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RPG Superstar 2015

Best PFS characters?


Advice


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber

I'm curious to see your best PFS-legal characters. I'm not looking for the best 12th level characters but rather the most playable, most enjoyable and most effective characters from level 1 through 12. The only rules for this is that the character be PFS-legal and that you not use any magical equipment as part of the planned build. Just race, class, attributes, traits, feats and skills.

This would be my entry, I think:

Human Fighter (standard)

Attributes:
STR - 16 (+2 racial bonus)
DEX - 15 (+1 at 8th level)
CON - 14
INT - 12 (+1 at 4th and 12th level)
WIS - 10
CHA - 7

Traits:
Defender of the Society (+1 AC when wearing medium or heavy armor)
Freed Slave, Andoran (+1 Will saves)

Feats:
1st Power Attack
1st Weapon Focus: Bardiche
1st Combat Reflexes
2nd Dodge
3rd Mobility
4th Combat Expertise
5th Spring Attack (swap Combat Reflexes for Whirlwind Attack)
6th Combat Reflexes
7th Lunge
8th Greater Weapon Focus: Bardiche
9th Desperate Battler
10th Weapon Specialization: Bardiche
11th Dazing Assault
12th Greater Weapon Specialization: Bardiche

I get the fun of an effective reach weapon with Combat Reflexes from the beginning and the ability to make a Whirlwind Attack with it by 5th level (keeping in mind the 5-foot step rule during full attack actions). At 7th level that becomes a Lunging Whirlwind Attack with a reach weapon and at 11th level a potential Lunging Dazing Whirlwind Attack with a reach weapon. Lots of potential damage, both when making a full attack action against a single target and when making an attack against everything within 15' (or more).

I took Desperate Battler instead of Improved Critical because I assume I'd be able to get a Keen weapon along the way. That kind of breaks my own rule about magical equipment, but its a risk I'm willing to take. It also gives me a nice bonus I can use when my Bardiche isn't handy for whatever reason and I have to draw my Greatsword.

I'd be interested in seeing other builds that players have enjoyed (or would enjoy) from start to finish.

Grand Lodge

My Eldritch Knight's been awesome. He's 9th level right now. If you click my name, I think I have his stats relatively current...

Dark Archive Star Voter 2013

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Maps, Modules Subscriber
Wiggz wrote:
I'm curious to see your best PFS-legal characters. I'm not looking for the best 12th level characters but rather the most playable, most enjoyable and most effective characters from level 1 through 12. The only rules for this is that the character be PFS-legal and that you not use any magical equipment as part of the planned build. Just race, class, attributes, traits, feats and skills.

This looks a fair bit like the Lorewarden Pole Dancer build I'm toying with. (I usually avoid superplanning by builds in case the organic growth of the character leads me off in a different direction).


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber
TetsujinOni wrote:
Wiggz wrote:
I'm curious to see your best PFS-legal characters. I'm not looking for the best 12th level characters but rather the most playable, most enjoyable and most effective characters from level 1 through 12. The only rules for this is that the character be PFS-legal and that you not use any magical equipment as part of the planned build. Just race, class, attributes, traits, feats and skills.

This looks a fair bit like the Lorewarden Pole Dancer build I'm toying with. (I usually avoid superplanning by builds in case the organic growth of the character leads me off in a different direction).

He originally started out as a Lore Warden due to gaining Combat Expertise for free, but once I realized that I wasn't planning on using any Combat Maneuvers, the ability to wear any armor and move unfettered around the battlefield was too appealing.

This was the Lore Warden build:

Attributes:
STR - 16 (+2 racial bonus, +1 at 4th and 8th level)
DEX - 15 (+1 at 12th level)
CON - 14
INT - 10
WIS - 12
CHA - 7

Feats:
1st Power Attack
1st Weapon Focus: Bardiche
1st Combat Reflexes
2nd Dodge
2nd Combat Expertise
3rd Mobility
4th Spring Attack (swap Combat Reflexes for Whirlwind Attack)
5th Combat Reflexes
6th Lunge
7th Desperate Battler
8th Greater Weapon Focus: Bardiche
9th Improved Critical: Bardiche
10th Weapon Specialization: Bardiche
11th Dazing Assault
12th Greater Weapon Specialization: Bardiche

The Lore Warden gets a slight Strength bump and an extra feat as well as his Whirlwind Attacks a level earlier... BUT his AC suffers greatly, and I plan on being in the thick of things with this character.

