Can a creature with Burrow bore through walls?
How about wooden doors?
How about the hull of a ship?
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Unfortunately, Burrow is not defined in pathfinder. Note: Earth Glide is a subset of burrow, it is not burrow.
Here is the relevant text from 3.5:
Burrow: A creature with a burrow speed can tunnel through dirt, but not through rock unless the descriptive text says otherwise. Creatures cannot charge or run while burrowing. Most burrowing creatures do not leave behind tunnels other creatures can use (either because the material they tunnel through fills in behind them or because they do not actually dislocate any material when burrowing); see the individual creature descriptions for details.
Thus, any answer is outside of RAW.
However, I would say no, burrow cannot burrow through wood/stone/metal walls/doors/hulls unless the ability states it can. Use the normal rules for breaching those substances. Maybe allow the creature to bypass some of the hardness if that is appropriate. But that is GM fiat territory.
- Gauss
So An earth elemental would be stopped cold by the roots of a tree?
A Bullete can basically swim through hard-packed ground but would be stopped cold by a wooden door?
A Thoqqua, which can swim through solid rock, can't go through a ship's hull?
Why is wood harder to get through than earth and stone?
Well, a Bullete could attack a wooden door and destroy it using the "attack to object" rule.
One could also make the opposite question: can a earthworm cross through a wooden hull? or an iron hull for that matter? Can a mole make a 20' hole in wood in one round?
In Pathfinder there's no descrpition about Burrow. In 3.5, it only worked on earth (not even on rock, or stone). So a mole can dig your yard, but can't dig the stone floor of your castle's dungeon. That was so in 3.5, as I said. Pathfinder has no rule about it.
Talking about earth elementals, they also have "earth glide". So one could assume they don't "burrow tunnels", they have burrowing movement because they can move through stone and earth as it weren't there. The same might not be true for wood (or even paper).
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Burrow
School transmutation; Level alchemist 3, druid 3, ranger 3,
sorcerer/wizard 3
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range touch
Target creature touched
Duration 1 minute/level
Saving Throw Will negates (harmless); Spell Resistance yes
(harmless)
The subject can burrow at a speed of 15 feet (or 10 feet if it
wears medium or heavy armor, or if it carries a medium or
heavy load) through sand, loose soil, or gravel, or at a speed
of 5 feet through stone. Using burrow requires only as much
concentration as walking, so the subject can attack or cast
spells normally. The burrowing creature cannot charge or run.
Loose material collapses behind the target 1 round after it
leaves the area. This spell does not give the target the ability
to breathe underground, so when passing through loose
material, the creature must hold its breath and take only short
trips, or else it may suffocate.
Ultimate Magic pg. 210.
I allowed my PCs to use it to burrow through wood because I knew what they wanted to use it for and I knew it was going to come back to bite them. Per RAW however, no, you cannot use the spell to burrow through wood.
Earthworms don't Burrow. They just dig/eat.
The Burrow ability is a nigh-supernatural movement type where a creature moves through solid material at the about the same pace that other creatures walk.
Many things (thoqqua, for example) can Burrow through stone. Why would a wooden door slow them down?
Purple Worms live in jungles where the entire ground is laced with thick interlocking roots. They can't burrow through them?
Why is burrowing stopped by wood?
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Because the rules don't say wood is a valid material for burrowing. Sand, loose soil, gravel, stone, these are all materials that can be burrowed through. Wood isn't on the list. So that would be why burrowing is stopped by wood, because wood isn't on the list.
If you don't like that, feel free to make a house rule.
Again, why would thick wood stop something that stone doesn't?
Why could a Bullete carve through hard packed plains like a shark, but the moment it hits a treeline, where the dirt is softer, the roots are somehow a deterrent?
Makes no sense. Either Burrow is a natural ability (possessed by many natural creatures), and has to obey common sense because it's natural, or it's supernatural, in which case something like stone being easier to move through than wood makes perfect sense.
I'm pretty sure it's listed as an Extraordinary ability, which means it's pretty much natural and not aided or hindered by anything supernatural. If that's the case, then wood should be easier to go through than dirt and rock.
Earthworms don't Burrow. They just dig/eat.
