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Pounce barbarian, is this legal? And any advice?


Advice


Ok, for a while Ive been seeing this whole AMBARBARIAN thing and it got me thinking, since I can use a lance one handed on a horse can I not two-weapon them? And if so can I get the spirited charge on all those attacks? So I set out to find how well a charging pouncing barbarian is. Now I realize there are loads of debates about the AM BARBARIAN and that is not quite what I'm building its just inspiration. So on to the build I've tried to put together

Spoiler:
25 point buy Human
starting stats:
20 (18 base+2 racial)
18
10
7
7
9

ending stats:
36 (20 starting+4 levels+ 4 inherent+ 6 enhancement+ 2 profane(succubus)
25 (18 starting+1 level+ 6 enhancement
10
7
7
9

feats:
1: two weapon fighting
1: mounted combat
3: ride by attack
5: spirited charge
7: improved two weapon fighting
9: double slice
11: Greater two weapon fighting
13: two weapon rend
15: power attack
17: weapon focus lance
19: improved critical lance

rage powers:
2:lesser beast totem
4: ferocious mount
6:beast totem
8:greater ferocious
10:greater beast totem
12:ferocious trample
14:superstition
16:witch hunter
18: spell sunder
20: sunder enchantment

I think his to hit ends up as +43/38/33/28 while raging with a +5 lance is that right?

Also if possible can I request the dpr on this and any changes that may increase it, Im trying to build this for either a future enemy or a character so I need so help. Thank you in advance.


A couple of issues:

1: Until Pounce rolls around, you get 1 attack on a charge. Not one with each lance. One attack. That means that 1/2 of your feats prior to level 10 will be worthless at any given round in combat, rather than synergizing.
2: Who goes 9 CHA and 7 WIS?
3: (This is big) Swap Power Attack and Double Slice. I might even consider moving the ENTIRE 2 WEAPON FIGHTING TREE to get PA earlier. Keep in mind how PA synergizes with Sprited Charge. It turns into an insta-gib for most targets.
4: Even once you get Pounce, your Spirited Charge damage craziness applies to the first two lance hits, which puts a premium on TWF as a feat, but NOT the rest of the chain. The rest do standard damage per a recent FAQ change by SKR (one that I agree with wholeheartedly).


Thank you for that clearing up and the advice, I'll switch that wisdom and charisma. Yeah I could go with out greater two weapon fighting and do some readjusting for power attack earlier. Thank you for helping out.

Osirion

I second Serisan' insistence on PA. I'd even suggest moving up to the lvl 7 slot; as he said, that second attack with your off-hand will only come into play during a full attack, not a charge.

Also, I understand what this build is going for, but I have to be pain and point out how idiotic this guy is (literally, his mental stats.) I'm impressed he learned how to ride an animal, let alone how he managed to get to lvl 20.
I try to interpret stats based on what they're supposed to represent, not just their number value. yeah, a -2 on your Int only technically hurts your skills, but IRL, this guy is dead the first time anyone with half a brain sets a proper trap or uses any Will-related attack on him. He could fight through a horde of enemies, but he'd chase them right into a burning barn to do it.

Just my humble opinion, I still wouldn't want to be anywhere remotely near the end of this guy's lances. Ouch.

Sczarni

A barbarian riding an animal with a negative in the stats you'd want to be a barbarian riding an animal? Seems like he is more likely to BONK the horse on the head than actually try and control him with Handle Animal. =b


Yeah he is kind of... challenged mentally but hey perhaps he could fit as The Big Guy who is kinda dumb and blunt but is ferocious in battle especially when it comes to say... his fragile wizard buddy who he only trusts because he saved his life once and he feels indebted to help him so that's how he survives smart enemies.

But any who nothing says he has to be a violent stupid except really when hes raging so anyways thanks. Later I will fix up the feats no time right now though.

Sczarni

Wasn't pounce intended for natural weapons? Have they not errata'd that yet?


Daryl MacLeod wrote:
Wasn't pounce intended for natural weapons? Have they not errata'd that yet?

It was intended for that. They have no rules saying it only applies to natural weapons

Sczarni

^Well then, I won't make a character using this tactic because it seems everytime I do manage to find a 'loophole' the designers close it with an untimely FAQ!


ossian666 wrote:
A barbarian riding an animal with a negative in the stats you'd want to be a barbarian riding an animal? Seems like he is more likely to BONK the horse on the head than actually try and control him with Handle Animal. =b

Wouldn't that be Ride, not Handle Animal?

The build has plenty of Dex to work with, so that's not a problem.


"Wasn't pounce intended for natural weapons? Have they not errata'd that yet?
It was intended for that. They have no rules saying it only applies to natural weapons"

James Jacobs stated in one of the questions and answer threads, that the barbarians pounce ability works with natural weapons ONLY and NOT with manufactured ones (which makes totally sense).

so if you choose the beast totem line, you could charge and attack with two claws, 1 bite, and maybe a gore attack on a charge.

I don´t know the thread´s name, you would have to search for it.

:)

steve


Sean K Reynolds puts it to rest for real in a recent FAQ:

"Pounce: If have this ability (page 302), can I make iterative attacks with weapons as part of my full attack?

Any melee attack sequence you can perform as a full attack is allowed as part of the charge-pounce-full attack. For example, a barbarian with the greater beast totem rage power gains the pounce universal monster ability and could make iterative attacks with manufactured melee weapons as part of her charge-pounce-full attack.

—Sean K Reynolds, 02/21/12"

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