Dark Archive Star Voter 2013

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Maps, Modules Subscriber

Lorewarden 4 / Barbarian 1 / Shadowdancer 4 / Barbarian 2 / Lore Warden til it gets boring after retirement.

Lantern Lodge

Race: Human
Class: Fighter (Archetype: Lore Warden)

Stats:
STR 14
DEX 17 (+2 Racial)(+1 at 4th, 8th, and 12th level)
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 10
CHA 07

Feats:
01 Weapon Finesse, Exotic Weapon Proficiency Whip, Weapon Focus (whip)
02 Combat Expertise, Whip Mastery
03 Combat Reflexes
04 Weapon Specialization Whip
05 Improved Whip Mastery
06 Improved Trip
07 Greater Trip
08 Greater Weapon Focus Whip
09 Two-Weapon Fighting
10 Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
11 Greater Two-Weapon Fighting
12 Greater Weapon Specialization Whip

TW Fighter that excels at AoO and keeping the enemy from full round attacking. Its best when there is a rogue or 2 in the party each with the Gang Up feat to take full advantage of ur trips.

Lantern Lodge

Lol, seems like the Lore Warden is quite a popular fighter archetype in PFS.

I just started PFS and I love my Dwarf Lore Warden - Archer build.

Focusing on the Snap shot line later as I level up. Will be taking most of the basic archery feats as I level, multi-shot, rapid shot, etc.

Silver Crusade

Curent level 6
Human
Bard (Focused on buffing)
Stats
Str 14
Dex 18 (+1 at 4)
Int 12
Wis 7
Cha 14

Traits
Vagavond Child (Disable Device as class skill)
Reactionary +2 Initiative

Feets
Human : Improved Initiative
1 : Lingering Performance
3 : Weapon Finess
5 : Quick Draw
7 : Two Weapon Fighting
9 : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
11 : Discordant Voice

Key Spells
1st
Cure Light Wounds
Anticipate Peril
2nd
Gallant Inspiration
Tactical Acumen
3rd
Haste
Good Hope
4th
Greater Invisibility

Star Voter 2014

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Reach weapon w/spiked armor, 1 level of clreic strength domain, the rest fighter Get combat reflexes and smoke eveything as it moves toward you.

Magical Heritage murderous command with extend on a dual cursed bones oracle. If they are living have them kill eachother. If undead control them.

Silver Crusade

In more general terms, due to the point-buy requirement, SAD characters have a big advantage over MAD ones!

It's one reason why I hate point-buy, but if I want to play PFS I have to suck it up!

Star Voter 2014

What are SAD and MAD?


Single Attribute Dependant
Multiple Attribute Dependant


Finlanderboy wrote:
What are SAD and MAD?

SAD - Single Attribute Dependency

MAD - Multiple Attribute Dependency

A wizard is a good example of SAD, their major class features run off 1 stat, Intelligence. A little Dex and Con help survival but otherwise that's all.

A Monk is a prime example of MAD, Wisdom, Dexterity, Strength,just to function well, with Con being close for survival.

Star Voter 2014

That just means in PFS you are better off specializing. Build your character to do one thing very well. Then expect your team to do the same.


I have a pet bard I have not played yet. The idea is as follows:

  • The bard is ALL flash, no bang.
  • The focus is on the Helpful Trait. All I do is hit with whip (Melee, 15 foot reach) against AC 10, to Aid Other for +4 on their attack that can actually do damage.
  • Pure support.