The Burrow ability is a nigh-supernatural movement type where a creature moves through solid material at the about the same pace that other creatures walk.
Many things (thoqqua, for example) can Burrow through stone. Why would a wooden door slow them down?
Purple Worms live in jungles where the entire ground is laced with thick interlocking roots. They can't burrow through them?
Why is burrowing stopped by wood?
Because as you said its nigh-supernatural. Its an ability that is not bound by physics and as such looking at in terms "This is harder then that so shouldn't it work on that?" is well flat out wrong.
It is like asking why Stone Shape won't work on wood. Because its a spell with power over stone. Burrowing is a ability/spell with power over earth and stone. Not wood.
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Hiya.
I think the problem some are having is reading the rules and noting things that aren't there as if they were specifically excluded during the writing of said rules.
Because the rules don't say wood is a valid material for burrowing. Sand, loose soil, gravel, stone, these are all materials that can be burrowed through. Wood isn't on the list. So that would be why burrowing is stopped by wood, because wood isn't on the list.
(not trying to 'pick on' you Corren28, just using your quote as an example)
The above rules also doesn't reference air, or water, so, because it isn't on the list, the resulting (false) logic is that the Burrow ability actually can't be used. Ever.
Of course, that isn't how the rules are supposed to be used. The rules are there as base-line "here's the gist of it" guidelines for running a RPG campaign of some consistency. Using non-specific words like "soil", "sand" and "gravel" are not specific for a reason. This way, a competent GM can read the rules, look at the situation, and then make his own decision for his campaign.
So, basically, why "can't" a creature with Burrow mow through a ship's hull? No reason other than it was never specifically mentioned. If it makes sense for you to have a bulette tear through a ship's hull in one round...do it. If you think it's not cool, disallow it. Most likely there will be some middle ground (e.g., the bulette is considered to always to maximum critical damage each round to the wood, for example). The point is this: The rules are not about specifically excluding or including specific things...the rules are about "here's the baseline, use your own brain to figure out the weird situations". If a GM can't make up his own decision on how to handle things in game, maybe GM'ing isn't for him/her.
^_^
Paul L. Ming
Again, why would thick wood stop something that stone doesn't?
Why could a Bullete carve through hard packed plains like a shark, but the moment it hits a treeline, where the dirt is softer, the roots are somehow a deterrent?
Makes no sense. Either Burrow is a natural ability (possessed by many natural creatures), and has to obey common sense because it's natural, or it's supernatural, in which case something like stone being easier to move through than wood makes perfect sense.
I'm pretty sure it's listed as an Extraordinary ability, which means it's pretty much natural and not aided or hindered by anything supernatural. If that's the case, then wood should be easier to go through than dirt and rock.
A bullete can dig through the dirt, and the roots are just "difficult terrain" for him. Not very different from walking in the surface through a dense bush.
Burrow is supernatural, or natural, depending on the creature. A (regular) Badger have burrow 10'. I find it difficult to see a badger making a 20' hole in a big sequoia in one turn, let alone making a 20' hole in say, the Chinese Great Wall.
Several others animals have burrow too. Wolverines , for example. And, although not listed, probably moles, or earthworms. Some other creatures have supernatural burrow ability. Like a Xorn, who just melt with the stone and "swim" about it.
The Thoqqua, specifies:
"Thoqquas are cantankerous creatures of f ire and slag.
Their bodies generate incredible heat that allows them
to burrow or melt through most surfaces, even solid
rock"
Unless specifically described so in the creature ability, as an exception (ie: thoqqua), they can't burrow through stone, or burrow at 5' per turn. A bulette can't make a big 60' hole in pure granite in a round.
I'm going to cite a few burrowing creatures in the Bestiary:
"Ankhegs burrow with their legs and mandibles,
moving with unsettling speed through loose soil, sand,
gravel, and the like—they cannot burrow through solid
stone."
