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Compatible race options for Rise of the Runelords


Pathfinder Adventure Path General Discussion


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I'm planning to run Rise of the Runelords for my (soon to be former) Shadowrun group in a couple of weeks. One of the players, always eager to be a pain in the ass, keeps asking for race options that make no real sense to me. So far he has requested:

- Goblin
- Ogre
- Giant
- Fetchling
- Human with constant Enlarge Person spell (at 1st level? How?)

Aside from the core races, tieflings, and aasimars, what races do you think would make "sense" for Rise of the Runelords, where the players are supposed to be well-liked heroes of Sandpoint?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Elemental Humanoid races (Ifrits, Oreads, Sylphs, Undines, MAYBE Sulis): These have about the same level of tie to humanity as the Tieflings and Aasimar - if you allow those I can't think of any reason to disallow the others.

Changelings: See above - culturally they're basically humanoids with funny hands and a magic affinity.

Dhampir: A little dark, but probably doable.

Grippli: There's a giant swamp next to Sandpoint - putting a Grippli tribe there and having a few occasionally come to town to trade for goods wouldn't be inappropriate.

All these were evaluated purely on a flavor basis - I make no value judgments on their relative power level.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Pawns Subscriber
spectrevk wrote:

I'm planning to run Rise of the Runelords for my (soon to be former) Shadowrun group in a couple of weeks. One of the players, always eager to be a pain in the ass, keeps asking for race options that make no real sense to me. So far he has requested:

- Goblin
- Ogre
- Giant
- Fetchling
- Human with constant Enlarge Person spell (at 1st level? How?)

Aside from the core races, tieflings, and aasimars, what races do you think would make "sense" for Rise of the Runelords, where the players are supposed to be well-liked heroes of Sandpoint?

I draw the line at "this race is a featured enemy of this AP". So goblin, ogre, and giant are absolutely verboten, kill-on-sight creatures.

My second rule is, "If this race is significantly more powerful at 1st level, then no." As you point out, a human with permanent Enlarge Person has thousands of g.p. worth of magic. Emphasize to your player how much this breaks balance -- "Every other player got 150 g.p. You got 5000 g.p. worth of spells. In what universe is this fair?"

After that, I allow all races, but I warn players that my NPCs will treat them accordingly. A fetchling (if they're not too over-the-top; don't have the Bestiary handy) would feel strong discrimination, would have no chance for relationships, and there would be a small chance on entering every town that he would be shot.

My recommendation is to have the player pay out of his own pocket for the Advanced Races Guide PDF or PRD (dirt cheap on the iPad) and build his own race using 9-10 race points. But if he wants something that looks just like the enemy, and won't back down, then I'm afraid the townspeople are going to have to shoot him.

(True story: I was a Runequest GM and allowed "any race with 3d6 INT or above". So someone decided to try my patience and rolled up a griffon. The moment she landed in the middle of town amidst screaming villagers, I had the town guard fill her full of crossbow bolts. Lesson learned, and she rolled up a 'reasonable' race for her second character.)

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Perhaps suggest Half-Giant?

Lantern Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

That is actually an interesting question and as a Gm and player i thought about that often.
Pathfinder rules name the races core races, featured races and uncommon races. If you read the descriptions of those, you learn a lot.
And i actually came to share the poit of view written there.

Featured races are already strange races and someone playing a "monster" or enemy race somewhere should feel the downside of that and act accordingly. Especially Goblin, Orc, Kobold, Hobgoblin, Drow, etc.

Uncommon races can be freaky, but fun. The text about them says they are subject of debate. So, if playing a Kitsune, nobody needs to know you´re not a human actually and you can try to keep your Kitsune form secret. Or sell it as magic. Get´s more difficult with a catfolk or others more unusual looking ones.

What me and my guys came up with lately was getting rid of the vidual markings of some half-human races.
especially Aasimars, Tieflings and the Elemental races. You can just treat them as some strange kind of human. Maybe with some speical elements or unusual stuff, but nothing like flaming hair.
I mean, come on, your hair is constantly on fire? perhaps it´s unnaturally red.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Not really sure if I agree the Enlarged Person is over powered. Make him take a trait, like gigantism or something.

He would lose a trait, gain +2 str and lose 2 dex (seems like an even trade). Take a -1 to hit and AC, which hurts a lot. The two big things are nicer weapon damage (although large weapons might cost more money, and would be much more rare to be certain, as would armor, and any other gear), and he would have a 10' reach, which I am not sure if really that big of a deal. He would make a nice tank, but there might be a good amount of occasions where he would have to squeeze, which could be an issue. The spell Enlarge Person is nice because it a) effects your stuff, and b) can be turned off. Just being large might be way less appealing.

