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RPG Superstar 2015

MultiClass Archetypes III: The Return of the MCA


Suggestions/House Rules/Homebrew

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Well, we are back, and more organized than before. MultiClass Productions is proud to present the new MCA thread, and links to the now completed and soon to be updated Core and Advanced class-based MultiClass Archetypes.

This thread is primarily meant to provide links to the MCA Wiki site, and the pages on the Pathfinder SRD that present our MultiClass Archetypes. However, it is also meant to provide a venue for MultiClass Productions to present our MCA creation process, and allow you, the fans, to participate in that same creation process for your own MCAs.

The MCA creation process has undergone various stages of development and refining until we have what we believe is one of the best and truly universal gestalt-style methods for multiclassing. It combines the BAB, saves, and class features of two classes in such a way as to, in reality, create a new single class-styled MultiClass Archetype.

The MultiClass Archetype creation process allows one to develop an MCA to meet one’s individual needs, whether by personal preference or the needs of a campaign. For example, one could MultiClass a Fighter and Rogue. Depending upon one’s tastes or needs, the new MCA can use one or the other class as its Primary class, while the other becomes the Secondary class. For a more militant rogue that enters the fray directly, one would likely use the Fighter as its Primary class, while a tougher but very stealthy rogue may use the Rogue as its Primary class. A detailed description of Primary and Secondary classes in reference to creating MCAs, and the general guidelines used in creating MCAs can be found at the links presented below.

We welcome all who are interested in participating in the MCA creation process, both GMs and Players alike, whether to develop their own MCAs specific to their individual campaigns, to post ideas, and seek the wisdom and aid of the very knowledgeable and skilled members of the MultiClass Production crew in your endeavors.

Also, consider this thread as a discussion forum for those who playtest the MCAs. Any feed back is much appreciated, since the number of MCAs (100+) is difficult for just the 5 members of MCP to play test themselves.

For further information on MultiClass Archetypes, finished works, creation guidelines, or the MultiClass Production crew, go to the following links.

MCArchetype Wiki

Cartmanbeck’s Lab on Pathfinder SRD

Previous Thread: Multiclass Archetypes II

MultiClass Productions thank you for your interest in our work.

MultiClass Production Crew: Elghinn Lightbringer, Flak, Cartmanbeck, Raiderrpg, and Oceanshieldwolf.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Yay we're back!!


With a VENGEANCE. <_< >_>

I'll prolly post something up this weekend, one of you guys start first xP


I'll throw one up so the new fans (and old) can see the MCA process at work. Afterall, I have a "few" new MCAs tha need to be hammerd out by Flak and Raider. Me, OSW, and Cartmanbeck have been doing some prelims to get ready for the scaple and vise of Flak and Raider. :D

I'll throw one up that was posted before, but Raider abandoned or shelved. So, here is the Aegis Lancer in its new reincarnation. Let me know what you think.

AEGIS LANCER:

Primary Class: Cavalier.
Secondary Class: Wizard.
Hit Dice: d8.

Bonus Skills and Ranks: The arcane lancer may select three wizard skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal cavalier class skills, one of which must be Spellcraft. The arcane lancer gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The arcane lancer is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, with light armor, medium armor, and with shields (except for tower shields).

Aegis Arcanum (Sp): Beginning at 1st level, an aegis lancer can cast a small number of arcane spells as a spell-like ability. The aegis lancer can use arcane mark, detect magic, and prestidigitation at will. In addition, he may also choose four 1st–level spells from his arcane school. An aegis lancer can use his 1st–level arcanum a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Intelligence modifier. Once an aegis lancer’s arcanum is chosen, it cannot be changed.

At 5th level, an aegis lancer can choose three 2nd–level spells from his arcane school. An aegis lancer can use his 2nd–level arcanum three times per day.

At 9th level, an aegis lancer can choose three 3rd–level spells from his arcane school. An aegis lancer can use his 3rd–level arcanum three times per day.

At 13th level, an aegis lancer can choose two 4th–level spells from his arcane school. An aegis lancer can use his 4th–level arcanum twice per day.

At 17th level, an aegis lancer can choose two 5th–level spells from his arcane school. An aegis lancer can use his 5th–level arcanum once per day.

The aegis lancer uses his level as his caster level when using his aegis arcanum. This ability replaces tactician, banner, greater tactician, greater banner, and master tactician.

Aegis Lance (Sp): Beginning at 1st level, as a swift action, an aegis lancer can create a lance of force for a number of rounds equal to 1/2 his aegis lancer level (minimum 1). This lance deals 1d8 force damage per hit at 1st level, +1 point for every three aegis lancer levels thereafter (maximum +5 at 15th level), and has the same threat range and critical multipliers as a real weapon of its form. At 4th level, an aegis lance is treated as magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. At 12th level, an aegis lance is treated as an aligned weapon for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction, as determined by the aegis lancer’s alignment. The aegis lancer can create an aegis lance a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Intelligence modifier. This ability functions only while the aegis lancer is conscious, not if he is unconscious or dead. This ability replaces challenge 1/day.

Arcane Order: At 1st level, an aegis lancer must select one of the arcane orders listed in the New Orders section. An arcane order is similar to the order of a cavalier, but has an arcane focus and is based on one of the schools of magic. This ability otherwise functions as and replaces order.

Challenge (Ex): This is exactly like the cavalier’s challenge ability, except that the aegis lancer can use it once per day at 1st level, and an additional time per day every six levels thereafter, to a maximum of 4/day at 19th level.

Bulwark (Su): At 3rd level, the aegis lancer can protect his allies by employing a mystical ward a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Intelligence modifier. This ward grants any ally (including the aegis lancer) a +1 resistance bonus to any saves against spells or spell-like effects. Bulwark has a 10–foot radius emanation centered on the aegis lancer, and lasts for a number of rounds equal to 1/2 his aegis lancer level. This ability replaces cavalier’s charge.

Mount (Ex): This is exactly like the cavalier ability of the same name, except that aegis lancer’s effective druid level is equal to his aegis lancer level –3. This ability otherwise functions as and replaces mount.

Mystic Studies (Ex): At 4th level, an aegis lancer can use magical wands, staffs, and arcane scrolls as a wizard with a caster level equal to 1/2 his aegis lancer level (minimum 1). He also takes a –4 penalty on Spellcraft checks related to spells. This ability replaces expert trainer.

Mystic Strike (Ex): At 6th level, the aegis lancer gains the Disruptive feat as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the requirements. At 12th level, the aegis lancer gains the Spellbreaker feat as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the requirements. At 18th level, the aegis lancer gains the Teleport Tactician feat as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the requirements. This ability replaces bonus feat at 6th, 12th, and 18th level.

Improved Bulwark (Su): At 10th level, the aegis lancer’s bulwark grants a +2 resistance bonus to any saves against spells or spell-like effects. This ability replaces mighty charge.

Intermediate Studies (Ex): At 11th level, the aegis lancer can use magical wands, staffs, and arcane scrolls as a wizard with a caster level equal to his aegis lancer level –3 (minimum 1), and only takes a –2 penalty on Spellcraft checks related to spells. This ability replaces challenge 4/day.

Greater Bulwark (Su): At 14th level, the aegis lancer’s bulwark grants a +3 resistance bonus to any saves against spells or spell-like effects. This ability replaces challenge 6/day.

Advanced Studies (Ex): At 16th level, the aegis lancer can use magical wands, staffs, and arcane scrolls as a wizard with a caster level equal to his aegis lancer level (minimum 1), and no longer takes any penalty on Spellcraft checks related to spells. This ability replaces demanding challenge.

Supreme Bulwark (Su): At 20th level, the aegis lancer’s bulwark grants a +6 resistance bonus to any saves against spells or spell-like effects. This ability replaces supreme charge.

Table: Aegis Lancer
Base
Class Attack Fort Ref Will
Level Bonus Save Save Save Special

1st +0 +2 +0 +2 Aegis arcanum (1st), aegis lance, arcane order, challenge 1/day
2nd +1 +3 +0 +3 Order ability
3rd +2 +3 +1 +3 Bulwark
4th +3 +4 +1 +4 Mount, mystic studies
5th +3 +4 +1 +4 Aegis arcanum (2nd)
6th +4 +5 +2 +5 Mystic strike (Disruptive)
7th +5 +5 +2 +5 Challenge 2/day
8th +6/+1 +6 +2 +6 Order ability
9th +6/+1 +6 +3 +6 Aegis arcanum (3rd)
10th +7/+2 +7 +3 +7 Improved bulwark
11th +8/+3 +7 +3 +7 Intermediate studies
12th +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 Mystic strike (Spellbreaker)
13th +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 Aegis arcanum (4th), challenge 3/day
14th +10/+5 +9 +4 +9 Greater bulwark
15th +11/+6/+1 +9 +5 +9 Order ability
16th +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 Advanced studies
17th +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 Aegis arcanum (5th)
18th +13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Mystic strike (Teleport Tactician)
19th +14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11 Challenge 4/day
20th +15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Supreme bulwark

NEW ORDERS:

The following orders are arcane-based, and the most common orders chosen by aegis lancers. Members of these orders are not necessarily bound together, but some organizations do exist that are comprised of aegis lancers that all belong to one specific order.

