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Help with overpowered character.


Advice

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So one of my players, two of his characters died in pretty rapid succession, and he hit the internet and found an amazing Paladin build. Problem is, ever since hes made the character, the combats have literally been him just one-shoting everything that I've thrown at the group. On top of that, hes able to cure every disease and anything else that I can throw at them, and its become rather problematic. I don't really know how to deal with the situation, because I don't think he means to break the game, but he has.

Any suggestion with how I should deal with this situation?


Don't throw evil creatures at him?

Would help more if we had the build. Also have you talked to him about it?


Toss up a build so that we can verify its legal and its weaknesses and then it will be possible to take it from there.

Beyond that start throwing around non evil villains.

Edit: Pesky ninja.


I would hate to even suggest it, but throw something that the wrong choice violates his paladin code of conduct.

Andoran

3 people marked this as a favorite.
krevon wrote:
I would hate to even suggest it, but throw something that the wrong choice violates his paladin code of conduct.

Nah. That's unfair. Doing that kind of thing should always be a part of a legitimate plot, not just something thrown in to depower the Paladin.

I agree with others that you should post the build (just to make sure everything is legal), and start using some non-Evil foes. Animals, mercenaries, Golems, etc.

However, I would also suggest that if this is a legitimate problem for the other PCs, you perhaps suggest ways in which they might make their characters more effective (or post their builds here and seek advice).

In my experience, powering up the other PCs is always gonna result in fewer hard feelings than depowering one in particular.


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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Lawful good enemies. Remember, same alignment, does not mean same team.


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Paladin traps are not a good idea. It just leads to unhappy players and frustration. If one person is over optimized for the group, you should ask him to tone his character down.


Knight Magenta wrote:
Paladin traps are not a good idea. It just leads to unhappy players and frustration. If one person is over optimized for the group, you should ask him to tone his character down.

This combined with making sure you aren't tossing him softballs either (if all you ever send at the party is evil dragons, undead, and outsiders and only a couple a day you're setting the paladin up for awesome and it isn't really his fault).


Are you trying to challenge the players or are you trying to kill them?

Do they want to be killed? If they don't you might have a conflict of play styles, and you should discuss this with your group.


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PaintedDeath wrote:
Problem is, ever since hes made the character, the combats have literally been him just one-shoting everything that I've thrown at the group

Use something that has more hit points than he can do damage in one attack.


have a talk with the player, he might have felt that your challenges were too powerful, and thus as he couldn't handle it himself he searched the internet for help.
Perhaps he just comes from mmorpgs where everyone reads and follows guides from the internet.

Anyhow this doesn't seem to be a bad case of the munchkins and you should be able to cure it. Just discuss powerlvl of the campaign vs characters with your players (and perhaps here by telling us how they both got killed, how much experience the players have, and what lvl you played).


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Paladins shine against evil creatures that are an obvious threat. My group is extreme power gamers and I have to mix things up to make combat challanging. Combat Manuevers, Stealth/Invis, battlefield management spells, summons, flight, burrowing, natural hazards, traps, are a few ways I deal with the power level and keep it interesting. I alter the AP's a bit and use them as the base to build from. Are you running an AP, homebrew, module? How many players? What are the other characters? These things will help.

I'm not a fan of telling people to power down. It's being punished for coming up with an intelligent build. You can typically find a way to challange a character.


My GM is saying that my character is overpowered...Is it? I created my own race, so stats might be extreme.

Str:24
Dex:8
Con:14
Int:22
Wis:8
Cha:0

Level 4 character: lv2 Magus/lv1 Barbarian/ lv1 dragonrider.

AC:25( lower than others in my group)
Since it is large, it deals more damage., but weapons cost more...

Fort:8
Ref:1
Will:4

CMb:9
Cmd:28(locked gauntlet lol)
Speed with armor: 40 ft.


it also has a BAB of 3, SR:7, and a special ability: it can regenertae 1 hp per round. and HP:35(including toughness feat at 4th level and cons modifier). and cons was increased fro 13-14 at 4th level.


darkorbit wrote:
it also has a BAB of 3, SR:7, and a special ability: it can regenertae 1 hp per round. and HP:35(including toughness feat at 4th level and cons modifier). and cons was increased fro 13-14 at 4th level.

