee could always do taijutsu, he just focused on it so he could eventually do it better then those who diversified their skills.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Ninjad again
Lee didn't train those things he couldn't do, he trained the things he could do, so that he didn't need to do those other things. Lee couldn't do ninjutsu and still can't do ninjutsu.
I would still differ there, even in what he was good at, he still had to work harder to get to the same place in his "specialty", at least in the early episodes, lee trained for years in his taijitsu, then Sauske trained for a couple months to be able to duplicate his skill. Sasuke is an example of one with attributes in his favor.
He may have had limitations on what he couldn't do, but even if he trained in his "specialty" for the same amount of time as others spent split, his natural aptitude was still so far behind even in his best skill, he had to work 10x harder, just to match. I personally would say this analogy still holds.
The point is how do you measure how strong one character is from another?
Saying they are the same is the easy and incomplete way out, and certainly doesn't give hope for a quality game.
Well in the end that is always the inevitable result, every skill does eventually cap, and it will come down to gear, and player tactics etc... to distinguish one from another. Essentially there is overall a perfect swing, techniques, moves etc... are generally mastered by people doing them. Putting them together, planning the perfect combos when under pressure etc... is where the real differences lay. In general that was at least my viewpoint overall in the real world when I was in national level tae kwon do tournaments. One 3rd degree blackbelts roundhouse, isn't really distinguishable from another, how well they translate that into another kick, or read your moves, anticipate the right counter is the real varience from one competitor vs another. As well, with the exception of schools with bad promoting practices, you will find black belts that took 9 years to reach a rank, and ones that took 4-5 years to reach the same rank, with comperable amount of training/week spent, yet both are often closely matched. Some people have a knack, some don't.
I could be misreading you, but it sounds to me your biggest fear is without attributes being the defining factor everyone would be equal, but I don't think that is the case, even among capstoned fighters, odds are they will have trained several different skills on the way there, and most likely they will have picked ones that compliment their attributes (as it will take them longer to level if they don't, it only makes sense that they would base their choices around their attributes, unless the game is misbalanced enough that one is blatently better than the other).
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One, Sasuke matched Lee while lee was wearing his weights. (Of course I only saw the early episodes, don't know much about shippuden)
Two, you are misreading, just a bit though,
In PF, strength gives a bonus to hit and to damage in melee, it also determines carrry capacity and the ability to shove things around and break through stuck doors. These are the effects I am mostly refering to.
My low strength character shouldn't be able able to shove a block of stone around as easily as a high strength character, if at all. Nor should I be able to carry as much weight. These are aspects I expect in PF, but saying that ability scores have no effects like these, leads me to wonder about how these things are handled and how spells like Bulls strength come into play. If the strength score does nothing, then neither does bulls strength, which is a loved spell by certain spellcasting warriors of mine.
Edit: I think setting training time is cool, but my quick and nimble sorceress/duelist shouldn't be able to throw Gimli without buffing her strength first.
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Goblin Squad Member
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shapeshifting could be linked to a 'totem' or similar item, like a druid equivalent of holy symbol. I would like a system where shifting to a bear would require a bear totem crafted from loot a bear, etc, and where druid totems, wizard wands, priest symbols and warrior weapons become commodities on equal level (ie losing your totem hurts about the same as losing your sword).What a great opportunity for merit badges--you must defeat the animal you want to shape to in order to master that shape. Be awesome if druids could "defeat" rather than kill animal opponents.
I agree. The whole, "Go kill a bear to become one" deal doesn't fit the whole druid image very well but struggling with and overcoming a bear without killing it to gain the merit badge to become one sounds like a great way to gain bear form. I could even see it requiring the druid to have a dialogue with the bear that ends in a non-fatal test of courage against each other. Or becoming a wolf requiring you to help a pack of wolves take down something fairly powerful as a member of the pack.
