Using a Scorpion Whip


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

When using a Scorpion Whip do you threaten?

Do you provoke when you use it?

Depending on whether you have Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Whip), or Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Scorpion Whip), can you use it in a different fashion?

Do you get a -4 when using it to do nonlethal damage?


blackbloodtroll wrote:

When using a Scorpion Whip do you threaten?

Do you provoke when you use it?

Depending on whether you have Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Whip), or Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Scorpion Whip), can you use it in a different fashion?

Do you get a -4 when using it to do nonlethal damage?

1. No, you don't threaten with it unless you have the whip feat (and then it's only 5 feet of threatening)

2. A scorpion whip counts as whips for proficiencies and the like (think of it as a way improved whip, its even light, so you can wield two with improved two-weapon fighting at -2 penalty).

3. I think so

Grand Lodge

It states you can use it as a whip, if proficient with whips, but can you choose to not use it as a whip?
If so, how does it function?


Personally I feel the Scorpion Whip is very badly written. It says you CAN use it as a whip (you don't have to) and fails to detail what this means (Is it like a whip in all uses including the non-lethal damage?), if you are proficient, and that it also gains the trip/reach/disarm properties if you are proficient with the whip. "All feats and abilities related to whips (including proficiency) apply to a Scorpion Whip" is much clearer.

I'd rule you can do that because you are spending two feats (or other methods of gaining whip+scorpion whip prof, such as Half Elf's Ancestral Arms, Tengu alternate racial trait, and Bard levels) you should be able to get a one handed reach weapon, but I highly doubt it is intended.

Grand Lodge

So, there is no way to wield it as anything other than a whip?


blackbloodtroll wrote:
When using a Scorpion Whip

Which one?

The Ultimate Combat Scorpion Whip is, depending on how you use it, identical in all ways to a normal whip, or alternately a light weapon without the reach, disarm, or trip abilities.

The Adventurers Armory Scorpion Whip uses the same rules as the whip in the PFRPG Core Rulebook, except (1) it deals lethal damage, even to creatures with armor bonuses, and (2) it has the stats in the table.

Here's a FAQ Request thread if you would like to see it addressed.

blackbloodtroll wrote:
do you threaten?

AASW: No

UCSW: No, when used as a whip. Unknown when used not-as-a-whip.

blackbloodtroll wrote:
Do you provoke when you use it?

AASW: Yes

UCSW: Yes, when used as a whip. Unknown when used not-as-a-whip.

blackbloodtroll wrote:
Depending on whether you have Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Whip), or Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Scorpion Whip), can you use it in a different fashion?

AASW: No

UCSW: Yes. Proficiency with whips lets you use it as a whip. If you're not proficient with a whip, you can't use it as a whip. Proficiency with the UCSW only changes the proficiency penalty.

blackbloodtroll wrote:
Do you get a -4 when using it to do nonlethal damage?

AASW: Yes

UCSW: No, when used as a whip. Unknown when used not-as-a-whip.

Grand Lodge

So, you are either using it as a whip, or using it as a weapon that no one knows how it works?


blackbloodtroll wrote:
So, you are either using it as a whip, or using it as a weapon that no one knows how it works?

Pretty much.

Monkeygod wrote:

James, in one of my games here on the boards, there's some confusion with the Scorpion Whip from Ultimate Combat.

This line is the cause of said confusion: If you are proficient with whips, you can use a scorpion whip as a whip.

Does this mean if you are proficient with a whip, you are also proficient with a scorpion whip? or does it mean that if you can use a whip and scorpion whip, you can perform trip and disarm attempts with the scorpion whip, which according to the weapons chart appears you can not do normally??

Yup; if you're proficient with a whip, you can use a scorpion whip. Doesn't mean you can use a scorpion whip to do all the things a whip can do, though... just what a scorpion whip can do.

So my best guess is when using the UCSW as itself (instead of as a whip) it's basically like a dagger. 1d3(s)/1d4(m), slashing, performance. You threaten, don't provoke, don't get reach, etc.

If you're proficient with whips (actual scorpion whip proficiency doesn't matter) then you can use the UCSW in every single way exactly like a standard whip. Provokes to use, doesn't threaten, nonlethal, 15' reach, disarm & trip qualities.

-edit-
An alternate way to read James' post, is that if you're proficient with either a scorpion whip or a whip, you can use the UCSW without non-proficiency penalty. Either way, it has no reach, no disarm, no trip, and deals lethal slashing damage. In this case, using the UCSW "as a whip" is basically meaningless, since you can't do what a whip can do, but only what a UCSW can do, which is not much.

Grand Lodge

I wish this was cleared up, in fashion as to describe it's function as a non-whip weapon.

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