Yes, it is overpowered. Did you use the Race Builder in the Advanced Races Guide?


Charisma of 0?


darkorbit wrote:
Cha:0
the rules wrote:
A character with a Charisma score of 0 is not able to exert himself in any way and is unconscious.

Qadira

bit of a diversion from the original thread, but yes your character is OP in my opinion. At level 4 it's relatively difficult to get your hands on a +2 stat item, so your strength being 24 already is pretty ridiculous. Even with a +2 stat item, a str of 22 is very, very powerful. Toss in the fast healing, and you make an already imbalanced character full on broken. As a DM, I would never allow a race like that in my campaign unless we were starting at a very high level when the racial bonuses have less impact (even then, I'd be very hesitant with this race). Did you use the race builder? How many points did you spend? Did you roll stats, or did you point buy?

Based on the point buy system, your character would be a 33 point buy with racial modifiers that add 6str, 4int, and -7cha. If on the off chance your cha is 10 and you mistyped, then the build becomes a 37 point buy with no racial negative modifiers. Since most games are played with 15-25 point buys (25 being on the high end), I would say that your stats alone break the game. Oh, and I just saw that your race is large by default. That means that you have natural reach which is extremely powerful especially at lower levels. I have no idea why your DM allowed this race at his table, but unless the rest of your group is playing equally ridiculous races, you should seriously consider using a more standard race.

However, your cha being 0 means your character is comatose, so I guess it's not overpowered.

---

Back to the original post, paladins are very frustrating to me. They generally trivialize any fight where you have a BBEG. Of course BBEG fights should have minions and whatnot to distract the party, but the BBEG is still the emphasis of the fight. Smite and 1-2 round killing your boss is extremely frustrating as a DM. I understand that throwing non-evil bad guys is a potential solution, but when the theme of the adventure has evil bad guys, that becomes a problem. I've had a fight or two where I've challenged the paladin in my group, but more often than not he decimates the challenges that I throw at him.

To the OP, I made the mistake of playing my campaign a bit too brutal. I had a player lose 2 characters in the same dungeon (one in the 2nd fight he played the new character). His response was to make a much more defensive character. Unfortunately, because of smite, he still deals a LOT of damage. I can't blame him for making a character that won't get killed so easily, but it has made the campaign as a whole much more difficult for me to challenge the party. The biggest mistake I made was allowing players to roll stats instead of using a point buy. I'm a gungho point buy advocate now because rolling stats (while more fun, no questions asked) breaks the game more often than not.

Silver Crusade

darkorbit wrote:

My GM is saying that my character is overpowered...Is it? I created my own race, so stats might be extreme.

Str:24
Int:22
Cha:0
Since it is large, it deals more damage., but weapons cost more...
Speed with armor: 40 ft.
Can regenerate 1hp/rnd

I'm a player much, much more than I DM, and I've been plaing for over 30 years, but I have never agreed more with a DM in my entire life!!!

Wait!! Weapons cost more? You mean, you pay 30gp for your large 2d6 longsword, while a puny medium creature only has to pay 15gp for his 1d8 medium longsword? That is so unfair! I take it back! Your DM must be secretly jealous of your Charisma.

It's a good job you've got that 40-ft (armoured) speed to help with all that running away you must be doing!

'Created your own race'? Really?

Qadira

side note, your CMB is +11 not +9. 11 = 7(str) + 3(bab) + 1(size)
your CMD should be around 20 (30 vs disarm). 20 = 10 + 7(str) + 3(bab) -1 (dex) +1 (size) +10(vs disarm from locked gauntlet)

edit: wait a sec...are we being trolled? I almost hope so...


i did roll buy and i used race builder


sry cha:1 lol sry


im making it -1 size for cmb to make it more fair


how can i tone it down?


adn some of my other friends have characters whose modifiers all add up to higher than all my modifiers added up, surpirsing, eh?


i cant' really turst my gamemaster because he doesn't even kow what an armro check penlty is, and he never makes us rolls initiative ... we are all new...

