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Bride of Government Folly


Off-Topic Discussions

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Freehold DM wrote:
Celestial Healer wrote:
A Man In Black wrote:
Quote:
She wasn't prosecuted for statutory rape. She was prosecuted for having an inappropriate relationship with a student.
And I didn't say she was prosecuted for statutory rape. She was prosecuted for a law that criminalizes abuse of an imbalance of power sexually. It's the same principle behind statutory rape and sexual harassment laws. Teachers should not be having sex with students for the same reason that adults should not have sex with minors and employers should not proposition employees: there is an inherent imbalance of power.

Emphasis mine

There is actually no law against an employer having sex with an employee. It only becomes sexual harassment when the advances are consistent and unwanted or when the employer proposes some sort of tit-for-tat arrangement.

If the teacher said, "That D I gave you on your essay could become an A if you partook in some 'extracurricular activity'," then I would agree that she should be charged with leveraging her position of authority to have sex with her students. Nothing here suggests that anything like that happened. I'm with FHDM: these are consenting adults. It is a professional lapse for which she should lose her job, but I can't see how we can justify jail time.

brofist

Not just her job, but her license. Her career as a teacher should DEFINITELY be finished. But she is NOT a sex offender- these were consenting adults.

Imprisoning consenting adults for sex seems draconian to me. It also seems like the state had to coerce the "victims" into testifying. This seems problematic to me. If the "victims" are consenting adults and they don't believe they are victims then this seems like a case of professional misconduct rather than sexual predation.

It seems to me that the finite resources of the state would be better applied to pursuing actual sexual predators like child rapists.

Is this law limited to high school?

It seems to me that this law could be a real mess for colleges.


Bitter Thorn wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
Celestial Healer wrote:
A Man In Black wrote:
Quote:
She wasn't prosecuted for statutory rape. She was prosecuted for having an inappropriate relationship with a student.
And I didn't say she was prosecuted for statutory rape. She was prosecuted for a law that criminalizes abuse of an imbalance of power sexually. It's the same principle behind statutory rape and sexual harassment laws. Teachers should not be having sex with students for the same reason that adults should not have sex with minors and employers should not proposition employees: there is an inherent imbalance of power.

Emphasis mine

There is actually no law against an employer having sex with an employee. It only becomes sexual harassment when the advances are consistent and unwanted or when the employer proposes some sort of tit-for-tat arrangement.

If the teacher said, "That D I gave you on your essay could become an A if you partook in some 'extracurricular activity'," then I would agree that she should be charged with leveraging her position of authority to have sex with her students. Nothing here suggests that anything like that happened. I'm with FHDM: these are consenting adults. It is a professional lapse for which she should lose her job, but I can't see how we can justify jail time.

brofist

Not just her job, but her license. Her career as a teacher should DEFINITELY be finished. But she is NOT a sex offender- these were consenting adults.

Imprisoning consenting adults for sex seems draconian to me. It also seems like the state had to coerce the "victims" into testifying. This seems problematic to me. If the "victims" are consenting adults and they don't believe they are victims then this seems like a case of professional misconduct rather than sexual predation.

It seems to me that the finite resources of the state would be better applied to pursuing actual sexual predators like child rapists.

Is this law limited to high...

according to the article, they refused to press charges, although they may have been forced to take the stand. I dunno on that last one.


Freehold DM wrote:
Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:
Man, where were these teachers when I was in high school?

BT, your thoughts?

I actually disagree with this very strongly. If these men were over the age of consent, she should have been fired, not prosecuted. I think her husband should have divorced her if she had a problem with it.

I also find it odd that the prosecution evidently never offered a plea bargain, and the county's media policy seems a bit strange too.

Testimony Concludes in Teacher Sex Trial

"Colleps agreed with her counsel not to put on a defense and stated that she nearly pleaded guilty on several occasions and was never offered a plea deal by the Tarrant County District Attorney's Office. The office could not say why no offer was extended because it's their policy not to speak to the media about a case until sentencing has concluded."


JOHANNESBURG — South African President Jacob Zuma has ordered an official inquiry into the police killing of 34 striking miners, the deadliest security operation in the country since the end of apartheid.

DA do you have any more on this?


Bitter Thorn wrote:

JOHANNESBURG — South African President Jacob Zuma has ordered an official inquiry into the police killing of 34 striking miners, the deadliest security operation in the country since the end of apartheid.

DA do you have any more on this?

No, I missed it entirely.

I'll look into it later tonight.


Sex, on the other hand, is important f~+%ing shiznit, so:

Bitter Thorn:
It seems to me that this law could be a real mess for colleges.