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Goblin Squad Member
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One, Sasuke matched Lee while lee was wearing his weights. (Of course I only saw the early episodes, don't know much about shippuden)
Two, you are misreading, just a bit though,
In PF, strength gives a bonus to hit and to damage in melee, it also determines carrry capacity and the ability to shove things around and break through stuck doors. These are the effects I am mostly refering to.
My low strength character shouldn't be able able to shove a block of stone around as easily as a high strength character, if at all. Nor should I be able to carry as much weight. These are aspects I expect in PF, but saying that ability scores have no effects like these, leads me to wonder about how these things are handled and how spells like Bulls strength come into play. If the strength score does nothing, then neither does bulls strength, which is a loved spell by certain spellcasting warriors of mine.
Edit: I think setting training time is cool, but my quick and nimble sorceress/duelist shouldn't be able to throw Gimli without buffing her strength first.
Here's where tabletop rules and PFO have completely different definitions. In P&P, your attributes are trainable (IE you pick one every 4 levels). PFO is clearly defining stats differently. In terms of realism neither one is particularly believable.
P&P it's clearly difficult to believe, due to the rate of 1 per 4 levels, we're essentially looking at someone who switched from a desk clerk, to a warrior, to a soldier in an army, to possibly take years in the changed role without gaining an ounce of str... (as if he started on an even number you are looking at level 8 before the modifyer even changes) and even then he somehow could only gain str or dex, when he had been doing activities that clearly work out both.
anywho, I'm 80% sure that sasuke did match lee's unweighted speed, but really I don't believe we are accomplishing anything by debating characters from a fictional anime, and still use real world equivalents. It is still pretty much fact that there are clearly people who do pick up skills in half the time as others, and one who dosn't have it natural can eventually catch up to one who does, just by practicing/working much harder. The point of difference really is that IRL skills don't really have a maximum state, which is something that would be inevitable within both systems (as if they did effect ability, you's just see more fighters with 18 str that are also identical to eachother in terms of damage).
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Goblin Squad Member
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I am very excited to learn about how you plan the combat. However I am a little concerned.
It seems that limiting the action bars by only 2 full bars (20 slots total) give certain classes an unapealing feel. I refer of course to wizards and clerics (and magus if/when it ever becomes available). The advantage to having a class like this is that u can have a TON of spell options. Not just in what YOU can cast but also in scrolls/wands/staves/etc. If I am to read this correctly classes that are based on being an ability Swiss army knife are going to need to be redone to make them at least fun and comparable to the original. I do understand that certain clases have alot and there will need to be some trimming but I feel that limiting the action bar like this may not be a good way to do it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Balanced PvP requires a limit on how many abilities of each type you can have, you don't want people to be super powerful, and there needs to be a carrot dangling where one more ability would make you super powerful.
There are no rigid classes, so anyone can get anything, you can't just balance the classes, because people can pick and choose what they want out of each. The game needs to be balanced so any sensible load-out is competitive with the others.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Balance doesn't mean that each individual loadout is roughly equally as powerful in a duel. Balance means, among other things, that each possible loadout should consistently lose duels against their counter-build, and each sensible build should consistently win duels with a different sensible build, and that there are neither abilities which are required in all sensible builds nor abilities which are not included in any sensible build.
So much for duel balance- there is also the matter of groups. Again, every party should have an effective counter, and every 'sensible' party should counter a different 'sensible' party of roughly the same number and time.
For at least the first 2.5 years, taking multiple roles will come at the price of not advancing as high as possible in either; the concerns about a all-classed character can safely be deferred for at least a year, or to whenever the higher-tier abilities are going through balance testing.
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Goblin Squad Member
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It boils down to being able to balance the combinations of skills possible in builds. So more skills available at any one moment from a selection -> ballooning of combinations out of control of devs. In effect having a limit across the board at around 18-24 or whatever it is, seems like a manageable number?
For at least the first 2.5 years, taking multiple roles will come at the price of not advancing as high as possible in either; the concerns about a all-classed character can safely be deferred for at least a year, or to whenever the higher-tier abilities are going through balance testing.