Qadira

Well, apparently you can change the rules as you see fit (size bonuses are size bonuses that you don't get to change because you feel like it). If you're not trolling (which I'm pretty sure you are at this point give the 5 1-phrase posts in a row), you should really have your DM help you rebuild this race according to the rules for player character races.

In response to your last post, I'm not even remotely surprised that your fellow players have higher combined modifiers. you have cumulative -7 penalty to offset the cumulative +15 you have to your primary stats. This is min/max/munchkin to the extreme.

Again, I'm pretty sure you're trolling us at this point, so I'm done. Congratz on getting so many people to respond tho!


what do u gus mean by im trolling u guys? im only 12...


If i take out regenrating hp, will it be more fair? And change my strength to 22?


i dont know the definiton of trolling


darkorbit wrote:
i cant' really turst my gamemaster because he doesn't even kow what an armro check penlty is, and he never makes us rolls initiative ... we are all new...

Really? If this is your position why are you even playing. I'm glad I play with adults...

Your character is overpowered by quite a bit. If you are new don't touch the race builder. Use regular classes and races from the core book. If you are all really new then you should show your GM understanding instead of opening telling him "I don't trust you".

Trust me on this... start off with core, it will help the DM learn the rules much faster.


unfortunately, they are all immature kids, and i have actually been playing for 6 months, i am more used to the game cuz i am used to going online adns seeking rules. and information, where they just making up some random **** and put it in the game.

Andoran

Very overpowered character which i would not have allowed. However, it can be challenged by good use of terrain, enemy's ranged attacks, imaginative use of traps and/or diversions, and such foes as harpies (which can both fly and have their own special attack which can netralize fighter types with low will saves).


thanx martin, u r a nice guy, giving ways that the gm can challenge me... thanx bro.... GUYS, HE SHOULD BE UR ROLE MODEL FOR THIS FORUM! and martin, would u have allowed itif u challenged me?


kk...im lowering my strength to 22(someone in part has that, dukai) and im taking out regenerating hp


Darkorbit, could you dissect your race for us, show how you've built it? Like, what abilities you used from the Race Builder to create it.


I'll never understand why more people don't understand that the ARG is primarily a GM tool, not a player one.

Cheliax

If his DM told him he could do it, then the blame rests on the DM's shoulders.


Yeah, the ARG can be easily abused to make overpowered characters. I've done it a few times myself in particularly ridiculous campaigns (Say hello to Super Sniper and Super Tanker, both with 40ft movement for the heck of it). There are a lot of cool abilities but it should really only be used by a GM to give their campaign flavor.


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darkorbit wrote:
unfortunately, they are all immature kids, and i have actually been playing for 6 months, i am more used to the game cuz i am used to going online adns seeking rules. and information, where they just making up some random **** and put it in the game.

Ah, yes! I started gaming about that age. 50th level characters with ability scores all around 25 (I think only Gods had better than a 20 in the early days.) Totally making stuff up, but having fun.

Don't sweat it, Darkorbit. just have fun. But if you want to see more standard playing, see if you can find a Pathfinder Society game in your town and just start with the Core Rules until you get a better feel for balancing the rules.


Pathfinder Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Yes, it does seem powerful, as stated earlier you should really go with the core classes and races if you are that new. Atleast until you are more familiar with the game. The other people in the group have similar abilities or just did different with the min/ max stuff. But its never fun when the encounters have to be tailored to one character to just be a challenge to him and the rest of the group nearly dies against something he finds mildly challenging. If there are other groups playing in your area I suggest getting in on one of those games to learn.


Am i the only one imagining the dwarf pointing at Minmax and stating "no he traded his ability to put on clothes correctly, for +1 to hit"...

Goblincomics rocks, now back to the actual thread, other ways of giving him a challange, send a ghost or other types of undead that uses incorporeal touches and does charisma damage. 1 hit and he is comatose, that should make the player scared enough.