ORDER OF THE SCEPTER
A cavalier who belongs to this order devotes his life to guiding and protecting any spellcasters under his charge, and works to protect those outside his charge who do not offend his code of ethics. Cavaliers of this order tend to be stalwart, compassionate, and willing to stand against prejudice and bigotry towards magic and spellcasters. This order complements the aegis lancer multiclass archetype and is among those most commonly orders chosen by them.

Edicts: The cavalier must be ever vigilant in protecting his charge, and guiding them in the proper ways of magic use. He must always place the protection of a spellcaster ahead of his own. The cavalier must take every opportunity to ensure that any spellcaster within his prevue gains sufficient rest and opportunity to maintain and increase his arcane knowledge and power.

Challenge: Whenever an order of the scepter cavalier issues a challenge, he receives a +1 morale bonus on all melee damage rolls made against the target of his challenge as long as target is threatening a spellcaster under his charge. This bonus increases by +1 for every four levels the cavalier possesses. Furthermore, should the scepter cavalier confirm a critical hit against the target of his challenge, the target must make a Will save against a DC equal to 10 + 1/2 the cavalier’s level or takes a –2 penalty to its AC against any attacks made by the cavalier until the end of the challenge.

Skills: An order of the scepter cavalier adds Knowledge (arcana) (Int) and Perception (Wis) to his list of class skills. In addition, an order of the scepter cavalier adds his Intelligence modifier to any saves against spells cast at him while he is adjacent to a spellcaster under his charge.

Order Abilities: A cavalier that belongs to the order of the scepter gains the following abilities as he increases in level.

Defender of the Apprentice (Sp): At 2nd level, as a swift action, the cavalier may bind himself to one ally for a number of rounds per day equal to his cavalier level. These rounds do not need to be consecutive. This effect has a range of 60 feet, and otherwise functions as the shield other spell.

Eldritch Guidance (Sp): At 8th level, as a swift action, the cavalier may select one allied arcane spellcaster within 60 ft of him. This spellcaster may cast touch spells upon the aegis lacer without being adjacent to him until the beginning of the cavalier’s next turn. The cavalier may use this ability a number of times per day equal to 1/2 his aegis lance level.

Spell Shielding (Sp): At 15th level, the cavalier can deflect spells back at the caster. The cavalier may spend a full–round action to deflect a number of spells cast at him during that round equal to 1d6 + his Intelligence modifier. This ability functions as the spell turning spell. If the cavalier has his defender of the apprentice in effect, he may choose to deflect spells cast upon that target instead.

ORDER OF THE SCROLL
A cavalier who belongs to this order does all within his power to secure, protect, and deliver magical writings and other arcane knowledge into the hands of those who would ensure their proper use. Cavaliers of this order tend to be adaptable, quick minded, and concerned with the dissemination of arcane knowledge, whether it is scrolls, spellbooks, or the like. This order complements the aegis lancer multiclass archetype and is among those most commonly orders chosen by them.

Edicts: An order of the scroll cavalier must guard and protect all spells or magic in written form at all costs. Some are also devoted to locating any evil or dark magic, no matter how devastating it might be, and zealously pursue its destruction. Most of these cavaliers believe that the preservation of written magic in all its forms is more important than a single life, even their own. It is their goal to ensure that future generations benefit from the repository of magical knowledge they’ve collected.

Challenge: Whenever an order of the scroll cavalier issues a challenge, he receives a +2 bonus on all saving throws against spells or spell-like abilities cast by the target of his challenge, and a +2 bonus on all Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft checks involving the target of his challenge.

Skills: An order of the scroll cavalier adds Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (religion) (Int), and Linguistics (Int) to his list of class skills. Furthermore, he can use Linguistics untrained. If he has ranks in Linguistics, he receives a bonus on the check equal to 1/2 his cavalier level (minimum +1).

Order Abilities: A cavalier belonging to the order of the scroll gains the following abilities as he increases in level.

Linguistic Knowledge (Ex): At 2nd level, an order of the scroll cavalier can make Linguistic checks untrained. If he has ranks in Linguistics, he receives a bonus on the check equal to 1/2 his cavalier level (minimum +1) as long as that check involves a book, tome, scroll, or any other form of written knowledge.

Divine Understanding (Ex): At 8th level, the cavalier gains the ability to cast divine spells from a scroll as if he had a caster level of his cavalier level –4. Furthermore, he gains a +1 bonus to his Intelligence score for purposes of determining the level of spells he can cast from a scroll, and this bonus increases by +1 at 10th level and every 5 levels thereafter (to a maximum of +4 at 20th level).

True Enlightenment (Sp): At 15th level, an order of the scroll cavalier can use tongues (as the spell) for a number of rounds per day equal to his cavalier level. These rounds do not need to be consecutive. Furthermore, any ally within 10 feet of the cavalier gains a +4 bonus to any Knowledge or Linguistic checks while true understanding is in effect.

ORDER FO THE SCYTHE
A cavalier who belongs to this order seeks to eliminate spellcasters that oppose his moral ethics, and working to further those of a similar morality to his own. Cavaliers of this order tend to be militant, rigid, and concerned only with destroying those spellcasters deserving of his wrath. This order complements the aegis lancer multiclass archetype and is among those most commonly orders chosen by them.

Edicts: The cavalier must remain vigilant against magic and spellcasters who oppose his moral ethics above those of all others. He must strive to prevent the destruction of innocent life by wayward magic and malevolent spellcasters. The cavalier must take every opportunity to increase his own magical power in his pursuit of rival magic and spellcasters.

Challenge: Whenever an order of the scythe cavalier issues a challenge, he receives a +1 morale bonus on all melee damage rolls made against the target of his challenge as long as the target is a spellcaster (arcane or otherwise). This bonus increases by +1 for every four levels the cavalier possesses. Furthermore, should the scythe cavalier confirm a critical hit against the target of his challenge, the target must make a Will save against a DC equal to 10 + 1/2 the cavaliers level or become shaken for 1 round.

Skills: An order of the scythe cavalier adds Knowledge (nobility) (Int) and Knowledge (planes) (Int) to his list of class skills. In addition, an order of the scythe cavalier adds his Intelligence modifier to his CMB and CMD checks when making a combat maneuver against, or defending against a combat maneuver initiated by an enemy spellcaster (in addition to his Strength and/or Dexterity modifier, as normal).

Order Abilities: A cavalier that belongs to the order of the scythe gains the following abilities as he increases in level.

Arcane Piercing (Ex): At 2nd level, whenever the cavalier strikes a spellcaster, it must succeed on a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 the cavalier’s level + his Intelligence modifier) or suffer a –1 penalty to his caster level for 1d4 rounds. This penalty increases to –2 at 9th level, and –3 at 16th.

Purify the Spirit (Ex): At 8th level, the cavalier may choose to make a second saving throw against any ongoing spell effect that is targeted him. He can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Int modifier.

Eldritch Suppression (Ex): At 15th level, the cavalier may begin to suppress spells nearby as a full-round action. Once he begins, he must track the number of rounds he has used this ability. While this ability is active, the cavalier can, as an immediate action, attempt to counter any spell he identifies with a spell level equal to or less than the number of rounds his eldritch suppression his been in effect. This ability functions as dispel magic, with a caster level equal to his cavalier level. He can use this ability for a number of rounds per day equal to his cavalier level. These rounds do not need to be consecutive.

ORDER OF THE SPELL
A cavalier who belongs to this order are more devoted in the practice of arcane magic than other orders, focusing on a particular school of magic, and engaging in spellcasting for the pure joy of it. Cavaliers of this order tend to be focused, driven, and unyielding in their search for new and grander spells. This order complements the aegis lancer multiclass archetype and is among those most commonly orders chosen by them.