    Progression would be:
    2: Versatile Performance Comedy (Bluff, Intimidate)
    3: Weapon Focus Whip.
    5: Dazzling Display
    6: Versatile Performance: Oratory (Diplomacy, Sense Motive)
    7: Lingering Performance
    9: Lucky Healer
    10: Versatile Performance Dance (Acrobatics, Fly)
    11: Discordant Voice

    Heward the Handy
    Male Halfling Bard 1
    NG Small Humanoid (halfling)
    Init +2; Senses Perception +1
    --------------------
    Defense
    --------------------
    AC 17, touch 13, flat-footed 15 (+3 armor, +1 shield, +2 Dex, +1 size)
    hp 9 (1d8+1)
    Fort +2, Ref +5, Will +2; +2 vs. fear
    --------------------
    Offense
    --------------------
    Speed 20 ft.
    Melee Light Shield Bash -2 (1d2-1/x2) and
    . . Whip +2 (1d2-1/x2)
    Special Attacks Bardic Performance (standard action) (9 rounds/day, Bardic Performance: Countersong, Bardic Performance: Distraction, Bardic Performance: Fascinate (1 targets) (DC 15), Bardic Performance: Inspire Courage +1
    Bard Spells Known (CL 1, +2 melee touch, +3 ranged touch):
    1 (3/day) Silent Image (DC 16), Saving Finale (DC 16)
    0 (at will) Read Magic, Ghost Sound (DC 15), Detect Magic, Prestidigitation (DC 15)
    --------------------
    Statistics
    --------------------
    Str 8, Dex 15, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 20
    Base Atk +0; CMB -2; CMD 10
    Feats Bard Weapon Proficiencies, Weapon Finesse
    Traits Helpful, Prehensile Whip
    Skills Acrobatics +6 (+2 jump), Diplomacy +9, Escape Artist +0, Intimidate +9, Linguistics +4, Perception +1, Perform (comedy) +9, Perform (dance) +9, Perform (oratory) +9, Ride +0, Stealth +4, Swim -3
    Languages Common, Halfling, Varisian
    SQ Bardic Knowledge +1, Fearless
    Combat Gear Light steel shield, Parade armor, Whip;
    --------------------
    TRACKED RESOURCES
    --------------------
    Bardic Performance (standard action) (9 rounds/day) - 0/9
    --------------------
    Special Abilities
    --------------------
    Bardic Knowledge +1 (Ex) Add + 1 to all knowledge skill checks.
    Bardic Performance (standard action) (9 rounds/day) Your performances can create magical effects.
    Bardic Performance: Countersong (Su) Counter magical effects that depend on sound.
    Bardic Performance: Distraction (Su) Counter magical effects that depend on sight.
    Bardic Performance: Fascinate (1 targets) (DC 15) (Su) One or more creatures becomes fascinated with you.
    Bardic Performance: Inspire Courage +1 (Su) Morale bonus on some saving throws, attack and damage rolls.
    Fearless +2 racial bonus vs Fear saves.
    Helpful Aid another grants allies a +4 bonus (instead of usual +2).

  • Sczarni Star Voter 2014

    1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

    No one else?


    1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.
    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber

    Anybody know why this thread got moved? No one is asking for any advice, we're discussing favorite PFS characters - why wouldn't that be in PFS General Discussion?

    I understand the reasoning behind moving threads from time to time, but it seems to be getting a little ridiculous of late.


    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

    Worth considering that builds that rely on certain magic items are more reasonable in a PFS context than a home game. ie you can reasonably predict what you can buy when (broadly speaking) and a character that relies on 1st level wands for example could be highly effective in a PFS context.

    I also think it is worth thinking about characters that can almost always fill a role at any PFS table. Clerics can be great here as they at a minimum can use cure light wands bu also have among the greatest spell casting flexibility of any class. One game you can have an all buffing cleric and the next a save or die and the next a melee cleric (within some reason and assuming you pick effective domains and feats)

    Dragon disciples that I've seen that are built to emphasize their STR can be frighteningly effective in PFS. I play with a dragon disciple who is frequently the biggest damage dealer on the table - while also having limited bard powers for self sufficiency with wands and minor buffs. And has claws for when he can't use his adamantine greatsword.

    My strange zen archer / menhir savant eagle domain Druid is tons of fun to play (only 6th level so not certain his progression up to 12th yet. Likely he will end up 6/6 monk Druid (or possibly 7 in one of the classes. Unless there is a newer prestige class that would fit his flavor best. Insane perception, highly effective damage dealer and very flexible spells and unusual Druidic abilities. Really fun if somewhat unique.