Bulettes:
"Burrowing rapidly through the earth just
beneath the surface, sometimes with its armored
fin cutting a distinctive wake behind it"
By the way, earth elementals burrow is related to it's glide ability. They can go through stone, but they can't go through other materials. That include not only wood, but even cloth or paper, because they cant "wood glide", only "earth glide". It's described as :
"Earth Glide (Ex) A burrowing earth elemental can pass through
stone, dirt, or almost any other sort of earth except metal as
easily as a fish swims through water. If protected against fire
damage, it can even glide through lava. Its burrowing leaves
behind no tunnel or hole, nor does it create any ripple or
other sign of its presence."
Burrowing isn't "phasing". That's Earth Glide. I could definitely see roots or doors stopping Earth Glide, but not Burrow.
Burrowing is just digging, like using a shovel very quickly.
If a critter can only dig through dirt, I can see wood being a problem for them, but if they can dig through stone, wood's actually easier than they are used to.
Aslo, no rules anywhere mention anything acting as "difficult terrain" while burrowing. Purple Worms don't get slowed down by roots in the jungle. If they did it would be mentioned somewhere.
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Multiple people have already given you your solution. No, per RAW, burrow does not allow you to pass through wood unless specifically stated. Per RAW, said creature would make an attack against the object and (probably) tear through it with ease.
If this makes no sense to you, just create a house rule and allow burrow to apply to wood as well. It's an easy fix bro.
(not trying to 'pick on' you Corren28, just using your quote as an example)
No worries! :)
The scenario that sparked the question was an earth elemental burrowing through a wooden ship hull in order to put a hole in the ship, if that helps anyone think about the answer.
That said, there is only one really correct RAW answer: it's up to the DM. Yeah, usually not the right answer in the rules forum, but in this case, Paizo forgot to to write any rules in Pathfinder saying what burrow actually does. Therefore, all the stuff masquerading as RAW in this thread is really just arguing what is the best house rule and whether to bring old 3.5 stuff (like d20pfsrd did) into it.
Personally I would adjudicate the initial question by stealing the break DC for a sturdy wooden door and having the elemental roll against it with a +2 to represent its burrowy prowess. Mostly because when I DM I habitually use circumstantial +2s to adjudicate cool/advantageous things not strictly covered by RAW. But if the DM wants to make it automatic success, or plain impossible, or anything in between, in this case he would be exactly as close to the RAW as I with any of those answers.
As a minor aside with little relationship to anything, having in the past worked on a trail crew digging stuff with shovels and other hand tools for a living, I can say that a thick tree root is way more of an impediment to digging than a five hundred pound rock. Tree roots - at least, big ones of the sort one finds when working in an old growth forest - are a huge g!&*~&n pain in the everything. Boulders are practically an aid to digging, you pull out the boulder in five minutes and get a big old hole for practically free.
Does this have any relationship to the imaginary ability of a creature which doesn't need to displace things to burrow through them (I personally imagine an earth elemental moving through earth like a wave through water)? Nope!
It seems to me that a good way of looking at it would be to compare Hardness.
Dirt doesn't really have Hardness, so things that burrow through dirt could only go through things with no hardness (like cloth, which makes sense. A Badger could definitely shred a sack in no time).
Stone has a hardness of 8. Things that can Burrow through stone could go through things with Hardness 8 or less. This keeps Earth Elementals from being stopped by sheets of glass.
Badgers have a problem burrowing through tree roots. Earth Elementals dont. Thoqqua (which can Burrow though just about anything according to their description) could probably even ignore/melt metal.
The issues of Burrowing through Stone Golems is avoided entirely by the fact that Creatures have DR, not Hardness. Once the golem was dead, then it could be Burrowed through.
Burrowing isn't "phasing". That's Earth Glide. I could definitely see roots or doors stopping Earth Glide, but not Burrow.
Burrowing is just digging, like using a shovel very quickly.
If a critter can only dig through dirt, I can see wood being a problem for them, but if they can dig through stone, wood's actually easier than they are used to.
Aslo, no rules anywhere mention anything acting as "difficult terrain" while burrowing. Purple Worms don't get slowed down by roots in the jungle. If they did it would be mentioned somewhere.
In game, burrowing is not digging. It's a mode of movement that depends on the creature. Thoqqua don't dig, they melt their way. Purple worms don't dig, they eat whatever is in front of them, explicitly minerals, gems and rocks too (so yes, probably roots as well). Ankhegs dig with their jaws and legs, but it's explicitly said that he can only do so through dirt, not through stone or other materials (that includes wood). Xorns, on the other hand, don't dig, they glide through stone.