I'll bet dollars to donuts that this law was written for colleges.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

I did some digging. It's primary/secondary students only, but it wasn't meant to apply to adult students at all. It's merely poorly worded, without consideration that some high school students are adults. While I don't have a problem with criminalizing teachers abusing their power over non-post-secondary students per se, that's apparently not the intent of this law.


Bitter Thorn wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:
Man, where were these teachers when I was in high school?

BT, your thoughts?

I actually disagree with this very strongly. If these men were over the age of consent, she should have been fired, not prosecuted. I think her husband should have divorced her if she had a problem with it.

I also find it odd that the prosecution evidently never offered a plea bargain, and the county's media policy seems a bit strange too.

Testimony Concludes in Teacher Sex Trial

"Colleps agreed with her counsel not to put on a defense and stated that she nearly pleaded guilty on several occasions and was never offered a plea deal by the Tarrant County District Attorney's Office. The office could not say why no offer was extended because it's their policy not to speak to the media about a case until sentencing has concluded."

Indeed. Something tells me this particular county has had problems with something like this before. That's just a gut feeling, though.


Damn it. You want dollars or donuts.

Liberty's Edge

Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:
Damn it. You want dollars or donuts.

Is there a particular euphemism you're using here, or did you just want to say something as Don Juan?

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Since it's been reported she had sex with the four men at the same time, that may have had something to do with the prosecution and verdict. Remember that anal sex was illegal in Texas until recently.


Gark the Goblin wrote:
Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:
Damn it. You want dollars or donuts.
Is there a particular euphemism you're using here, or did you just want to say something as Don Juan?

I lost my dollars for donuts bet.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Krensky wrote:
Since it's been reported she had sex with the four men

Woah. I missed that.

Like I said, where were these teachers when I was in high school?


Krensky wrote:
Since it's been reported she had sex with the four men at the same time, that may have had something to do with the prosecution and verdict. Remember that anal sex was illegal in Texas until recently.

Hnn. A good point. And an ugly one.

Liberty's Edge

Sorry, I missed that it was you who made that particular bet.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

Krensky wrote:
Since it's been reported she had sex with the four men at the same time, that may have had something to do with the prosecution and verdict.

Yeah. This is why I suspected that it was coercive or abusive of her authority, myself. I'm not entirely happy with how the law is enforced in general given its intent, but like the last sex-with-a-just-barely-not-a-minor case in the last Folly thread (the guy who we thought was just charged because of pictures of an otherwise-consenting partner), it turns out it's a pretty hairy borderline case.


Bitter Thorn wrote:

JOHANNESBURG — South African President Jacob Zuma has ordered an official inquiry into the police killing of 34 striking miners, the deadliest security operation in the country since the end of apartheid.

DA do you have any more on this?

Committee for a Worker's International

There's tons of mainstream articles, but it doesn't seem to have hit my usual retinue of commie sites yet. Nothing on infowars, either. I'll check al-Jazeera and Russia Today.


The Tripartite Alliance between the African National Congress, the South African Communist Party and the Congress of South African Trade Unions has been under a lot of pressure because it turns out, surprise, surprise, without socialist revolution the overthrowing of apartheid just meant black faces among the Randlords and more crushing poverty in the townships.

The video on the al-Jazeera page has a speech by some dude who was an ANC youth leader and was kicked out for "fomenting division." The union that these wildcat strikers belong to is an independent, breakaway from the goverment-allied COSATU confederation.


Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

The Tripartite Alliance between the African National Congress, the South African Communist Party and the Congress of South African Trade Unions has been under a lot of pressure because it turns out, surprise, surprise, without socialist revolution the overthrowing of apartheid just meant black faces among the Randlords and more crushing poverty in the townships.

The video on the al-Jazeera page has a speech by some dude who was an ANC youth leader and was kicked out for "fomenting division." The union that these wildcat strikers belong to is an independent, breakaway from the goverment-allied COSATU confederation.

According to what little I know classism was just as bad in South Africa in the 80s as racism and apartheid systems of government.


Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

The Tripartite Alliance between the African National Congress, the South African Communist Party and the Congress of South African Trade Unions has been under a lot of pressure because it turns out, surprise, surprise, without socialist revolution the overthrowing of apartheid just meant black faces among the Randlords and more crushing poverty in the townships.

The video on the al-Jazeera page has a speech by some dude who was an ANC youth leader and was kicked out for "fomenting division." The union that these wildcat strikers belong to is an independent, breakaway from the goverment-allied COSATU confederation.

Are there any clear reports on who started the violence?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

I am not a Polack!!!

A li'l culture for y'all.

This is the REAL Kowalski!!!


