My players fought The Splatterman yesterday and pretty much took him to school. However, as a new DM I'm still learning about tactics, so I had a question if anyone would be kind enough to answer for me.
They have not found Warden Hawkran's badge yet, and still have The Piper of Illmarsh and Father Charlatan to fight.
I read that The Splatterman has "rejuvenation", but the only thing I could find on it was Vesorianna's own rejuvenation.
When I played through this campaign myself, we fought The Splatterman before fighting off the other baddies and my GM just decided that after destroying The Splatterman, Harrowstone would collapse and we had to get the heck out of there. He was getting tired of the dungeon and the other three players were committing evil acts but refusing to allow their alignments to be changed and disregarding trust points and Ravengro's opinion of them whatsoever. We just wanted to get out of there.
But as for me, my party is actually pretty overpowered (I have a cleric inquistor who is stacked against undead and has actually become very smug about it, sometimes even ignoring the game until it's his turn with the excuse of well I'll just kill everything anyway). I didn't want to end it there. I want them to kill the other baddies and find the Warden's badge.
So, here's my question, and I'm sorry if it's obvious: Since the Splatterman has rejuvenation, does he come back at full health in 1d4 days or so and are they required to kill him again? Even though they reduced him to 0 hit points? There is no mention of him having Destruction, the way the other murderers have.
Has anyone else had a similar experience, and does anyone have any suggestions as to what I can do? Thank you SO MUCH!
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Rejuvenation is an ability that all ghosts have by default. For the Splatter Man and the other main ghosts at Harrowstone, the written adventure states that they can't rejuvenate because Vessoriana has the power to destroy them after they're defeated by the PCs. So as-written, he should be dead for good. It's not mentioned in his stat block specifically, since the adventure assumes that the PCs kill him last.
*However*, it's your adventure and you can change it however you want!
Here are some ideas:
1. It turns out that the "Splatter Man" that they fought was just an illusion. In reality, Vessoriana absorbed him into herself years ago. She's actually the real final boss of the dungeon, and the PCs can't leave until they kill her.
2. As long as any one of the five main prisoners remains active, the other ones can rejuvenate as normal.
3. The ghost of the Splatter Man has actually left the prison and is now possessing Gibbs. Gibbs has spells now, and nasty powers like corrupting touch. But he's not actually an undead monster, so the cleric can't just swat him.
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How did the PCs get to the Splatterman without finding the badge first? The hallway to the north of his room is blocked by an iron portcullis that can't be opened, and the secret passage is in the room where the warden's corpse/badge is.
Refusing to allow their alignments to be changed? I can see why the GM was getting tired of the game. Those kind of players would quickly find themselves never invited back to a game in my playgroup.
I think, for story purposes, the Splatterman should rejuvinate if the PC's don't beat the other ghosts fast enough.
You have discovered the exact reason why I've banned cleric as a PC class in the Carrion Crown game I'm running. Channel positive energy completely breaks the first book, and The Haunting of Harrowstone is such a cool adventure that it's really a shame not to be able to run it as it deserves.
I did the same thing. I baned cleric and paladin, because I knew that it would become a one-man show. I didn't want the other players to get overshadowed.
If you do run the Splatter Man again, throw away the recommended tactics and have him hide in walls, popping out to whack people with corrupting touch and then hiding inside again. See if they can handle *that*! :)
Eh, it makes the first adventure a bit annoying, but it doesn't greatly effect the overall game. By the time you reach another undead-heavy book, things have channel resistance. If a player really wants to make himself an undead killer, he's going to be very bored in most of 2 through 4.
Our GM had Vessoriana tell us that the ghosts would rejuvinate after a few days so we had to quickly defeat them all and get her the badge so she could banish them once and for all.
As for Splatterman, GM had him hover 20ft in the air over the pit so melee was completely out of the question. Cleric had 1 channel left, we were out of haunt syphons, and only had 2 of the ghosttouch arrows left. Not as devious as hiding in the walls but it wasnt a complete cakewalk either.
Such awesome ideas, thanks guys! I was talking with my boyfriend, who is an experienced DM and he's going to help me re-stat Vesorianna for a big bad fight.
I don't think I would have done this if they were so overpowered, but from what I've observed from game time, it's been a cakewalk for a few of them. I almost killed my alchemist, but I've done nothing but clink the armor of the cleric.
And the portcullis is indeed broken and jammed into the ground, but with an adamantine mug (added for a big of flavor), it didn't take too long for the alchemist to break it down.
