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Selling your spellbook?


Pathfinder Society® General Discussion


Hey all.

If you play a class that gets a free spellbook can you sell it?

Andoran

Theoretically yes, though why would you.

Edit: Didn't see that this was a PFS question.

Qadira ***

Mark Morelands answer when I asked this question

edit: correcting link

so the PFS answer is:
(Mark Moreland) Spellbooks are a slightly different animal, and until I figure out a way to make wording on any clarification of how to sell them back work without further confusing things or fully opening up item creation for this one item type, they can't be sold. I'm adding it to my list of FAQs to look into as time permits.

Paizo Employee ***** Global Organized Play Coordinator

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Unless otherwise stated, you cannot sell for money something you got for free. It doesn't matter how you acquired the item. This includes spell books and bonded items (which lose all magic propertied when not used by the wizard to whom they are bonded anyway).


well there you go.....

seems silly but the rule (kinda) is the rule.

Qadira ***

Not to argue at all with Mr. Brock (he is my GM and I'm getting the T-shirt that says that),

but there may be a change coming later due to the fact that often large amounts of gold have been spent on spell books, (in scribing spells other than the free ones). So the spell but is not always a free item. It's partly free, partly not.

Silver Crusade **

I sense this thread going nowhere happy, in a God-awful hurry. RAW, RAI, my table, PFS forum for non PFS question....

LET THE NERD RAGE GAMES BEGIN!

Qadira ***

Alexander_Damocles wrote:

I sense this thread going nowhere happy, in a God-awful hurry. RAW, RAI, my table, PFS forum for non PFS question....

LET THE NERD RAGE GAMES BEGIN!

???

what?
for PFS (where this thread is posted) M&M have both responded on this topic.
both have said:
"No"
with a note from Mark Moreland that that may change later, but for now it's still no.

so... huh?

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber
nosig wrote:
Mike Morelands answer when I asked this question

Mike Moreland?

Is that some kind of weird science experiment mixing DNA from Mike and Mark?

Qadira ***

Dragnmoon wrote:
nosig wrote:
Mike Morelands answer when I asked this question

Mike Moreland?

Is that some kind of weird science experiment mixing DNA from Mike and Mark?

thanks Dragnmoon - fixed it. (blush) plainly I am not on a first name bases with either of them...

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber
nosig wrote:
thanks Dragnmoon - fixed it. (blush) plainly I am not on a first name bases with either of them...

Go ahead... call them Mr. Moreland and Mr. Brock, I know they both love that... ;)

Silver Crusade **

nosig wrote:
Alexander_Damocles wrote:

I sense this thread going nowhere happy, in a God-awful hurry. RAW, RAI, my table, PFS forum for non PFS question....

LET THE NERD RAGE GAMES BEGIN!

???

what?
for PFS (where this thread is posted) M&M have both responded on this topic.
both have said:
"No"
with a note from Mark Moreland that that may change later, but for now it's still no.

so... huh?

I got ninja'd by Mike. Glad this didn't go all crazy. Who knew sanity and reason could be used online?

Qadira ***

nosig wrote:

Mark Morelands answer when I asked this question

so the PFS answer is:
(Mark Moreland) Spellbooks are a slightly different animal, and until I figure out a way to make wording on any clarification of how to sell them back work without further confusing things or fully opening up item creation for this one item type, they can't be sold. I'm adding it to my list of FAQs to look into as time permits.

Just wondering if there is anything more on this yet?

Grand Lodge ***

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules Subscriber

I thought Mike's response was the 'anything more' you were requesting.

Qadira ***

Paz wrote:
I thought Mike's response was the 'anything more' you were requesting.

A spell book is something a wizard is likely to have spent a lot of GP on. Most likely he has spent more on it than he can on any one item. If he had to buy it all at once, most likely he could not, due to Fame limits on GP spent. If he wished to replace it, he would spend a lot of GP. I would not count this as something he got for free.

So I figured Mike and Mark would not either.

Andoran ***

Ugly thought: does your fame limit the total value of your spellbook?

I just had a newbie Wizard spend a significant part of his proceeds from his first scenario on scrolls and scribing them into his spellbook.

Okay, 20 Int Wizard, so all cantrips and 8 free first level spells, IIRC. Might be only 7, though. Then 10 first level spell scrolls for 250 gold, and another 100 gold to scribe them all into his spellbook. His spellcraft was at +11, so T10 sufficed for everything needed...

But that would move his spellbook value up, too, won't it?

Agh, I just fried my mind...

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber

Though putting a spell into a spellbook does raise the price of the spellbook, the cost of the scroll does not figure into the cost of the spellbook.

One of the unique things with PFS is the way they have Wizards buy new spells compared to the Rules in Core book.

The cost of a spellbook equals to half the cost of purchasing and inscribing the spells within, problem is those rules are based on the cost of purchasing a spell which is half the cost to write the spell into a spellbook not the cost of a scroll.

In PFS a wizard can end up paying significantly more for their spells then a normal Pathfinder Game, because they have to buy magic items (Scrolls) to get new spells compared to just paying the much lower cost of just buying the spell from another NPC wizard. In some cases the price you would get for selling your spellbook would be very small fraction compared to what it actually cost the wizard to make the spellbook.

