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Reasons why Corporations aren't People


Off-Topic Discussions

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I think that's kind of evidence for what I'm saying though. Police deal with belligerent people so often they assume the worst before giving people a chance. Their job is to stop or deter crime, so they see crime everywhere even when it isn't happening.

I'm not even talking about "bad cops" in the traditional sense, I'm saying that some of the problems with the institution are either a)laziness or b)the opposite: the application of a work ethic to a job that is, largely, responsive not proactive. In other words they look for trouble and thus see it everywhere. Everyone who wears a uniform is assumed to have the best interest of the community in mind and to be telling the truth; their word is unimpeachable. And yet, they're human and make mistakes just like everyone. So when the system favors the cop over anyone else and rules in his favor continually, it's natural for him to think that he's just that good rather than he has made a mistake AND the system is stacked in his favor.

Mind you, I'm not talking about any felonious actions. I'm just talking about the collective experiences of myself and my law-abiding friends who are continually baffled by the near zealous aggression with which cops, with nothing else to do, execute their duties on things like littering or minor traffic infractions (real OR imagined).


That very well could be a fair assessment Meatrace. As a tangent do you know if your police force (at the time of the incidents) was public or private (do you know what it is now)?

I have family members that are police officers so I get to hear about the crap they have to deal with on a regular basis, I also try to be aware of the problems others have in their jobs/lives as a means to help remind myself that my own problems are minor and to not get too irritated with others over their perceived failings.

What I've found to help me is to understand the protocol they have to work through and actively do things that make me look non-aggressive (though not necessarily helpful, as that can actually raise more suspicion ironically). I tell don't get things out if pulled over, I wait with my hands on the wheel until asked for the papers and then tell them where I have to reach to get them and receive permission to retrieve them.

I think you are correct though -- many times when the cops are involved it's because something bad has happened; that has to rub off on the mind more than a little bit and does have an influence on how they act. However I would remind you that this would be true for almost anyone in those positions (in fact you reinforce it now with your own negative opinions on the police based on your own constant negative experiences with them). It's a part of humanity I don't think we can easily get rid of or should really expect others to not have.


And none of this has much to do with how much they're paid and how good their benefits are.

I think police in the US are often over-militarized and under-policed in a "Who watches the watchmen?" sense. That doesn't mean I think they're overpaid.
Underpaying your police force is, historically, bad policy. It tends to increase corruption and lower the quality of applicants. Since these are the people you're trusting to walk around armed and enforce the law, that's a bad plan.


thejeff wrote:

And none of this has much to do with how much they're paid and how good their benefits are.

I think police in the US are often over-militarized and under-policed in a "Who watches the watchmen?" sense. That doesn't mean I think they're overpaid.
Underpaying your police force is, historically, bad policy. It tends to increase corruption and lower the quality of applicants. Since these are the people you're trusting to walk around armed and enforce the law, that's a bad plan.

The same theory is applied to legislator's salaries, though. If you pay them inordinate sums of money they won't need to take bribes. Ya know what? They take bribes anyway because they're greedy and/or can't get elected without them. Bad eggs are bad eggs and paying them more won't make them ethical. Especially when it's practically guaranteed that the police force will increase by about 10% each year because it makes white people feel safe.

I do think they're overpaid, at least here. Again, a job that only requires a high school diploma, 36 hours of work a week, and has a negligible chance of seeing anything remotely dangerous, starting at higher pay than 90%+ of your municipality's residents?


It does amuse me that conservative politicians/pundits tout the virtues of market forces, then complain about the quality of teachers and insist their pay be lowered.

Osirion

Conservatives make me laugh. They want to improve education but slash funds for schools (300 teachers were/are about to get laid off here). Where I graduated from high school, all the teachers in the english department wouldn't cut their hair until the end of the school year. They would sell it to a wig company and pay for the textbooks they needed. The schoolboard got a referendum on the ballot to raise the real estate tax by 1 cent per $100. It got shot down by a large margin, yet when the school needed funding for the football stadium, they raised the tax by 5 cents per $100 and it passed by nearly the same percentage they shot down the prior referendum. None of the money went to new textbooks because my friend's daughter is using the very same economics book that I used when I graduated. It was printed in 1981. Reagan hadn't even been shot yet.


Auxmaulous wrote:
And on the "punker" comment. I use punk rock as a generic and common term, I'm not going to call one band crusty vs. another anarcho and yet another hardcore. Please spare my the uninformed criticism and attempt to nullify my influences with what amounts as character assassination.

24 hours later, this is still my favorite part. Hee hee!

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
Orthos wrote:
A lot of my complaint rests on that lack of ability to up and leave, to be honest. There's literally nowhere in the world one can go that isn't already held under someone else's thumb. There's no frontier. There's no "leave behind the conveniences of modern life and forge out on your own". There's no way out of decisions that others made on your behalf.

Are you really that anti-social a person? If you're sincerely honest in that desire, there are still places where you can go and get yourself completely lost. Upper Canada, and the Australian outback come to mind.

Of course that means doing without all of the fringe benefits you've been taking for granted... like clean water, reliable food, clothing, and the other things, like the internet you post rants like this on. Humans aren't built to prosper that well as completely isolated animals.


Although, in retrospect, I linked the wrong scene from Freaks & Geeks--I posted it before I went to work and didn't watch the whole thing.

I was looking for the scene where DeFranco tells the hawt punk chick that he loves "punker" music, and she tells him, "The first thing you should know is that it's not called 'punker'."

Oh well. At least it took him a day to get to the whole "you want to kill my family!" shtick.


LazarX wrote:

Are you really that anti-social a person? If you're sincerely honest in that desire, there are still places where you can go and get yourself completely lost. Upper Canada, and the Australian outback come to mind.

I hear Papau New Guinea is nice this time of year.


off-topic anecdotes:

abraham spalding wrote:
I doubt a single person on this board could go back as much little as 4 generations and not find someone in their family that needed and deserved the help they got from a government support program.

5 generations ago, my great great grandfather was detained without trial. His crime? selling whiskey to someone who turned out to be a confederate soldier.

meatrace wrote:
Everyone has stories of cops harassing them for no good reason.

I once got pulled over for doing 28 in a 25. Seriously the cop asked me "how fast do you think you were going?" I said 25. With a straight face he said, "No, 28" Then he pulled my best friend out of the car, had us assume the position, and patted us both down and searched the car.

Osirion

I know why cops exist, someone has to do what they do. I just don't count on them.


TheWhiteknife wrote:


5 generations ago, my great great grandfather was detained without trial. His crime? selling whiskey to someone who turned out to be a confederate soldier.

Out of respect for the people involved in this tread and the thread itself I'll leave my opinions of the Confederacy out of this.


yeah it was off topic. Eventually he was released after it was decided that its pretty hard to tell a confederate soldier on leave from a regular guy.


TheWhiteknife wrote:

yeah it was off topic. Eventually he was released after it was decided that its pretty hard to tell a confederate soldier on leave from a regular guy.

Well at least 'common sense' came through in the end I guess.

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