Yeah, the game when I played it was fun, but the other players just weren't meshing right with the group and unfortunately disbanded almost as soon as we finished Harrowstone. My DM offered to run an entirely evil campaign for them, but they assured us they weren't evil characters.
The advice given on this site is always sound. I enjoy these forums so much. Thank you guys again so much for the advice!
Such awesome ideas, thanks guys! I was talking with my boyfriend, who is an experienced DM and he's going to help me re-stat Vesorianna for a big bad fight.
I don't think I would have done this if they were so overpowered, but from what I've observed from game time, it's been a cakewalk for a few of them. I almost killed my alchemist, but I've done nothing but clink the armor of the cleric.
And the portcullis is indeed broken and jammed into the ground, but with an adamantine mug (added for a big of flavor), it didn't take too long for the alchemist to break it down.
Yeah, the game when I played it was fun, but the other players just weren't meshing right with the group and unfortunately disbanded almost as soon as we finished Harrowstone. My DM offered to run an entirely evil campaign for them, but they assured us they weren't evil characters.
The advice given on this site is always sound. I enjoy these forums so much. Thank you guys again so much for the advice!
an adamantine mug
Just for fun:
If 20 arrows weigh 3 lbs, 1 arrow would weigh about 2.4 oz [3*16/20]For simplicity, we'll assume that iron/steel and adamantine have the same weight.
If it costs +60gp to create 1 adamantine arrow, we can assume that 2.4 oz of adamantine costs roughly 60gp. (1 Adamantine Unit, 2.4 oz, costs 60gp)
A clay mug (volume = 1 pint) weighs 1 pound. A flask (I assume metal, volume also 1 pint) weighs 1.5 lbs. We'll assume a metal mug weighs roughly 2 lbs due to a slightly increased thickness from a flask.
Adamantine mug: weight in oz / adamantine unit * adamantine price per unit
32/2.4*60
That's an 800gp mug.
My math may be absolutely horrid here, so anyone may feel free to double check.
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Such awesome ideas, thanks guys! I was talking with my boyfriend, who is an experienced DM and he's going to help me re-stat Vesorianna for a big bad fight.
I don't think I would have done this if they were so overpowered, but from what I've observed from game time, it's been a cakewalk for a few of them. I almost killed my alchemist, but I've done nothing but clink the armor of the cleric.
And the portcullis is indeed broken and jammed into the ground, but with an adamantine mug (added for a big of flavor), it didn't take too long for the alchemist to break it down.
Yeah, the game when I played it was fun, but the other players just weren't meshing right with the group and unfortunately disbanded almost as soon as we finished Harrowstone. My DM offered to run an entirely evil campaign for them, but they assured us they weren't evil characters.
The advice given on this site is always sound. I enjoy these forums so much. Thank you guys again so much for the advice!
Hey, I threw in an adamantine mug too! I had the barkeep offer it as the prize in a drinking game. The main reason I did so was to try to give them a chance against that nasty haunted scythe. That was a clever move by them, using it to break down the portcullis.
One more tip: Harrowstone as-written is almost 100% undead, but consider throwing in a few extra non-undead encounters that play more to the strengths of the characters who have had a tougher time. Give them a chance to shine, so that they don't feel like they're inferior to the divine-casting ghostbusters.
Specifically, for your Alchemist, maybe put in a rat swarm down in the dungeons or a mosquito swarm up by the Piper for him to kill with his bombs. Not too much the Inquisitor should be able to do against those things!
Gonna run what may likely be the last session of Harrowstone tomorrow (well, more likely in 9 hours).
I did a drinking contest for the adamantine mug as well! Apparently that's a common idea, and a good one at that.
The players that have been frustrated with the undead-heavy dungeon were pleased to hear that Trial of the Beast was not so full of them.
My Alchemist is more fond of the feral thing, and likes to mutagen himself up for big fights. He bought his own little hulk mini for when he changes. I don't know yet if he's going to go the bomb route, but that will definitely be something to think about.
The biggest problem with the cleric is that he has some kind of trait (I can't for the life of me find it now) that completely negates channel resistance. So, it doesn't matter how much channel resistance a creature will have in future books--his channel bypasses it and I take damage regardless. Plus he has seven a day. I'm not gonna lie, as a new DM that really irks me, especially since he's had it since 1st level. I'll get over it, though.
I still have to rebuild Vesorianna though, so I'm going to do that now.
& that is one expensive adamantine mug! I would try to convince the Alchemist to sell it, but I'm pretty sure he's become fond of it. :D
Thanks again for all the help, guys.