It all depends on how many spells you added to your spellbook through buying scrolls vs Found scrolls and other PC wizards.

*

Well, it's probably good that wizards can't sell their spellbooks (even ones they DIDN'T get for free) because with Cypher Script now legal as a feat (1/2 scribe cost) and the cost to COPY YOUR OWN spellbook is 1/2 cost (i.e. copying your own spellbook is 1/4 cost with Cypher Script), then a wizard could copy his own spellbook into a newly-purchased 15g spellbook (or 10g Traveler's Spellbook) and then sell that for [1/2(15g or 10g) + ( 1/2 of "the cost of purchasing and inscribing the spells within")]; but since he only paid 1/4 of "the cost of purchasing and inscribing the spells within", he doubles his money (minus a little on the 1/2 value of the book itself).

These shenanigans are about equivalent to buying a yak (24gp, 2 tons, adventurer's armory) and then using Profession: Butcher to carve it up and sell it as meat, chunk of (3sp, 1/2 lb, Core Rulebook). Even if half the weight of the yak is bones, fur, skin, other unusable stuff: 2 tons = 4000 lbs * 1/2 = 2000 lbs usable meat * 2 [a chunk of meat is 1/2 lb] = 4000 chunks of meat * 3sp = 12000 silver = 1200 gp. (I assume without even asking that the above is not PFS legal, and would be denied by every GM in every home game ever).

Why every peasant in Golarion is not either a yak farmer or a butcher is entirely beyond me...

Qadira ***

Until we get a different ruleing from Mike & Mark, in PFS a wizard CAN'T sell his spell book (original, copy or whatever). I was just wondering if there was and change on getting a procedure for this, something like "a wizard can sell a spell book for half of what he spent on it."

This would mean that if he has scribed no spells to it (Cost 0 gp) then he would be able to sell it for 1/2 of zero... and if he has paid 40 gp to scribe spells into it he would be able to sell it for 20 gp.

Shadow Lodge *****

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
nosig wrote:

Until we get a different ruleing from Mike & Mark, in PFS a wizard CAN'T sell his spell book (original, copy or whatever). I was just wondering if there was and change on getting a procedure for this, something like "a wizard can sell a spell book for half of what he spent on it."

This would mean that if he has scribed no spells to it (Cost 0 gp) then he would be able to sell it for 1/2 of zero... and if he has paid 40 gp to scribe spells into it he would be able to sell it for 20 gp.

Not trying to advocate anything in any direction on this, but just had a funny thought that seemed relevant:

If a wizard literally tore a page of his spellbook out (and thus removed it from his list of spells known), wouldn't it technically be a scroll at that point?

I couldn't see a wizard doing that except if it meant the difference between having enough gp for a raise-dead or not, but still.

Qadira ***

Mike Bramnik wrote:
nosig wrote:

Until we get a different ruleing from Mike & Mark, in PFS a wizard CAN'T sell his spell book (original, copy or whatever). I was just wondering if there was and change on getting a procedure for this, something like "a wizard can sell a spell book for half of what he spent on it."

This would mean that if he has scribed no spells to it (Cost 0 gp) then he would be able to sell it for 1/2 of zero... and if he has paid 40 gp to scribe spells into it he would be able to sell it for 20 gp.

Not trying to advocate anything in any direction on this, but just had a funny thought that seemed relevant:

If a wizard literally tore a page of his spellbook out (and thus removed it from his list of spells known), wouldn't it technically be a scroll at that point?

I couldn't see a wizard doing that except if it meant the difference between having enough gp for a raise-dead or not, but still.

actually no. Though this is a common house rule, the spell pages in a spell book can NOT be used to cast a spell (like a scroll).

Andoran *** Venture-Captain, Washington—Seattle aka The Great Rinaldo!

I'm unclear on why a wizard would WANT to sell his spellbook ... doesn't he rather need it?

Qadira ***

The Great Rinaldo! wrote:
I'm unclear on why a wizard would WANT to sell his spellbook ... doesn't he rather need it?

Buy a Blessed Book - now you have two spellbooks. Sell the older (smaller) one.

Taldor **

Michael Brock wrote:
Unless otherwise stated, you cannot sell for money something you got for free. It doesn't matter how you acquired the item. This includes spell books and bonded items (which lose all magic propertied when not used by the wizard to whom they are bonded anyway).

So, a gunslinger is a special case, then (most likely due to the actual special text for the class feature?) Not that any sane gunslinger SHOULD sell their starting gun before it increases in value, but is still a special case that is related to this decision.

Additional Resources; Ultimate Combat wrote:
A gunslinger's starting gun (granted by the gunsmith class feature) is worth 22 gp if sold (the average of 4d10).

Taldor *****

RAGE!

Qadira ***

The Gold Goblin wrote:
RAGE!

??? who let the goblin in???

****

nosig wrote:
The Gold Goblin wrote:
RAGE!
??? who let the goblin in???

Kill it with fire!

Taldor *****

BURNS IT! BURNS THE MAGIK BOOKS AND STEALS THE YELLOW SHINYS!

*

It was probably a smurf... here to steal Gargamel's spellbook.

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