Personally I would say no to any evil races. No Drow, Goblins, Kobolds, definitely no Ogres or Giants.

Any of the Elemental Races seem like they would work, Catfolk might draw attention but I would assume as long as they behaved would not be seen as any more problematic as say gnomes, Changlings, Griplis, anything like that seems pretty harmless. I would say Half-Orc is a good standard. If the town can tolerate half orcs can it also tolerate <insert>.

I would probably have it that if the player was the only one of his kind around though he would be given less leeway. Once the town sees you as more of a beast then a person they will have no problem putting you down like a wild animal.


A generous as I used to be as a GM, it looks like you may have a bit of a twink here. PITA players like "off the wall"

I owuld recommend NFW for the 1st 3 selections. They are AP enemies. It would stretch disbeliefe a bit too much. (like having a drow PC in Second Darkness)

Fetchling COULD be acceptable. They're basically humans evolved to live in the plane of shadow. The pic on the pfsrd shows one with a mask.

They are essentially a race of goths (the Sisters of Mercy kind, not the pillage of Rome kind).

I would ask him to provide a backstory as to why the character is in Sandpoint (I would ask that of ALL players, anyway), and why they might want to "stick around" for a little while.


Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I've had players who are exactly the same way one in particular will request a fetchling or an "evil" aligned race every time. After the race book came out my other players have been asking for alternate races as well. Getting ready to run Runelords myself so I gave these options

1. The core seven are always allowed.
2. Races listed in the Dragon Empires Players guide are allowed (with backstory reasons as to why or how they crossed the crown of the world)
3. Human half bloods (Asimar, Teifling, elemental blooded etc allowed with good backstory, no Dhampirs though.)
4. Beast-folk (Ratfolk, Catfolk, Vanaras,Gripli) (Ratfolk are actually very appropriate as apparently there would be a sizeable population in Magnimar)
5.Changelings

None of these are designated "villain" races and for the most part have a roughly 15rp or less (a couple are 16) scheme in the race builder so not overly powerful.


Backstory for the aasimar race is tha they're apparently rather common in Varisia...


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pawns Subscriber

If you use the campaign traits you can fit almost anything in just make an unusual choice take the 'adopted' trait and have them raised (and known locally) in Sandpoint.

That doesn't mean they are well liked or that there aren't prejudices but it does give a good reason as to why they are in the area and a reason for the town to not scream 'monster' - reactions in the rest of the AP could be interesting but presumably by the time they move out they'll have enough clout to get letters of introduction to smooth over initial reactions.

As to Drow - I think they are fine but I'd make them use adopted (as above) and use the 'low light' alternate racial trait - which removes the sun sensitivity and dark vision and just makes them a more interesting type of elf ;)

I'd most likely make them remove the poison affinity as well (IMO) but that's my two cents.


Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules Subscriber

I would advise against either Aasimar or Teifling 'raised' in Sandpoint, considering...

Spoiler:
The BBEG for the first adventure is a native Sandpoint Aasimar.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
darkwarriorkarg wrote:

Fetchling COULD be acceptable. They're basically humans evolved to live in the plane of shadow. The pic on the pfsrd shows one with a mask.

They are essentially a race of goths (the Sisters of Mercy kind, not the pillage of Rome kind).

This made me laugh way more than I should have.

I second the "genie" races (Sulis) as being doable if you're willing to allow the planar races. Fetchlings aren't too bad to pull off, especially considering that aside from their eyes they look rather like they are sick humans. Some go so far as to dye their hair black or red.

The ARG lists Tengu as a not uncommon species often living in ghettos near/in larger human settlements. My view is that if people can stand to live with anthropomorphic crows, they can stand to live near other non-monstrous humanoids.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Any of the Dragon Empire races would work as you could explain them as being the descendants of the Kaijitsu family's retainers that accompanied them in their flight from Minkai...or even the descendants of some of their pursuers.

Lantern Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Also all of the half-human races, like the elemental races, can just be played like humans with a "touch". Means more like a variety of humans, like a half elf perhaps. No need for flaming hair^^ Would be difficult for clothes and hats anyway hehe.


Irnk, Dead-Eye's Prodigal wrote:

I would advise against either Aasimar or Teifling 'raised' in Sandpoint, considering...

** spoiler omitted **

That was actually used a story & family hook for my character. Definitely made for some interesting feelings towards the end of the book

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