It's another good thing about the skill-training attenuating out!
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It doesn't take a weaker person longer to learn Judo, the weaker person just isn't going to hit as hard until they get strength up.
Intelligence is the only true factor in learning speed, the attributes don't affect how quickly one can learn but instead limit how well they can perform. A weak individual with perfect form will never hit as hard as a strong person with good form, improving the stats used is thus generally a parrallel goal to learning such things.
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You can have a bunch of spell options, each spell book takes one slot and has 6 spells that get shown in the weapon slots. A wizard with 4 spellbooks, has 24 spells, more then the number of slots available.
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CEO, Goblinworks
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It should be noted that balancing all possible character builds is not an objective of the design team.
In fact, balancing most character builds isn't an objective of the design team.
PvP balance is only one facet of a character and doesn't really define its usefulness in the game except for those characters who are focused on PvP. It is good to have several different builds that are balanced in PvP to create interesting strategic choices and to avoid a situation where everyone has a cookie-cutter character.
We've defined 4 areas of focus for the game: Exploration, Adventure, Development and Domination. Different types of characters will be better at one of those aspects of the game than others. A character optimized for fighting aberrations, undead, fey and other sorts of "monsters" might not be very effective at fighting player characters. A solider that is optimized to fight coherently in a unit might not be very good in a 1:1 encounter. And a person who constructs buildings might not put up much of a fight at all.
There are specialized roles that aren't balanced either. Characters who can track others, or who can scout ahead without being detected, etc.
Don't get too focused on figuring out how we'll balance every type of character against every other type of character. Because we're not going to do that.
RyanD
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Goblin Squad Member
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I suspect that spells that increase ability scores in PnP PF will do something similar in PFO. For instance Bulls strength could increase the amount of damage done with melee/thrown weapons, increase encumbrance levels and improved str-based saves. Cats Grace will improve armour class, improved ranged chance to hit and increase the dex-based saves etc. While ability damage/drain will do the reverse. So these two mechanic’s will act as buffs and debuff’s respectively.
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Okay so I could rephrase that to say Intelligence, Wisdom, and maybe some other mental processes, but the point stands that learning is a mental thing and physical abilties have little impact on learning, despite having a large impact on performance. Though I guess the game is likely more intent on the ability to act on knowledge then the gaining of knowledge.
Glad to hear the rest of it!
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@ Ravening
Yes, that's the point, they either need a stat that affects the appropriate things or they have to do way to much programming. Said stat can also either be different for individuals or be the same for everyone, and I don't think my skinny halfling alchemist should should be equal in breaking down doors as a half-orc barbarian.
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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It should be noted that balancing all possible character builds is not an objective of the design team.
In fact, balancing most character builds isn't an objective of the design team.
PvP balance is only one facet of a character and doesn't really define its usefulness in the game except for those characters who are focused on PvP. It is good to have several different builds that are balanced in PvP to create interesting strategic choices and to avoid a situation where everyone has a cookie-cutter character.
We've defined 4 areas of focus for the game: Exploration, Adventure, Development and Domination. Different types of characters will be better at one of those aspects of the game than others. A character optimized for fighting aberrations, undead, fey and other sorts of "monsters" might not be very effective at fighting player characters. A solider that is optimized to fight coherently in a unit might not be very good in a 1:1 encounter. And a person who constructs buildings might not put up much of a fight at all.
There are specialized roles that aren't balanced either. Characters who can track others, or who can scout ahead without being detected, etc.
Don't get too focused on figuring out how we'll balance every type of character against every other type of character. Because we're not going to do that.
RyanD
I stand corrected- everything I have said regarding cyclical balance applies only within a very limited domain, or a much broader consideration.
Now I'm thinking of a L5R kind of situation, where the best duelist is laughed out of court for his uncouth manner, inability to play Go, and his horrible haiku. I don't think having characters compete in the quality of their poetry is a good design goal; if the subject comes up I'm sure players will end up competing in their respective artistic skills.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Don't get too focused on figuring out how we'll balance every type of character against every other type of character. Because we're not going to do that.