2 people marked this as a favorite.

[Imagine a link to Raising Arizona here.]


Bitter Thorn wrote:
Are there any clear reports on who started the violence?

I didn't see any, no.

I asked my friend The Black Goblin about this and he had already been reading about it. He said that there had been an incident earlier in the week where two police officers had been killed. I think those are the same 2 officers mentioned in the article, but they might be different.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Comrade Anklebiter wrote:
[Imagine a link to Raising Arizona here.]

"Or maybe he just told one Pollack joke too many..."


South Africa

I haven't really been to Counterpunch much since Alexander Cockburn died--:(--but here's another article. I haven't actually read it yet.


And another.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

Louisiana has rolled out their school voucher programs, funding private religious schools with public funds, with Florida attempting to follow suit. Let's read some of the textbooks from these publicly-funded religious schools!

Emphasis mine in all cases.

Quote:
God used the Trail of Tears to bring many Indians to Christ.
Quote:
Some people have developed the idea that higher mathematics and science have little to do with the Bible or Christian life. They think that because physics deals with scientific facts, or because it is not pervaded with evolutionary ideas, there is no need to study it from a Christian perspective. This kind of thinking ignores a number of important facts to the Christian: First, all secular science is pervaded by mechanistic, naturalistic and evolutionistic philosophy. Learning that the laws of mechanics as they pertain to a baseball in flight are just the natural consequences of the way matter came together denies the wisdom and power of our Creator God. ... Second, physics as taught in the schools of the world contradicts the processes that shaped the world we see today. Trying to believe both secular physics and the Bible leaves you in a state of confusion that will weaken your faith in God's Word.
Quote:
American believers can appreciate Jefferson's rich contribution to the development of their nation, but they must beware of his view of Christ as a good teacher but not the incarnate son of God. As the Apostle John said, "Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son" (I John 2:22).
Quote:
[Homosexuals] have no more claims to special rights than child molesters or rapists.
Quote:
These immoral [homosexual] Americans not only try to excuse their sin as simply another choice of lifestyle but also try to demand special recognition and privilege. Such a situation serves to illustrate man's sinful condition and his great need for the Savior.
Quote:
Although the United States has been a sinless nation, conditions of the 1960s and 1970s saw much open defiance of God's standards. [...] Hard rock music, drugs, and open immorality continue to plague America.
Quote:
[Mark] Twain's outlook was both self-centered and ultimately hopeless. Denying that he was created in the image of God, Twain was able to rid himself of feeling any responsibility to his Creator. At the same time, however, he defiantly cut himself off from God's love. Twain's skepticism was clearly not the honest questioning of a seeker of truth but the deliberate defiance of a confessed rebel.
Quote:
A serious flaw developed in American culture during the Cold War period as America began to drift away from the institutions and heritage that made her great. For example, the U.S. government continued to move toward socialism following the "New Deal"; under the Kennedy, Johnson, and Carter administrations, government spending grew enormously as welfare programs sapped the economy and resulted in a heavier tax burden upon the American people
Quote:
God's original purpose for government was to punish the evil and reward the good. [...] All governments are ordained by God, but none compare to government by God, theocracy.
Quote:
There are several reasons why North America has not experienced a great spiritual awakening. The humanist educational system, media, and mindset have trained North Americans to rationalize away much of the Bible and its teaching.
Quote:
Because basic phonics, traditional math, drill, and repetition had been virtually eliminated from many school curriculums, students were not learning. Grades fell, and a reliable study classified thirty percent of all public school students as "learning disabled." As the federal government began to hand out large amounts of money to educate these "learning disabled" students, critics suggested that some educators labeled students "learning disabled" in order to qualify for more government aid.
Quote:
[The Ku Klux] Klan in some areas of the country tried to be a means of reform, fighting the decline in morality and using the symbol of the cross. Klan targets were bootleggers, wife-beaters, and immoral movies. In some communities it achieved a certain respectability as it worked with politicians.
Quote:
A few slave holders were undeniably cruel. Examples of slaves beaten to death were not common, neither were they unknown. The majority of slave holders treated their slaves well.
Quote:
To help them endure the difficulties of slavery, God gave Christian slaves the ability to combine the African heritage of song with the dignity of Christian praise. Through the Negro spiritual, the slaves developed the patience to wait on the Lord and discovered that the truest freedom is from the bondage of sin. By first giving them their spiritual freedom, God prepared the slaves for their coming physical freedom.
Quote:
Contrary to the basic Judeo-Christian concept of law which places limits on government, the UN charter laid the foundation for one-world government with unlimited power. [...] The UN founders envisioned an all-powerful, global authority with power to bend nations into conformity with its plans for the "world community." Given the radical agenda and the totalitarian philosophy of the UN, one can quickly discern the threat of its plan for world government to the political, religious, and social liberty of all free peoples. It is a collectivist juggernaut that would crush individual freedom and force the will of an elite few on all of humanity.
Quote:
But instead of this world unification ushering in an age of prosperity and peace, as most globalists believe it will, it will be a time of unimaginable human suffering as recorded in God's Word. The Anti-christ will tightly regulate who may buy and sell.
Quote:
During the 16 years following that 1973 decision [Roe v Wade], more than 20 million lives were ended by abortion. That number is more than ten times the number of Americans who have died in all the wars the nation has fought! That number is more than three times the number of Jews that Adolf Hitler exterminated in concentration camps during the Holocaust! The United States of America, founded on the Word of God, had legalized the murder of millions of babies.
Quote:
Ignoring 3,500 years of Judeo-Christian civilization, religion, morality, and law, the Burger Court held that an unborn child was not a living person but rather the "property" of the mother (much like slaves were considered property in the 1857 case of Dred Scott v. Sandford)
Quote:
Perhaps the best known work of propaganda to come from the Depression was John Steinbeck's The Grapes of Wrath. [...] Other forms of propaganda included rumors of mortgage foreclosures, mass evictions, and hunger riots and exaggerated statistics representing the number of unemployed and homeless people in America.
Quote:
[Is] it possible that a fire-breathing animal really existed? Today some scientists are saying yes. They have found large chambers in certain dinosaur skulls [...] The large skull chambers could have contained special chemical-producing glands. When the animal forced the chemicals out of its mouth or nose, these substances may have combined and produced fire and smoke.
Quote:
Bible-believing Christians cannot accept any evolutionary interpretation. Dinosaurs and humans were definitely on the earth at the same time and may have even lived side by side within the past few thousand years.
Quote:
Africa is a continent with many needs. It is still in need of the gospel [...] Only about ten percent of Africans can read and write. In some areas the mission schools have been shut down by Communists who have taken over the government.