In the case of Earth elementals, Earth Glide is the way they get their "burrowing" mode of movement.
It's in their Earth Glide description:
"Earth Glide (Ex) A burrowing earth elemental can pass through stone, dirt, or almost any other sort of earth except metal as easily as a fish swims through water. If protected against fire damage, it can even glide through lava. Its burrowing leaves behind no tunnel or hole, nor does it create any ripple or other sign of its presence."
The burrowing of a Thoqqua melt stuff, that includes metal, except *maybe* Adamantine or some other special stuff, because that's it's description. The burrowing of an Ankhegg goes through dirt but not through stone, that's it's description too. The burrowing of an earth elemental, though, leaves behind no tunnel or hole
Earthworms don't Burrow. They just dig/eat.
The Burrow ability is a nigh-supernatural movement type where a creature moves through solid material at the about the same pace that other creatures walk.
Many things (thoqqua, for example) can Burrow through stone. Why would a wooden door slow them down?
Purple Worms live in jungles where the entire ground is laced with thick interlocking roots. They can't burrow through them?
Why is burrowing stopped by wood?
Because it takes a badger a little while to dig out of a wooden box.
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It's in their Earth Glide description...
I read that as "Earth Glide is something Earth Elementals can do while burrowing". It's an option, the same way someone who is running can also jump.
An earth elemental can Earth Glide. They can also burrow normally. Why would Earth Glide be the only way they can burrow?
Because it takes a badger a little while to dig out of a wooden box.
A badger, sure. How about a Thoqqua?
I sort of covered that in my hardness idea.
Seems like Burrow would benefit from some additional specificity within the general movement type, kind of like Fly has.
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It's in their Earth Glide description...
I read that as "Earth Glide is something Earth Elementals can do while burrowing". It's an option, the same way someone who is running can also jump.
An earth elemental can Earth Glide. They can also burrow normally. Why would Earth Glide be the only way they can burrow?
What is, in game terms, "burrow normally"? Is it to remove earth using your hands/claws as shovels, making a tunnel? If that's burrowing... how does a purpple worm burrow, then? Or a Thoqqua?
Why wouldn't it the only way they can burrow? Why would them be able to borrow other creatures form of burrow, such as the Bullette form? Can they melt things like Thoqquas? Or eat their way such as purple worms?
Burrowing is not a "rule", it's a "mode of movement". Having the mode of movement "burrow" is similar to having the mode of movement "swim". Just because Michael Phelps the Merfolk has a swimming movemen't and a python has it too, it doesn't means the python can swim using butterfly stroke as Phelps does. Just because a dove and a helicopter both have fly mode of movement doesn't mean the helicopter can glide using his wings.
That a creature, as an earth elemental, or Thoqqua, or Purple Worm, or Bullette, share a mode of movement. The "burrow X feet" in their entrance has no other rule meaning, but th amount of feet they can move underground. Each of those mode of movements is different, and how it works is described in the description. For example, the ankheg use his jaws. The bulette use his claws. The Thoqqua doesn't use his jaws or his claws, use his melting bore head. The purple worm, on the other hand, eat through the earth. And the Earth Elemental *glides* through stone. Assuming the earth elemental can borrow the Bulette or Ankheg method has no support in the earth elemental description, and thus has the same back up than assuming they can borrow the Thoqqua or Purple Worm method. To be able to *claw* their way into earth like the bulette does, an earth elemental would need.... claws. Which it doesn't have, it has slams as his listed mode of attack, not claws. Slamming through dirt sounds as a poor method to build a tunnel.
EDIT: Also, note that the Earth Glide description says " Its burrowing leaves behind no tunnel or hole, nor does it create any ripple or other sign of its presence." Not "Its earthgliding leave behidn no tunnel or hole", it's describing his burrowing method as a whole.
I understand what you're saying. It just seems very silly to me that an Earth Elemental can't dig a hole. Really, they should be the undisputed kings of digging holes, at least until the invention of the shovel elemental.