Very glad to hear that. I've been arguing for a while that 1:1 PvP balance between the Roles is completely unnecessary. It's quite gratifying to hear that you see it the same way.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I wouldn't want to see 1:1 balance, when I talk about balance I mean effectiveness, every build shouldn't be able to 1v1 every other build, there should be builds that are very good at taking down other players. And builds that are good at other things.
League of Legends has a group of characters that are pretty much win every 1v1 battle against characters not in that group, but they lack things like AoE damage, or sustainability. They are good solo or as cleanup, but not as good in a team fight. As long as you are never alone, they usually aren't an issue.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Okay so I could rephrase that to say Intelligence, Wisdom, and maybe some other mental processes, but the point stands that learning is a mental thing and physical abilties have little impact on learning, despite having a large impact on performance. Though I guess the game is likely more intent on the ability to act on knowledge then the gaining of knowledge.
Glad to hear the rest of it!
Actually, they do effect the rate at which you can learn. I took fencing lessons (best college credits *EVER*), but I couldn't learn as fast as others due to asthma. I was limited in how long I could put out effort, while others could carry on.
You could see that as me having a lower CON score. Some people are just plain genetically inclined towards certain things and will have an easier time of gaining skill in them.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Okay so I could rephrase that to say Intelligence, Wisdom, and maybe some other mental processes, but the point stands that learning is a mental thing and physical abilties have little impact on learning, despite having a large impact on performance...
Actually, they do effect the rate at which you can learn.
Indeed.
"Learning" is not just about understanding, it is also about training muscles/muscle memory and internalizing/automating actions. Just how much do you think a high IQ helps when learning to swim (or cartwheel, climb a rope, juggle, dance or playing drums). A little bit, sure. But being the major factor, no.On the other hand, "intelligence" is also a multifaceted word, and we have psychologists talking about social intelligence, body intelligence, emotional intelligence, musical intelligence. But then we are essentially back where we started: GW 'ability scores' could very easily be viewed as different aptitudes or 'intelligences', and then the system should make sense to you again.
FYI, a top rated young chess master (Magnus Carlsen) has said publicly that he trains long distance running in order to become a better chess player. That extra stamina makes him do less errors after 4 hours of intense thinking.
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One: There is a difference between learning and performing.
Two: Intelligence and understanding helps extremely well in learning those things, sometimes people forget that knowing what you are doing and being good at doing it are two different topics.
After awhile you don't need the teacher telling you what to do, you just need to keep doing it to improve performance, that's because you already learned it and you just need to have your performance catch up.
Also this facet is somewhat harder to distinguish when everyone is of a similar intelligence level (often because we get held back based on performance), get someone outside the norm and the difference becomes appearent.
Running is great not because it somehow affects our thinking, but because it is an excellent form of meditation. We get out there and we don't need to focus on anything, or be aware of everything, we go into a meditative state of being alone with no connection to anything, no worries, no hopes, no dreams, just a blank and calm sea of tranquility. This is as helpful to our mental state as exercise is to our physical state.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I know I'm late to the party, but I just wanted to pop on and say that I am extremely pleased to see how combat is going to be structured.
Both the blog about 'unit' combat and this blog honestly assess the realities of previous combat system theories and player's ability usage within them. The solutions PFO offers are surprising and intriguing. I wouldn't change a thing.
Combat is an important part of an MMO in this setting, but I think it will be less important in PFO than any other game in the same setting. I think that giving players the option to refrain from direct combat and focusing on supporting their societies in other ways means you have a lot of room to innovate and design something 'foreign' but also spectacular.