    I'm playing a lore warden at the moment as well but haven't decided yet if I'm going to multiclass him (very likely into something int based since he has an 18 int)

    PFS has lots of great options. Which is really the fun of it.


    A pistol packing archaeologist with a whip and the prehensile whip trait would be amusing. Just have to come up with a name.... ;)


    2 people marked this as a favorite.

    GNOME SORCERER ILLUSIONIST

    gnome sorcerer of any bloodline that floats your boat
    trait: magical lineage - ghost sound
    1: spell focus: illusion
    3: threatening illusion (now your ghost sound can threaten and still be a 0 level spell!)
    5: effortless trickery (cast your silent image modified by threatening illusion, and use a swift action every round to maintain it forever, you always have a flank buddy for your allies!(assuming failed will saves))
    7: shadow gambit (destroy your ongoing figments for real damage, 7 types of damage to choose from!(remember mirror image is a figment you can do this with too))
    9: reach spell (at level 10 you can cast a reach telekinetic charge to put an ally anywhere within 200 feet of you AND give him a free attack, not only a free attack but a free attack in a flank with the aforementioned flanking illusion! yay!)

    obviously focus on illusions but you can fireball/glitterdust too, take the usually good sorcerer spells to go with it, plus its not dependent on a bloodline so you can have a familiar or animal companion to help with your trickery(although if someone knows of a good illusionist bloodline i would very much like to know of it)

    flesh out the stats and spells how you like, it's a VERY fun character to play. (mine is only lvl 7 so i haven't thought much about what to take lvl 10+)

    Liberty's Edge

    Pathfinder Modules Subscriber

    I have a few plans for PFS characters I'm debating on starting up when I get the time. I have a Half-Orc Dragoon 1 / Inquisitor (feather domain) that rides around on his Roc companion, using my teamwork feat with my companion and making cornugon-smash-mounted-charges. I also have a Halfling Master Summoner that uses his eidolon as a skill monkey, mount (flying at 10th), and back up caster (with UMD).

    Right now though, I'm working on a Marid-blooded sorcerer, possibly with the Seeker archetype. I don't have the exact build on hand, but it goes something like this:

    Human Sorcerer
    STR 7 DEX 14 CON 14 INT 7 WIS 14 CHA 19 (all points here)

    Traits:
    Reactionary: +2 trait bonus to initiative checks.
    Focused Mind: +2 trait bonus to concentration checks.
    OR Magical Lineage (Shocking Grasp / Fireball)

    Feats:
    Human. Elemental Focus (Cold)
    1. Rime Spell
    3. Lingering Spell
    5. Intensified Spell
    7. Sickening Spell
    Bloodline 7. Improved Initiative
    9. Dazing Spell
    11. Selective Spell

    I try to get at least one blast, one buff, and one debuff per spell level. Rough list goes like this:

    0: Ray of Frost, Detect Magic, Dancing Lights, Mage Hand, Message, Ghost Noise, Open/Close, Arcane Mark, Prestidigitation, Read Magic, Mending, Mending
    1: Obscuring Mist, Ray of Enfeeblement, Charm Person, Enlarge Person, Mage Armor, Shield, Grease, Burning Hands / Shocking Grasp
    2: See Invisibility, Glitterdust, Invisibility, Web, Scorching Ray, Acid Arrow, Knock, Rope Trick
    3: Gaseous Form, Haste, Slow, Fly, Fireball, Lightning Bolt, Dispel Magic
    4: Wall of Ice, Black Tentacles, Confusion, Dimension Door, Shadow Conjuration, Resilient Sphere
    5: Persistent Image, Cloudkill, Shadow Evocation, Baleful Polymorph
    6: Chain Lightning / Greater Dispel Magic

    Basic idea is quickly buff the party (haste most likely), open with a Rime Cold-Fireball (Lingering if helpful) to lay out some crowd control, and continue with debuffs / debuffing blasts using Black Tentacles, Grease, Web, Wall of Ice, or Sickening / Dazing / Rime spells.

    I'm somewhat tempted to go Crossblooded Marid-Rime-Blooded for a free slow on top of everything or Boreal for another +1 DC (and a wider variety of spells / feats / powers), but I don't know if the human bonus spells are enough to offset the cost.

