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Who likes getting +8 to strength? If you raised your hand, here's the topic of the discussion:
What is the best way to multiclass Alchemist and Barbarian?
Here's my initial thought: go Barbarian 1/Alchemist X, grab a greatsword and some medium armor, and tear shit up with Mutagen, Rage, and Enlarge Person (or your favorite buff of choice). Later on, you could have, say, a flying, hasted, invisible, raging beatstick!
Str 17
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 14
Wis 12
Cha 7
How would you do it?
FYI - at second level, starting with a 20 Str +4 alchemical (Mutagen) +4 morale (Rage) +2 size (Enlarge Person) = 30 Str. By Alchemist 4 you can also use Bull's Strength for another +4 enhancement bonus bringing that up to 34.
Wild Rager Barb 1 / Vivvisectionist Beastmorph Alchemist 19, with cha 7 from point buy and preferably a -2 cha race that buffs strength. Wild Rager's confusion will help to greatly extend rage usage per day, and the anemic charisma will keep the will DC extremely low, making it easy to pass when needed (and you can always choose to fail a save) and giving you near total control of when it is used. Viv. gets rid of the stupid bombs for sneak attack damage; beastmorph gets rid of the poison stuff for eventually flight and pounce, among other things.
Barb level should come first for the hp and starting proficiencies and BAB. Even a single class Alchemist can't take extra discovery till level 3, so delaying alchemist progression a level right from the start isn't hurting you that much, compared to dipping Barb later.
What he said. Unless you want to start as an Alchemist for flavor reasons or if you want to have bombs for something to do when you are not in your mutagenic form.
Nuh-uh.
It's all about Barbarian 2/Beastmorph Vivisectionist X with feral mutagen.
Use your rage power to get Lesser Fiend Totem and you are pouncing with 4 primary natural attacks with sneak attack. Yeaaaaah.
Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere
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I too have tossed this concept around, but with Ragechemist. Alchemist (Ragechemist)2/ Barbarian. +6 mutagen, +4 rage and enlarge person and bam. With meager STR 14 at start you can have Str 22 or if you wanna get nasty then STR 16 and then you can have STR of 26. OF course you have to wait for a couple of levels but that is still nasty.
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So I ran a RageChemist/Wild Rager for one scenario. After having to make a god awful amount of will saves I realized the +2 and extra attack are not worth it. If you want to be effective drop your Str a bit, up your Con a tad and be a Vivisectionist with the aim of going Master Chymist (talk to your GM about the MC bomb thrower ability progressing SneakAttack as well).
Then with Barbarian 1/Vivisectionist 7/Master Chymist x
This gives you a couple rounds of rage plus multiple uses of your Mutagen every day. I also agree with Interzone, try and get as many natural attacks that you can muster because while they don't do a tremendous amount of damage, you get to use them at full BAB. You could also be a Titan Mauler, get 3 Natural attacks some how, and pick up MultiAttack. Then you can wield a Great Sword in one hand and get your BAB progression attacks with that while getting an additional 2 Natural Attacks at your BAB-2. Throw Sneak Attack on that and you are golden for DPR.
Please Don't Kill Me is correct. The +2 Str is not worth the drawbacks of the Rage Chemist. I recommend against it.
1 level Synthesis?
1 level Synthesis?
While the synth sounds nice, taking the BAB hit and not progressing the eidolon is not.
1 level Synthesis?While the synth sounds nice, taking the BAB hit and not progressing the eidolon is not.
If you make a 1 level dip you don't lose a BAB hit while fused, which can be all do long.
Biggest problem with Synth dip is locking your strength score before items to 16, or 14 if you want pounce. You can't use your level up points towards it. Otherwise, a very good dip. Or 20 level class.
Also, agree with above. Don't ever play a comatose chemist, it's not worth it, unless you hate playing pathfinder and were just looking for an excuse to get up from the table and go play smash brothers or something.
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I'm also curious: what backstories did you guys come up with for your characters?
