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RPG Superstar 2015

Water / Ice Sorcerer in PFS? New to Pathfinder and the Society


Advice


I am curious about a build for Pathfinder Society with a Sorcerer. Edited in that meant that I was looking for something ice based if possible end edit. I am not looking for the biggest and baddest build. I do not want to have any negative stats. Want something different than normal with a roleplay aspect to it. Was thinking Elemental or Marid bloodline.

I appreciate any advice. Glad to have found the chance to play where I am as 4th edition did not work for me but spells and feats are still something I am learning.

Thank you,
Robb

Star Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Welcome Robb,

The sorcerer elemental bloodline (water) means your bloodline spells will do cold damage. The Advanced Players Guide (APG) has an aquatic and a boreal bloodline. Boreal bloodline seems the most like what you are asking since "you count among your ancestors giant-kin, troll-born, and frost-rimed spirits. "

I hope that helps.

Liberty's Edge

An Idea.

Arctic Archetype Druid with the Fire Domain (Ash Subdomain)

You could use elemental spell, but at 9th level you'll be replacing all the domain spells with the cold descriptor.


Thanks for the advice Curaigh. Boreal does not seem as good as the Marid bloodline. But will look and try and look at how it would looked leveled up.

Interesting idea Laschoni but with Pathfinder Society really only going to 12 that means 2/3s of his life would not have the cold descriptor.

Sczarni

I would try only to keep water and ice in different concepts since water wouldn't necessarily mean that you will use cold type damage. Water is actually more control type magic while ice is control and damage type magic.

Not saying anything that you can't combine both, it would most likely be awsome in both ways, just saying that they are a bit different.


Thank you Malag. I was just curious as I could see the cold added on to the water bloodlines including the cold resist.

Scarab Sages

Waves Oracle?? Similar to Arcane casting sorcerer, just with Divine spells? Some of the flavor Revelations are pretty sweet.


The Marid and Elemental (Water) bloodlines are near identical; the only main difference are the spells. If you're looking to do more damage type spells, the elemental bloodline spells would support that more, but if you're looking for more versatile spells, Marid would probably be the better choice.
Marid would also probably provide more roleplay opportunities.


Thank you Bomanz. It is one where I really want to do the Sorcerer. I figure will do all of the classes at some point (except maybe Fighter or Rogue)and so will look at Oracle and see what I can think of there.

Akantha, I really thank you for that insight. I was thinking Marid as it did seem more interesting. Now guess I need to figure out how I need to build and level the character.

Anyone have advice on what I would need to take as feats and such? I am one that if for a good roleplay reason then will look at having a negative stat but most times go with 18 for main stat (that is with racial bonus) and then put the rest where I need them.

I don't know most of the feats or requirements and figure it might take me a few weeks of reading to figure out how to get everything done to a proficient degree. I will be honest that feats seem to be the hardest part of character building for me.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
Robbgobb wrote:
Thank you Bomanz. It is one where I really want to do the Sorcerer.

That's the beauty with PFS. You don't need builds that are built to the level of the "Elitist Jerks" web page to succeed in this campaign. It's built for average characters with the 20 point buy. Create what you want and work with it.


Thank you LazarX as I have played a few low level games and it seemed to be less intense than 4.0 early mobs (still remember incorporeal fight in a early mod) and more of a friendly game.

The problem is that I seem to hear friends talking about higher level games and so I might now want maximize every little point it is one where am curious about what feats are best to look at. I know that with cold based there is a feat for making spells entangle but other than that not really sure what I would need.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

Robbgobb wrote:

I am curious about a build for Pathfinder Society with a Sorcerer. Edited in that meant that I was looking for something ice based if possible end edit. I am not looking for the biggest and baddest build. I do not want to have any negative stats. Want something different than normal with a roleplay aspect to it. Was thinking Elemental or Marid bloodline.

I appreciate any advice. Glad to have found the chance to play where I am as 4th edition did not work for me but spells and feats are still something I am learning.