    Grand Lodge

    Haven't gotten a character above 4th yet but am having fun with my Chellish Wizard(conjurer)/Lawyer who packs a sword, thanks to heirloom weapon (used MW transformation on it post level 1), and wears armour (arcane armour training and a mithral chain shirt). I've had the odd GM ask me 'how are you dressed' and invariably my appearance gives the impression of bard or magus or rogue type until I blast something. He'll be going for Hellknight Signifier at 6th level (its better to go to 6th level wizard at 7th so as to get 2 free 4th level spells and the improved saving throws)

    Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

    1 person marked this as a favorite.
    Helaman wrote:
    Haven't gotten a character above 4th yet but am having fun with my Chellish Wizard(conjurer)/Lawyer who packs a sword, thanks to heirloom weapon (used MW transformation on it post level 1), and wears armour (arcane armour training and a mithral chain shirt). I've had the odd GM ask me 'how are you dressed' and invariably my appearance gives the impression of bard or magus or rogue type until I blast something. He'll be going for Hellknight Signifier at 6th level (its better to go to 6th level wizard at 7th so as to get 2 free 4th level spells and the improved saving throws)

    My favorite one right now is a gnome Sorcerer (Crossblooded[Draconic/Orc]/Tattooed) 1/Wizard (Evocation[Admixture]) 4

    Str 7 Dex 14 Con 14 Int 21 Wis 10 Cha 14

    Alternate race traits: Academician, Gift of Tongues, Pyromaniac
    Favored class: Wizard, +1/2 use of Versatile Evocation
    Traits: Reactionary (+2 Init), Magical Lineage (burning hands)
    Feat 1: Improved Initiative
    Feat 3: Intensified Spell
    Feat 5: Spell Specialization (currently Burning Arc)
    Varisian Tattoo bonus feat (Evocation)

    Between the Varisian Tattoo, Pyromaniac, the two bloodline arcana, Spell Specialization and the evoker Wizard's Intense Spells ability, I'm dealing 8d6 + 17 damage to the first person that Burning Arc hits, then half of that to the next and half of that to the next. Reflex save for half is DC 18. I vaporize enemies pretty often.

    Sczarni

    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.


    ossian666 wrote:
    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.

    How do you reload as a free action more than once per round at 11th level?


    ossian666 wrote:
    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.

    And when do you get to shoot things 100 ft out in PFS?


    ossian666 wrote:
    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.

    Best you can do is 50 feet touch ac move action with Steady Aim still takes a move action to reload with Fast Musket, and Rapid Reload.

    Silver Crusade

    Thread title wrote:
    Best PFS characters?

    Me.

    ;)


    johnlocke90 wrote:
    ossian666 wrote:
    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.
    How do you reload as a free action more than once per round at 11th level?

    This is what I was wondering.

    I've been having a lot of of fun with Treantmonk's Switch Hitter Ranger. He's 5th level right now, just got his Boon Companion for his wolf.


    Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

    I'm only 2nd level but my elf alchemist (bomber-type preservationist) is pretty darn cool. I also got the opportunity to play as a goblin cleric (We Be Goblins!) and that was a blast!

    I'm also putting together my human ranger switch-hitter and a tiefling magus. Gotta have a strong bench!

    Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 , Marathon Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

    Jodokai wrote:
    johnlocke90 wrote:
    ossian666 wrote:
    A Musket Master Gunslinger just breaks PFS...being able to reload as a free action and shoot touch AC out on a firearm out past 100 ft. is just unfair...then toss in Clustered Shots and you just have to sit back and liquify things.
    How do you reload as a free action more than once per round at 11th level?
    This is what I was wondering.

    Musket starts as a full-round action to reload.

    They get Rapid Reload as a bonus feat, reducing it to a standard action.

    There's a deed they can take at 3rd level that lets them treat their musket as a one-handed firearm for purposes of reloading. A one-handed firearm with Rapid Reload is a move action.

    Alchemical cartridges reduce the reload time by one step, going from a move action to a free action.

    Net result: Musket Masters can reload their guns as a free action pretty early on, if they're willing to shell out extra gold for fancy-pants ammo.


    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

    A musket master with rapid reload and who is third level with at least 1 grit point can treat two handed weapons as one handed so loads two handed weapons as a move action.