@A Man In Black

I don't know what to say when I see this kind of idiocy.

That said, this a direct result of state rights. A centralised national curriculum, which all schools and home tuition was required to demonstrate compliance with, could make this rubbish a thing of the past.

The biology fail isn't even the scariest thing. Some of the history is down right terror inducing, "decline of the first republic" stuff.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.


meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

And without government, these guys would likely be a much bigger deal.


Zombieneighbours wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

And without government, these guys would likely be a much bigger deal.

I honestly can't begin to fathom what our education system would be like without public schools setting a standard.

The more I read about this sort of stuff the luckier I feel for having gone to a religious school that put education before indoctrination.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.


A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

Truth in that.


A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

I agree. Alls I'm saying is that the government folly here is in allowing someone else to have power. In this case, religious nutbags. If we open government folly up beyond what the government itself is doing, to what it's allowing by not stopping, literally anything can be gov't folly.

The recent mass shootings, for example, are gov't folly for not having a system in place to flag potentially violent mental patients.


Brain Cox says britain isn't spending enough of research.


meatrace wrote:
A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

I agree. Alls I'm saying is that the government folly here is in allowing someone else to have power. In this case, religious nutbags. If we open government folly up beyond what the government itself is doing, to what it's allowing by not stopping, literally anything can be gov't folly.

The recent mass shootings, for example, are gov't folly for not having a system in place to flag potentially violent mental patients.

I think the destintion is that government is actively destroying itself on ideological grounds to give power to these groups. I don't know enough about the specifics to say what the reason for that choice is, but my money would be on either right-wing libertarianism, or dominionism(or some combination their off) being responcible


A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

I think this lines up with the libertarian narrative perfectly.

Socialized education is an abysmal failure.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Bitter Thorn wrote:
A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

I think this lines up with the libertarian narrative perfectly.

Socialized education is an abysmal failure.

Because the religious and libertarian conservatives can take it over?

Do we have an example of non-socialized education working? Do any of the countries widely considered to be ahead of the US in education use a non-socialized model? To be a fair comparison, they have to educate all (or at least the vast majority) of their kids, not just the children of the elites.


I am always surprised when I read that the Department of Education wasn't founded until 1980.

What's the story with that?


Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

I am always surprised when I read that the Department of Education wasn't founded until 1980.

What's the story with that?