Edicts: The cavalier must select a single arcane school (see Arcane Schools entry of the Wizard class in the Core Rulebook). He must then seek to master the magic within his grasp, and strive to enhance or improve it. He must always place the purity and love of magic above all other things. The cavalier must take every opportunity to ensure those seeking to further magic in all its facets are given the opportunity to so, so long as it is not detrimental to magic itself.

Challenge: Whenever an order of the spell cavalier issues a challenge, he receives a +1 morale bonus on the caster level of any spell or spell-like ability (including aegis Arcanum) used against the target of his challenge. This bonus increases to +2 at 9th level, and +3 at 17th level. Furthermore, should the spell cavalier confirm a critical hit against the target of his challenge that has spell resistance, the target must make a Will save against a DC equal to 10 + 1/2 the cavaliers level + his Intelligence modifier or have his spell resistance reduced by 2 until the end of the challenge. At 12th level, the target’s spell resistance is reduced by 4.

Skills: An order of the spell cavalier adds Knowledge (arcana) (Int) and Spellcraft (Int) to his list of class skills. In addition, beginning at 6th level, an order of the spell cavalier gains a +1 bonus to the save DC of a single spell or spell-like ability he possesses (including aegis arcanum) once per day, and an additional time per day every six levels thereafter.

Order Abilities: A cavalier that belongs to the order of the scepter gains the following abilities as he increases in level.

Apprentice Learning (Sp): At 2nd level, the cavalier gains his first listed school power.

Intermediate Learning (Sp): At 8th level, the cavalier gains his second listed school power.

Advanced Learning (Sp): At 15th level, the cavalier gains his third listed school power.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8

Before anything else, is it an arcane lancer or an aegis lancer?


More in-depth look later. First things first, code of conduct on the scythe jumps out at me: "He must strive to prevent the destruction of innocent life by wayward magic and malevolent spellcasters."

I set up the order of the scythe as more 'N, NE' I believe. We could probably re-work that line to fit? More 'evil' cavalier options plox :o


@Flak: Uh, I don't understand the question? The name IS Aegis Lancer. :D

@Raider: Yeah, that stuff can be changed.

Dedicated Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Nice to see the band back together!


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Dotted.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8

@Elghinn: A lot of the descriptions of abilities refer to an arcane lancer. That's why I asked.


Oh... -1

I guess I'll change those in my doc. Must be leftovers from when I was deciding to name it Arcane or Aegis Lancer, and decided to keep Raider's original Aegis Lancer.

Star Voter 2014

Nice to see you back, Elghinn. You were missed.
I'm a little disappointed not to have worked on the site and the archetype revision. On the other hand, it's also true that quite probably I wouldn't have had the time.
So, if we're back, can I propose again the last version of my Arcane Templar?

Arcane Templar:

Some divine agents are followers of exoteric sects venerating gods of magic, and use both arcane comprehension and mystic gifts, along with their frightening prowess in battle, to further their god’s ends and the cause of good, be it in the light of law or in the dark of chaotic secret wars. Enforcer and spy, public defender and dirty worker, the arcane templar is a strange hybrid: faithful yet independent, he thinks with his own head, can cast arcane spells as well as channeling divine energy, goes wherever he’s needed to be and does what needs to be done and no other could do.

Primary Class: Magus
Secondary Class: Paladin
Skills: +3 from Paladin class
BAB: ¾
Saves: GPG
Spells: as magus but see Merciful Magic
Alignment: Any Good

1) Aura of Good, Cantrips, Divine Spirit, Spell Combat
2) Spellstrike
3) Templar Arcana
4) Merciful Hand
5) Aura of Courage
6) Templar Arcana
7) Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor
8) Improved Spell Combat
9) Templar Arcana
10) Aura of Resolve
11) Merciful Burst
12) Templar Arcana
13) Heavy Armor, Improved Merciful Hand
14) Greater Spell Combat
15) Templar Arcana
16) Insightful Prayer
17) Aura of Dispelling
18) Templar Arcana
19) Merciful Magic
20) Templar Champion
New Arcana: Arcane Commune, Arcane Mercy, Arcane Spirit, Champion Blending, Faithful Blending, Graceful Spirit, Hunter Blending, Merciful Gaze

Aura of Good (Ex): as paladin.
Divine Spirit (Su): At 1st level, the arcane templar’s magic studies and unswerving faith attract the attention of an agent of his deity, a being of pure magic called an archanangel. Communion with this guardian spirit, which he alone can sense and communicate with, grants the arcane templar a reservoir of divine power, which slowly meshes with his arcane powers as he advances in level. The powers granted by the spirit are divine in nature, and effects that can cut a paladin off from using his lay on hands, channel energy, or divine spellcasting function against the powers of the divine spirit as well. However, this energy pool counts as an arcane pool for all prerequisites, feats, and abilities.
The divine spirit reservoir has a number of points equal to ½ the arcane templar’s level (minimum 1) + his Charisma modifier. The pool refreshes once per day when the arcane templar prepares his spells.
At 1st level, the arcane templar can expend 1 point from the divine spirit pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. A weapon charged in this way glows like a torch. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
At 5th level, these bonuses can be used to add any of the following weapon properties: brilliant energy, dancing, defending, disruption, flaming, flaming burst, frost, holy, icy burst, speed.
Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property’s base price modifier. These properties are added to any the weapon already has, but duplicates do not stack. If the weapon is not magical, at least a +1 enhancement bonus must be added before any other properties can be added. These bonuses and properties are decided when the divine spirit pool point is spent and cannot be changed until the next time the arcane templar uses this ability. These bonuses do not function if the weapon is wielded by anyone other than the templar, and apply to only one end of a double weapon.
An arcane templar can only enhance one weapon in this way at one time. If he uses this ability again, the first use immediately ends.
Cantrips: As magus.
Spell Combat (Ex): As magus.
Spellstrike (Su): As magus.
Templar Arcana: As magus arcana, plus the arcane templar has access to the following new arcana.

Arcane Commune:The archanangel uses the arcane templar's familiar as a conduit to interact more directly with its mortal charge, giving him wise advice. Once per week, the templar may use this link to cast commune as a spell-like ability, at a caster level equal to his arcane templar level. The archanangel speaks to his charge via his familiar or via telepathic contact. To choose this arcana, the arcane templar must be at least 9th level and have the familiar arcana.
Arcane Mercy (Su): The arcane templar chooses one paladin mercy that he can add to his channel positive energy power. This mercy follows all the rules of a paladin mercy, and the arcane templar is considered a paladin of his arcane templar level for all its effects. He can’t choose a mercy that a paladin of his level could not use. The arcane templar must be at least 6th level to choose this arcana.
Arcane Spirit (Ex): The arcane templar’s divine spirit is more powerfully bound to the forces of arcane magic. The arcane templar adds half his Intelligence modifier (round down) to his divine spirit pool. This arcana can be selected up to two times.
Champion Blending (Ex): When an arcane templar selects this arcana, he must select one spell from the paladin list that is of a magus spell level he can cast. He adds this spell to his spellbook and list of magus spells known as a magus spell of its paladin spell level. He can instead select two spells to add in this way, but both must be at least one level lower than the highest-level magus spell he can cast. An arcane templar can select this magus arcana more than once.
Faithful Blending (Ex): When an arcane templar selects this arcana, he must select one spell from the cleric spell list that is at least one level lower than the highest magus spell level he can cast. He adds this spell to his spellbook and list of magus spells known as a magus spell one level higher than its cleric spell level. He can instead select two spells to add in this way, but both must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level magus spell he can cast. An arcane templar can select this magus arcana more than once.
Graceful Spirit (Ex): By spending one point from the divine spirit pool as an immediate action the arcane templar gains an untyped bonus to all saving throws equal to his charisma modifier for a number of rounds equal to his intelligence modifier. This bonus cannot stack with itself.
Hunter Blending (Ex): When an arcane templar selects this arcana, he must select one spell from the inquisitor spell list that is at least one level lower than the highest magus spell level he can cast. He adds this spell to his spellbook and list of magus spells known as a magus spell one level higher than its inquisitor spell level. He can instead select two spells to add in this way, but both must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level magus spell he can cast. An arcane templar can select this magus arcana more than once.
Merciful Gaze (Su): The arcane templar can channel energy through his gaze. The arcane templar’ eyes become pure white-gold and he can use his channel energy power on a single target within 30 feet of him. The amount of damage healed or caused is ½ the touch attack’s effect. An arcane templar must be at least 6th level to select this arcana.

