Paizo Top Nav Branding
  • Hello, Guest! |
  • Sign In |
  • My Account |
  • Shopping Cart |
  • Help/FAQ
About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game
Pathfinder Society

Pathfinder Beginner Box

Pathfinder Adventure Card Game

Pathfinder Comics

Pathfinder Legends

RPG Superstar 2015

Why weren't Aboleths copyrighted?


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion

51 to 71 of 71 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>

Displacer Beasts were cut whole cloth out of one of the short stories in Voyage of the Space Beagle, a late 40's or early 50's science fiction work by A.E. Van Vogt.

I've read the story, and can confirm it definitely had to be the inspiration. Well not exactly, that thing in the short story was SCARY.

I'm no lawyer, but it would be hard for me to imagine they could win a court case if someone actually wanted to test the waters on that monster.

And just for giggles, a link to the wikipedia entry on the original alien lifeform.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coeurl


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Haven't read any of the Barsoom books, so just basing that on what someone else sometime ago said here (I think?)

Point about the Drow is that the name at least might not be copyrightable.

Interestingly, from what little perusal of the 4E bestiaries I have done, most of the newer monsters seemed to have been invented from scratch. I am assuming this is to make their IP more defendable.

ON a related note, Trow would be excellent as a playable troll race.

Liberty's Edge Star Voter 2013, Star Voter 2014

Sean K Reynolds wrote:
samurai + spacefaring culture + psychic powers + laser swords = original concept.

Man, that sounds awesome!

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber
Ryan. Costello wrote:
Sean K Reynolds wrote:
samurai + spacefaring culture + psychic powers + laser swords = original concept.
Man, that sounds awesome!

I know right... Someone should totally do this... oh, wait...

Nevermind...

These are not the droids you're looking for, move along! ;-P


Yeah, Star Wars is fantasy...in spaaaace.

Probably why I like it so much. ^.^


How about this. If your reading this there is a high probability that you're older than the internet. Tell a kid that to truly freak them out.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
How about this. If your reading this there is a high probability that you're older than the internet. Tell a kid that to truly freak them out.

Hm. According to The Fount of All Knowledge, the Internet was named in 1982, so you figure that the majority of people here are thirty and up? I guess that's reasonable.


John Woodford wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
How about this. If your reading this there is a high probability that you're older than the internet. Tell a kid that to truly freak them out.
Hm. According to The Fount of All Knowledge, the Internet was named in 1982, so you figure that the majority of people here are thirty and up? I guess that's reasonable.

I assume most here are 30+, but I really am not sure of the paizo posters demographic. I took a chance.

Edit: especially in the "look how old we are" thread.


It may be changing with the introduction of the Beginner Box, but I've always assumed a similar demographic.


John Woodford wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
How about this. If your reading this there is a high probability that you're older than the internet. Tell a kid that to truly freak them out.
Hm. According to The Fount of All Knowledge, the Internet was named in 1982, so you figure that the majority of people here are thirty and up? I guess that's reasonable.

I was born after the internet then. There goes my plan for world domination.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

30+ is reasonable, yes, but in any case the majority are definitely older than the World-Wide Web (1991).

Sovereign Court

Damn...born five years too late...but i am older then when the internet began to acutally be used by a lot of people...does that count?

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
sunbeam wrote:

Displacer Beasts were cut whole cloth out of one of the short stories in Voyage of the Space Beagle, a late 40's or early 50's science fiction work by A.E. Van Vogt.

I've read the story, and can confirm it definitely had to be the inspiration. Well not exactly, that thing in the short story was SCARY.

I'm no lawyer, but it would be hard for me to imagine they could win a court case if someone actually wanted to test the waters on that monster.

And just for giggles, a link to the wikipedia entry on the original alien lifeform.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coeurl

The Coeurl has actually appeared in Pathfinder volume 22, The End of Eternity, p 78-79. They were not released as Open Content, however, just statted up for 3.5 while the IP remains fully under the control of the Van Vogt estate.

(There's only been one other monster to appear in the pages of the Pathfinder AP to not also be released as OGC, Penny Arcade's Deep Crows, which are in Pathfinder volume 16, Endless Night.)

Star Voter 2013

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Hama wrote:
Damn...born five years too late...but i am older then when the internet began to acutally be used by a lot of people...does that count?

Hmmmph. I have graph paper maps of dungeons that are older than you. Now get offa my lawn.


Bill Dunn wrote:
It's possible that the dark elves have a root in the Prose Edda since they are swarthy, apparently evil (at least their behavior contrasts with the light elves as much as their forms do), and live underground. Even without considering the spiders and matriarchy, that's probably enough reason to not try to make them particularly important IP, withheld from the SRD.

Yeah, from what I've read, seems like the drow took after the Dökkálfr in Norse mythology.

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

Sean K Reynolds wrote:
MMCJawa wrote:
Drow are from folklore. Shetlands or Hebrides, can't remember which. Although in folklore they were less dark-skinned, white-haired elves, and more ugly troll-like fairies.

... which is why D&D/OGL drow are distinct from folklore "trow."

In the same way that if I create a race of short, orange-skinned, hairless creatures who eat only bacon and call them "elves," they're quite distinct from folklore elves, Tolkien elves, and D&D/OGL elves.

MMCJawa wrote:
On top of that, I actually think the appearance/personality of Drow is taken from a race in one of the Barsoom books, so really, not a whole lot of originality there to cling to.

I'm a big fan of the Barsoom books, and I don't recall any of the Barsoomian races looking like drow (the black-skinned martians look human, not elven, and I don't think they have white hair) or have a culture like drow (they worship a female queen as a goddess, but she is a mortal, and not associated with spiders).