Keep up the good work! I am now seriously regretting that my personal situation denied me the ability to contribute to the kickstarter campaign =(
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Goblin Squad Member
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I do like the idea of wounds or spells (curses) that act as minor debuffs until they are cured. "Curing" could happen naturaly over time or it could be done through friendly magic (spells) or as a result of visiting certain facilities (Temple/Shrine/Physician) within a settlement ...depending on the specific malady inflicted. I think it might make an interesting "death penalty" as well for those characters that weren't revived on the battle-field (assuming "revival" is possible). Nothing so harsh that the player feels unable to play, but something you would definately be motivated to take care of in order to get back to optimal function.
The blogs have the answer, but most people either ignore it or missed it, because there was a bunch of discussion on the topic. Blogs around 3-6 are probably the best to read, and contain the most information that is constantly repeated on these boards.
Short version:
Stop thinking of PFO in terms of Pathfinder mechanics. Attributes effect how well you train skills attached to them. If you have high strength you are not stronger, you are able to get stronger faster. Someone with a lower strength can become as strong as you, but they must work at it longer.The only way I can see PFO working well is if they divorce the mechanics of the RPG and make their own systems. One game is turn based strategy, the other is real time combat. The 'flavor' that is retained should be mostly the lore, setting, and the general idea behind most spells, like 'fireball' casts a fireball.
Then they should be calling it Golarion Online or River Kingdoms Online since its limited to that small part of it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Then they should be calling it Golarion Online or River Kingdoms Online since its limited to that small part of it.The blogs have the answer, but most people either ignore it or missed it, because there was a bunch of discussion on the topic. Blogs around 3-6 are probably the best to read, and contain the most information that is constantly repeated on these boards.
Short version:
Stop thinking of PFO in terms of Pathfinder mechanics. Attributes effect how well you train skills attached to them. If you have high strength you are not stronger, you are able to get stronger faster. Someone with a lower strength can become as strong as you, but they must work at it longer.The only way I can see PFO working well is if they divorce the mechanics of the RPG and make their own systems. One game is turn based strategy, the other is real time combat. The 'flavor' that is retained should be mostly the lore, setting, and the general idea behind most spells, like 'fireball' casts a fireball.
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, and Pathfinder Online basically contain the same amount of 'Pathfinder'. Pathfinder is a successful D&D mod, there are some mechanical modifications, but the vast majority of pathfinder is additional nouns and adjectives to added to the 'base'(DnD), just as they would be added to an MMO environment.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Then they should be calling it Golarion Online or River Kingdoms Online since its limited to that small part of it.The blogs have the answer, but most people either ignore it or missed it, because there was a bunch of discussion on the topic. Blogs around 3-6 are probably the best to read, and contain the most information that is constantly repeated on these boards.
Short version:
Stop thinking of PFO in terms of Pathfinder mechanics. Attributes effect how well you train skills attached to them. If you have high strength you are not stronger, you are able to get stronger faster. Someone with a lower strength can become as strong as you, but they must work at it longer.The only way I can see PFO working well is if they divorce the mechanics of the RPG and make their own systems. One game is turn based strategy, the other is real time combat. The 'flavor' that is retained should be mostly the lore, setting, and the general idea behind most spells, like 'fireball' casts a fireball.
Because Branding is for suckers.
Here's the thing: Goblinworks has many reasons for not just translating the PFRPG mechanics straight into the MMO. They discussed some in the early blogs. These are well thought out, intelligent reasons. But in addition to those reasons are legal reasons.
Pathfinder is in a tricky legal position when it comes to adaptations of its mechanics. Pathfinder was made using the Open Game License created by Wizards of the Coast with the Third Edition of Dungeons and Dragons. This allows them to use the mechanics of Third Edition and 3.5 in their tabletop products. It does not allow them to adapt those mechanics into a video game. Paizo and Goblinworks are cannot make a video game using the Pathfinder mechanics.
The stamina bar seems like an awesome idea. Hack and slash is fun, but buw kinda mindless at some point. I think this will he a brilliant addition that will both hold my interest, and give a shout out to the roots of the game.
I don't think I like the idea of dedicated slots in the action bar though. That seems like a big mistake. I'd much rather them all be open to however I want to use them. I guess I'll have to give it a shot though huh