Merciful Hand (Su): At 4th level, the arcane templar can expend 2 points of his divine spirit pool to channel positive energy with his touch. This functions like a paladin’s ability, except it can be used on a single touched creature. Touching a creature against its will requires an unarmed attack. Using this ability is a standard action unless the arcane templar targets himself, in which case it is a swift action. Feats and effects that modify the channel energy ability (like Channeling Smite or Turn Undead) affect this power too, except they specifically require an area of effect. This power doesn't work in conjunction with spell combat or spellstrike.
Aura of Courage (Su): As paladin.
Knowledge Pool (Su): As magus.
Medium Armor (Ex): As magus.
Improved Spell Combat (Ex): As magus.
Aura of Resolve (Su): As paladin.
Merciful Burst (Su): At 11th level, the arcane templar can expend 3 points from his divine spirit pool and use his channeling power to release a burst of energy, similar to a cleric channeling effect. Channeling energy in this way heals or inflicts ½ the damage of the merciful hand attack.
Heavy Armor (Ex): As magus.
Improved Merciful Hand (Su): At 13th level, the connection between the Arcane Templar and the archanangel grows so strong that channeling energy with touch costs only 1 point from the divine spirit pool, while the merciful burst power costs 2 points. Further, the Arcane Templar can use his merciful hand power in conjunction with the spell combat and spellstrike abilities (these still won't work with Merciful Burst).
Greater Spell Combat (Ex): As magus.
Insightful Prayer (Su): At 16th level, the archanangel suggests to the arcane templar a few divine incantations that he can use together with his arcane spells. When the templar prepares his magus spells, he can decide to expend 2 or more points from his divine spirit pool up to his Charisma modifier. For each 2 points he expends, he may treat any one spell from the paladin spell list as if it were a magus spell in his spellbook and can prepare that spell as normal that day. If he does not cast spells prepared in this way before the next time he prepares spells, he loses those spells.
Aura of Dispelling (Su): At 17th level, the templar gains resistance to enemy spells and can grant the same resistance to his friends too. The arcane templar can expend 2 points of his divine spirit pool to grant all his allies within 10’ an holy protection from magic for 1 minute. When a creature with this bonus makes a successful attack against an enemy who’s casting a spell or is under a spell effect, that opponent is subject to a targeted dispel magic attempt as if cast by the arcane templar. If an ally leaves the aura’s range, he can’t benefit of the protection until he re-enters it.
Merciful Magic (Su): At 19th level, the arcane templar gains access to an expanded spell list. He learns and places 8 spells from the paladin’s spell list into his spellbook as magus spells of their paladin level. He gains two of each of the following paladin spells not on the magus spell list:
1st-level, 2nd-level, 3rd-level, and 4th-level.
Templar Champion (Su): At 20th level, the arcane templar becomes a true receptacle of divine wrath and arcane power. Whenever he uses his spell combat ability, he does not need to make a concentration check to cast the spell defensively. Whenever the magus uses spell combat and his spell targets the same creature as his melee attacks, as long as the enemy's evil, he can choose to either increase the DC to resist the spell by +4, grant himself a +4 circumstance bonus on any checks made to overcome spell resistance, or grant himself a +4 circumstance bonus on all attack rolls made against the target during his turn. In addition, whenever he channels positive energy to heal a creature, he heals the maximum possible amount.

Notes: Rumors speak of an evil branch of Arcane Templars with antipaladin powers, called the Purple Templars :P

Dedicated Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Hey Bardess! Good to see you again. Can you list the swaps for this MCA? It's a little difficult to see where the balance lies, both these classes have so many class abilities already...

P.S. You still interested in non-LG paladins? If you're interested in creating some as archetypes or Pathfinderising old school 1e alternate alignment Paladins, email me:

email:
cumanannan@hotmail.com

Star Voter 2014

Hi OSW... actually, I love non-LG paladins and already made some archetypes here. I'll mail you when I can.

As for the swaps:
Aura of Good is "for free" :p
Divine Spirit fuses Arcane Pool and Divine Bond
Templar Arcana fuses Magus Arcana with Mercies, plus some unique powers
Merciful Hand replaces Spell Recall
Aura of Courage replaces the 5th-level bonus feat
Aura of Resolve replaces Fighter Training
Merciful Burst replaces the 11th-level bonus feat
Improved Merciful Hand replaces Improved Spell Recall
Insightful Prayer replaces Counterstrike
Aura of Dispelling replaces the 17th-level bonus feat
Merciful Magic replaces Greater Spell Access
Templar Champion fuses True Magus and Holy Champion


Merciful Magic has one fatal flaw- you assume Paladin spellcasting ranks at the same rate as Magus spellcasting.

It doesn't. No fourth level Magus spell is gonna grant you +5 holy avengers of "OH GOD IT HURTS", for example, or anything near that effect. This is always the issue when adding 'smaller' spell lists to bigger ones.

Templar Champion is a bit much- could change the DC to resist increase resist to 2, and drop the healing matter?

Actually, why is is he suddenly such a healer? Keeping the main damage abilities of the Magus and getting the healing capability of a Paladin seems pretty OP to me.

I hate to sing the same old song, but "Balance, balance, balance!"

Edit: Actually, we might want to make a whole 'new' spell list blending more 'divine' combat spells with some 'arcane' buffs and utilities for this guy. Keep the divine spell damage limits and use arcane spells for buffs and so on... I can see that working. If you like I can whip up something approp over tonight and tomorrow for you to check over?

Star Voter 2014

Ummm. Maybe I could stat that the paladin spells are added to the list as magus spells 2 levels higher? That's a pretty simple way to solve the matter. But I'd like to see your "integrated spell list" too.

As for Templar Champion- Ok for dropping the healing boost, but, while a standard magus has always a +2 bonus, I increased it to +4 ONLY against evil opponents. Against neutrals or good, the Templar has no bonus at all. Isn't this balanced for you?


I only discovered the work you had all done last week, and wanted to drop by to say how impressed I am with both the flavor and balance of so many of the classes.

I am looking to make my own class merge but I find that despite reading your guidelines I'm at somewhat of a loss as to how to structure new abilities so hoped that you might be able to take the time to point me in the right direction.

The concept, at its base is called an Evolutionist, a class that is focused upon the tracking and defeating of Magical Beast type monsters by adapting to better fight them. The class merge would be primary Ranger and secondary summoner, granting a strong ability to fight along with the more obvious abilities required to track such creatures and the ability to evolve to better survive such encounters.

My difficulty comes with scaling of a self Evolution pool to allow for adaption to better battle such foes, and this is what i hoped for a few rough guidelines for. I fully appreciate that scaling anything is more challenging without seeing an entire build but with some concept of how to go forward I could complete it in base, and then probably bother you with additional questions....


Working on the spell list, could use suggestions. Going for an 'iconic' spell, one buff, one offensive, one utility and one 'debuff' for each level right now. Then gonna expand.

Level 1: Shocking Grasp, Magic Weapon, Burning Hands, Floating Disk, Sleep
Level 2: Spiritual Weapon, Bull's Strength, Sound Burst, Levitate, Shatter
Level 3: Magic Circle Against Chaos/Evil, Prayer, Scorching Ray, Force Hook Charge, Bestow Curse
Level 4: Cure Serious Wounds, Haste, Ice Storm, Beast Shape II, Black Tentacles
Level 5: Mark of Justice, Stoneskin, Flame Strike, Telekinesis, Dispel Evil
Level 6: Holy Sword, Mass Bear's Endurance, Cone of Cold, Overland Flight, Word of Recall

As you can see, I'm sorta cribbing a few effects from the cleric list- mostly for areas where Magus and Paladin spell 'flavors' overlap, such as the Arcane Teleport and Divine Magic leading to Word of Recall over the actual teleport spells; and the Magus 'blasting' spells leading to Flame Strike.

I figure about 5-7 more spells per spell level should do; so far I've gone for Core only, but feel free to do the rest of the PRD'd ones; ESPECIALLY if you find a few Touch spells.

And yes, no Vampiric Touch. Negative Energy? On a Paladin? Awkwaaaaard.

And Bardess, 4 points is a lot more than you think. Plus, this guy would be most likely to fight a large number of evil opponents- so it's barely 'weakening' it at all, so to speak.


Crimson, my advice? See which Evolutions are worth a 'feat'. I believe the one for a familiar allows a 1-point evolution, which is a start: 1 Feat = 1 EP.

This gives you a baseline to begin.