    If she then uses alchemical cartridges that time is shifted to a free action.

    This means that a musket master over 3rd level can with alchemical cartridges full attack with a musket as often as a bowman could with a bow. Very effective with the right build.
    (I played a scenario with an optimized musket master and the damage he could pump out from nearly anywhere on the battlefield including via ricochet shots was impressive and resulted in a lot of one shot kills)


    Most fun I've had in PFS was with four pregen rogues and a cleric. The cleric was the best theif, by dint of being able to roll above 10. XD

    There was a plot or a mission or something, but I just remember it becoming a contest to see who could steal the most ridiculous thing.

    I don't think there is anything PFS-related but were I to join I'd be a Monk or a Grenadier... probably a Grenadier, given the renewed focus on skills.

    Sczarni

    Yep...toss in a Double Barrel Musket and firing both barrels at once (-4 to hit on each) and you can get upwards to 6 shots/round at level 6 or so...and you only take the DR off of the grand total of all damage dice if you have clustered shots. So on average lets say all shots hit (should be no reason they don't) and the enemy has DR 15. 6d12+30=72 damage per round from a Distance gun.

    Don't even get me started about the Dual Wielding Alchemist Pistolero with Double Barrel Pistols...that gets a little unfair and rather pricey to maintain the equipment.

    Main point...Gunslingers=OP...until they misfire ;)


    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

    Well in PFS play Alchemist Pistolero's would take multiclassing (or a LOT of feats) not actually sure what the Alchemist levels would give a gunslinger in PFS play (other than perhaps some flexibility)

    The key to limiting the OP nature of gunslingers is to make sure that:

    1) Ammunition is tracked. For guns this is far more crucial than it is for bows. Especially if they are using expensive ammunition such as Alchemical cartridges.

    2) Grit points are tracked. Gunslingers don't get a lot of grit and many of their more powerful features (like the musket master's fast reload deed) require at least one point of grit - if they spend that, they go back to slower reloads.

    3) You as the GM (and/or as the player) understand cover as well as firing into melee. Make sure that gunslingers have the feats - i.e. precise shot for example. If they don't make sure they are accounting for all of the cover and other penalties. While less crucial since they may be shooting for a touch attack pay attention.

    4) Track range increments carefully and pay attention to when they are getting touch attacks vs when they aren't - one 5' miscalculation can be a big difference.

    All that said a high level gunslinger (around level 7 or so) with a magical gun and a smart player with a carefully chosen set of feats (and deeds) and smart use of grit will be a powerful force in combat - but done well the rest of the party should still have plenty of chances to shine as well.

    (yet another argument from a scenario design for scenarios with lots of minions along with the BBEG vs a single solo BBEG)

    Sczarni

    1) Since time is unlimited between PFS sessions and Gunslingers can make their own ammo at such a small price its not unreasonable to have all you need.

    2) As a Gunslinger I find very few Deeds REALLY worth spending grit on (maybe Quick Clear)...not to mention since you do so much damage its not unheard of to get it back faster than you can spend it.

    3) Eh what else you gonna spend feats on? There are only so many you need as a Gunslinger and you need Precise Shot to take Clustered Shots.

    4) Distance makes that Musket a 160 ft. Touch AC firearm of DEATH. As someone else pointed out...how often are you further than like 50 ft. from enemies in PFS?

    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.


    ossian666 wrote:
    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.

    just curious, could you be a tiefling with the 'prehensile tail' alternative racial trait and get the same effect?

    Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 , Marathon Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

    asthyril wrote:
    ossian666 wrote:
    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.
    just curious, could you be a tiefling with the 'prehensile tail' alternative racial trait and get the same effect?

    If I had a nickel for every time someone looked at that "retrieve an item as a swift action" ability and asked "does it let me do this other thing that's in no way related to retrieving an item as a swift action?" I'd be rich.


    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

    In PFS you can't craft (even between scenarios) - the "gunsmithing" feat just allows you to purchase ammunition (and guns if you have the right other feats) at a discount on the listed prices. If you also have one rank in craft [ alchemy] you can purchase alchemical cartridges.

    (see additional resources)

    So while gunslingers can indeed buy ammo at a discount they can't, in PFS play, make it themselves.