From Wikipedia

Quote:
A previous Department of Education was created in 1867 but was soon demoted to an Office in 1868.[3] [4] As an agency not represented in the president's cabinet, it quickly became a relatively minor bureau in the Department of the Interior. In 1939, the bureau was transferred to the Federal Security Agency, where it was renamed the Office of Education. In 1953, the Federal Security Agency was upgraded to cabinet-level status as the Department of Health, Education, and Welfare.

In other words, it existed, but as part of other departments. It's not like the feds weren't involved with education before 1980.


"Socialized" education for the win!


Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

South Africa

I haven't really been to Counterpunch much since Alexander Cockburn died--:(--but here's another article. I haven't actually read it yet.

Oh yeah, I've read this article now. The author sounds like a real f@$@ing scab.


Comrade Anklebiter wrote:
Comrade Anklebiter wrote:

South Africa

I haven't really been to Counterpunch much since Alexander Cockburn died--:(--but here's another article. I haven't actually read it yet.

Oh yeah, I've read this article now. The author sounds like a real f$~@ing scab.

Yeah, I wasn't impressed with that one. It's hard to tell what's really going on from the other side of the planet, but he seems really dismissive of any problems with the big union and biased against the upstart. Which bills itself as "anti-communist", but the older union seems to be in cahoots with the mine owners, which doesn't seem very communist to me.

He's right that dual-unionism can be a problem, but what's the alternative if your union is co-opted?


I, of course, am not particularly enamored of anti-communist unions, but when the main trade-union federation is affiliated with the government and the reformist Communist Party acts as the junior partner of the Randlords, what do you expect?

And you're going to sit there and criticize a union spokesman for saying they're gonna finish what they started come hell or high water after 30 strikers were gunned down? Shut the f~+* up, scab.

And, yeah, I'm not in love with dual-unionism, but, uh, CIO in the '30s?

I really hope that Counterpunch doesn't go soft now that Alex is dead.


I'm so pissed I linked that.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Bitter Thorn wrote:
Socialized education is an abysmal failure.

As compared to what?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion Subscriber
GentleGiant wrote:

To get this a bit more back on track:

High Court Rules That Man Must Prolong His Suffering Instead of Dying with Dignity
Hemant Metha wrote:
Without knowing the legal system overseas, this doesn’t appear to be the court’s fault. They’re just doing their jobs. But it’s up to English lawmakers to correct this injustice. It may be a politically incorrect topic, but it’s an important one. For all the thought given to the politics regarding birth and conception, we don’t pay much attention to end-of-life issues.

Well, Mr Nicklinson has finally defied the government.


Mrgh.

Man, there just ain't nothing good to be said about that.


thejeff wrote:
Bitter Thorn wrote:
A Man In Black wrote:
meatrace wrote:

Just as tales of corporate malfeasance, even when tacitly allowed by our government, belongs in a corporate folly thread, those examples belong in a religious folly thread.

Every one of those quotes has left me gobsmacked. It is sickening.

The governments of those states are or want to dismantle their public education systems to fund schools teaching these things. I'd say that's government folly. It's certainly wasteful, and there is that whole commitment to providing a universal education that they're neglecting. There's no reason that government folly necessarily has to serve a libertarian narrative.

I think this lines up with the libertarian narrative perfectly.

Socialized education is an abysmal failure.

Because the religious and libertarian conservatives can take it over?

Do we have an example of non-socialized education working? Do any of the countries widely considered to be ahead of the US in education use a non-socialized model? To be a fair comparison, they have to educate all (or at least the vast majority) of their kids, not just the children of the elites.

I tend to think that socialized education is an abysmal failure because left wing statists find an uneducated population easier to manipulate. That's why you want the failure that is public education to be a captive system.

Choice and opportunity could lead to fewer people being dependent on the state. That wouldn't serve the agenda of the left at all now would it?

Parents should have more choices when educating their kids.

The state has poured vast amounts of money into public education bureaucracy. That bureaucracy is a horrifying over priced failure that crushes creativity and critical thinking. It's a gross moral failure that the state effectively forces many poor kids to stay in the system rather than letting try other options with some of their own tax money.

We tried the left wing approach. Maybe we could give freedom a try.


GentleGiant wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:

To get this a bit more back on track:

High Court Rules That Man Must Prolong His Suffering Instead of Dying with Dignity
Hemant Metha wrote:
Without knowing the legal system overseas, this doesn’t appear to be the court’s fault. They’re just doing their jobs. But it’s up to English lawmakers to correct this injustice. It may be a politically incorrect topic, but it’s an important one. For all the thought given to the politics regarding birth and conception, we don’t pay much attention to end-of-life issues.
Well, Mr Nicklinson has finally defied the government.

It's sad the state denied him the right to choose. I truly don't understand how letting him make his own end of life choices hurts others.

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