Personally, I'd take out combat style feats and the Quarry chain of abilities, then put a single EP in each of those spots (Maybe 2 for the final one); and an ability around level 8 that allows them to switch up their evolutions about 1/week, so that they can't just mess around- but so that they CAN prepare for different hunts >:3

Quick, easy, effective. Qee. I'm coining this RIGHT NOW. Qee it >3


Welcome to the thread Crimson Seeker. I see Raider beat me to the punch.

First step is to have a clear vision of your new MCA, which I belive you do.

Second, determine New base stats. As a Ranger/Summoner, you would have the following MCA stats according to our guidelines:

BAB = 3/4 (Full BAB + 1/2 BAB = 3/4 BAB; split the diff)

HD = d10 (Primary Rgr d10, Secondary Summoner d8; they are only one step from each other so keep Rgr HD)

Saves = 2 good, 1 bad; as a Rgr (good Fort/Ref)/Sum (good Will), you will likely have good Will saves, plus either a good Fort or Ref save, depeding on whether you envision this MCA as tough or agile.

Skill Points = 4 + Int (split diff between Ranger's 6 and Summoner's 2)
Skills = All Ranger's + 3 skills from the Summoner of the PC's choice

Next step is the ability swap/new ability creation. This is the tougher part, so you need to decide:

1) What class abilities you want to keep from the Primary class (which is the chasis you will build your MCA upon). This would include any ability's from the primary you may want to alter, but is similar or based upon a Primary class ability.

2) What class abilities do you want to add to the Primary to replace less desireable abilities.

I have a Word doc with the Advancement Tables of ALL the Core and Base classes. So when I create a new MCA, I copy paste the Primary and Secondary class tables into a new doc, and look at the listed abilities, deciding what to keep from both. The trick is then to decide what is a fair and equal swap for replacing a Primary class ability with one form the secondary class.

So, your first step is to do this. Decide what abilities from the ranger you want to keep, and is within the role, flavor, and vision of your MCA concept. Then, decide what from the secondary also fits. This is where you may decide that you need to create new abilities to get the right balance and flavored abilities to match your cocept.

Once you have your list of Ranger and Summoner abilities you want to keep, post them, and we'll help you along with the rest.


Note that what Elghinn is describing is the more in-depth look, while mine is just Qee.

More in-depth is prolly best if you wanna have the whole thing properly written up and available for others >:3

Star Voter 2014

Hmmm. So, Raider, what do you think is better, my correction on Merciful Magic or your unique spell list? Or maybe both? I'd also modify the Champion Blending arcana consequently, and you're right on vampiric touch... I could also stat that "some" magus spells are prohibited to the Templar.
Ok, you got a point on Templar Champion too. But I don't like the idea of using True Magus without modifications. I'd like a blended capstone ability. So how I could make it? Maybe adding some smite evil effect to spell combat at 20th level too? I'm thinking on it.


Let's see how the spell list works out, first. If the 'finished' version is something we're happy with, we can go with it- otherwise we can refuse negative energy spells and just choose a scattering of paladin spells for the Magus to learn.

Star Voter 2014

Ok, maybe I've found it. What about this:

Templar Champion (Su): At 20th level, the arcane templar becomes a true receptacle of divine wrath and arcane power. Whenever he uses his spell combat ability, he does not need to make a concentration check to cast the spell defensively. Whenever the magus uses his merciful hand ability in conjunction with spell combat and the target of merciful hand is the same creature as his melee attacks, as long as the enemy's evil, he can choose to either increase the DC to resist the positive energy by +2, inflict the maximum possible positive energy damage, or grant himself a +2 circumstance bonus on all attack rolls made against the target during his turn.


Thank you for the advice, its very much appreciated.
My first query is in concerns to base attack. Ranger is full and Summoner is 3/4 so does that make it full with Ranger as the primary class ?

My second question concerns spell casting, since the ranger is a slow progression caster and the summoner is a mid range one how would you recommend adapting it ?

Taking into account as a base idea Raiders concepts for evolution point advancement a 18th level Evolutionist would have around 7 points,access to certain summoner spells would allow for further adaption without altering the power scaling too heavily and allowing the class to retool abilities via the use of spells (such as Evolution Surge in its various forms and Transmogrify). I agree that too many passive points would allow for a build that could easily overpower in certain situations so I feel that the list of evolutions might have to be adapted somewhat (looking at what was done for the Angelic Knight has given me a few ideas).

My final question was concerning flavor abilities and if they have any weighting in a class build. I like the idea that the class can repress its abilities and re-enact them as a move-action. This is more to allow the characters to enjoy the benefits without having to wander through social situations as a multi limbed monster (I've never been a fan of role play scenes suffering due to players having to hide from villagers).

Questions aside I was playing with the idea that each Evolutionist receives a passive, constant bonus at level 1, taking the place of the actual eidolon class feature. For this I'd take a key aspect from each of the current Eidolon base types and make it a constant bonus. For example if Quadruped is chosen the character might gain a permanent 10ft movement boost, while Serpentine could add a small AC bonus.

As always your thoughts are happily accepted :)

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

Crimson Seeker wrote:

Thank you for the advice, its very much appreciated.

My first query is in concerns to base attack. Ranger is full and Summoner is 3/4 so does that make it full with Ranger as the primary class ?

Correct, you'd keep the full BAB progression (Elghinn incorrectly listed the Summoner's BAB as 1/2 earlier in the thread. SHAME ON YOU! LOL)

Quote:

My second question concerns spell casting, since the ranger is a slow progression caster and the summoner is a mid range one how would you recommend adapting it ?

This one is up to you based on the flavor of the class. In your case, I don't think spellcasting itself is necessarily important, so I would say keep the slow progression, or even drop spellcasting altogether and replace it with some polymorph-based spell-like abilities (you could base these off a Druid's wild shape, and then be able to add evolutions to the new shape).

Quote:


Taking into account as a base idea Raiders concepts for evolution point advancement a 18th level Evolutionist would have around 7 points,access to certain summoner spells would allow for further adaption without altering the power scaling too heavily and allowing the class to retool abilities via the use of spells (such as Evolution Surge in its various forms and Transmogrify). I agree that too many passive points would allow for a build that could easily overpower in certain situations so I feel that the list of evolutions might have to be adapted somewhat (looking at what was done for the Angelic Knight has given me a few ideas).

My final question was concerning flavor abilities and if they have any weighting in a class build. I like the idea that the class can repress its abilities and re-enact them as a move-action. This is more to allow the characters to enjoy the benefits without having to wander through social situations as a multi limbed monster (I've never been a fan of role play scenes suffering due to players having to hide from villagers).

This is definitely a good idea, though you may want to also have a per-day limit to how many times the evolutions can be activated, just to keep the player on their toes and discourage wasteful uses of the ability.

Quote:


Questions aside I was playing with the idea that each Evolutionist receives a passive, constant bonus at level 1, taking the place of the actual eidolon class feature. For this I'd take a key aspect from each of the current Eidolon base types and make it a constant bonus. For example if Quadruped is chosen the character might gain a permanent 10ft movement boost, while Serpentine could add a small AC bonus.

This COULD work, but remember that since you're using Ranger as the primary class, you aren't actually "replacing" the eidolon ability, since the base class doesn't have it. However, you could definitely make a level 1 ability to replace Wild Empathy where the player chooses one of several boons, it's permanent, and it's based on the different eidolon base types like you said.


Yeah, my bad, Cartmenbeck. The Ranger does have the Nature bond and can be swapped for a reduced "eidolon" type ability, ie your evolutions that allow your individual to evolve. Could probably do areduced, -3 level equivalent eidolon evolution progression, maybe even reduce overall evolution ponts by 1 too?

Crimson, I'd need to really see in a table what the plan is for your swap outs. I'm a visual guy. That's why I use the tables so much.


Now I've cleared up all of my current questions I'll get on with developing it, thanks again for letting me know, and expect to see the class appear shorty !

Grand Lodge

Have a request for someone to do up. It's not my request though. It came from a discussion that while we have classes that can do two-weapon fighting, there's no one real class that's best at it. I'd name it the Wild Tempest. It's the Two-Weapon Warrior Fighter archetype/Two-Weapon Combat Style Ranger.

It might work best to start with this...
Base Fighter
Second Ranger
d10
Full BAB
4+Int skills
Strong Fort and Ref
No spellcasting
Lose Bravery for gaining the combat styles that give you feats without the standard requirements.

Could this work?


Pathfinder Modules Subscriber

Any plans for three-class archetypes? Sometimes I kinda miss cleric/fighter/mage and fighter/mage/thief from the old days.