    Feat(s) I've seen gunslingers take:

    Precise Shot
    Point Blank Shot
    Extra Grit
    Clustered Shots
    Deft Shootist (to avoid AoO when reloading)
    Ricochet Shot - which requires Blind Fighting as a prerequisite) - extremely effective - literally shooting around corners becomes possible.
    Signature Deed (at level 11 - haven't yet played with a level 11 gunslinger but seems worth taking)
    Rapid Reload (if not getting it as a bonus feat from an archetype)

    For a class without a lot of bonus feats that's a fair number of useful feats. Not to mention generally useful feats like Improved Initiative or the Dodge/Mobility chain or toughness or feats to improve a weak save.

    Sczarni

    Yea they BUY ammo at the price it costs to make it...so same difference.

    And the Tiefling Prehensile Tail is neat, but doesn't allow you to hold things. Its great for drawing weapons or potions though!


    Jiggy wrote:
    asthyril wrote:
    ossian666 wrote:
    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.
    just curious, could you be a tiefling with the 'prehensile tail' alternative racial trait and get the same effect?
    If I had a nickel for every time someone looked at that "retrieve an item as a swift action" ability and asked "does it let me do this other thing that's in no way related to retrieving an item as a swift action?" I'd be rich.

    I suppose you could use it to retrieve more bullets.


    ossian666 wrote:

    1) Since time is unlimited between PFS sessions and Gunslingers can make their own ammo at such a small price its not unreasonable to have all you need.

    2) As a Gunslinger I find very few Deeds REALLY worth spending grit on (maybe Quick Clear)...not to mention since you do so much damage its not unheard of to get it back faster than you can spend it.

    3) Eh what else you gonna spend feats on? There are only so many you need as a Gunslinger and you need Precise Shot to take Clustered Shots.

    4) Distance makes that Musket a 160 ft. Touch AC firearm of DEATH. As someone else pointed out...how often are you further than like 50 ft. from enemies in PFS?

    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.

    But growing a 3rd arm you're okay with, and isn't considered "cheap"? Just curious.

    As far as a gunslinger being OP'd? I have to say in our 10th level Kingmaker game, the Archer Cleric is out DPS'ing our Musket Master.

    Lantern Lodge

    I find musket gunslingers meh. 5 levels of Gunslinger (Mysterious Stranger / Pistolero) and 5 levels of Alchemist (Grenadier) with the Explosive Bomb and Explosive Missile Discoveries = gun damage + dex + bomb (3d6 + int) + Pistolero's Up Close and Deadly (2d6) + Vital Strike = win. All for the cost of 1 bullet, 1 grit point, and 1 bomb use as a standard action.

    Sczarni

    Jodokai wrote:
    ossian666 wrote:

    1) Since time is unlimited between PFS sessions and Gunslingers can make their own ammo at such a small price its not unreasonable to have all you need.

    2) As a Gunslinger I find very few Deeds REALLY worth spending grit on (maybe Quick Clear)...not to mention since you do so much damage its not unheard of to get it back faster than you can spend it.

    3) Eh what else you gonna spend feats on? There are only so many you need as a Gunslinger and you need Precise Shot to take Clustered Shots.

    4) Distance makes that Musket a 160 ft. Touch AC firearm of DEATH. As someone else pointed out...how often are you further than like 50 ft. from enemies in PFS?

    Edit: And as a Pistolero you take 2 levels in Alchemist for your first discovery so you can take Vistigial Arm so you can reload your pistols. Need a free hand to reload firearms and I don't like the cheap Weapon Cords trick.

    But growing a 3rd arm you're okay with, and isn't considered "cheap"? Just curious.

    As far as a gunslinger being OP'd? I have to say in our 10th level Kingmaker game, the Archer Cleric is out DPS'ing our Musket Master.

    No. The Weapon Cords are 1s. Growing an extra arm requires you to take TWO LEVELS in a class that really doesn't grant you much more that you can really use other than the arm. Some of the stuff is neat to have but it puts you TWO LEVELS behind your Gunslinger advancement which in the world of PFS is 16% of your career. Not to mention its a hit on BAB which makes you put off getting Clustered Shots which is your single best feat.

