Spell combinations

[djtezlee]

Hi was wondering... if i cast a spell such as grease and a number of monsters fail and fall, then i cast a spell like fireball that targets reflex, do they instantly fail?

[Marthian]

no, they still get a reflex save if their prone, but at a -4 penalty. Still not bad.

Edit: Apparently, there isn't anything in Prone that says -4 penalty to reflex saves... Derp. (Although isn't it harder to dodge something while your on the floor rather than standing? I dunno.) But still, they are at a -4 penalty to attack rolls and AC regarding melee attacks.

[djtezlee]

do you know any other good combinations?

[Jiggy]

Marthian wrote:

no, they still get a reflex save if their prone, but at a -4 penalty. Still not bad.

Wait, what? Where's that rule from?

[Mark Hoover]

Wish for a villain to fail their next save the Death Spell?

I'm terrible at this so I'm dotting for reference.

[davidernst11]

Falling prone does not give a penalty to reflex saves. You get a -4 penalty to melee AC and a +4 bonus to ranged AC. Nothing happens to your reflex save or dexterity.

An entangled creature who is fatigued, shaken, and sickened would suffer a -7 to their reflex saves. Try that route.

[Mark Hoover]

So...you'd need to hit a single guy with a ray of sickening, a touch of fatigue, an entangle spell...THEN cast a fireball on him?

I'd rather just buff a 2hf w/a greatsword and retreat to a safe distance.

What other SPELL COMBOS are there? If a flaming sphere sets something on fire, does a freezing sphere freeze them? If so what about Freezing Sphere + shatter?

[Fionnabhair]

Ill Omen plus any spell that allows a save. Works best if quickened.

[Darksol the Painbringer]

djtezlee wrote:

Hi was wondering... if i cast a spell such as grease and a number of monsters fail and fall, then i cast a spell like fireball that targets reflex, do they instantly fail?

Honestly? Prone doesn't really detail that much in terms of penalties that one should normally get, and it's pretty stupid. I'd find it harder to escape something if I was on my back or stomach than I would if I was standing and able to move.

As a GM, I would verdict that the creatures would be considered flat-footed, meaning they would not receive their Dexterity Modifier to their saving throw (assuming that they can become prone via the grease spell, whereas some creatures cannot be, such as flying creatures and/or oozes and the like). But as far as an official ruling? They wouldn't be considered flat-footed, and there's no way in hell they'd auto-fail. Unfortunately, it would probably just be considered a standard save, which is pretty lame.

[Bertious]

Web + Fireball is a old time favorite. Web entangles foes causing them a -4 dex so -2 to reflex save and then to add insult to injury (well actually more injury to injury) the web causes an extra 2d4 fire damage to those in it with no save.

Black tenticles is also fun with this and for an added bonus can't be damaged by the fire ball.