Silver Crusade

Okay, I've recently gotten into this subject and have decided to use it to bring forth my favorite archetype that no one ever wants to help me with. Behold

Hand of Fate:

Paladins are no stranger to training one’s body in order to fight the pawns of injustice, however some take it a step further and turn their bodies into weapons themselves, rending all evil in their path no matter their defences

Primary Class: Paladin
Secondary Class: Monk

Alignment: Must be Lawful Good

Hit Die: d10

Class Skills: THe Hand of Fate adds Three monk skills to his list of skills in addition to his paladin skill list. additionally at first level he may also sacrifice the Ride skill for Acrobatics.

Code of Conduct: THe Hand of Fate must adhere to the Paladin's code of conduct

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Holy Fists are proficient in all simple weapons, 5 martial weapons, and one extra Monk weapon. Weapon and they also start off with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat even if they don’t meet the prerequisites. Holy Fists are also proficient in Light and Medium Armor, light shields, and bucklers. This replaces normal weapon and armor proficiencies

Unarmed Strike: A Holy Fist's unarmed strike increases in damage same as a Monk, except that it stops increasing when it reaches 2d6

Monastic Seminary: The need for Charisma to check and allow for all paladin abilities, such as the ability to channel or smite evil, can be replaced with the use of Wisdom. This change is optional and chosen at first level, once it is chosen it can’t be changed.

Aura of Good: as Paladin

Detect Evil: as Paladin

Smite Evil: as Paladin

Divine Grace: as Paladin

Lay on hands: as paladin

Aura of Courage: as paladin

Mercy: as paladin

Divine Stance: at 3rd level and every 3 levels after a Holy fist may qualify for and take Combat Stance feat, ignoring all prerequisites other than the needing previous stance feats within the Stance's progression except for the Stunning Fist and Elemental Fist feats, though they too can be gained without prerequisites as with any other style feat. If they do not wish to take a stance feat they may instead take bonus Fighter feat. This ability replaces Divine Health.

Channel Positive Evergy: as paladin

Divine Quickening: Rather than receive spells from their patron deity, they are instead blessed with powers that augment their physical prowess. Starting at fourth level the Holy Fist Can gains powers from the Ki-Powers list that Qinggong Monks and in the same fashion (from Ultimate Magic rule book) draw from with a few exceptions (See below). These abilities either use Charisma or Wisdom (based on Monastic Seminary choice) for saving throws, class specific ability options for spell and concentration bonus, otherwise treat as normal Qinggong Monk powers. In Addition the Holy Fist gains a minor pool of Ki that stacks with any the Holy fist previously had or eventually gains. The number of Ki points given is equal to half his Holy Fist level–2 plus their Wisdom or Charisma (depending on choice made with Monastic Seminary) modifier. This class feature replaces the Holy Fist’s ability to cast spells and counts as having the Ki pool Class feature.
The following Ki powers have replacements
Hydraulic push - Litany of Righteousness (2 points)
Scorching Ray – Vestment of the Champion (1 point)
Gaseous Form – Burst of Speed (2 points)
Hydraulic Torrent – Water Walk (1 point)
Poison-Cure Moderate Wounds (1 point)
Ki Leach – Draconic Reservoir (0 points)
Spit Venom – Force Punch (2 points
Blood Crow Strike – Fire of Vengeance (2 point)
Cold Ice Strike – Leashed Shackle (3 points)

Divine Bond: A Holy Fist makes a personal bond with the divine spirits of the Good-Aligned planes, who fortify his body with their holy might. This functions like a normal Paladin's spirit bond, however the bonus applies only to non-natural weapon and any other weapons that aren't his unarmed strike. However if he enhances his unarmed strike it instead allows him to ignore that much of his opponents Armor bonus to AC as well as that much of any DR the opponent might have. This stacks with any other affect he has that allows him to overcome DR. Every five levels after fifth you this bonus as twice its current total and any gains in amount of bonuses between each interval are added as normal then combined into the total when it is multiplied again (see table below). This is replaces a normal Paladin's divine bond.
Level- Bonus to unarmed penetration
5- 1
8- 2
10- 4
11- 5
14- 6
15- 12
17- 13
20- 28

Aura of Resolve: as Paladin

Aura of Justice: as Paladin

Aura of Faith: as Paladin (Treat unarmed Strike as weapon)

Aura of Righteousness: as Paladin

Holy Champion: as Paladin

Level BAB Fort Ref WillSpecial
1 1 0 2 2 Aura of Good, Detect Evil,SmiteEvil 1/day
2 2 0 3 3 Divine Grace, Lay On Hands
3 3 1 3 3 Aura of Courage, Mercy, Divine Stance
4 4 1 4 4 Quickening Power, Channel, Smite 2/day
5 5 1 4 4 Divine Bond
6 6/1 2 5 5 Mercy, Quickening Power
7 7/2 2 5 5 Smite 3/day
8 8/3 2 6 6 Aura of Resolve, Quickening power
9 9/4 3 6 6 Mercy
10 10/5 3 7 7 Smite 4/day, Quickening power
11 11/6/1 3 7 7 Aura of Justice
12 12/7/2 4 8 8 Mercy, Quickening power
13 13/8/3 4 8 8 Smite 5/day
14 14/9/4 4 9 9 Aura of Faith, Quickening power
15 15/10/5 5 9 9 Mercy
16 16/11/6/1 5 10 10 Smite 6/day, Quickening power
17 17/12/7/2 5 10 10 Aura of Righteousness
18 18/13/8/3 6 11 11 Mercy, Quickening Power
19 19/14/9/4 6 11 11 Smite 7/day
20 20/15/10/5 6 12 12 Holy Champion, Quickening power

So... what do you all think?

Dedicated Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

@Quintin: Definitely interesting and not too similar to the Holy Fist we have on the wiki (Monk/Paladin). I played a Paladin/Monk through all of NWN, was definitely a lot of fun...

Formatting:
*Don't bother iterating abilities that are unchanged - they appear in the level progression table.
*Monastic Seminary should appear in the level progression at 1st level.
*Second last sentence "Every five levels..." is a mashup indeed. I almost understand but not quite. You'll find me to be the least crunch conversant MCP member, so I can tell you it makes little sense!

Overall:
*Monastic Seminary is a nice tweak for this MCA, helping out with MAD.
* Divine Stance: I'm not sure the "take a fighter feat" exactly matches a Divine Stance, but one can flavour anything - seems like a nice open option, if a little too open. I'm not sure how Divine Stance as is balances against Divine Health it replaces...
* Divine Quickening/Quickening Power: I like the name. I think this is well in theme for a holy combatant sans spells. I'm assuming the alternates to the ki powers you present are spells turned into ki powers?
*Divine Bond: Nice tweak leaving the bond as is with non-natural attacks, but more powerful when unarmed. Maybe too powerful. As stated above the writeup in the last sentence has me confused...

I'm sure Elghinn, Bardess, (the paladin geeks) Raiderrpg, cartmanbeck or Flak may have more pertinent reviews...

Nice work Quintin!


The wiki master list has Mutanthag listed as Alchemist/Rogue, but it's should be Alchemist/Witch.


@Crimson: Can't wait to see it.

@kevin-video: Yes this could work. It would be a very narrow niche type MCA, but it would work. We often canibalize ideas/alternate abilities from from the normal Class ARchetypes, so melding 2 archetypes into a new MCA is doable.

@blaphers: No. Multiclassing two classes the way we do it is time consuming and mentally taking enough,let alone trying to combine 3 classes. I'll leave that for the 2E fans who like to triple class.

@Quintein Belmont: OSW is right, I;m a paladin geek. I take a good look at it and get back to you.

@Madak: Thank you for the errata spot. With just five of us, we sometimes miss things. It's nice to see out work is actually being viewed, and appreciated. It's already fixed.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

kevin_video wrote:

Have a request for someone to do up. It's not my request though. It came from a discussion that while we have classes that can do two-weapon fighting, there's no one real class that's best at it. I'd name it the Wild Tempest. It's the Two-Weapon Warrior Fighter archetype/Two-Weapon Combat Style Ranger.

It might work best to start with this...
Base Fighter
Second Ranger
d10
Full BAB
4+Int skills
Strong Fort and Ref
No spellcasting
Lose Bravery for gaining the combat styles that give you feats without the standard requirements.

Could this work?

I like this idea, but you'll definitely want to come up with a few new abilities that will make this more than just a Fighter/Ranger multiclass character. Fighter is one of the hardest to do, because you can do a LOT with feats, so you need to come up with something that can't be done by a vanilla fighter in the same way. I'll try to come up with some ideas over the next day or two.