Thank you,
Robb

I would suggest one of two things:

1. take one level of Tattooed sorcerer (crossblooded(Draconic(white)/Rime-Blooded[Boreal])), choosing evocation as your Varisian tattoo focus, and then after that take Wizard with the Evocation[Admixture] school.
2. Flip those, so you take one level of the Wizard Evocation[Admixture] and every level after that of Tattooed sorcerer (crossblooded.....)

Here's why: you get extra damage to spells with the cold descriptor from the Draconic arcana (1 extra damage per dice), you can slow your enemies with every cold spell from the Rime-blooded arcana, you manifest evocation spells at +1 caster level thanks to Varisian tattoo, and you can transform fire/acid/electricity spells into cold spells on the fly, which is good because there are far fewer cold spells on the sorc/wizard list than there are fire spells and such. You should also be using Rime Spell as much as humanly (or elfly, etc) possible.

I'm currently running a Sorc 1/Wiz X in a PFS game and focusing on fire instead of cold, and I'm wishing I would have done cold instead only because of Rime spell. It's an EXTREMELY powerful metamagic feat.


Thanks for the advice cartmanbeck. I am thinking that the +1 damage isn't really that important and I don't see an Archetype I like that much. Rime-Blooded might work if I wanted to be Boreal but it doesn't really catch my attention. It sounds right but really doesn't offer anything that I really want.

I do have to say that it does sound like a fun build but not really what I want to try and keep track of.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

Robbgobb wrote:

Thanks for the advice cartmanbeck. I am thinking that the +1 damage isn't really that important and I don't see an Archetype I like that much. Rime-Blooded might work if I wanted to be Boreal but it doesn't really catch my attention. It sounds right but really doesn't offer anything that I really want.

I do have to say that it does sound like a fun build but not really what I want to try and keep track of.

+1 damage doesn't sound like that much, but when you're adding +1 damage PER DAMAGE DICE to spells that normally would only be Xd4, it's a significant boost, trust me. My sorc/wizard is only 2nd level right now (so 1 level of sorcerer and 1 of wizard), and I'm dealing out 3d4 + 7 damage in a cone with Burning hands. (+1 caster level from Varisian tattoo, +1 caster level from Pyromaniac gnome alternate racial trait, +1 damage per dice from Draconic bloodline, +1 damage per dice from Orc bloodline, and +1 damage to the whole spell from the Wizard's Intense Spells ability)

Edit: Also, he has a +11 to initiative (+4 from comsognathus familiar, +4 from Improved Init, +2 from Reactionary trait and +1 Dex) :-D


I appreciate the advice cartmanbeck. I was more thinking that the +1 on damage dice was not equal to -2 Will and 1 less spell per level. As I am learning then I want to get the basics down at first before I start making things even more limited.

That is impressive damage at 2nd level as the +7 does tend to really affect the groups. I will have to remember that.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

Robbgobb wrote:

I appreciate the advice cartmanbeck. I was more thinking that the +1 on damage dice was not equal to -2 Will and 1 less spell per level. As I am learning then I want to get the basics down at first before I start making things even more limited.

That is impressive damage at 2nd level as the +7 does tend to really affect the groups. I will have to remember that.

Yeah the 1 less spell known is painful, but that's why I'm using Sorcerer as the dip and Wizard as the main spellcasting class, so it doesn't hurt nearly as much. The -2 Will sucks, but at least it's your high save so you end up making up for it a good bit. Just don't dump Wisdom completely.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
Robbgobb wrote:

Thank you LazarX as I have played a few low level games and it seemed to be less intense than 4.0 early mobs (still remember incorporeal fight in a early mod) and more of a friendly game.

The problem is that I seem to hear friends talking about higher level games and so I might now want maximize every little point it is one where am curious about what feats are best to look at. I know that with cold based there is a feat for making spells entangle but other than that not really sure what I would need.

The problem is that has the game progresses beyond 12th level, it gets far and far less predictable. Yes you're going to have campaigns that in which every little rules bending niggling advantage is going to be necessary.

