Lore warden fighter builds?


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Ascalaphus wrote:
So I'm a bit confused here. It's become conventional wisdom on this forum that maneuvers aren't all that good because CMD rises too faster after say, level 8. Is the lorewarden an exception? Maneuver Mastery gives a nice bonus, but is that really all the difference you needed? Or were maneuvers not as hard as commonly said? (For a fighter, perhaps?)

The bonus to manoeuvres is really nice, and on top of that, you get Combat Expertise as a bonus feat, making the feat chain far less expensive. If you put a lot of effort into a few manoeuvres, it can work out, but they're hard to use at high levels without any investment.


Mergy wrote:
Ascalaphus wrote:
So I'm a bit confused here. It's become conventional wisdom on this forum that maneuvers aren't all that good because CMD rises too faster after say, level 8. Is the lorewarden an exception? Maneuver Mastery gives a nice bonus, but is that really all the difference you needed? Or were maneuvers not as hard as commonly said? (For a fighter, perhaps?)
The bonus to manoeuvres is really nice, and on top of that, you get Combat Expertise as a bonus feat, making the feat chain far less expensive. If you put a lot of effort into a few manoeuvres, it can work out, but they're hard to use at high levels without any investment.

Yes but several bonuses have multipurposes. a typical fighter would want WF, GWF and gloves of dueling it helps with DPR, not to mention weapon training is a class ability. So the Lore warden can be a very good at maneuvers and do good in the DPR. (and if the LW is a reach specialist with combat reflexes he would have good defenses against melee oponents)


I thought the Lore Warden was preferable for PFS play, for any group really, compared to a straight DPR fighter (for which Barbarian is a better option) because the Maneuvers are more about team-play. I figure it's more fun for the group when I can call out, "I've Tripped/Disarmed/Blinded the BBEG - come over and wail on him," especially compared to, "I one-shotted the BBEG! What do you mean the GM has nothing else prepared for tonight?"
It's also nice to have 6 skill points per level.


Also keep in mind one thing with dirty trick vs trip, the devs have ruled via blog that most dirty tricks maneuver are weapon independent so your weapon bonuses do not apply, unless your GM rules otherwise.

Trip weapon bonuses do apply, however, since flying and trip immune monsters become much more common the higher level you go, the weaker it becomes.


So how 'good' would a ranged focused Lore Warden be compared to one focusing on maneuvers? is one better then the other?

The Campaign I play alot in is mainly Humanoids. Also large numbers of enemies in giant open spaces.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

With Dirty Trick, once you have Quick Dirty Trick, can you DT in lieu of an AoO?


Galnörag wrote:
With Dirty Trick, once you have Quick Dirty Trick, can you DT in lieu of an AoO?

NO.

Quick Dirty Trick (Combat)
You can perpetrate a dirty trick and deliver an attack before your opponent is the wiser.

Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise, Improved Dirty Trick, base attack bonus +6.

Benefit: On your turn, you can perform a single dirty trick combat maneuver in place of one of your melee attacks. You must choose the melee attack with the highest base attack bonus to make the dirty trick combat maneuver.

Normal: A dirty trick combat maneuver is a standard action.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

So as a lore warden, you always best to keep a second manoeuvre in the tank that can be used in that way, like trip or disarm. Sure it is more constrained to "people with weapons or who can be tripped" but especially if you are using a reach weapon you can really impact a foe who provokes.

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