I've got two I'm thinking about at the moment:
Dr. Thogg, Ph.D - Dr. Thogg am Barbarian that went to medical school. Dr. Thogg master of science of hitting things. Dr. Thogg conduct many experiments in that field.
Igor - formerly a half-orc barbarian like the rest of his tribe, Igor was captured by an insane alchemist and used as a test subject. Igor now knows that the true path to hitting things really, really hard is a combination of science AND bloodlust, and he's out to prove it.
(PS: if you ever call him "Mr. Thogg"... run.)
Please Don't Kill Me is correct. The +2 Str is not worth the drawbacks of the Rage Chemist. I recommend against it.
If you can manage the MAD because you got good rolls... then bumping wisdom up for high enough will saves makes the +2 totally worth it. If your will save is high enough it never gets worse. :)
A Barbarian with a nice will save is also something most enemies have not encountered often. No Calm Emotions draining YOUR rage. :D
No, Ragechemist is never worth it. But I'm sick of explaining why, so now that I've done my civic duty once again, I suppose I'll just sit back and let characters who don't "get it" earn their Darwin Awards.
No, Ragechemist is never worth it. But I'm sick of explaining why, so now that I've done my civic duty once again, I suppose I'll just sit back and let characters who don't "get it" earn their Darwin Awards.
Its a matter of opinions that just don't agree. No need to be calling us idiots.
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I called the characters idiots. Some people like playing stupid or wildly unoptimized characters. For fun or challenge or something.
And it's not a case of disagreeing. It is fact. It is no more a debate than arguing whether jumping off a bridge is bad for your health or not is a "disagreement."
Ah... but are you jumping off the bridge with a parachute or bungee cord?
I was just saying, that if you are willing to take the precautions necessary to provide a high enough will save that you practically just have to roll a non-one not to fail once a round, you effectively have that parachute or bungee cord. You can still fail, but rolling a one on a save is relatively rare. In that instance the RageChemist becomes viable.
Granted, you CAN fail, just like something could happen to your parachute or bungee cord. Luckily in this case, death is not the result, the save just gets harder but again... if your starting stats and will save is high enough that is not the end of the world and does not guarantee a unconscious PC.
Also, I'm not suggesting this is an option for a game that using point buy unless its a very HIGH point buy. If you'll note I mentioned "if you got good rolls". I've known players who can take any set of dice and consistently roll high on their starting stats and generally love to play characters that have "MAD" issues.
Just being a RageChemist does not automatically make you eligible for the darwin awards. PC or Player alike.
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I have to agree with SOTS here:
Mixing rage and alchemy I believe would lead to way too many explosive situations
Why do I think far too many Barbarians who know alchemy would be like handing TnT to rednecks?
I can see/hear many a last word of the Darwinian overachievers going something like:
Hey guys, watch THIS!!!
I have to agree with SOTS here:
Mixing rage and alchemy I believe would lead to way too many explosive situations
Why do I think far too many Barbarians who know alchemy would be like handing TnT to rednecks?
I can see/hear many a last word of the Darwinian overachievers going something like:
Hey guys, watch THIS!!!
Funny thing... the barbarian rage actually INCREASES your will saves and the ability to resist taking INT damage. If you INT is above average and your WIS is high... you'd be gimping the character yourself to play it like a retard.
Most of the "Hey guys, watch this" comes from low wisdom.
Intelligence = book smarts.
Wisdom = common sense.
Exactly! :)
Smart enough to figure out how to do it. Wise enough to figure out that "Hey, this may hurt, lets not do it."
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I have a PFS character based on this and I decided to dive 100% in and resulted with the following: Alchemist (Ragechemist) 2/Barbarian (Titan mauler) 2/Fighter (Two-Handed Fighter) 8.
Because you have so many bonuses to STR it doesn't really matter based on the negatives for 2x two big weapons. Scythe or Greatsword or whatever makes you excited and twirl them around hoping to connect with people.