The biggest problem with the cleric is that he has some kind of trait (I can't for the life of me find it now) that completely negates channel resistance. So, it doesn't matter how much channel resistance a creature will have in future books--his channel bypasses it and I take damage regardless. Plus he has seven a day. I'm not gonna lie, as a new DM that really irks me, especially since he's had it since 1st level. I'll get over it, though.
Quick bit of sort of related advice. You need to have your players leave their sheets with you after the next session. Familiarize yourself with all their abilities, feats, and traits. I don't want to suggest they're cheating, but the only thing I could find that negates channel resist is a 20th level class ability. It could be that you have a player looking to take advantage of the fact that you're unfamiliar with certain aspects of the game, or that they're misreading the ability, but either way it probably doesn't work that way.
Also, check their ability scores. I don't know what point buy you used (I would suggest 15 points going forward for AP's), but seven channels per day seems excessive at such a low level.
Sun's Blessing from the Sun domain does that.
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Andrea1 is right, that's what the ability is called. I wasn't able to find it last night. I do have all their character sheets--I printed a party tracking sheet to follow their saves and stuff like that. They're also using 20 point buy.
So, what I ended up doing with Vesorianna:
The PCs finished off Father Charlatan and The Piper rather quickly, even with 8 burning skeletons that I threw in.
Incidentally they failed to search Warden Hawkran's body when they found him, so they didn't get the badge. They returned to Vesorianna and she told them that his badge was located in The Splatterman's oubliette.
When they got down there and found the badge, Vesorianna appeared behind them and asked for it. My Alchemist handed it to her--she smiled, her blue hue turned red, she screamed and vanished. The walls around the room started dripping with blood, and her name "Vesorianna" was drawn in blood in every corner and slab of the wall.
Her tactics - she would fly in and out of the wall, using the corrupting touch of the Splatterman. Or she would remain hidden and use a full action to summon 2 ectoplasmic humans.
I also used a "Furious Five" haunt, utilizing every one of the five prisoners. They went on Initiative 10, or Vesorianna could force on her turn every d4 rounds.
The Piper would, on a failed DC15 Will Save, cause 1d6 damage flavored as stirge stings on a PC's neck
Father Charlatan would, on a failed DC14 Will Save, have the person affected as if by a Hold Person effect, flavored as ghostly chains.
The Lopper would attack with a +7 touch, doing 1d6 bleed damage to heal Vesorianna.
The Mosswater Marauder would attack with a +3 touch, doing 1d6 damage, and causing a PC to be staggered.
The Splatterman would, on a DC16 Will Save, caused 2 points Wisdom Damage.
Only one of the five would pop out during the Haunt's turn.
Vesorianna had 62 HP, while the haunt had 36.
It was a very good fight. It was interesting also because in this fight, my other players shined--the sun cleric had used up all his channels in the Charlatan fight. The MVP was Luna, the good old fashioned original fighter--who functioned with a keen magical longsword and brute strength potions and enlarge person from the wizard schooled in transmutation. Also the Fort Saves my players made were VERY good. Vesorianna only ended up doing half damage to all of them when touched--however the lowest damage dealt was 12 points.
Thanks again everyone for all your help, and I hope you think our flavor Big Bad Boss Fight was pretty sweet.
*edited for context.
Damn, that is cool. If I run this again I will probably do something like that! Thanks!
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Fantastic, palindromicsquare! Looks like the boards have improved another game! :)
BTW, I can't claim credit for the idea of making Vesorianna the BBEG. That was first thought up by Metal Mage over on the main HoH advice thread. I just thought it was so cool that I wish I could have run it myself!
I think your "Furious Five" haunt is a FANTASTIC addition, though! Really, if I ever get a chance to run HoH again, I'm stealing your fight in its entirety!
We did haunting of the harrowstone for kicks and a solo just as a "kick off the halloween month" crew went in as four inquisitor mulitclasses.
Inquisitor/monk
Inquisitor/magus
Inquisitor/Ranger
Inquisitor/cleric.
it was an undead hunt fest and quite fun.
Beat the dungeon in under 4 hours.
Outstanding and I love the concept! Its a thing of beauty... the furious five thing. Hope your players appreciated it.
Yeah I might use the furious five haunt in my game the first time they enter the harrow stone
Dear palindromicsquare:
Thanks brosephine, I'm 100% for sure gonna' use Vers as my last boss with the template you drew up for her.
Very exciting.