@Quintin Belmont: I'll post my ideas tomorrows, but I need you to explain what you're trying to do with the divine bond. I don't understand what you mean by unarmed penetration?

Grand Lodge

cartmanbeck wrote:
I like this idea, but you'll definitely want to come up with a few new abilities that will make this more than just a Fighter/Ranger multiclass character. Fighter is one of the hardest to do, because you can do a LOT with feats, so you need to come up with something that can't be done by a vanilla fighter in the same way. I'll try to come up with some ideas over the next day or two.

The only suggestions I can think of is check out the original 3.5 Tempest and Dervish. They were TWF specific PrC.

Silver Crusade

Elghinn Lightbringer wrote:
@Quintin Belmont: I'll post my ideas tomorrows, but I need you to explain what you're trying to do with the divine bond. I don't understand what you mean by unarmed penetration?

Its kinda simple really. The number put for the penetration is pretty much that amount of DR and armor AC that his attacks negate when he makes his attack. Thematically its akin to light being able to penetrate the deepest darkness, or peeling away the defenses of evil like an onion.

Anyway...@Ocean:
1st-I cant remember what was going through my head when I did the math for the penetration bonus. Just ignore the sentance and follow the chart, maybe you can figure out the math I forgoth since I did design this archetype about a year ago.
2nd- the "take a Combat Feat" thing is just a way to give more variety and choice to the archetype. Say your paladin kep on finding enchanted monk weapons and wanted feats to make that play style stronger? hence you get those feats instead of Stance feats since thier only good with unarmed combat.
3rd- yes those spells replace the previous spells.
4th- think of it this way: while your fists will get more powerful as you level: what if you find an awesome +5 Holy Vorpal Monkspade of Dragon slaying? which would you choose to use your bond powers on? its based solely on personal preference and play style


Here's what I would do with your Hand of Fate. I really wish they had these boards so the kept formatting from Word docs.

HAND OF FATE:

Paladins are no stranger to training one’s body in order to fight the pawns of injustice, however some take it a step further and turn their bodies into weapons themselves, rending all evil in their path no matter their defenses.

Primary Class: Paladin.
Secondary Class: Monk.
Alignment: Lawful good.
Hit Dice: d10.

Bonus Skills and Ranks: The hand of fate selects three monk skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal paladin class skills. At 1st level, a hand of fate may select the monk’s Acrobatics skill in place of the paladin’s Ride skill. The hand of fate gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 2 + Int modifier.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The hand of fate is proficient with all simple and monk weapons, and with five martial weapons of his choice. The hand of fate is proficient with light and medium armor, and with light shields, and the buckler.

Code of Conduct: A hand of fate must adhere to the guidelines presented in the paladin’s code of conduct.

Monastic Seminary (Ex): The hand of fate can modify his divine focus so that the powers granted to him by his deity are dependent upon his willpower and intuition instead of strength of personality. Upon learning this discipline, the hand of fate replaces all Charisma-based requirements for all paladin abilities to that of Wisdom-based. The hand of fate must select this ability at 1st level, and once selected it cannot be changed.

Smite Evil (Su): This is exactly like the paladin’s ability of the same name, except that this ability also applies to his unarmed strikes.

Unarmed Strike: At 1st level, a hand of fate gains the monk’s unarmed strike ability, except that the hand of fate deals unarmed damage as indicated on Table: Hand of Fate. This ability counts for any feat with Improved Unarmed Strike as its prerequisite.

Divine Stance (Ex): At 3rd level, whenever a hand of fate selects a combat feat, he can use his Wisdom or Charisma (see Monastic Seminary) score in place of any Strength or Constitution prerequisites. If a combat feat has both Strength and Constitution scores as its prerequisite, he may choose which ability score to replace with either his Wisdom or Charisma score. In addition, the hand of fate also counts 1/2 his level as his fighter level for any combat feats with fighter levels as its prerequisite. This ability replaces divine health.

Divine Quickening (Su): At 4th level, a hand of fate is blessed with divine powers that augment his physical prowess. The hand of fate gains a ki pool that has a number of points equal to 1/2 his hand of fate level (see below) + his Wisdom or Charisma (see Monastic Seminary) modifier. At 4th level, and every 2 levels thereafter, a hand of fate can select a ki power for which he qualifies from those listed in the qinggong monk archetype entry (see p.52 of Ultimate Magic). These powers are also dependant upon the hand of fate’s Wisdom or Charisma ability (see Monastic Seminary). This ability functions like the qinggong monk’s ki power (which is part of the monk’s Ki Pool class feature), except that the hand of fate’s effective monk level when determining the number of points in his ki pool is equal to his hand of fate level – 3. This ability replaces the paladin’s spellcasting ability.

The hand of fate replaces the following qinggong monk ki powers with the listed spells below, at the indicated level.

Level Qinggong Monk Ki Power New Ki Power
4th Hydralic push Litany of righteousness (2 points)
4th Scorching ray Vestment of the champion (1 point)
6th Gaseous form Burst of speed (2 points)
6th Hydraulic torrent Water walk (1 point)
8th Poison Cure moderate wounds (1 point)
10th Ki leech Draconic reservoir (0 points)
10th Spit venom Force punch (2 points)
14th Blood crow strike Fire of vengeance (2 point)
14th Cold ice strike Leashed shackle (3 points)

Divine Bond (Sp): At 5th level, a hand of fate must select the weapon bond, and can only enhance a weapon that he is proficient with, including his unarmed strikes. If the hand of fate chooses to enhance his unarmed strikes, he ignores an amount of his opponent’s Armor Class equal to 1/2 his hand of fate level (rounded down) as if he were making a melee touch attack (see Touch Attacks in the Pathfinder Core Rulebook). This remains in effect while the bond is active. Like other touch attacks, his unarmed strikes do not ignore other modifiers, such as size modifiers, Dexterity modifiers, and deflection bonuses. This effect stacks with any effects that by pass damage reduction, such as the hand of fate’s aura of faith. This ability otherwise functions as and replaces divine bond.

Aura of Faith: This is exactly like the paladin’s ability of the same name, except that this ability also applies to the hand of fate’s unarmed strikes.

Table: Hand of Fate
Base
Class Attack Fort Ref Will Unarmed
Level Bonus Save Save Save Special Damage

1st +1 +0 +2 +2 Aura of good, detect evil, monastic seminary, 1d4
smite evil 1/day, unarmed strike
2nd +2 +0 +3 +3 Divine grace, lay on hands 1d4
3rd +3 +1 +3 +3 Aura of courage, divine stance, mercy 1d4
4th +4 +1 +4 +4 Channel positive energy, quickening power, 1d4
smite evil 2/day
5th +5 +1 +4 +4 Divine bond 1d6
6th +6/+1 +2 +5 +5 Mercy, quickening power 1d6
7th +7/+2 +2 +5 +5 Smite evil 3/day 1d6
8th +8/+3 +2 +6 +6 Aura of resolve, quickening power 1d6
9th +9/+4 +3 +6 +6 Mercy 1d8
10th +10/+5 +3 +7 +7 Smite evil 4/day, quickening power 1d8
11th +11/+6/+1 +3 +7 +7 Aura of justice 1d8
12th +12/+7/+2 +4 +8 +8 Mercy, quickening power 1d8
13th +13/+8/+3 +4 +8 +8 Smite evil 5/day 1d10
14th +14/+9/+4 +4 +9 +9 Aura of faith, quickening power 1d10
15th +15/+10/+5 +5 +9 +9 Mercy 1d10
16th +16/+11/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 Smite evil 6/day, quickening power 1d10
17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 Aura of righteousness 2d6
18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +6 +11 +11 Mercy, quickening power 2d6
19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +6 +11 +11 Smite evil 7/day 2d6
20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +12 Holy champion, quickening power 2d6

Silver Crusade

nice. My only concern is the adaptation of Divine Stance since when I originally design the class the feature was to allow for the access of Style feats a lot more easily.

other than that small urp I really love and appreciate how you were able to translate my idea. Perhaps I design some more MCAs

Coming soon: Pacted Acolyte and Cosmic Defender!


But what I did doesn't restrict him from Style feats. As a Pal/Mnk MCA, he counts his hand of fate level as his Paladin or his Monk level when choosing feats. That's the way all MCAs work, unless noted otherwise. Most, if not all Style feats have a BAB req., or Monk level req. You have a full BAB and Monk level in your favor.

Star Voter 2014

So if/when my Arcane Templar can get Raider's OK, I'll come up with the Redeemer (Paladin/Inquisitor) and the Gascon (Bard/Cavalier)!

