Hamatulatsu Feat

[Victor Zajic]

So I was looking through the Inner Sea World Guide, and I came across the Hamatulatsu feat.

Hamatulatsu (Combat)
You have mastered a deadly fighting form inspired by the
hideous attacks of the barbed devil.
Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, Weapon Focus
(unarmed strike).
Benefit: Your unarmed attacks can deal either
bludgeoning or piercing damage. You decide which type
of damage you deal whenever you attack a foe, but you may
only choose one type at a time. If you critically hit a foe
with your unarmed strike while doing piercing damage,
the additional pain caused by the strike causes the foe to
become sickened for 1 round (or staggered for 1 round if
the target is already sickened). Multiple critical hits in a
round against a single foe do not increase the duration of
the sickened or staggered condition.
Special: Hamatulatsu may be selected as a substitute
bonus feat at 6th level by a monk even if the monk does
not otherwise meet the prerequisites. This fighting style
is normally only taught to women of the Sisterhood of the
Golden Erinyes.

After reading this I thought, "hey, my GF plays a Sisterhood of the Golden Erinyes Chelish Monk, here's a cool, flavorful feat she could take.

Then I looked at the addition resources page, and learned that this feat was banned for PFS play.

Does anyone have any idea why? I remember there was another version of this feat, in Inner Sea Primer (I think), that was pretty riddiculous because it could extend your crit range to 15-20 or something like that.

But this feat just allows you to call piercing or bludgeoning, and lets you sicken on a crit. It's cool, but actually kinda lackluster compared to something like Snake Style from Ultimate Combat, which does something similar.

Anyone know any of the reasoning behind this? I'm not demanding it be changed, I'm just curious why this feat would be inapproriate for PFS play, when something like Beliar's Bite from Cheliax: Empire of Devils (1d4 bleed damage on unarmed attacks with no pre-reqs) is approved for PFS play.

[Victor Zajic]

I would like to respectfully ask again that Hamatulatsu be looked at again for PFS legally.

While this method of unarmed combat might be brutal, it really isn't against the goals or themes of the campaign. Cheliax has been encouraged as a faction from day one of the campaign, and this is just the Chelish take on monks.

The general consensus of legality of option in PFS is to be permissive rather than not. There is a lot less discression used in PFS than most organized campaigns I've been in. Pretty much any new material is allowed, with a few exceptions, instead of what is being allowed being the exception. I don't beleive the most recent version of the feat deserves to be an exception to the rule.

The previous version of this feat from the Inner Sea Primer was banned for good reason. But the Inner Sea World Guide completely overwrote the ability, and now it is very reasonable. Compared to allowed feats like Snake Style, it's not really ahead of the power curve at all.

At the end of the day, I see a feat that rewards character who are trying to buy into the campaign world as it's been presented, and looking at the story of their character over the min/max of the mechanics. And since it doesn't upset the power of characters who take it, and I doubt that the majority of Monks in PFS would end up taking this feat, I see no reason for it to be amongst the relatively few exception to the policy letting us use any published material we want.

[Chris Mortika]

If I recall, there has been comment about the feat. The concern was that it was too complicated, rather than overpowered. I concur that it isn't any more complicated now than several style feats.

[Victor Zajic]

The old feat was incredibly complicated. You had to keep track of what damage types you used on the previous round, and where you were on consequative rounds (1 to 5). It was just a mess.

[RtrnofdMax]

For what it's worth, I will put in my vote for the PFS team to rethink the banning of this feat. I think its banning may be a holdover from before and they just missed the new wording.

[BigNorseWolf]

The lack of a saving throw probably isn't doing it any favors...

[ThreeEyedSloth]

The lack of a saving throw is nice, but to be honest, the tiny crit range on Unarmed Strikes keeps it balanced I think. Even if you were to take Improved Critical (which Monks can't get until 11th level), there are FAR more powerful critical hit-centric feats and powers at that high of level.

I feel like it would be fine to un-ban, but I'm simply speaking from my own opinion. We'll see if the powers-that-be feel it's worth revisiting.

[Imbicatus]

Sorry to necro the thread, but if the hamatulatsu master archetype from inner sea combat is legal, why is the hamatulatsu feat itself still illegal?

[Victor Zajic]

That's a good question.

[Skull]

Sorry for the thread necro, but I was also curious as to this. I am making a Hamatulatsu Master for PFS, and found hamatulatsu the feat to be a nice flavorful feat to take as I advance, only to learn it is banned. :P

Guess this means I will take Belier's Bite. Making all my unarmed attacks cause 1d4 bleed instead.

[Imbicatus]

Just bumping as the feat is still illegal.

[Game Master]

While I'm not sure it should have gotten a necro, for what it's worth, this feat should be legal.