    Quote:
    I find musket gunslingers meh. 5 levels of Gunslinger (Mysterious Stranger / Pistolero) and 5 levels of Alchemist (Grenadier) with the Explosive Bomb and Explosive Missile Discoveries = gun damage + dex + bomb (3d6 + int) + Pistolero's Up Close and Deadly (2d6) + Vital Strike = win. All for the cost of 1 bullet, 1 grit point, and 1 bomb use as a standard action.

    Gotta be careful though...its been said that the Mysterious Stranger is supposed to replace Pistolero's Pistol Training, so they shouldn't be able to mix. Not to mention that damage is booty for a 10th level Gunslinger. Its kind of laughable. Lets do the math.

    (1d6)+5+(3d6+2)+(2d6)+(1d6)=4+5+14+8+4=35

    My level 6 Gunslinger did more damage. I'm not really impressed with your flashy show.

    Shadow Lodge

    hevens oracle: stack charisma,cast color spray, coupe de grace for the next 2 rounds. at 7th level you get to do it to undead as well.

    i havent seen a more powerful character. they have healing, control, and one hit kills on everything, high ac and HP, they can be the front liner, or stay back and cast buff spells.

    truly a OP character.

    Lantern Lodge Star Voter 2013

    If trying to optimize a pistolero with double pistol is my personal favorite. However gunslingers require smart, tactical players to be effective. It's a constant gamble when using double shot because there's good chance it could misfire and then explode.

    Grit and ammunition isn't really an issue for gunslingers. Grit recharges quickly due to killing things. My PFS gunslinger is level six and the most I've ever spent on ammunition during an adventure was last week at 25 shots (150 gp). Prior to that my average is around 15 shots (90gp). So that's pocket change.

    Also, never try to dual wield using weapon cords or some cheese that you "guess might work". For one fellow players will deteste your cheese and two because you're likely to be dealing massive damage your character will get scrutiny. Dual-wielding using weapon cords per RAW is a GM's call so I guarentee they will rule it illegal. Also, dual wielding prior to level 13 is ineffective due to feat tax, misfires, and penalties.

    All that said, the gunslinger is powerful but still balanced in my opinion. You must be smart and at times gamble losing your weapon.Over six levels I've suffered countless misfires (One scenario I misfired almost every encounter) and one gun explosion which caused us to retreat.

    Summoners I feel are the most OP. Thank God they got rid of the Synthesist but still a properly built Eidolon will outshine melee classes.

    Sczarni

    Yea a player in the game I GM is playing a Goblin Pistolero I made him...and I admit I made him too well...8 Bullets/round that RARELY miss, and it only takes one nat 20 to one shot ANYTHING. Not to mention you have a pretty decent AC since your stack stat is Dex and you get Nimble AND can wear armor.

    Sadly the Weapon Cords aren't against any rules, but as a GM I'd sunder them every chance I got and ruin hat player's day.

    Dark Archive

    1 person marked this as a favorite.

    I am new to PFS so I only have level 1 characters. With that said you can optimize a lot just by using the Tiefling race!

    Example 1: Optimizing AC.
    Go Tiefling Fighter with at least 16 dex. Feats: Dodge and Armor of the pit. Start with a heavy wooden shield and a weapon. After the first scenario is completed you should be able to afford a Breastplate. This brings your total ac up to a whopping 24 at level 1! On top of that you have 5 resistance vs fire, cold and electricity and with fiendish sprinter you can even charge at full speed in medium armor!

    Example 2: Optimizing via ability scores. Rogues and Monks benefit a lot from the +2 Dex and Int and the hit to cha is better than the hit to con that Elves get. Wizards can even achieve 20 in both those stats at first level by going 7str, 19dex, 10con, 20int, 8wis and 5cha. The key is choosing Transmutation as your focused school which gives +1 to a physical stat. With 20 Dex your ranged touch spells will be much easier to land, and weapon finesse can do the same for the melee touch attacks!

    Another boon is that as a Tiefling you are an outsider instead of a humanoid = Hold Person and other spells that target Humanoids can not target you!

    Sczarni

    1 person marked this as a favorite.

    Ooooph you won't find many people telling you to do either of those things.

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