Silver Crusade

Elghinn Lightbringer wrote:
But what I did doesn't restrict him from Style feats. As a Pal/Mnk MCA, he counts his hand of fate level as his Paladin or his Monk level when choosing feats. That's the way all MCAs work, unless noted otherwise. Most, if not all Style feats have a BAB req., or Monk level req. You have a full BAB and Monk level in your favor.

oh, thank you for clarafying that. Okay then the Archetype is now gold and ready to go! Go ahead and put it on the site if you want since its now as much of your creation as it is my own.

Oh, and on my upcoming creations: Pacted Acolyte is a Witch/Cleric and Cosmic Defender is my own personal take on the Paladin/Oracle.

see ya then.


@Bardess: Just so you are aware there is the Sword Seer Pal/Ora MCA on the wiki which is placeholder position right now. It's made, but hasn't been presented to the MCA crew. It's based on Joan of Arch, a vision-laydened paladin type seer/prophet. As long it's different from that, then have at it.

Your Brd/Cav is good to go. We just have a Cav/Brd (Knight Errant)

Silver Crusade

don't worry, it will be WAAAAAAY different, focusing more on the mystery channeling aspect than on the vision seeing aspect. In other words it turns the Paladin into a Jedi.


Sorry Quintin, I must have thought Bardess was doing the Pal/Ora, she's doing the Pal/Inq. Glad you figured that out!! LOL! :D


Hand of Fate has quite a few busted factors, I think.

Gonna numbercrunch and come back with stuff on it later tonight when I've got time on hand. Should have the spell list for you, too, Bardess.


Decided to just post the worst of it now. Will come back later with moaaaar.

Issues, round 1:
Monastic Seminary. WHY are we removing part of the MAD from the two most well-known MAD classes? Someone explain how this balances the combination rather than simply improves it over the standard paladin? I get that it'll be hard to build without, but this guy should need at least as many stats as the paladin- or why play the paladin at all?

Divine Stance: Removes more MAD. Seriously, just give this guy an 18 Wisdom and just-barely-over-ten Str and Con, and he can go nuts.

Divine Quickening: Needs some rewording before I can properly comment. Which is it for Ki Pool? Half level or level -3?

That said, the Qinggong powers replacing spellcasting only? Broken, because while Paladin spellcasting tends to tap out at buffs and heals, Qinggong allows for bonus feats, spells, and
... and...

Draconic reservoir for free. I'm sorry, you gave it Draconic Reservoir for free. Elghinn, man, I'm honestly disappointed here.

Cure Moderate Wounds for 1 ki is equally crazy. While a Paladin might max at a good 16 spells a day, Ki tends to be easier to get and hoard up because of feats and the like- feats that you have to spare because Ki powers can get you MORE feats. I'd happily spend one feat, grab a little more ki, and spend a power on the feat I'd really want.

I'd also like to point out that the Qinggong monk gains ~11 powers. This guy gains ~9, correct? Are we really to say Paladin casting is equal to slow fall (4th), high jump (5th), wholeness of body (7th), diamond body (11th), abundant step (12th), diamond soul (13th), quivering palm (15th), timeless body (17th), tongue of the sun and moon (17th) (list shamelessly copied from the PRD)

Divine Bond: Ignoring armor class. 'nuff said, drop that and you've got something usable. Otherwise you're not building a full BAB class, you're building a 1.5 BAB class.

As it stands Holy Fist is simply 'Better+Chocolate Cake' than the Paladin. Neeeeeds some fixing.

Silver Crusade

Well if your so upset over it then how about you offer some alernatives. First of all I made Resevior worth zero because Ki Leach was also worth zero and theres the fact that Resevior becomes useless at higher levels.

I added Seminary due to the fact that Since holy people are all about will power why not give that to a Paladin already, plus if you still want to be the party face, as is usually required to keep things civil according to your alignment, you still need a good Cha meaning you'll still be MAD.

The Quickening thing is simple: you add the half your class to the ki pool and add your class-3 as your caster level. For instance: you just got to 4th level and have your pool. which is now 2+ your mod. you take one of the spell powers and it has your caster level as 1 for the power.

Now I don't care much for how Elghinn changed Stance from its original form, but I trusted him as a proffessional. If you want it changed, then just make it so that he can only gain Style feats instead of fighter feats and replace the Str/Con replacement.

as for the low cost of Cure moderate wounds: remember the Hand will only have so many Ki points a day so he has to make a choice wheather to use those points to heal or to smash, effectivly making him less useful than a bard in terms of spells since he will probably spend those points on feats instead.

For divine bond it was stated originally when I posted it that it would just negate a specific amount of armor points instead of just being a touch attack, so I think you might like that version better.

....whew! Anyway if you plan on offering any constructive hints and advice I would advise looking at both the original version and the new version and compare the too and, please, take both into consideration as you give forth some constructive criticism

Silver Crusade

on a different note here's my Witch/Cleric MCA:

Consecrated Acolyte:

All witches are aware, at least in passing, that thier powers are gained from some powerful entity. While most ignore this entity, not wanting to look a gift horse in the mouth, few seek for knowledge of the being, and fewer still end up learning of and worshipping this entity. For thier obedience they are gifted in mighty arcane powers beyond the scope of thier common witch brethren.

Primary Class: Witch
Secondary Class: Cleric
Alignment: Within one step of Patron's Alignment
Hit Dice: d6

Bonus Skills and Ranks: The Consecrated Acolyte selects three Cleric skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal paladin class skills. The Consecrated Acolyte gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 2 + Int modifier.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The Consecrated Acolyte is proficient with all simple weapons and his Patron's Favored Weapon(see Below). He is proficient with Light armors and Bucklers, other forms of armor interferes with the Acolyt's guestures which can cause somatic componants to fail

Patron's Bonding: The Acolyte is fully aware of His patron and not only knows who or what the power is but also revere's it. Due to the Acolyte's close ties to his patron he gains proficiency in his favored weapon and can still cast spells while weilding it. if the Patron is a Deity or other divine power then one can use their favored weapon. If not then one can (with GM approval) choose a thematically apropriate weapon.

Patron Domain: Instead of gaining extra spells from the Patron selection instead the Consecrated Acolyte chooses a single Cleric Domain at 1st level, treating his Witch level as his cleric level. This replaces the normal Patron spell selections.

Diminished Spell Casting: THe Consecrated Acolyte's number of non-domain spells per day for each spell level is one less than normal. If this reduces the number of spells per day for that level to 0, she gains only the bonus spells she would be entitled to based on her Intelligence score for that level, plus his domain spell for that level.

Cloistered Study: At 6th level a Consecrated Acolyte is able to add his Wis Modifier plus half his class level (rounded down) on all knowledge and spell craft checks. This replaces 6th level Hex.

Zealot's Training: at 10th level the Consecrated Acolyte gains proficiency in Medium armor and is no longer susceptible to Arcane spell failure while wearing it. This Replaces the 10th level Hex.

Strengthened Faith: at 18th the Consecrated Acolyte gains access to a second domain and treats his effective cleric level for it as his wizard level -5. This replaces Grand Hex

Table: Consecrated Acolyte
Base
Class Attack Fort Ref Will Spells per day
Level Bonus Save Save Save Special 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
1st +0 +2 +0 +2 Cantrips,Hex,Familiar 3 0
2nd +1 +3 +0 +3 hex 4 1
3rd +1 +3 +1 +3 4 2 0
4th +2 +4 +1 +4 hex 4 3 1
5th +2 +4 +1 +4 4 3 2 1
6th +3 +5 +2 +5 Cloistered Study 4 3 3 1
7th +3 +5 +2 +5 4 4 3 2 0
8th +4 +6 +2 +6 hex 4 4 3 2 1
9th +4 +6 +3 +6 4 4 4 3 2 0
10th +5 +7 +3 +7 Zealot's training 4 4 4 3 3 1
11th +5 +7 +3 +7 4 4 4 4 3 2 0
12th +6/+1 +8 +4 +8 hex 4 4 4 4 3 2 1
13th +6/+1 +8 +4 +8 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 0
14th +7/+2 +9 +4 +9 hex 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 1
15th +7/+2 +9 +5 +9 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 0
16th +8/+3 +10 +5 +10 hex 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 1
17th +8/+3 +10 +5 +10 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 0
18th +9/+4 +11 +6 +11 hex,Strengthened Faith 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 2 1
19th +9/+4 +11 +6 +11 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 2
20th +10/+5 +12 +6 +12 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 3

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