A lot of people however, including myself would not have much taste for those kinds of campaigns. High level play is a lot of YMWV.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

LazarX wrote:
Robbgobb wrote:

Thank you LazarX as I have played a few low level games and it seemed to be less intense than 4.0 early mobs (still remember incorporeal fight in a early mod) and more of a friendly game.

The problem is that I seem to hear friends talking about higher level games and so I might now want maximize every little point it is one where am curious about what feats are best to look at. I know that with cold based there is a feat for making spells entangle but other than that not really sure what I would need.

The problem is that has the game progresses beyond 12th level, it gets far and far less predictable. Yes you're going to have campaigns that in which every little rules bending niggling advantage is going to be necessary.

A lot of people however, including myself would not have much taste for those kinds of campaigns. High level play is a lot of YMWV.

Also, you posted this as a question about a PFS character, so in theory it's NEVER going to get higher than 12th level, right?


LazarX, it is one where the higher level games I was talking about were people playing at 7th and such. I don't want to make a character and take what seems like good feats and such to end up with being stuck a couple of levels later with a feat that doesn't really help any longer.

cartmanbeck, I am thinking about that is why some of your suggestions as I was looking makes me want to remember (if I ever get to play a campaign over PFS) on some of my options and what sounds like would be fun. I feel like in PFS I can play more of a roleplay character that is efficient though maybe not powerful. If I play in a campaign then want a more powerful character and just roleplay it to the best I can. Not having but a total of 30+ sessions at most means if playing ever week barely lasts more than half a year.

I want to roleplay more as my first two characters are more learning the rules and pretty much standard cleric and then a musket master gunslinger. Overall not much to worry about. With any other class I was looking and thinking about feats where reading them and not really knowing what is good and what is not. That is why I was asking for advice. I have seen a few threads here where people talk about what fits for certain types of each class.


This another suggestion tangential to your request. The Witch APG class has an interesting ice-based archetype based off of the Irrisen Ice witches. This (mostly) evil group of bone-collecting, troll and winter wolf allied women has some great rp opportunities. The archetype has a good selection of ice spells, especially with the winter patron. Even if you go with sorcerer, you might use the witches as background material.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/witch/archetypes/paizo---witch -archetypes/winter-witch

Grand Lodge

Tangaroa wrote:

This another suggestion tangential to your request. The Witch APG class has an interesting ice-based archetype based off of the Irrisen Ice witches. This (mostly) evil group of bone-collecting, troll and winter wolf allied women has some great rp opportunities. The archetype has a good selection of ice spells, especially with the winter patron. Even if you go with sorcerer, you might use the witches as background material.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/witch/archetypes/paizo---witch -archetypes/winter-witch

Great RP opportunities, but I can see it being very difficult in Society play where no evil PCs are allowed. There's also the problem that the Pathfinder Society is outlawed in Irrisen and the winter witches' servants serve as antagonists in some Society scenarios.

Not impossible to RP, but definitely difficult.


Ok, going to try here for a build though not good with feats.

Thinking
Human
Sorcerer Bloodline Marid
Str 10, Con 12, Dex 14, Int 13, Wis 10, Cha 18

Spells through life of character

0 level spells:
Detect Magic, Read Magic, Acid Splash, Ray of Frost

Not sure what to take as advance in level

1 level spells:
Burning Hands, Magic Missle (can understand why to take Color Spray but is it really necessary?)

Will get 3 more 1st level but not sure what really would pick other than Color Spray

2 level spells:
Burning Arc, Glitterdust, Scorching Ray, Web, Fire Breath

Not sure on order best to get those

3 level spells:
Fireball, Fly, Haste, Sheet lightning

Not sure if best choices

4 level spells:
Ball Lightning, Greater Invisibility, Ice Storm

5 level spells:
Not sure as I like the Cloudkill, Teleport, Cone of Cold, and Fire Snake

6 level spell:
either Chain Lightning or Disintegrate

Traits I have no idea about

Feats:

Spell Focus, Spell Specialization, Rime Spell, Spontaneous Metafocus

I am not sure about which feats I need or do not need. I do know that I want Rime Spell though.