Pathfinder Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

yes that would work Anomander, but it would probably be best to just have them start new normal characters until they get experience playing and the GM has experience running the game.

I mean... how often can you have this for.

"ok suddenly 4 goblins appear... and 1 ghost..."

"hey! last time it was 3 bugbears and a ghost.. why does the ghost always attack me?"

you can try to doctor the characters to have them work... but I think you will encounter problems later on, if only because everyone is new and the GM will not have the experience to draw from on how to combat some issues that will arrive with characters who have custom drawn from scratch races.


this is for the guys who wnat to see my race build

Type: Humanoid with Giant Subtype 0rp
Size: Large: Large creatures gain a +2 size bonus to Strength and a –2 size penalty to Dexterity. Large races take a –1 size penalty to their AC, a –1 size penalty on attack rolls, a +1 bonus on combat maneuver checks and to their CMD, and a –4 size penalty on Stealth checks. A Large creature takes up a space that is 10 feet by 10 feet and has a reach of 5 feet. 7rp
Base Speed: Medium (30ft.) 0rp
Ability Score Modifiers: Standard +2 int, +2 str, -4 cha (-1rp)
Languages: Standard: Common and Orc. Stone Giants with a high intelligence can choose from Abyssal, Draconic, Infernal, Giant, Terrran, Celestial, or Aquan. 0rp
Racial Traits
Ability Score Racial Traits
Advanced Intelligence +2 4rp
Advanced Strength +2 4rp
Defense Racial Traits
Improved Natural Armor: Add +2 to your AC for natural armor.3rp
Spell Resistance, Lesser: 6+ your characters level for spell resistance 2rp
Movement Racial Traits
Flight: Members of this race have a fly speed of 30 feet with clumsy maneuverability. 4rp
Senses Racial Traits
Light Blindness -2rp
Negative Energy Affinity -1rp
Offense Racial Traits
Slapping Tail: Members of this race have a tail they can use to make attacks of opportunity with a reach of 5 feet. The tail is a natural attack that deals 1d6 points of damage plus the user’s Strength modifier if Small, 1d8 points of damage plus the user's Strength modifier if Medium, or 1d10 points of damage plus 1-1/2 times the user's Strength modifier if Large.
Special: If a Large creature has the reach trait, its tail also gains reach. 3rp
23rp total!


If you are all new why dont you try using the races in the provided books before making more of a mess?


ive been playing or 6 months, every day... i know what im doin


I think this thread shows quite clearly that you don't(6 months is not very long anyhow).. what are you?

Giant subtype....
speaks orc/common...
slapping tail?
"stone giants with a high intelligence..."

What is this? A stone giant/orc with a tail? The DM really should not have allowed this. It appears you just looked at the ARG and picked out traits at random without any concept.

If you want your DM to improve discard this character and play a standard race. You are not doing any favors in bringing this BS to a gaming table.


23 RP is VERY hefty, more than half again the 15 RP for an aasimar. I'd suggest dropping down to the Slow XP track as a tradeoff and play from there. Yes, this means your level adjusts accordingly downward.

Two things your negative racial traits will jack you up with over and over:

  • Negative Energy Affinity means getting caught in positive channeled energy effects or accidentally 'cured' by cure wounds spells, heal spells, a paladin's lay on hands and so on is that you take damage from that stuff instead of being cured.
  • Light Blindness in this build is illegal - you missed the "requires darkvision" part, so your custom race of quarter dragon stone giants actually costs 25 RP. Just as bad is that you are immediately made into sneak attack bait each and every time one of your allies - or you yourself - cast any kind of light descriptor spell due to getting blinded.


i know about the ne affinity but not about the light blindness... thanx. sciencerob give me ur email so i can send u a history about stone giants... they are actually offspring of orcs and blessed giants which have grown to live in the mountains and adapt to their environment. and i used a monstrus template, just to let u knwo for the race builder


and no need to be mean science rob... im a little kid(relatively)

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