Evil elf + underground + matriarchy + spider goddess + unique magical powers = original concept, in the same way that samurai + spacefaring culture + psychic powers + laser swords = original concept.

Sean, you need to read Gods of Mars again. The drow society is clearly modeled on the black martians.


I love this thread ^_^ !

Voyage of the Space Beagle is the first SF book I read, at the tender age of 12 something, in its french translation La Faune de L'Espace ("Fauna from Space").

Not one year after that I discovered D&D basic, and then AD&D in high school. I never made the connection between the displacer beast and the cat-thing in the Beagle though :-D !

And now I want to read Gods of Mars...

Vive les aboleths !


Quiche Lisp wrote:

I love this thread ^_^ !

Voyage of the Space Beagle is the first SF book I read, at the tender age of 12 something, in its french translation La Faune de L'Espace ("Fauna from Space").

Not one year after that I discovered D&D basic, and then AD&D in high school. I never made the connection between the displacer beast and the cat-thing in the Beagle though :-D !

And now I want to read Gods of Mars...

Vive les aboleths !

That book has been pretty influential for whatever reason. I've read some stuff that suggest it inspired the 1950's science fiction film, Forbidden Planet.

I've also read stuff that indicated Forbidden Planet was the inspiration for Star Trek.

Other people have written that Star Trek was based directly on Voyage of the Space Beagle. A character on the Beagle was suspiciously like Mr. Spock in demeanor and competence. Also the Beagle was on a "10 year voyage of discovery."

And then there is this:

"Antecedents
In the decades since its original release critics have analyzed and acknowledged Alien's roots in earlier works of fiction. It has been noted as sharing thematic similarities with earlier science fiction films such as The Thing from Another World (1951)[12][89] and It! The Terror from Beyond Space (1958),[19][63] as well as a kinship with other 1970s horror films such as Jaws (1975) and Halloween (1978).[12] Literary connections have also been suggested, including thematic comparisons to And Then There Were None (1939).[89] Many critics have also suggested that the film derives in part from A. E. van Vogt's The Voyage of the Space Beagle (1950), particularly the stories The Black Destroyer, in which a cat-like alien infiltrates the ship and hunts the crew, and Discord in Scarlet, in which an alien implants parasitic eggs inside crew members which then hatch and eat their way out.[90] O'Bannon, however, denies that this was a source of his inspiration for Alien's story.[15] Van Vogt actually initiated a lawsuit against 20th Century Fox over the similarities, but Fox settled out of court.[91] Writer David McIntee has also noted similarities to the Doctor Who episode "The Ark in Space" (1975), in which an insectoid queen alien lays larvae inside humans which later eat their way out, a life cycle inspired by that of the ichneumons wasp.[15]

Contributor

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Erik Mona wrote:
Sean, you need to read Gods of Mars again. The drow society is clearly modeled on the black martians.

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED.


Hmmm 175 pages of John Carter eating up the story. Including about 20 pages of Tars Tarkas and John Carter fighting back to back, with an ending interlude with Thuvia.

1/2 page of some random dude expounding on the religious beliefs of the Black Martians.

The rest of it is blah except for Woola coming back, and Carthoris' introduction. Then Dejah Thoris is locked in that clock prison.

Shouldn't take too long. I mean to evaluate whether this novel influenced Gygax's dark elves. They definitely had a female goddess Issus, but I don't remember them being matriarchal.


see wrote:


The only monsters that, in the opinion of Ryan Dancey in 2000, met both those criteria were "beholder, gauth, carrion crawler, displacer beast, githyanki, githzerai, mind flayer, illithid, umber hulk, yuan-ti". So they were reserved, while everything else in the 3rd edition Monster Manual was released.

The actual copyright status of most of those is pretty ambiguous. And copyright law itself doesn't really let you monopolise either 'monster ideas' or 'monster names' - Trade Mark law may enable you to do the latter, if you are actually using them as a badge of origin. I could for instance use githyanki and githzerai in a non-OGL product, deriving them solely from their original appearance in White Dwarf magazine, which text was copyright Charles Stross, their creator.

But the copyright status of these monsters is completely irrelevant to the OGL. The OGL is a contractual license that lets the user use SRD material and prohibits the user from using designated 'Product Identity' such as mind flayers and githyanki. The copyright status of mind flayers or displacer beasts or githyanki is irrelevant to their status as forbidden PI under the SRD. If you use the OGL then you can't use designated PI.

51 to 71 of 71 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Paizo / Messageboards / Paizo Publishing / Pathfinder® / Pathfinder RPG / General Discussion / Why weren't Aboleths copyrighted? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.

©2002–2014 Paizo Inc.®. Need help? Email customer.service@paizo.com or call 425-250-0800 during our business hours: Monday–Friday, 10 AM–5 PM Pacific Time. View our privacy policy. Paizo Inc., Paizo, the Paizo golem logo, Pathfinder, the Pathfinder logo, Pathfinder Society, GameMastery, and Planet Stories are registered trademarks of Paizo Inc., and Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pathfinder Adventure Card Game, Pathfinder Player Companion, Pathfinder Modules, Pathfinder Tales, Pathfinder Battles, Pathfinder Online, PaizoCon, RPG Superstar, The Golem's Got It, Titanic Games, the Titanic logo, and the Planet Stories planet logo are trademarks of Paizo Inc. Dungeons & Dragons, Dragon, Dungeon, and Polyhedron are registered trademarks of Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and have been used by Paizo Inc. under license. Most product names are trademarks owned or used under license by the companies that publish those products; use of such names without mention of trademark status should not be construed as a challenge to such status.