Any help with this and how I should pick as I go up in levels would be appreciated.


Thank you for the suggestion Tangaroa. Sound like something worth trying. I did not see this till after I researched what I could for the sorcerer though.

Arutema, I have to say that the difficulty could make it more fun. Not sure how much roleplay would happen but still intersting but I do not know much.

Don't know much about witch class at the moment. So much to learn for spellcasters it feels like to me.

Silver Crusade

I don't know every spell you listed on your progression, so I won't comment on all of them, but I'll throw out a few thoughts.

For level 0 spells, Acid Splash and Ray of Frost are redundant, especially since your bloodline lets you change acid damage to cold. I'd drop Ray of Frost, and probably go with Daze, which is a handy little spell at low levels.

Level 1 spells - Grease is a great spell. Silent Image is another good one to consider. Sleep is nice at low levels, but trade it out later, since sorcerers can start trading out spells known at level 4. If you're not good aligned, Infernal Healing is a good one to consider, too. Mage Armor and Shield are good for defense, though Shield is just as good as a wand. The duration makes Mage Armor better known than as a wand.

Level 2 spells - Do you really need that many different blasting spells? You've got Glitterdust and Web, which are good for variety, but maybe consider stuff like Invisibility, Create Pit, or Hideous Laughter in place of one or two of the blasting spells.

I'm not that experienced at playing mid-high levels, so I won't comment on most of those, except to mention that Black Tentacles is extremely popular, so you should consider it.

As for feats, I like your first three choices, but only take Spontaneous Metafocus if you really feel you need it after playing the character a bit. You'll probably want stuff to overcome Spell Resistance past level 7 or so, which would be Spell Pentration, Greater Spell Penetration, and Piercing Spell.

Also, consider Improved Initiative early. Being able to go first is much more useful for spellcasters than most classes, because you'll want to cast area of effect spells that only affect your allies or only affect your enemies, before they charge each other and get all mixed up in melee. It also helps with getting out of harm's way before the enemies can hit you. This is why the Reactionary trait is always worth considering, too.

Sczarni

Just a mini comment, always have some other energy type spells at hand. I guy at PFS played crossblooded with +2 per dmg dice, fire based sorcerer. He was litteraly useless vs fire immune creatures, and there are many of them. Devil's and demons often have resistance or immunity.

Silver Crusade

Malag wrote:
Just a mini comment, always have some other energy type spells at hand. I guy at PFS played crossblooded with +2 per dmg dice, fire based sorcerer. He was litteraly useless vs fire immune creatures, and there are many of them. Devil's and demons often have resistance or immunity.

He actually does have some variety there, with Magic Missile early, Sheet Lightning, Ice Storm, etc. But I agree that he has a lot of fire spells, too. But yeah, it's worth making a point of picking up non-fire spells before more fire spells, once you have one.

For my new sorc that I'm currently designing, I'm probably going Scorching Ray as my first level 2 spell, so I probably won't get Fireball early, just because I'd like to get a non-fire blast first.


Thanks Fromper and Malag.

That is why I had been asking for advice. I get to change my fire to cold if I want and did not know acid was an energy type so was picking up lightning and fire.

So at 6th level I would want Spell Penetration or Piercing Spell?

I was figuring with being able to change type descriptor of energy to cold and then with Rime Spell (adds 1 level) that entangles the target (only for number of rounds equal to original level) so was thinking of trying hard on making that work.

I can change Burning Arc to Hideous Laughter.


Arutema wrote:
Tangaroa wrote:
The Witch APG class has an interesting ice-based archetype based off of the Irrisen Ice witches.

Great RP opportunities, but I can see it being very difficult in Society play where no evil PCs are allowed. There's also the problem that the Pathfinder Society is outlawed in Irrisen and the winter witches' servants serve as antagonists in some Society scenarios.

Not impossible to RP, but definitely difficult.

Our VC roleplays an Oracle of Rovagug (the Very Naughty God of Armageddon). I think playing a Winter Witch would be a breeze in comparison :)

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